what's the difference between 4motion and quattro?

[$4c@b]

Is there a mechanical difference? better materials?

[ROUGHEDGES]

i know something with the diff or power dist. is controlled different. For the r32 you could get some kind of diff controller to put more power to the rear wheels. Not exactly sure though, just giving you a jumping off point to search.

[eskimopunk]

Quattro ftw... That is all I have lol.

[ROUGHEDGES]

its the haldex unit and i am not sure if the audis have this or not. Been out of the game.

[ROUGHEDGES]

Quattro ftw... That is all I have lol.

well coming from owning 3 audis with quattro, the evo/sti's are far better than quattro.

[RolledMySTi]

One requires buying a gay ass vw, the other comes with a real car.

[KNaudi]

wow.... HUGELY informative crowd here today haha.

[ROUGHEDGES]

wow.... HUGELY informative crowd here today haha.

yeah, arent we always

[noznab]

its the haldex unit and i am not sure if the audis have this or not. Been out of the game.

Most VW's run off a haldex based system as opposed to the Torsen system that audis use (except for the TT). The difference is that with Torsen systems the car is continuously powering all 4 wheels where as in a haldex system the cars are basically fwd until sensors detect the wheels slipping. Then the differential engages and transfers power accordingly. Haldex is supposed to be better for gas mileage since it mostly runs in fwd, but ppl debate whether or not its better or worse than Torsen even though it only takes a fraction of a second for the diff to engage.

My last car was a MKIV R32 (Haldex) and I loved the awd system tbh. I haven't driven my S4 through the winter yet so I guess I can't really judge which has better handling characteristics in the snow.

[KNaudi]

http://www.golfmkv.com/forums/archiv...p/t-10779.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4motion

From what I can tell 4motion is just a name, not a technology. Some cars (transverse engined) use haldex others use Torsen (longitudinal engined). So basically 4motion is a trademark name just like quattro.

[ROUGHEDGES]

Haldex system:
Golf 4Motion
Jetta 4Motion
Audi TT quattro

Torsen system:
VW Passat 4Motion
A4 quattro

just marketing... ALL transverse mounted engines use the Heldex (A3, TT, Jetta [borra])
all longitudnal mounted engines use the Tosen (A4, A6, S4, Passat)

just search google. I found this audiworld. There has to be more info out there.

[ROUGHEDGES]

Most VW's run off a haldex based system as opposed to the Torsen system that audis use (except for the TT). The difference is that with Torsen systems the car is continuously powering all 4 wheels where as in a haldex system the cars are basically fwd until sensors detect the wheels slipping. Then the differential engages and transfers power accordingly. Haldex is supposed to be better for gas mileage since it mostly runs in fwd, but ppl debate whether or not its better or worse than Torsen even though it only takes a fraction of a second for the diff to engage.

My last car was a MKIV R32 (Haldex) and I loved the awd system tbh. I haven't driven my S4 through the winter yet so I guess I can't really judge which has better handling characteristics in the snow.

so here is a good question. what do lambos use?

[KNaudi]

so here is a good question. what do lambos use?

God's AWD system.

Edit: snippet from wiki about 4wd: The Lamborghini Murciélago is a 4WD that powers the front via a viscous coupling unit if the rear slips.

Another edit: It (the Gallardo) is also much more practical to use in bad weather than many other supercars, thanks to rear-biased all-wheel drive. Although corporate owner Audi is renowned for its Quattro AWD system, Lamborghini uses a system of its own.

[noznab]

Pretty sure Torsen

[Richard]

so does this mean that a B5 TDI 4motion passat could potentially be placed on the underside of a B5 A4?

[KNaudi]

so does this mean that a B5 TDI 4motion passat could potentially be placed on the underside of a B5 A4?

I didn't find anything that talked about the TDIs specifically but what I did read made it sound like that would work.

[noznab]

so does this mean that a B5 TDI 4motion passat could potentially be placed on the underside of a B5 A4?

No idea, but if you ask here they could probably help you out:

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zeroforum?id=38

[eskimopunk]

well coming from owning 3 audis with quattro, the evo/sti's are far better than quattro.

We're not comparing to jdm. Comparing vag.

[Chknkatsu]

One requires buying a gay ass vw, the other comes with a real car.

...

[$4c@b]

Comparing vag.

taste or smell?

[marty was here]

torsen or gtfo seriously.

and gallardos use torsen.

haldex is fwd that may be an awd.

[ROUGHEDGES]

taste or smell?

HAIRCUT?

[Quattrotakis]

Based on my snow drifting experience, Quattro > Subaru AWD

[eskimopunk]

taste or smell?

They go hand in hand.

[ROUGHEDGES]

Based on my snow drifting experience, Quattro > Subaru AWD

well i dont know if the sti has different diffs than the regular subies. But have the posi front and rear diffs on the sti/evo is WAY better for handling. When i would load up the s4 the inside tires would spin. When i load up the evo the posi kicks in and rotates the car into the apex reducing understeer.

[RomanA6]

"if the milk turns out to be sour, I ain't the kind of pussy to drink it"

[Hassmeister]

taste or smell?

Fart.

[djwimbo]

Haldex system:
Golf 4Motion
Jetta 4Motion
Audi TT quattro

Torsen system:
VW Passat 4Motion
A4 quattro

just marketing... ALL transverse mounted engines use the Heldex (A3, TT, Jetta [borra])
all longitudnal mounted engines use the Tosen (A4, A6, S4, Passat)

just search google. I found this audiworld. There has to be more info out there.

Thank you for being an informative member.

The Passat's that are longitudinally mounted are (mechanically) identical to the Quattro Tip/Auto A4's.

ALL transverse mounted cars that are 4Motion are Haldex units.

[djwimbo]

so does this mean that a B5 TDI 4motion passat could potentially be placed on the underside of a B5 A4?

Absolutely. It will straight bolt up.

Differences are in the gearing though. You would need to swap the trans and the rear differential since the ratios are different.

[eskimopunk]

don't forget the a3 quattro

[djwimbo]

don't forget the a3 quattro (HALDEX)

Fixed.

... I'd rather have a LSD FronTrak A3 than a Quattro.

[mallrat]

well coming from owning 3 audis with quattro, the evo/sti's are far better than quattro.

I can't find the pic right now...It's on AudiWorld Pacific NorthWest regional forum. But it's a B5 1.8T pulling out an Evo and sti out of the snow. The Audi and his 2 friends went out in the snow last year. Audi won, considering the other 2 spun out and the Audi was the only one that could pull them out.

Hence I agree... Audi > Evo, sti AWD

[Dylan]

i found my wrx to be way better in the snow than my b6 avant, but there's more to it than just the awd system - wrx had way more power (225 vs 170), was stick (my b6 is auto), and wasn't a wagon.

[{PMS}fishy]

Its this simple:

haldex is used in transverse cars
torsen is used in longitudinal cars

[audirs]

i found my wrx to be way better in the snow than my b6 avant, but there's more to it than just the awd system - wrx had way more power (225 vs 170), was stick (my b6 is auto), and wasn't a wagon.

maybe in that situation. doesnt mean quattro is inferior though..

[RomanA6]

whats the weight on the WRX/STi/Evo and what is the weight of a B6 A4/S4 with quattro?

[ProOnThaSnow]

Absolutely. It will straight bolt up.

Differences are in the gearing though. You would need to swap the trans and the rear differential since the ratios are different.

I almost want to do this... the whole time I owned my 30V I wished it had been a TDI.

[FITZ TITS]

Most VW's run off a haldex based system as opposed to the Torsen system that audis use (except for the TT). The difference is that with Torsen systems the car is continuously powering all 4 wheels where as in a haldex system the cars are basically fwd until sensors detect the wheels slipping. Then the differential engages and transfers power accordingly. Haldex is supposed to be better for gas mileage since it mostly runs in fwd, but ppl debate whether or not its better or worse than Torsen even though it only takes a fraction of a second for the diff to engage.

My last car was a MKIV R32 (Haldex) and I loved the awd system tbh. I haven't driven my S4 through the winter yet so I guess I can't really judge which has better handling characteristics in the snow.

Cliff's Notes:

[Hassmeister]

whats the weight on the WRX/STi/Evo and what is the weight of a B6 A4/S4 with quattro?

B6 A4...
Curb Weight
1545 kg (3406 lbs) - manual quattro 1.8T sedan
1610 kg (3550 lbs) - automatic quattro 1.8T sedan
1625 kg (3583 lbs) - manual quattro 3.0 sedan
1645 kg (3627 lbs) - automatic quattro 3.0 sedan


2008 Subaru Impreza WRX STI...
a claimed 3400 pounds for the U.S. car.


2008 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution X...
Curb weight
3345 lb

[ROUGHEDGES]

whats the weight on the WRX/STi/Evo and what is the weight of a B6 A4/S4 with quattro?

way lighter. My evo was around 3300 stock and is low 2900 now.

and the snow driving with the audi and evo prove nothing. There are two many variables. You cant compare in the snow unless they had the same tires.

and have had tracked the s4 and the evo, the evo is a far superior handling machine. The s4 i had h and r ultras with a neuspeed sway bar. The evo has 32 way adjustable helix 10k/11k with cusco rear swaybar and cusco strut tower bar with perrin sway links.

until you have really pushed(some have on here) the limits of a awd car with posi diffs dont have any idea of how huge the difference is. It reacts much more like a rwd car than a awd.

The turn in is far better with the evo. Less understear. Less tirewear. Less brake wear.

I AM IN NO WAY SAYING THAT I DONT LIKE AUDIS AND AM DISCREDITING THEM. I LOVE THEM I HAD TWO. ITS JUST YOU CANT DENY THAT THE EVO/STI ARE PURPOSE BUILT TRACK WHORES. THE INTERIOR SUCKS, QUALITY SO SO, LOUD, AND BUILT LIKE A TIN CAN. BUT, THEY SERVE ONE PURPOSE AND ITS GOING LIKE SNOT ON A TRACK.