Wideband A/F

[AudiRacerS4]

I just picked up an Innovate LC-1 Wideband and i need to where I should but the bung for the o2 sensor...I was told it should be 8-12'' after the primary o2 sensor

[Don Supreme]

18 inches behind the turbo.

[AudiRacerS4]

18 inches behind the turbo.

so it should be a little after my secondary o2 sensor then

[mike-2ptzero]

At the bottom of the DP or just after the DP is the best spot.

[B5Burn]

At the bottom of the DP or just after the DP is the best spot.

That's where I just put mine after Mike's advice also. Takes a minute to jack the car to reach it... I wonder if I got some Rhino ramps if it would be any easier..

If yours is going in full time - looks like it - there is a lot of room down there, I would just mention to plan your wiring well... axle and road debris dangers ;) I don't think it's a huge problem but you'll obviously want to shield your cabling well.

B.

[mike-2ptzero]

That's where I just put mine after Mike's advice also. Takes a minute to jack the car to reach it... I wonder if I got some Rhino ramps if it would be any easier..

If yours is going in full time - looks like it - there is a lot of room down there, I would just mention to plan your wiring well... axle and road debris dangers ;) I don't think it's a huge problem but you'll obviously want to shield your cabling well.

B.

Right up next to the transmission and then over to the driverside. I wire tie the plug to the coolant sensor on the back of the head so that it doesn't bounce around, also makes it easy to swap sensors.

[AudiRacerS4]

Right up next to the transmission and then over to the driverside. I wire tie the plug to the coolant sensor on the back of the head so that it doesn't bounce around, also makes it easy to swap sensors.

ok so i'm going to put it right after the flex pipe in the DP, also is the wire long enough to reach or does it have to be extended?

[mike-2ptzero]

ok so i'm going to put it right after the flex pipe in the DP, also is the wire long enough to reach or does it have to be extended?

The LC1 cable + the 02 sensor cable should be long enough to make it.

[genecan]

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/s...C-1_Manual.pdf

Look at page 7 and 8!

[mike-2ptzero]

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/s...C-1_Manual.pdf

Look at page 7 and 8!

Problem with that is the cat is directly behind the turbo, back pressure and EGT's are too high for the 02 sensor between the turbo and cat. I guess its an ok place if you dont mind spending $75 often for new sensors.

[genecan]

Problem with that is the cat is directly behind the turbo, back pressure and EGT's are too high for the 02 sensor between the turbo and cat. I guess its an ok place if you dont mind spending $75 often for new sensors.

I agree with you and it is exactly what is written later in the manual. I guess the spot you are discussing in this thread is best for setups with testpipes, but for setups with HFC there is not much of a choise - people have to use this: http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/x...8&cat=0&page=1

[mike-2ptzero]

Well even if you put it after a HFC the readings are not going to be that far off from what it would be before the HFC. This can also be seen on a Vag com of the stock pre and post cat 02 sensors.

[genecan]

Well even if you put it after a HFC the readings are not going to be that far off from what it would be before the HFC. This can also be seen on a Vag com of the stock pre and post cat 02 sensors.

Hm... interesting approach.

So you say the voltage difference between the primary and the secondary stock O2 sensor is not that big at all. Are both O2 stock sensors absolutely identical?... otherwise such comparison may not be valuable.

Secondly one should assess the cat/HFC effect on this difference (∆U) throughout the whole rpm range:

1. If the difference stays the same (i.e. the absolute ∆U is constant for different gas flows), then the scenario is very acceptable for tuning/monitoring, just the tuner/driver have to keep in mind that what he sees must be corrected with the difference value;

2. If the ∆U/gas flow relation is linear (i.e. the ∆U changes with some sort of coefficient for different gas flows), then scenario might be still good for tuning, but I think it is too much math for casual driving monitoring;

3. If the ∆U/gas flow relation is non-linear, then I think everything gets too complicated for tuning and for monitoring.

Does anyone have any real life observation on these issues?

[mike-2ptzero]

Have to remember that all dyno shops read AFR at the tail pipe and those readings are pretty close to what would be seen further up stream, only difference is that the reading is slightly delayed in the rpm.

[genecan]

Probably all my concerns from above are ignorable as in absolute values these A/F deviations could be too small compared to the A/F value itself.

I am not sure about that, but regardless the correct answers it would be interesting to see some real numbers.

Offtopic: Mike, speaking about tuning at shops with WB at the tailpipe you said there is a delay of the real RPM for which a current A/F is read. How tuners correct/compensate this? May be this delay is ignorable too?

[mike-2ptzero]

Probably all my concerns from above are ignorable as in absolute values these A/F deviations could be too small compared to the A/F value itself.

I am not sure about that, but regardless the correct answers it would be interesting to see some real numbers.

Offtopic: Mike, speaking about tuning at shops with WB at the tailpipe you said there is a delay of the real RPM for which a current A/F is read. How tuners correct/compensate this? May be this delay is ignorable too?

Well I am sure that delay is not big enough to cause a issue while tuning a car.

[JumboBlack1.8]

I wish I had started a thread like this before I installed mine.....I put it an inch after the secondary o2 on custom DP (~12" from turbo).....now I get the E-8 error which means the sensor is too hot. So now I've gotta relocate the wideband o2 which succkkkks.......So, a lesson to everyone, make sure it is at LEAST 18" back

[Sigma 3]

Please forgive the jack, but id ther a wideband/ boost guage available ? I thoguht I saw one blink across the advertiser banner oncebut im not sure?

TIA

[mike-2ptzero]

Please forgive the jack, but id ther a wideband/ boost guage available ? I thoguht I saw one blink across the advertiser banner oncebut im not sure?

TIA

You might have seen the PODI gauge.

[B5Burn]

Don't know of the quality but have seen these around

VEI Gauges

[t1demont1]

Im relocating my wideband to the bottom of the downpipe this week. and putting the primary 02 where my wideband was. My primary is like an inch from the turbo and i think its causing some problems with the tune a little.

[lowandslow4now]

sorry for jackin but if you have a catless setup and software that eliminates the second O2 sensore can you use that location

[Sigma 3]

Don't know of the quality but have seen these around

VEI Gauges

Thank you sir thats what im looking for.

[AudiRacerS4]

hooked up the LC-1 today took about 30 min to install and that included welding in the o2 bung right before the flex pipe on the DP. I give it a 3-10 difficulty wise if you are mechanically inclined. I needed to hook up 5 wires and weld in an o2 bung. If you cant weld a muffler shop can do this for you for about $15-30. So far I'm very pleased with the LC-1 it seems to be very accurate so far. Here are my readings so far...

Readings:

WOT: 10.8-11.6
Deceleration: 22.4
Crusing: 13.8-14.8
Idle: 14.2-15.1

[mike-2ptzero]

Numbers sound good.

[AudiRacerS4]

Numbers sound good.

alright so i guess everything is good. The install went too smooth so i thought i might have messed it up