Staz's BT dolphin build thread

[Kittrell]

Do not quote me on this, but I am pretty sure the A/S/RS all use a Getrag 466 transmission, and the only difference is the clutch. So you just need a B6/B7 six speed, doesn't really matter what it's out of. Someone feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

As far as the TIP is concerned, the B6 S4 uses a 6HP19. You'll want a first gen box, which came in the B6 S (not a B7 S) so there is no incompatibility with the controllers. Other than that, I could not tell you, I have yet to see it done. The 5HP19 Tip can handle 450 or more with upgrades, so it might not be worth the hassle of the swap.

[Staz]

If you're going to go through all the trouble of swapping transmissions, fucking do it right and get a standard. just trust me. and I'm sure many, many others will agree.


EDIT: reads more harsh than I actually mean it. but I wanted to get my point across.

well thats what im trying to figure out .. what the difference in electrical and whats needed to get everything running is between a tip and stick.

as much as i do want to swap in a 6 speed manual, i just as much want to swap in a 6 speed tip just to do something different and test the power of it at the same time - if a b6 s4 tip tranny bolts right in and no change in electrical, wiring, and so on is needed then id swap it in asap (assuming they dont cost an arm and a leg)

Do not quote me on this, but I am pretty sure the A/S/RS all use a Getrag 466 transmission, and the only difference is the clutch. So you just need a B6/B7 six speed, doesn't really matter what it's out of. Someone feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

As far as the TIP is concerned, the B6 S4 uses a 6HP19. You'll want a first gen box, which came in the B6 S (not a B7 S) so there is no incompatibility with the controllers. Other than that, I could not tell you, I have yet to see it done. The 5HP19 Tip can handle 450 or more with upgrades, so it might not be worth the hassle of the swap.

so my 5 speed tip right now is capable of 450 or more ?! jeeeeez everybody always used to say these trannys sucked

anybody else with more info on this feel free to chime in !

[Arclight]

Your car looks great Staz - I think the hood really compliments your car nicely!

I look forward to seeing your build come together. Glad you decided to keep her and treat her to some upgrades.

[Kittrell]

so my 5 speed tip right now is capable of 450 or more ?! jeeeeez everybody always used to say these trannys sucked

anybody else with more info on this feel free to chime in !

The B5 S4 uses the 5HP19FLA (same 5 speed the B6 A4 got) and there is one running around with TiAL R650 turbos on a 517 trans rebuild. So yes, with some money, they can hold the power.

[Antoinebourdeau]

I would love to see a stock airbox with that PSi manifold

A few ppl have already done it. you just need to flush mount the screws on the block off plate and a few more minor tweaks and it fits like a glove

[Kittrell]

A few ppl have already done it. you just need to flush mount the screws on the block off plate and a few more minor tweaks and it fits like a glove

I have yet to see a picture, have any handy?

[Staz]

but at the same time wouldnt it just be better to upgrade to something with an extra gear that can hold more power already ? and if need be, could always upgrade that one

i def wouldnt mind 6 gears - would probably have to swap out the cluster to an s4 one as well to include the 6th gear on the display no ?

[Kittrell]

Honestly I'm not sure it's ever been done. You would be diving into something with little to no help along the way. And there are software issues you would have to figure out. At the end of the day it would probably be more logical, time effective, and economical to just upgrade the 5HP. I know 2Bennett has a tip rebuild that can handle 500hp.

Maybe this will help dissuade you. I dug out an old PM between myself and John.

I don't know of anyone having done this or of any new info regarding the ECU/TCU situation. AFAIK, since the ECU and TCU are only connected via CAN buss, as far as ECU and TCU inter-control is concerned,(The 6HP19 TCU is internal to the trans, as a Mechatronic assembly with the valve body) the situation is if the two controllers will accept data messages sent to each other. It's possible that the ECU can be line item reprogrammed manually to accept the CAN messages from the TCU and vice versa, but at this time, it's just a speculative matter on my part. I don't know exactly what the criteria for the message packet header info is implemented and required, or if the actual situation is a simpler, easier to adapt to cooperate together as a practical matter. The second generation 6HP19 is a lot better trans than the 1st gen box, for several reasons, but would likely be a similar task to adapt the controllers to work together compared to the 1st gen 6 speed. A CAN packet sniffer to read the actual data on the CAN busses, comparing the 5HP and the 6HP would be the place to start regarding compatibility. Also, because the B6 S4 used the 1st gen 6HP19, there should not be any incompatibility with the other controllers. Another problem is getting around the component protection issues that may occur.

If you have a lot of money, there is always a way to work around these kinds of problems.

[Bische]

I have yet to see a picture, have any handy?

x10

[Staz]

wow great info kittrell & diagnosticator !!



edit: oh well, looks like ill just have to go with a torque converter

[Snooter]

Car looks awesome man Can't wait to see how this comes along for you.

[dougyfresh]

The manual transmission swap is fairly straightforward. If I can get my shop space secured in the next few months I will have the ability to do such things for people other than myself at the beginning of the year.

[Dan[FN]6262]

The manual transmission swap is fairly straightforward. If I can get my shop space secured in the next few months I will have the ability to do such things for people other than myself at the beginning of the year.

You should name the building "Doug Werks"

[bclemons]

Talk to VAST tuning, they can tell you about all about the transmissions. They have so much information about them since they have been doing S4"s for so long. It will give you some further information to look at as far as what works and what doesn't. I know they have done 500hp S4's and they have had no problems. Ask for Mike, he is the owner, the other guys can help if he is not in.

[BUSAfREAkA4]

Slight thread jack but still on topic, which transmission is stronger and holds up better with a BT? I know there are letters and numbers associated with them. But i know them as 5 speed and 6 speed. I am going to Audi wiki it right now and possibly edit the post if i find it before someone answers.

Edit: All I found was the you put GL4 fluid in and the b6 comes with 5 or 6 speed manual or Tip. Of the manuals, what trans seems to hold up better? Anyone? Or does it really depend on cryo treating gears and syncros and the type of clutch installed?

[dougyfresh]

You should name the building "Doug Werks"

There will be nothing with that second word in it. That word haunts me.

[Dan[FN]6262]

There will be nothing with that second word in it. That word haunts me.

LOL!!!!

[EErie B6]

Slight thread jack but still on topic, which transmission is stronger and holds up better with a BT? I know there are letters and numbers associated with them. But i know them as 5 speed and 6 speed. I am going to Audi wiki it right now and possibly edit the post if i find it before someone answers.

Edit: All I found was the you put GL4 fluid in and the b6 comes with 5 or 6 speed manual or Tip. Of the manuals, what trans seems to hold up better? Anyone? Or does it really depend on cryo treating gears and syncros and the type of clutch installed?

The 6-speed (02X) is the stronger of the 2... Its also much more expensive to replace IF you do break one.

[nefkntym]

If you're going to go through all the trouble of swapping transmissions, fucking do it right and get a standard. just trust me. and I'm sure many, many others will agree.



EDIT: reads more harsh than I actually mean it. but I wanted to get my point across.

I was thinking the exactly the same thing.

[nefkntym]

The 6-speed (02X) is the stronger of the 2... Its also much more expensive to replace IF you do break one.

Get a 6sp 01E from the 02-03 B6 A4, there is no doubt about it being strong, even stronger than the 02x. Cheaper and easier to find, that is what I swapped in my car.

[BUSAfREAkA4]

I have an 04 usp. So I have the 02x?

[vinny.dtw]

There will be nothing with that second word in it. That word haunts me.

Haunts you...? Thats an understatement for me.

Baron: Vast won't do shit. Mike won't even answer phone calls or emails let alone share info to the general public... They are all about the money nowadays.

[AudiA4Turbo22]

If you're going to go through all the trouble of swapping transmissions, fucking do it right and get a standard. just trust me. and I'm sure many, many others will agree.



EDIT: reads more harsh than I actually mean it. but I wanted to get my point across.

I do not agree, my tip has been great with my 3076

[dougyfresh]

Haunts you...? Thats an understatement for me.

I'll never forget that morning I let Omega out and looked through the window to see an additional vehicle sitting in my driveway that shouldn't have been there. The more I remember that moment the more I want to sell my house and move off my busy road.... To a place where my neighbors won't call the police when I walk out of my front door with a gun in my hand.

[Dan[FN]6262]

I do not agree, my tip has been great with my 3076

yes, with your 3076. and you have it built correctly. OP had sent me a PM about his future plans, which involve a turbo in the 35R range, so I was speaking in the long term. The last time I had checked the thread in the B5 section with the dude running a 35R on his tiptronic, he was still having some problems. But it has been a while since I've bothered looking.

[Dan[FN]6262]

To a place where my neighbors won't call the police when I walk out of my front door with a gun in my hand.

you could do that in middle of my town, and no one would look at you twice LOL.

[nefkntym]

you could do that in middle of my town, and no one would look at you twice LOL.

Same here, people here all over the place with unconcealed and concealed carry.

[EErie B6]

Get a 6sp 01E from the 02-03 B6 A4, there is no doubt about it being strong, even stronger than the 02x. Cheaper and easier to find, that is what I swapped in my car.

Que? That came in the B5 S4 & C5 A6. 02-03 A4 only came in a 5-spd.

That said, it IS the 6-spd of choice. As far as O.E. B6 A4 transmissions, the 02X from the 04-05 cars are the best you could have.

I have an 04 usp. So I have the 02x?

yes.

[dougyfresh]

Que? That came in the B5 S4 & C5 A6. 02-03 A4 only came in a 5-spd.

Came in the 2002-2003 3.0L manual transmission model.

Problem is finding one as most 3.0L are automatic transmissions.


The 1.8Ts came in a 5spd for 2002-2003.

[vinny.dtw]

Que? That came in the B5 S4 & C5 A6. 02-03 A4 only came in a 5-spd.

That said, it IS the 6-spd of choice. As far as O.E. B6 A4 transmissions, the 02X from the 04-05 cars are the best you could have.


yes.

02/03 B6 3.0 came with 01E as well. Thats what I have on my car currently.

[Dan[FN]6262]

I want a 6spd


my first gear sounds horrible

[EErie B6]

02/03 B6 3.0 came with 01E as well. Thats what I have on my car currently.

oops, I stand corrected. I forget the 3.0 even exists.

I want a 6spd


my first gear sounds horrible

your first gear sounds like a Civic in reverse.

[MmmBoost]

My first gear on my '02 5 speed sounded HORRIBLE. Had a chipped tooth. It sounded like a friggin diesel truck

[Dan[FN]6262]

your first gear sounds like a Civic in reverse.

lol you're right, it does. I never even made a connection between the two hahahaha

My first gear on my '02 5 speed sounded HORRIBLE. Had a chipped tooth. It sounded like a friggin diesel truck

That's probably what happened to mine, from using launch control like a billion times *sigh*

[dougyfresh]

You should hear all the gears in my 5spd. I think I blew the bearings in the main shaft. It whines like no tomorrow.

[AudiA4Turbo22]

yes, with your 3076. and you have it built correctly. OP had sent me a PM about his future plans, which involve a turbo in the 35R range, so I was speaking in the long term. The last time I had checked the thread in the B5 section with the dude running a 35R on his tiptronic, he was still having some problems. But it has been a while since I've bothered looking.

Oh I agree with you there, GT35R on a tip ain't ever going to work well, the kick from that turbo will destroy its internals. The B5 guy has had nothing but problems.

I was saying that with a 2860rs he should be just fine.

[Staz]

I do not agree, my tip has been great with my 3076

whats done to the tranny ? torque converter ?

yes, with your 3076. and you have it built correctly. OP had sent me a PM about his future plans, which involve a turbo in the 35R range, so I was speaking in the long term. The last time I had checked the thread in the B5 section with the dude running a 35R on his tiptronic, he was still having some problems. But it has been a while since I've bothered looking.

yeah i was just wondering about that - but once u said no, i left it at that. i know its a powerful turbo but was just thinking maybeeeeeeeee itd work. i was wrong

[AudiA4Turbo22]

517 T/C and V/B

[Staz]

thats def getting bumped up on my list .. gonna give them a call tomorrow morning

[Staz]

fb quality sucks