RS5 "Automatic" Transmission

[noshadow]

I've driven manual for most of my life. I love the feel and I haven't considered driving an automatic actually driving. It just felt like the automatic would hide all the characteristics of a car. Kind of a waste if you're getting one for the fun of the drive.

I wanted to get the 2013 RS5, but was turned off by the auto only. But yes, I know that these new transmissions are better performing, but I don't care so much about minimal changes if it sacrifices drive feel.

Without test driving an RS5 yet, I'd love to hear those who have historically driven manual transmission cars who went to an auto RS5.

Also, just a few naive questions:

1. Will it shift automatically if you don't want it to?
2. How easy is it to downshift from something like 5th to 2nd?
3. How do you start on first gear? I usually like to drop the clutch at some ideal RPM. Is this possible?
4. Does your clutch foot ever accidentally slam on the break pedal? =P

[superswiss]

The S-tronic in the RS5 is a sweet sweet transmission. It is performance tuned. You have to drive it to really know what that means. I've been driving manual up until the RS5 and I don't miss it. The feel and control is there. The split second shifts are addictive.

As to your questions.

1. The RS5 S-tronic has a true manual mode. It only downshifts to prevent the engine from stalling, otherwise it's up to you. If you don't watch the revvs, you gonna bounce off the revv limiter. Happens to me occasionally as this engine revvs so fast.

2. It takes a few flicks. I usually don't need to downshift more than two gears, which is very fast. You just flick the paddle twice and within one throttle blip it downsifts two gears in a blink of an eye. The fastest way to downshift into the right gear is to press the throttle past the point of resistance into kick-down. That will throw you back in the seat and the car takes off like a bat out of hell.

3. Just mash the pedal and it takes off. If that's not brutal enough, engage launch control and it takes off at 5000 rpm.

4. Never.

[essfour]

This is the first and only car I have owned with out a true manual transmission. I have never had more fun behind the wheel.
1. It will NOT shift up if you dont do it manually with the stick or the paddle (as long as you are in manual mode). It will let you bang the needle against the rev-limiter all day long.
2. 5th-2nd gear downshift? Um... extremely easy and super fast. If you are in dynamic and sport mode the computer will do this for you if you punch it and it happens instantaneously
3. You have launch control which holds and dumps the clutch at 5K rpm.
4. Never on the brake pedal. But when I go to start the car nearly every time my foot still searches for the non-existant third pedal...

[Got No Game]

Agree with what has been said. Before I got my car, I had the same hesitation as the OP. Most of my previous cars were manual transmissions. I can honestly say that the dual-clutch DSG is very, very good. It is a huge improvement over the tiptronic and a lot of fun to drive. Honestly, you should try to drive one and make the comparison for yourself.

The only time I think it exhibits some "confusion" is if you're in AUTO mode. I rarely use this mode for that reason.

[shonseb]

I've hit the brake when I went from manual to auto, but you get over it quick.

[DOCEVG]

+1 I have had 5 manual Audis before buying my RS5. While I'll never lose my soft spot for manual trannies, driving my RS5 in the manual mode is, well, addictive like Superswiss said. Its an incredible piece of engineering (and much faster than I could ever shift by depressing a clutch). Like Superswiss I've bounced off the rev limiter a few times in first gear.

[superswiss]

On a side note, the transmission was one of the biggest reasons I bought the RS5 over the S5. The manual transmission at this point is subpar IMO. You are stuck with the old torsen center diff and as a result no torque vectoring on the front axle. The S5 S-tronic on the other hand lacks the performance tuning and true manual mode. The nostalgia in me wasn't enough to give up on the latest quattro enhancements.

[GotRS?]

Still on the fence artchang? You shouldn't be by now!

[ernsrs5]

The transmissions is great when in Sport/Dyamic mode and you are on it. When you are just driving around town/city, it's just another automatic transmission to me. I've never gotten any pleasure paddle shifting when just driving around town/city, although I know many people do it. I'm old school and prefere the connection with the car a good manual transmission gives me, especially at lower speeds.

[superswiss]

I sometimes paddle it around town and sometimes don't. I think that's the whole beauty of the transmission and the RS5 in general. If I'm tired, just want a relaxed drive or want to avoid the evil eye from the wife, the car goes in Comfort or Auto and the transmission in D for a luxo drive around town. Quick flick over to manual to merge on the highway or get past slow drivers. When I'm alone in the car and seek some fun, Dynamic it is and Sport manual for the transmission. Best of both worlds, isn't that why we all drive an Audi?

[Gspothit]

get a 2008-12 S5 and put an APR Supercharger Stage 3 OR get a 2014 S5 manual, minor ECU upgrade will give you RS5 performance

[Shawn@PacificGerman]

I agree with every post except for the one above. I traded up from a 2013 manual trans S5 to an RS5. I'd never drive any other automatic again after this one.
Ive done STaSIS software upgrades in many 3.0 DSG, and manual cars... There is a big difference between the RS and S.

Don't get me wrong S5 is a very capable car, the RS is just in a different league.

Regardless whats posted, there's no comparison between a tuned supercharged car, and the exhilaration experience of an RS5!

Buy what works with your lifestyle, and your budget.

[shonseb]

He was referring to the 4.2 S5 supercharged also

[Shawn@PacificGerman]

I know, but neither car shift like an RS5!

[superswiss]

I think most people fall into two camps on this one. You have the manual diehards, who look at the RS5 and immediately dismiss it because it doesn't come with a manual transmission. The other camp looks at the RS5, sees S-tronic and thinks it's the same garden variety S-tronic found on the S4/5/6/7. It is not! The transmission was highly tuned for the 2010 RS5 in Europe and it was further tuned for the 2013 RS5. This version shifts even faster than the one on the original RS5. I can certainly accept that some folks don't like it. It can shift rough at times. The first comment from my dad was it feels like it's slamming in every gear when I was driving in dynamic and pushing it. But then again, this car isn't wearing the RS badge for nothing. If you want something more sedate, but still fast, you ought to be looking at the S6/7.

[HAWKiS5]

I can certainly accept that some folks don't like it. It can shift rough at times.

For me a real Manual gearbox would be preferred, but ok, the RS5 S-tronic is already better than the A5/S5 one (since it does NOT upshift in Manual mode), but atill it does not give optimal torque in every situation. Especially driving though town or cruising elsewhere is not relaxed in Auto mode (either in Dynamic/S or Auto/Comfort/D).

SO I drive it most of time in Manual, to get the optimal torque and not the nereuticness of the Dynamic/S mode.

But now there is a solution, belief it or not, but it is the (hidden) Efficiency (E) mode, see here!

[superswiss]

Interesting, I keep this in mind. Personally, I only see the auto modes useful in Stop & Go traffic and highway cruising. Around town, I've always preferred to drive by throttle, so I wanna be in control of the shifts. For example, I prefer to roll up to a stop in 3rd for a much smoother stop than shifting down to 2nd. Comfort Auto does a good job at that, but lacks sufficient engine breaking. Sport Auto is too jerky as it shifts down thinking I'm heading into a turn and want full acceleration out of the turn when in fact I'm coming to a stop at a red light. It must be said that Sport/Dynamic on the RS5 is tailored towards driving on the track or spirited driving on twisty roads. It should also be pointed out, that the S-tronic has two manual modes. Comfort manual is different from Dynamic/Sport manual. The main difference is in the uptake of the clutch from a dead stop for example, and the aggressiveness of the individual shifts. For regular daily driving, I'm settling in on ADS in Auto and the transmission in Comfort manual.

['Qfizzle]

I took my RS4 Avant to the dealer the other day to see if i can adjust the clutch capacity/points. On my GTR, i can adjust the capacity to make her shift faster/aggressively or slower on the go with a device called Cobb. So while i was at the dealer having a chat with the Audi service manager, i brought up this subject to see if i can fiddle around with the transmission on my RS4. He said, sure we can. The points were +2 for clutch A and clutch B capacity and touch points. I bumped my clutch capacities to +4. Now it shifts as fast as the GTR and downshifts/blips much faster than before at WOT. Its not as easy as it sounds because i had to test the points a few times until we got it right. It doesnt only shift faster, but also made him fiddle around with it more to get the car to creep way less while on D. Then i tested launching the car a few times to see if theres any difference, now it does not bog off the line as much as it used to.

[noshadow]

Thanks so much everyone! Really appreciate all the feedback.

I'll definitely need to go test drive it and see how it feels. I'm really glad to hear so many manual drivers who've found it to be enjoyable.

[HAWKiS5]

Interesting, I keep this in mind. Personally, I only see the auto modes useful in Stop & Go traffic and highway cruising. Around town, I've always preferred to drive by throttle, so I wanna be in control of the shifts. For example, I prefer to roll up to a stop in 3rd for a much smoother stop than shifting down to 2nd. Comfort Auto does a good job at that, but lacks sufficient engine breaking. Sport Auto is too jerky as it shifts down thinking I'm heading into a turn and want full acceleration out of the turn when in fact I'm coming to a stop at a red light. It must be said that Sport/Dynamic on the RS5 is tailored towards driving on the track or spirited driving on twisty roads. It should also be pointed out, that the S-tronic has two manual modes. Comfort manual is different from Dynamic/Sport manual. The main difference is in the uptake of the clutch from a dead stop for example, and the aggressiveness of the individual shifts. For regular daily driving, I'm settling in on ADS in Auto and the transmission in Comfort manual.

I had exactly the same feeling, and therefore was surprised to see/feel that E-mode is right in between Comfort and Dynamic mode when it comes to shifting gears. Of course when you really are actively driving, you choose S/Dynamic (by quickly touching the gear lever) but otherwise driving in E-mode is very convenient through town (beware: NO more kickdown in E-mode, which I am happy about, since you are in control!).

I took my RS4 Avant to the dealer the other day to see if i can adjust the clutch capacity/points. On my GTR, i can adjust the capacity to make her shift faster/aggressively or slower on the go with a device called Cobb. So while i was at the dealer having a chat with the Audi service manager, i brought up this subject to see if i can fiddle around with the transmission on my RS4. He said, sure we can. The points were +2 for clutch A and clutch B capacity and touch points. I bumped my clutch capacities to +4. Now it shifts as fast as the GTR and downshifts/blips much faster than before at WOT. Its not as easy as it sounds because i had to test the points a few times until we got it right. It doesnt only shift faster, but also made him fiddle around with it more to get the car to creep way less while on D. Then i tested launching the car a few times to see if theres any difference, now it does not bog off the line as much as it used to.

Interesting to read! Is this possible using VCDS/VAGCOM?

[salmjo1]

This is why I am going to keep my manual S4...

[dglasser]

I have a slightly different perspective on the RS5's S-Tronic transmission, coming from an E46 M3 with an SMG (sequential manual gearbox).

Prior to the M3, I drove cars with conventional manual transmissions. With SMG, you have a transmission that is mechanically identical to the conventional manual but with a computer-controlled, hydraulically-activated clutch in place of the clutch pedal. Consequently, driving an SMG-equipped M3 felt very similar to driving a conventional manual in how the transmission and the engine interacted. With SMG, there was an automatic mode but it was neither intelligent or smooth, so I rarely used it. This means I did all of the upshifting and most of the downshifting myself.

Audi's S-Tronic is similar to SMG in that when you're in manual mode, it will never automatically upshift and will downshift only as necessary to prevent stalling. But S-Tronic's automatic mode is both smooth and responsive, so unlike SMG you don't have to drive it in manual mode to enjoy it. Also, because you have a relative smooth power band and seven gear ratios to work with, the difference after a shift is less pronounced. Often you can't even tell what gear you're in without looking at the dash display. The main benefits of S-Tronic's manual mode are if you want to keep the revs high in the RPM band (for performance) or low in the RPM band (for economy).

I'm also finding that in daily driving, the S-Tronic upshifts relatively leisurely, even in manual mode. To get it to shift quickly, you either have to keep the car high in the RPM band or be heavy on the throttle. This makes sense, since it's trying to balance smoothness and responsiveness, but something to keep in mind if you're concerned about perceived shift speed. I say "perceived" because if you're using any automated manual transmission, it's easy to believe that it's slower than doing it yourself because you're waiting for the car to work the clutch. If you're driving a conventional manual, you're too busy doing the work yourself to notice that it's actually taking longer to effect the shift.

In the area of automated manuals, the market has spoken clearly. SMG failed because the hardcore folks want a clutch pedal and everyone else wants something that's as smooth as an automatic. BMW has abandoned SMG for DCT in its current models, though they do a better job than Audi of offering conventional manuals across their model line (interestingly, in large part due to demand from the U.S. market).

While the RS5 S-Tronic does an excellent job of balancing responsiveness and smoothness, I'm finding that the benefits of shifting myself vs. letting S-Tronic do it are marginal, esp. in daily driving.