Am I crazy? My build plans.

[public_void]

Hey everyone, I'm hoping for a sanity check.

I'm want to build an s4 avant. I don't have a car yet, so I've been looking for a while. I'd like some feedback on my build, the goal, and whether it's something I should even undertake.

1. The goal: build a fun, reliable daily driver. I would like to take this opportunity to do a full engine rebuild, partially because I just want to do it, partially because I'd like to have something reliable.

2. A rough build plan:

3.0 stroker - full bottom end rebuild
2.8l heads, rebuilt (new cams, valves, springs, etc.)
Tial 605 kit
Rebuild 01E w/ JHM

3. My Skills:

I'm not an experienced guy by any means. I've done regular maintenance, belts, alternators, starters, water pumps, etc. I lifted my jeep, swapped axles, built a transfer case (frankensteined some jy stuff together). I think with the resources of the internet, the right tools, and patience, I should be able to manage this type of build (limited fab, not unique, etc). I have a small garage (it's a bit cramped, but I think it's big enough to do some wrenching) and time so that should help.

4. The car:

I recently found a manual avant near me. I've had a hard time finding a cheap manual s4 avant (for example autotrader has ~1 nationwide, and it's already built - that's no fun!). The one I found is inside what I budgeted, so that's good. The reason it's cheap is it has a blown turbo and won't start (owner says he thinks it's the CPS). I don't think that should deter me, as I was planning on pulling & rebuilding the engine/trans anyway. It has a handful of mods:

F21bt Turbos
Ev14 52lb Injectors
Srm 85mm maf housing and intake
Oem Rs4 PP with clutchnet 6 puck disk and oem flywheel
034 Motor mounts
ECS snub
Fk coilovers
Oz Superleggeras 18x8 With good tires
Podi Boost gauge
PIggie Pipes with oem exhaust with rear muffler delete
New timing belt, water pump, tsat and housing etc. (All done in the last 10k miles)

So that's the info. The questions are:

1. Am I crazy thinking I can build a b5 to a reliable dd?
2. Am I crazy thinking I can completely rebuild a b5 with little/no experience?
3. Am I crazy to think this car is worthwhile?
4. How would you value this car?
5. How much would you have budgeted to build this car (including purchasing the car)?

Thanks ahead of time. I've been devouring this forum while looking for a car, there is SO MUCH to learn about these cars.

[jaychen]

1. yes/no (depends)
2. yes/no (depends)
3. yes/no (depends)
4. ......
5. ......

[jaychen]

how long is a piece of string, how deep down the hole do you want to go.

you're going about this backwards. I dont think you know what you want... have you ever driven an s4?

[public_void]

how long is a piece of string, how deep down the hole do you want to go.

you're going about this backwards. I dont think you know what you want... have you ever driven an s4?

Good point. I haven't driven a b5, I was test driving new b8's. I couldn't justify the money for how the car felt to me (sort of sterile & underwhelming). I am having a hard time finding a car that "checks all the boxes" - that, combined with the fact that I've always wanted to do a fun build, got this idea in my head that I should just build a car. The b5 is very attractive to me... so that's why I'm here.

[jaychen]

go drive one. go drive a few. then see what you think...

[happy2B5]

He will want one, many...

[Audi9]

Just buy the car first.

[MarlinFoundNemo]

I know what avant youre talking about ;) its clean and cheap and a rare color. Go for it. Even if you don't go along with your plans you'd still have a stage 3 once its fixed. If you want a joyride or to ride in one I'm sure theres some B5 guys around here who would love to convert you into something you cant leave :)

[rani_aridi]

If you want reliable just forget all about a stroker motor. Very few people have reliable 3L builds. Otherwise, you've gotta drive one first! A well sorted one*

[tmaclax013]

^That would be my best answer too. Once you get into the stroker game, as far as I can tell reliability goes out the window more or less

[public_void]

I know what avant youre talking about ;) its clean and cheap and a rare color. Go for it. Even if you don't go along with your plans you'd still have a stage 3 once its fixed. If you want a joyride or to ride in one I'm sure theres some B5 guys around here who would love to convert you into something you cant leave :)

No way! Do you know anything more about it?

[public_void]

Alright, sounds like I'll drive one first. Unfortunately, there are only sedans for sale around me right now.

Also, I like the idea of getting it running and maybe dding it for a while before building it.

[zillarob]

Get the avant and some new chra's from ft.
Good place to start/learn, and far enough to have plenty of fun.

Your other list may be a nice for round 2, but get your hands dirty before you decide to jump off that bridge.

[Peter1.8t]

My advice is to drive a couple B5's before you decide to go all crazy on us.

There's so many people that buy these cars with the intentions of doing a killer build, but very rarely do we see the projects being completed. They either lose interest, run out of money, or realize that it's not all much power for the money your spending. It takes an insane man to build a b5s4.

Luckily you live in the Seattle area, which means you have AMD in your backyard. They've probably built more 3L tial cars than anyone in the country, so I would suggest you use that resource if you really want to consider building one of these.

[papuc14369]

1. Am I crazy thinking I can build a b5 to a reliable dd? --- YES
2. Am I crazy thinking I can completely rebuild a b5 with little/no experience? --- NO
3. Am I crazy to think this car is worthwhile? --- Perfectly normal feeling, YES
4. How would you value this car? --- After all is said and done 15K tops
5. How much would you have budgeted to build this car (including purchasing the car)? --- 20K-25K

[julex]

It is a positive answer to all the question (go for it) except for one, don't do 3.0L. Going 3.0L is really a next level in expense and very real possibility of failure of car and as far from DD as one can get.

I can only advise for you to drive a well sorted "plain" stage 3 car first to see if you like it. They're fast.

[01audia4]

TL:DR

I daily my B5 S4 (F21 car) it sees boost regularly. As long as it is well maintained you'll be fine. I'm sure you'll have some upfront cost because the PO probably did some janky shit unless you get lucky. Other than that, take care of it, she will take care of you.

[MarlinFoundNemo]

No way! Do you know anything more about it?

No but one of my buddies knows the guy. Have you talked him about the avant?

[public_void]

No but one of my buddies knows the guy. Have you talked him about the avant?

Yeah, I'm going to take a look at it this weekend. I'll go see a few others in the area during the week as well. As much as I like the Avant, the fact that it doesn't start worries me a little.

[achb5]

Forget the 3.0L

[ElementR]

FWIW - I had never been in an S4 before I bought mine. I knew I wanted one before every driving one. I used to drool over a neighbor's buddy's silver sedan 15 years ago when they were brand new. I was turning wrenches on my fox body mustang and he would come around. I loved the idea of AWD, manual trans, nice looks, comfort, power and class. I drooled over many others that graced the streets over the years. I picked up my Volvo S60R new back in 2007 largely because it fit the same bill of what the Audi offered although was brand new and offered safety factor for our newborn son. It was easy justifiable to the wife from that point of view... whereas a mustang - not so much.

I had an '04 Mystichrome Cobra with plenty of mods. Super clean and fast car. Turned lots of heads, but my wife hated it. It got old after a while. I realized I really enjoyed the wolf in sheeps clothing nature of a quick sedan and started thinking about the S4 again. I realized that the price point was right and it was a perfect platform for me to be able to further mod while still retaining everything it originally offered new from the showroom. Fate had its way and after some downtime with the S60R (upgraded turbo and such and took a while to get the tune right) it was time for a change with the '04 Cobra as it was not a car I wanted to be driving every day especially with winter fast approaching and my S60R down.

I ended up buying my S4 with mods from a guy out of state last year. I spoke to him extensively before purchasing it and drove down one day to test drive it. It was everything I expected and more. I made an agreement and returned to pick up the car a couple weeks later. Point is that if you know what you want, go drive it. You'll know right away if you want it or not.

[ElementR]

As for the car not starting.... that's a can of worms. I would suggest getting it diagnosed or telling him to get it started before you pick it up. Worst case scenario is that when it finally starts, you have a major rebuild on your hands. It would be best to check compression and/or leakdown rate on the cylinders before you buy it. Any mechanic can do it or you can pick up the testers at Harbor Freight for cheap. You will need an air compressor to work the leak down tester.

[Avantugofast]

Keep the bottom end stock except rods. With 605.2's you'll be very happy and reliable. I have a 3L car with low miles on the build and it already needs new rings. Don't go there unless it's NOT your DD and just for occasional fun. 3L power is addicting and it makes my k04 feel slow but you'll have good results with 605's and mostly stock bottom end.

[julex]

and if the seller says "it's CPS", why doesn't he change it himself (very easy). My bet is there are bent valves etc involved from usual belt slip.

[Avantugofast]

and if the seller says "it's CPS", why doesn't he change it himself (very easy). My bet is there are bent valves etc involved from usual belt slip.

Yeah and have him pull the passenger upper Tbelt cover. If that belt is loose then you've got at least bent valves or will need pistons too. If the last timing belt kit was NOT OEM than that is a huge concern. Even OEM have been failing prematurely.

[S4VAGE-B5]

Tons to learn about b5 s4's... make sure you pick the right one.. Be patient it'll pay off to get the car you want. Not one that's been ragged out. just bought my 1st S4 after a year of looking.. But I couldn't have gotten a better car for 6 G's.



"My Preeeecious"

[Meow]

1. Am I crazy thinking I can build a b5 to a reliable dd? --- No, it will cost you more time and money, but it is possible. You wont be able to push the car to its max, as that will cause the car to become even more unreliable than a typical b5. You are crazy if you think you can do it on a budget...


2. Am I crazy thinking I can completely rebuild a b5 with little/no experience? --- No, these cars are extremely easy to work on with the right tools. It sucks when you forget things from inexperience, but it happens.

3. Am I crazy to think this car is worthwhile? --- Your idea of worthwhile is different, but don't be fooled to think its an investment, you will spend 1.5-2 times as much as it will be worth in parts.

4. How would you value this car? --- After all is said and done 15K tops, if you use top dollar parts and take your time and have a really well sorted car. Realistically, 12k, likely more along the lines of 9-10k when you are finished because that will be in at least a year, if not more.

5. How much would you have budgeted to build this car (including purchasing the car)? --- 20K is good ballpark.

It is a positive answer to all the question (go for it) except for one, don't do 3.0L. Going 3.0L is really a next level in expense and very real possibility of failure of car and as far from DD as one can get.

I can only advise for you to drive a well sorted "plain" stage 3 car first to see if you like it. They're fast.

I would agree with Julex here, don't do 3 liter.

[MikeyB3]

Tons to learn about b5 s4's... make sure you pick the right one.. Be patient it'll pay off to get the car you want. Not one that's been ragged out. just bought my 1st S4 after a year of looking.. But I couldn't have gotten a better car for 6 G's."

THIS. This x1000. Spend the time. Choose wisely, do it once. I hunted for 2 years.

[Audimilo]

can you daily a B5 S4 ? Yes. I do it, ive got 274,000 miles on the Avant, and it can be done. I only went stage 3 F21's at 253,000 miles.

is it cheap? no.

is it fun? yes.

it takes patience, $ and a lotta time on the forums & at a shop or in your garage.

but it can be done.

hope that answers your question # 1.

[public_void]

Hey everyone, thanks for great responses to a not-so-great post :) I'm encouraged by the amount of you that dd and enjoy these cars. Seems like a good community!

Some of you have mentioned 20k for an initial budget which is what I had earmarked for this project, so that's good.

I'll check this one out still after driving a few - the interior and exterior don't look bad. Since I had planned for a rebuild anyway, the fact that it doesn't start doesn't scare me too much. And if I can get this one for the right price...

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

[CJ_]

When I got my s4, I had no idea what I was getting into, I had never really driven Audis, except my sister's b6 a4 cabrio.. I ended up with the s4 in a trade and a twin turbo v6 sedan sounded cool at the time.
Here I am a year and half later building it into a stage 3. I really lucked out not having done much research on them and not knowing anything about it. It was very clean and has been super reliable.