Odds of having Timing Chain Issues in B6 S4, And is it worth it?

[Dylan13198]

I've been looking at cars forever and I'll be trading in my truck this december to get a car. I live near Chicago and the weather can be very bad in the winter, which is why I've been really wanting an S4. I don't really want a Subaru WRX or an Evo or something of that nature so an S4 seems like the perfect car. That is, if I don't have to drop $5,000-$12,000 (guestimate) on a Timing Chain replacement.

The other car I'd also love is an e36 M3 or maybe an e46, only thing is they're RWD and can be expensive to obtain, but if getting an S4 isn't financially doable (maintenance wise) I'll probably get an e36, slap some snow tires on and cry through winter while I slide around.

My main question is really this: If you could guess, I mean how likely is it that a B6 S4 will have this issue.

Trust me I know there's no way of saying, and before buying I'll see if they've already replaced it. However, is it only a small number of S4's that have this issue? I've heard people spending $14k on this repair. For me to drop $14-18k on a car and then be faced with a repair that expensive would be catastrophic . I'm prepared to pay standard maintenance costs that come along with any car (and I know they're high with BMWs/Audis) and also the occasional unexpected repair. But not a $14,000 repair.

I mean this mustn't happen to everyone or I don't see how people would be buying them.

TL;DR: I'm prepared to pay regular maintenance costs for the S4 and the occasional more expensive issue but replacing the Timing Chain is just way too expensive. Is it very likely to be an issue?

Again I don't mean to be annoying because I'm sure I'm going to get a lot of "well if you don't have $20,000 in the bank for repairs then don't buy an Audi" . But I've been searching far and wide about this topic, and when the time comes I want to go in and confidently purchase the car.

Thanks guys.

[Slow4]

but replacing the Timing Chain is just way too expensive. Is it very likely to be an issue?

Question asked and answered; don't buy a B6 S4.

TL;DR: if you have to question cost factor of maintenance then the car in question isn't worth it.

[jhruzek]

Why not look for a B7? Supposedly they did not have the problem after 2007(?).


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[Concavitor]

1:2.7

[cheetah993]

Spending 14k on timing is not an accurate figure. Say 4 to 8k. Expensive but puts a smile on my face every time.

[Jwheeler]

"I mean this mustn't happen to everyone or I don't see how people would be buying them."


I think people buy before they know about the problems they have. I did. I feel like I got really lucky with mine. Only 80k miles on my 05. Zero oil consumption or rattles. After hearing all the stories on here and seeing quite a few on cl with bad chains, I probably won't own another. I really want to sell my sedan and get a wagon but have the same fears you do. Afraid I will get a dud.


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[Tjtalan]

I am going on my second month of B6 S4 ownership. I fell in love with this model the first time I herd one blast past, And I went into ownership expecting to preventatively replace the timing components.

[Quadfreak]

I think people buy before they know about the problems they have. I did. I feel like I got really lucky with mine.

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Exactly. I was aware of the problem, but not the extent of it. If I were to do it again, I would spend a few thousand more and get a well documented B7.

[LINDW4LL]

While it seems to be somewhat common on here, I suspect the actual risk is less than perceived here.

I guess the question is, what's your budget? I see you suggested spending $14-16k on a car. I see S4s pretty frequently here in the Milwaukee/Chicagoland areas for ~10k, and B7s for 11-12.5k. These are pretty reliable cars aside from the chain issue (which is really just luck). It may be in your best interest to save a little money by purchasing one with a bit higher mileage (95k-120k) and stow away the extra cash for if and when chain issues arise.

[SlickFix]

Exactly. I was aware of the problem, but not the extent of it. If I were to do it again, I would spend a few thousand more and get a well documented B7.

+1. I did my homework first, and bought into the B6 S4 knowing the potential was there. But I think I talked myself into thinking "Nah, won't happen to me, it's not happening to that many people." Well, it's happening to me slowly but surely. I just hope it lasts long enough for me to save the money for the parts. I don't drive the car much, so I'm hopeful.

FYI, it's not the timing chains themselves that fail. It's the components that support the chains that fail: chain guides, tensioners, and both mechanical and electric adjusters. The electric adjusters are the big money items.

Knowing what I know now, would I have purchased the car? I'm afraid the answer is yes. I just love this car, and I can't wait to get this resolved. Once the timing components are done, then it's back to all the usual headaches of owning a B6.

[IslandHydro]

Mine's fine for now (knock knock) but I am planning to do the work in the future (60K mi currently). In some ways I'm actually kinda looking forward to it, because I intend to do some upgrades at the same time. Headers for sure, undecided from there (Nitrous or supercharger or?). Hopefully it'll be years from now so options will be clearer, maybe someone will actually have perfected sleaving by that time!

[JimGreen]

It WILL happen, in most cases it's at around the 80 - 90k (Miles). However there are some owners reporting that they've gone over the 100k and they're still ok.

BUT you have to remember, your getting one hell of a lot of car for your money in the first place and this is due to the cost of this inevitable job.

What other high spec performance saloon/sedan can you buy for the same money and the same year.

If your mechanically minded, then the cost of the job is the cost of the parts. If your not mechanically minded think the cost of the parts and the same again in labour and you won't be far wrong.

Now......... there are quite a few cars out there that have reached the kind of mileage where the timing chain/tensioner issues have already been replaced...... Look for one of them and your good for many years.

YES - It's Worth It

[dolphin B6 S4]

I bought my 04 with 42k miles hoping those issues wouldn't arrive for a long time, sure enough the service had to be done at 51k..

[mistral cytz]

I bought my 04 with 42k miles hoping those issues wouldn't arrive for a long time, sure enough the service had to be done at 51k..

Out of curiosity, what were the extent of your issues besides start up rattle? You must have had timing related codes pop up and rough running idle etc..

[blaelock]

Spending 14k on timing is not an accurate figure. Say 4 to 8k. Expensive but puts a smile on my face every time.

$4k-$8k for the chains is realistic, but what about scored cylinder walls? My local dealership shelled out over $12k for a new engine in my '05.

[StudentProf]

Hey,

I drove an E36 BMW 328i with winter tires for three years in New Brunswick. I won't say slip and slide everywhere and it can be fun at times.

My 2004 S4 Avant 6MT (now in storage, waiting my return) has 236,000km/147,000 miles and start up rattle was sporadic at best.

To echo what others are saying I knew there was the potential for expensive repairs before I got the car and mentally budgeted for that. I love the car, a great stress release at times with excellent storage for all my army crap when required. If I drive with half a brain the fuel isn’t that bad, especially compared to what most of my peers get in their pickups.

I always think that part of the deal with having an older car is I reap the benefits in lower insurance and not having monthly car payments. This has to be offset by the acknowledgement of routine maintenance is a must and at any time I could be hit by a massive repair bill.

To be honest when I get back if I were to decide to replace the car the only one I am considering is a ‘02/’03 S6 Avant…..

[dolphin B6 S4]

I had a worn camshaft adjuster, which gave me misfire and timing over advanced codes.

[pandapod]

Just my two cents...but I have 143k miles on my B7 and don't have any timing issues. There is a slight noise when i do a cold start, but after looking at some youtube videos i'd hardly call it a chain rattle...its barely audible. Just replaced the oil check valves and luckily they were working, so I hope to be good for a long time. We'll see though. I also bought this car with the expectation that i'd eventually have to do the timing components, and used that to my advantage when negotiating price.

Good luck, and i'd lean towards B7

[SlickFix]

I had a worn camshaft adjuster, which gave me misfire and timing over advanced codes.

Did you also have any broken or cracked chain guides or tensioners?

[Jake@JHM]

Odds of having Timing Chain Issues in B6 S4: 100%

All good things come to an end.

[JimGreen]

Odds of having Timing Chain Issues in B6 S4: 100%

All good things come to an end.

A Famous Quote Comes To Mind............

"We can rebuild him. We have the technology. We can make him better than he was. Better, stronger, faster"

LOL

[dolphin B6 S4]

1 guide had a crack in it, wasn't in half yet though, and a few more had gouges in them.

[Mr. Corey]

Every S4 will need the service. I've seen failures happening to other member's over past 7 years from 35k-150k..... sucks but its going to happen! Just have 5k pushed aside for when it does and drive and enjoy!!!!

[Frinkferta]

Find one that has already had the work done.

[SpoolBus]

Change the timing belt and don't worry about the chains

[SpoolBus]

BTW Cory I only have $4,999 set aside..had to buy a soda today..

[Slow4]

BTW Cory I only have $4,999 set aside..had to buy a soda today..

No tax?
Lucky!

[Mr. Corey]

BTW Cory I only have $4,999 set aside..had to buy a soda today..

That's a bummer sounds like your going to be shit outta luck then too!

[SlickFix]

A Famous Quote Comes To Mind............

"We can rebuild him. We have the technology. We can make him better than he was. Better, stronger, faster"

LOL

Haha, someone else who grew up in the 1970's. I know that quote!

[SpoolBus]

Grew up in the 70's or born in 70's?

..man this went off the rails quick...apologies to OP

[SlickFix]

Grew up in the 70's, son. That quote is from "The Six Million Dollar Man."

[dparm]

I'll restate what others have already written in this thread.

Low-volume performance vehicles have their quirks. You need to be willing to put up with this sort of thing if you want to own one, unfortunately. I've owned plenty of cars over the years and they all had various annoyances, design oversights, or faults. I suggest you think long and hard about what types of things are dealbreakers, and what you can accept. Regardless of the vehicle you choose, you can expect maintenance to be expensive and aggravating (i.e. parts availability, frequency of replacement, etc).

[the fly]

Why don't you just do what I did and find one that has had the job done? That's what I did when I bought my lovely Nogaro blue from the other end of the country earlier this year. I did a search in Autotrader for "timing chain" and found one that had all the receipts and documentation.

[cobraBLACK]

Low-volume performance vehicles have their quirks. You need to be willing to put up with this sort of thing if you want to own one, unfortunately.

I've never really thought about it in that way before but it's a sagacious [word of the day!] perspective. I've always cursed the comprise of having the timing components at the back but I guess Audi expected the engine, clutch, etc. to last the life of the car so it wouldn't have been a concern.

[jeffrey146]

My 04 s4 is at 110k on the clock. zero timing chain issues. With that being said I would not buy one if you are not prepared for the continual maintenance of these cars especially if you intend on it being your DD. For me it's not my dd so it's not an issue if the thing sits for even months if I don't have money.

[dparm]

I've never really thought about it in that way before but it's a sagacious [word of the day!] perspective. I've always cursed the comprise of having the timing components at the back but I guess Audi expected the engine, clutch, etc. to last the life of the car so it wouldn't have been a concern.

No, they expect it to last 1 day longer than the warranty.

Some things are very difficult to test for, and a car is so damn complicated that it will never be trouble-free.

[XLR8 Craig]

It isn't really "if" but "when" will you have chain/guide/tensioner issues. And even that is a complete crap-shoot.

We have customer cars that are quiet and smooth at 150,000 miles on the original components and others that broke a guide at under 100,000 miles.

$14,000 is high for the job even if a guide breaks and wipes out the valves and requires that the heads be rebuilt.

Now is it worth it? You have to decide how much you love the car and how it drives. I personally love a burbley V8 with a bunch of torque on tap at low RPM's without waiting for boost. So yes, to me it would be worth it... if I ever decided I needed a second quattro car and got rid of my 5-series it would most likely be for a B7 S4 avant... and my tune wouldn't change if I didn't work at a shop that is fully capable of doing the job.

[jhruzek]

What is your experience with the B7 S4? I have seen references that there some changes that reduce the odds of having to do the repair for my engine.


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[FulhamFTW]

What is your experience with the B7 S4? I have seen references that there some changes that reduce the odds of having to do the repair for my engine.


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I would say that you are in good shape. You have a 2008, and my understanding is that 07-08 got the timing guide refresh. Which is probably why you never hear of RS4's with timing guide failure. While I know the RS4 is a different motor, the timing system is pretty much the same, so if they got beefier guides, I would think the 07-08 S4's got them as well. If the timing systems are similar enough to use the same guides, then it makes economical sense for Audi to use the same parts for both, rather tham manufacture a completely different set of guides for each motor.

[Ritt]

I bought my b6 s4 from its original owner with a pile of up to date maintenance paper work. The car had 107K for and was not perfect... I knew it needed work like, brakes, suspension, bald tires, and a good cleaning/buff. I got the seller down to $8500 so I pulled the trigger, knowing that the timing issue was a ticking time bomb and I would get the dreaded rattle... In my eyes at the end of the day car is still worth investing the time and money to fix this know problem.

Things like brakes, tires, and suspension were not an issue as I'm changing all this out anyways. Look for a deal, and if you can jump on one of these for little money do it! Just be ready to replace the timing components at some point.