B8 Ko4 owners follow up thread

[AllroadCorbin]

I forgot to mention that I'm only running 19 psi peak boost tapering to 13.5. Requested is 22.5 tapering to 16.5......damn ginormous FMIC!!

A custom tuned k03 E85 on meth would push another 20whp/30wtq

Good numbers on the IHI


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[AllroadCorbin]

I forgot to mention that I'm only running 19 psi peak boost tapering to 13.5. Requested is 22.5 tapering to 16.5......damn ginormous FMIC!!

A custom tuned k03 E85 on meth would push another 20whp/30wtq

I don’t think you’d gain 20whp but they’d likely be able to find places in the powerband where they can push it further depending on hardware and such. Regardless, nearly 300whp on the stock turbo is excellent


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[AUDacIouS4]

I don’t think you’d gain 20whp but they’d likely be able to find places in the powerband where they can push it further depending on hardware and such. Regardless, nearly 300whp on the stock turbo is excellent


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You need some meth.....11's are in the Allroads future

[AllroadCorbin]

You need some meth.....11's are in the Allroads future

Kinda strange how the fastest B8 K04 cars are all the heavier Allroads. if a flex fuel A4 got in the business with us he’d prob get better times


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[Coldcarnival]

What's "the business" lol? my sedan weights 3940 with me and half a tank. And I weight 170.

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[AllroadCorbin]

What's "the business" lol? my sedan weights 3940 with me and half a tank. And I weight 170.

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By that I mean was on this thread gunning for the lowest 1/4 time. it seems like all the lowest times/ people trying are in Allroads


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[Perry01]

Regardless, nearly 300whp on the stock turbo is excellent

And on a Mustang Dyno nonetheless....

[Spawne32]

I don't even acknowledge E85 dynos as being part of the group. As great as E85 is, because it isnt available at the pump all over the nation, it's not something most people will ever see. I live in the tristate around philly, i know of ONE E85 station near the atco raceway, and not a single other in my area. Dunno why the stuff isnt more regularly available to be honest.

[MagnaFlow]

Solid power numbers! This car looks like a ton of fun!

[earhythmic]

Anyone have experience with the Killer Chiller? I’m wondering if running one and bypassing my big ass intercooler (and swapping out the big ol 20s) will get me in 11s.

https://killerchiller.com/products/2...-turbo-kc-kits

[AUDacIouS4]

I don’t think you’d gain 20whp but they’d likely be able to find places in the powerband where they can push it further depending on hardware and such. Regardless, nearly 300whp on the stock turbo is excellent


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I think it's possible. The easy way is to run lightweight wheels, that will get me over 300whp on tbe dyno easy. If I'm currently only hitting 19psi peak boost and the k03 can make 22, then usually 1 psi if boost = 10whp. I need to turn the boost up and richen up the fueling. I made the most power in 5th gear which I noticed on the track is the most powerful. If you look at the lambda in 5th gear, it runs almost a whole point richer than 4th gear and makes 9whp/13wtq more power. Giac has gears 1-4 too lean and underboosted.

I think E85 +meth + lightweight wheels +k04 = 11's.

Somone get @Allroadcorbin and @Earythmic some lightweight wheels already!!!!!

[AllroadCorbin]

I think it's possible. The easy way is to run lightweight wheels, that will get me over 300whp on tbe dyno easy. If I'm currently only hitting 19psi peak boost and the k03 can make 22, then usually 1 psi if boost = 10whp. I need to turn the boost up and richen up the fueling. I made the most power in 5th gear which I noticed on the track is the most powerful. If you look at the lambda in 5th gear, it runs almost a whole point richer than 4th gear and makes 9whp/13wtq more power. Giac has gears 1-4 too lean and underboosted.

I think E85 +meth + lightweight wheels +k04 = 11's.

Somone get @Allroadcorbin and @Earythmic some lightweight wheels already!!!!!

That, some meth, strip the car, and try 104 octane file


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[earhythmic]

Somone get @Allroadcorbin and @Earythmic some lightweight wheels already!!!!!

Accepting donations

[Perry01]

I forgot to mention that I'm only running 19 psi peak boost tapering to 13.5. Requested is 22.5 tapering to 16.5......damn ginormous FMIC!!

Are you attributing 3+ PSI under requested due to your IC?

After installing an IE intercooler I didn’t see much of a drop in pressure. Whatever drop in psi was made up by the cooler, denser air going into the motor.

[majerrahim]

I think it's possible. The easy way is to run lightweight wheels, that will get me over 300whp on tbe dyno easy. If I'm currently only hitting 19psi peak boost and the k03 can make 22, then usually 1 psi if boost = 10whp. I need to turn the boost up and richen up the fueling. I made the most power in 5th gear which I noticed on the track is the most powerful. If you look at the lambda in 5th gear, it runs almost a whole point richer than 4th gear and makes 9whp/13wtq more power. Giac has gears 1-4 too lean and underboosted.

I think E85 +meth + lightweight wheels +k04 = 11's.

Somone get @Allroadcorbin and @Earythmic some lightweight wheels already!!!!!

It ain't gonna happen, unless you remove at least 500lb and lighter wheels , then maybe you can get close to that

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[AUDacIouS4]

Are you attributing 3+ PSI under requested due to your IC?

After installing an IE intercooler I didn’t see much of a drop in pressure. Whatever drop in psi was made up by the cooler, denser air going into the motor.

That was my thinking. The turbo is probably generating the correct amount of boost pressure but it gets reduced by the larger volume of the intercooler. Its like you said, slightly less boost pressure but it's colder/denser so it generates more power. On a k04 or bigger turbo, the bigger FMIC wouldn't affect boost pressure but with the smaller JH5 it does.

I just sent GIAC some logs and my dyno. They think I can run about 10* more timing and likely make another 20whp mid range and up top. They said the JH5 (k03) isn't going to move any more air than it already is, so that's tapped out. The only way to make any more power is timing advance, and lots of it.

[Perry01]

That was my thinking. The turbo is probably generating the correct amount of boost pressure but it gets reduced by the larger volume of the intercooler. Its like you said, slightly less boost pressure but it's colder/denser so it generates more power. On a k04 or bigger turbo, the bigger FMIC wouldn't affect boost pressure but with the smaller JH5 it does.

I just sent GIAC some logs and my dyno. They think I can run about 10* more timing and likely make another 20whp mid range and up top. They said the JH5 (k03) isn't going to move any more air than it already is, so that's tapped out. The only way to make any more power is timing advance, and lots of it.

Your lucky to have access to E85. With the higher octane, your tuner can really advance the timing to generate more power without knock.

I’m still wondering if you have a boost leak somewhere. My stage 1 with a stock IC produced 23 PSI peak tapering to 15 psi at 6k RPM but only 3.5° of timing advance up top using 92 octance pump gas.

https://datazap.me/u/perry01/q5-stag...37&tmax=108.56

How much timing advance are you seeing up top?

[AUDacIouS4]

Your lucky to have access to E85. With the higher octane, your tuner can really advance the timing to generate more power without knock.

I’m still wondering if you have a boost leak somewhere. My stage 1 with a stock IC produced 23 PSI peak tapering to 15 psi at 6k RPM but only 3.5° of timing advance up top using 92 octance pump gas.

https://datazap.me/u/perry01/q5-stag...37&tmax=108.56

How much timing advance are you seeing up top?

14* advance up top. GIAC said I could probably run 20* or more

[AllroadCorbin]

It ain't gonna happen, unless you remove at least 500lb and lighter wheels , then maybe you can get close to that

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Yea you’d have to basically strip the car to the frame to go under 12. The amount of incremental power/ weight loss needed to go lower on time after a certain point starts becoming exponential


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[AUDacIouS4]

Yea you’d have to basically strip the car to the frame to go under 12. The amount of incremental power/ weight loss needed to go lower on time after a certain point starts becoming exponential


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So what are you waiting for? Who doesn't want a gutted Allroad? So much more practical. Im sure the drone wont be that much worse? Might be a little uncomfortable for passengers, "hey, you might not want to sit on those exposed bolts!!" but they'll get over it once you hit the throttle. Sarcasm off.

[hyperunion]

Kinda strange how the fastest B8 K04 cars are all the heavier Allroads. if a flex fuel A4 got in the business with us he’d prob get better times


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I'm really considering cts's kit !. With apr's tune!.. especially running my light weight 18lb wheels.. and my easy access to over 75% ethanol!...

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[hyperunion]

That was my thinking. The turbo is probably generating the correct amount of boost pressure but it gets reduced by the larger volume of the intercooler. Its like you said, slightly less boost pressure but it's colder/denser so it generates more power. On a k04 or bigger turbo, the bigger FMIC wouldn't affect boost pressure but with the smaller JH5 it does.

I just sent GIAC some logs and my dyno. They think I can run about 10* more timing and likely make another 20whp mid range and up top. They said the JH5 (k03) isn't going to move any more air than it already is, so that's tapped out. The only way to make any more power is timing advance, and lots of it.

I believe apr's tune's timing for the st2 is set Higher!. Remember Boomtime.. he ran similar power to you at 290 something.. but much more awtq like around 385lbs!. At around 50% ethanol!. And 0 meth kit , stock airbox... Stock exaust...

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[shonseb]

Big Turbo A5

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...EFR-6758-Build

[lettuce]

Big Turbo A5

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...EFR-6758-Build

Finally! Man, that's awesome. Been getting so discouraged by the BT posts on here lately. This restores my hope in our platform.

[earhythmic]

Big Turbo A5

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...EFR-6758-Build

That looks awesome. But when I get to the point of built internals I’m building one of these for less than what I have put into my current AR:

[B8_Dude97]

The s4 guys better look out. Couple more bt builds and we're looking pretty good.

This is the same turbo apr ran a 12.2 with and this guy ran a 11.7 with fueling upgrades

...they said it would never happen....


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[Zach L]

Finally! Man, that's awesome. Been getting so discouraged by the BT posts on here lately. This restores my hope in our platform.

As expected, that horsepower required the Bosch GM Ecotec injectors, an upgraded Autotech HPFP, and even then he's running a multi-port water/meth system with a custom controller. Everything continues pointing to the fueling system (and the tuning to support the upgraded components) as being the major single obstacle to overcome on this platform. I think think we can get 370-420 awhp from the factory system max. I don't think it was mentioned in that thread, so I inquired about who did the tuning.

That said, the experience from builds like that A5 and other VW TSI engine builds is starting to provide some real clarity on what works. That's a good thing!

[AUDacIouS4]

"That's A LOT of money Al !! Maybe it's time we re-think our decision making paradigm?"

[AllroadCorbin]

As expected, that horsepower required the Bosch GM Ecotec injectors, an upgraded Autotech HPFP, and even then he's running a multi-port water/meth system with a custom controller. Everything continues pointing to the fueling system (and the tuning to support the upgraded components) as being the major single obstacle to overcome on this platform. I think think we can get 370-420 awhp from the factory system max. I don't think it was mentioned in that thread, so I inquired about who did the tuning.

That said, the experience from builds like that A5 and other VW TSI engine builds is starting to provide some real clarity on what works. That's a good thing!

420whp on the stock fueling is a pipe dream on the B8 2.0


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[Zach L]

420whp on the stock fueling is a pipe dream on the B8 2.0


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Just for clarity, I'm talking about with a true big turbo; not a K04. Initially, yeah it's a pipe dream even with the bigger turbo, but with time I think it'll happen.

That's how it happened for the Mk6 TSI. There were GTI making more than 370whp on stock fueling about 6 years ago. Then over the years with tuning revisions, 420whp on stock fueling hardware. That's with 93 octane and no water/meth. That's been the case for more than 2 years now.

The B8 stock fueling system is just as capable as the Mk6 GTI. Our current problem is there's not enough people pushing the limits, and now that the aftermarket injectors are becoming more common I assume people on our B8 platform will just jump to using those rather than really pushing the factory fueling system to its true limit.

[Spawne32]

Even 300whp seems to be a pipe dream on the K04 on pump gas. lol

[spin0rz]

Even 300whp seems to be a pipe dream on the K04 on pump gas. lol

I know right


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[Coldcarnival]

Even 300whp seems to be a pipe dream on the K04 on pump gas. lol

I think that's possible on 93 , but not on a mustang Dyno lol

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[Zach L]

More info on that Big Turbo A5, related to K04 discussion:

Nice....but how's the turbo lag? I'd imagine it's got almost all of it's power in the upper rpm's, no?

Here is the graph, I have more than enough torque at 3k rpm. After K04 I don't feel much difference in spool.

Nice build. Who did the tuning?

Thanks)
All software (ECU and TCU) by AGPMotorsport. It's a Russian company specialized in custom tuning.

[A4x]

When does everyone's K04 spool up?

Maybe crossing 20 psi is a good measuring point. Can you hit this around 2500 rpm, or is it more like 3000 rpm?

[AUDacIouS4]

More info on that Big Turbo A5, related to K04 discussion:

That graph doesn't have Tq And HP cross at 5250 rpm. Is the Hp - Nm relationship different?

[Brandon K.]

That graph doesn't have Tq And HP cross at 5250 rpm. Is the Hp - Nm relationship different?

Can someone please explain to me why they need to cross at 5250 rpm? I know a good amount about cars (been my hobby for 25 years) and have an engineering degree and I have only read this information about it crossing at 5250 on this board. I don’t understand why/how I have never heard of this before.

Thanks


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[Jake@JHM]

can someone please explain to me why they need to cross at 5250 rpm? I know a good amount about cars (been my hobby for 25 years) and have an engineering degree and i have only read this information about it crossing at 5250 on this board. I don’t understand why/how i have never heard of this before.

Thanks


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hp = (tq*rpm)/5252

HP is just a measurement of torque over time

[Jake@JHM]

That graph doesn't have Tq And HP cross at 5250 rpm. Is the Hp - Nm relationship different?

NM is a higher number than TQ so it will cross sooner.

[lettuce]

Can someone please explain to me why they need to cross at 5250 rpm? I know a good amount about cars (been my hobby for 25 years) and have an engineering degree and I have only read this information about it crossing at 5250 on this board. I don’t understand why/how I have never heard of this before.

Thanks


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Where did you buy your engineering degree from?

Joking