Driveline insert options RS5

[Ape Factory]

Curious what driveline inserts people have gone with and which seems to be the best bang for the buck.

I'm looking at a few "kits" which have the transmission insert along with four differential inserts. Problem is, I already have the Apikol rear diff mount. http://www.apikol.com/index.php/prod...-mount-b8.html

I'm not sure which mount the Apikol is actually and I'm not sure if "upgrading the other mount(s) is worth it if I have the Apikol. Here's a diagram of how the rear diff mounts in the subframe...


They list it as a "rear" differential mount but I see two mounts in that diagram above (#8 bolt plus the duplicate on other side which is not labeled with a number). Not sure if they're referring to the entire "rear differential" in reference but it looks like #1.

With that said, I'm assuming there are parts of the "kits" which would be redundant given that I have the Apikol but I'm not sure which part. I see three offered, 034 solid, ECS with polyurethane and Forge, which are also solid like the 034's but are about $50 less expensive for the entire kit. If I end up not needing part of the kit, I'd probably just add the rear subframe inserts and buy only what I need (transmission insert plus one of the diff inserts).

With the above options, I'm debating whether to go poly or solid. ECS says no increase in NVH with their kit and I've heard even the solid kits really don't introduce anything either. Poly will eventually wear whereas metal will not. I do not want a significant increase in NVH.

Lastly, since I'm lowered and running H&R sways, I'm debating going with adjustable front swaybar links. I've heard aftermarket units tend to make a lot of noise on our cars but I can't imagine my sways are loaded correctly with the front OEM mount. Passing on the rear adjustable links as no one offers an adjustable version.

Feedback from track or aggressive street/canyon carvers much appreciated.

[ffearless]

From the posts I've read, NVH is a real issue for folks using the solid inserts. Based on that, I installed the ECS polyurethane inserts, and as tight as they go in, I doubt they will wear. I have not experienced any NVH.

2014 Estoril Blue RS5, loaded, 034 Motorsport X-Brace and rear anti sway bar, CR-15 strut tower brace, ECStuning transmission and differential inserts, carbon fiber mirror housings, LED backup lights, VAG COMM mods, mid-resonator delete, true dual exhaust

[HMS]

NVH anyone?

[julianwhitta]

Running 034 front and rear diff mount inserts. No noticeable increase in NVH. That said, these things aren’t the quietest cars in the world, aluminium being the excellent noise transmitter that it is. I think you’d be hard pressed to pick a noticeable difference no matter what kind of insert you used.

[Mops@Nemesis]

I ran the Apikol blue on my A5 and never noticed any added NVH. I've also run every 034 mount offered on the A5, SQ, S3 and S4. Maybe the expected click and clunk now and then, but I kind of like that. Overall, nothing notable. But I always run intakes and pipes too.

[s vier]

I have been collecting all the braces, mounts inserts and stiffeners offered over the last two years. A few are in and a bunch to go. I learned my lessons on a B5 S4 with installing too many at once: “What is that whine?!?” On the RS5 I slowwwwwly introduce a new one and drive it for a while. Then try another. If it adds anything negative I am Comfortable removing it and trying the next option. Here’s how it sits currently:

Installed:
Trans Brace (Like it)
CR-15 (Like it)
Rear Diff carrier inserts (Like it)

Not yet Installed:
Alukruz
O34 Sway
034 solid end links
034 Sub frame inserts
Apikol Rear Diff Mount
034 Trans mount

Nothing bad so far. I’m leary about the solid sway bar end links being noisy though.

[Mops@Nemesis]

My links have been in for around 1.5 years. Still silent


Moppers on da move

[JamesRS5]

I have the ECS polyurethane kit installed, main reason for going with these was from an engineering/physics point of view. Polyurethane still has some compliance and will absorb vibration and movement where a solid bush will just transmit that energy somewhere else further along and create vibrations in the item the bushes were designed to isolate.

[JoshDub]

I have an aluminum insert for the trans mount. They can be had on ebay for at little at $15. Mine added no NVH when I installed.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Aluminum-Tr...pZ-q~Y&vxp=mtr

[Ape Factory]

Since I already have the Apikol (blue) mount, is it honestly worth adding any additional differential inserts? I've not driven the car without so I can't say how much it's helped one way or the other.

JoshDub, thanks for the link. For $15, I can try it and make a decision from there.

James, makes sense! I was actually leaning towards the ECS set overall but wanted some feedback.

I have CR-15 and I didn't notice much of a change, maybe a bit less prone to tramline.

HMS, NVH=noise vibration and harshness.

S Vier, you have WAY more patience than I could every hope to have. I don't know how you do it.

[Drew0u812]

Am running the ECS tuning complete drivetrain mount kit and I do notice a soft whine that seems to be coming from the rear diff.
The sound is soft enough to be ignored and I also do not hear it at higher speeds like when cruising on the Freeway, it's most noticeable around the 50-65 MPH range.
My A5 has complete stock exhaust, the whine may not be so audible with an aftermarket exhaust.

[Jezza]

Check out powerflex. The have complete bushing replacements for the same price the other are selling inserts.

https://powerflexusa.com/audiS72007.aspx

Sent from my SM-G930VL using Audizine mobile app

[s vier]

My links have been in for around 1.5 years. Still silent


Moppers on da move

This is news I like to hear!

[Mops@Nemesis]

This is news I like to hear!

The 034 solid rear bar with endlinks is HUGE. Did wonders for the SQ.

[JamesRS5]

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...Audi-A5-S5-RS5

The ECS kit certainly makes a difference, especially in dynamic mode where it feels a lot less like there’s a piano loose in the trunk. No vibration felt at any time, only a very slight whine from the diff at approximately 30mph, mainly on overrun or light throttle.

[Ape Factory]

Check out powerflex. The have complete bushing replacements for the same price the other are selling inserts.

https://powerflexusa.com/audiS72007.aspx

Sent from my SM-G930VL using Audizine mobile app

I've seen the Powerflex stuff for other cars, didn't even dawn on me they make stuff for Audi. After looking over their products, I was really interested in the subframe poly bushings which are complete replacements for the factory items. I looked up the procedure for replacing them and I have to say I will not be doing that any time soon! It's a major amount of work.

But the two piece transmission insert looks cool along with a few other things. Nice they have replacements for just about every bushing on the B8.

[Ape Factory]

Ok...so after doing a bit more research, if you have the Apikol rear differential bushing, that's the front mount on the front side of the rear differential. I contacted ECS and they didn't know as they didn't carry the Apikol bushing. BUT, from 034's installation guide, you can clearly see the front mount on the rear differential is shaped the same as the Apikol in their photos. The two rear mounts on the rear differential are the ones that I can still upgrade and look nothing like the front mount on the rear differential. Feel like this is an episode of who's on first.

[Ape Factory]

Ok...pulled the trigger on the following;
-034 Motorsports solid rear subframe mounts (looking forward to these the most)
-034 Motorsports Density Line strut mounts
-ECS Tuning adjustable front swaybar end links
-ECS Tuning rear bushing differential mount inserts

I may try to just do the subframe mounts first in the interest of science. Honestly, there's about a less than 1% chance that'll actually happen. More than likely, I'll install all on the same day.

I also have an eBay, China ripoff special trans insert. If I like it, I'll order the ECS unit just because and because it has a poly insert. Slightly tempted by the two-piece Powerflex unit as it sandwiches everything in. I know it'll take a lot more work to install though. I do like to support the locals.

I spread the love and ordered from JHM and ECS :)

[6ixof1]

My first mod was the CR-15 for a noticeable difference. Front end stayed flatter when cornering.
Next came a Stasis RSB and solid endlinks which improved rotation even more.
I jumped on the 034 Motorsport X Brace group buy. That seriously improves steering close to neutral.

I'm waiting for good weather to install the ECS rear diff mounts and trans mount. I also have the JHM short shifter - which I'll probably do first. Trying to decide if I should keep the stock knob. I'm stoked to tighten up the drivetrain!

[JamesRS5]

Did you really think the front stays flatter in cornering after the CR15 install?

[wkhanna]

my A5 did not experiance less body roll when i installed the CR-15....

....it did (& still does) make less 'creaking' noise the first time i backed out of my driveway across the small curb.
....turn-in response felt quicker, too
....also, noticeable improvement in tracking stability in medium & higher speed turns.

jmho.... ymmv....

[6ixof1]

@JamesRS5 I tend to take turns as fast as possible, so yes. I also autox'd and was able to point and shoot where I wanted the car to go.. After installing the RSB I tracked it and am pretty happy with the turn in. Compared to when I first got the car the steering was vague. I admit this is all subjective though.

[JamesRS5]

I agree it definitely reduces flex at the front but there was no real noticeable change in handling or the cars body roll through corners.

[JoshDub]

I also noticed better turn in and response, but I don't see how it would impact body roll.

[wkhanna]

I also noticed better turn in and response, but I don't see how it would impact body roll.

this....

a stiffer sway (stabilizer) bar will reduce body roll by offering resistance in the longitudinal movement of the chassis....
the CR-15 stiffens the chassis, reducing flex, which 'tightens' the feedback felt thru the steering wheel....
there is a reduction in latency between steering input & the reaction of the chassis to that input.....

[Ape Factory]

The CR15 isn't attached to any pivot points like a roll bar so it doesn't have the same type of effect. Only three ways to reduce body roll as we traditionally think of it; sways, spring rate and damping rates. You could throw tire sidewall deflection in there as well. The CR15 is a chassis brace, plain and simple.

[Ape Factory]

Was under the car today adding the 034 subframe inserts and took a photo of the front bushing for the rear differential. This is the Apikol replacement bushing. The ECS inserts for the rear bushings for the rear differential and front sway bar end links are scheduled to arrive on Wednesday.

[Ape Factory]

Box full of parts arrived today. ECS differential inserts, ECS front sway end links, and 034 Motorsports density line front strut mounts. The transmission insert should arrive tomorrow.



The ECS end links look and feel stout and well made. They should be a nice addition. I'm not convinced on the ECS rear differential mounts, the polyurethane is very flexible but their description states a "significant" reduction in differential movement so we'll see! I wasn't convinced subframe inserts would make much of a difference but they did. One set of S-curves says so. Really nice ECS includes the bolts.


The 034 density line front strut mounts are about as unsexy as you can get but from what I've read, they make a difference. Just do them when you upgrade the suspension as it'll be a major pain to install these after the fact mostly due to Audi using stretch bolts on everything.

I'll get the differential mounts in fairly quickly but the strut mounts and end links will take a while mostly because I have to source a small army of bolts and a few tools to complete the job.

[JamesRS5]

The sway bar links look nice, how are you going to set the length on these?

[Ape Factory]

I'm going to put the car on four ramps so the car is off the ground, the suspension is loaded at ride height and then adjust for zero preload. As close as I can get so there's no play. I really need a lift in my garage.

[wkhanna]

i will be installing my front & rear eruocode front & rear bars with their billet adjustable hemi links soon, also....

their installation instructions say "set the adjustable link length to match the oem link length"....

your method makes way more sense to me, especially if there have been any changes to the suspension/wheels.....

[Ape Factory]

It'l work Bill. I have the OEM end links on there now with the H&R sways. Probably not ideal in terms of suspension setup but that's why I'm doing it this way. You could have an alignment shop put it up on the rack later and adjust it for you. It'd probably take them five minutes. It's a pain getting all four wheels off the ground evenly!

[Ape Factory]

Ebay knockoff special tranny insert.

[JamesRS5]

I'm going to put the car on four ramps so the car is off the ground, the suspension is loaded at ride height and then adjust for zero preload. As close as I can get so there's no play. I really need a lift in my garage.

I had to add and extra half inch to my rear right spring height to get the car sitting correctly, I’ve set it to 68cm (26.7”) Front and 69cm (27.1”) Rear, I wouldn’t have seen this with the car up in the air. This DRC suspension is confusing, depressurize the system and the car settles to a ride height, we adjusted the height at that, you then pressurize both accumulators in the rear to 19 Bar and the ride height changes with the rear right 1/2” lower than the rest.

I’m with you on having a lift in the garage, when I finally leave this place and move back to a real life (possibly in Sweden) I’ll be getting one of these installed http://www.automotechservices.co.uk/...-scissor-lift/

[Ape Factory]

The DRC seems like it's a pain in the ass! That would frustrate me to no end. especially if it wasn't consistent when you pressurized the system.

I'm making plans to have the car corner weighted when I swap the tires. I think the rear end is too low. Since I've adjusted the tire pressure, I'm getting understeer despite the larger rear bar and I may go to the firmer setting. My other option is to run equal pressure, or closer to it, rear vs. front.

[JamesRS5]

It’s a great system, just takes some adjusting to get everything squared up.

What camber are you running at the front?

[Ape Factory]

Off the top of my head 1.4 degrees.

[JamesRS5]

It it turn in under steer or corner exit under power?

[Ape Factory]

There’s always a bit when you throw it into a corner at low speed but this was a powering out situation that caught me a bit off guard.

[JamesRS5]

I find I can make it understeer more with the traction control turned off, I’m guessing it isn’t nipping the brakes to pull the front end in as much if at all?

I remember watching an old Top Gear back in the UK when the RS5 was first released, Clarkson was complaining how badly the car understeered as he gave it full throttle through tight corners, I’m sure this is where the car developed it’s reputation for terrible understeer.
He had the traction control off on that test.
I think if you let the smart computer do it’s thing it actually does it really well.