Steering Issues - 2013

[visualguy]

anyone without the issue????

No issue with the steering on mine - 2013 S5.

[visualguy]

I am curious why not all 2013 B8 owners are experiencing this issue. so far it seems to be a handful of folks without any obvious pattern. This may take a while to sort out, but at least they are aware of it and researching possible solutions. I would think we will hear something in the next month or so.

Some folks who aren't experiencing the issue yet may experience it in the future... It seems that it doesn't always show up right away when the car is new.

[handruin]

I do feel a sensation of a empty "floaty" spot in the wheel while driving on the highway. It hasn't felt alarming but I do notice it more now that I'm aware. I'll be asking my dealer about it when I bring it in and see if mine needs the TSB software update.

[kooltechie]

JohnEnglish, au5, visualguy added to the "no issue" list.
Thx!

[Pilfer]

What is the number referencing the software update for the electronic steering? I want to make sure I ask my SA about it before I take delivery.

[foobert]

You can add me to the no issues at this time list. Unsure of build date, will check and edit. I took delivery in late Sept. and have to say the drive home that night from the dealer felt loose-ish on the highway, enough that I was weirded out but not overly concerned. That was literally the first, last, and only time I ever felt or noticed anything odd w/steering response at any speeds since, including the drive to work the next morning.

I wonder how ambient temps play into this whole scenario? We haven't had overnight temps < 50ish, and only 1-2 nights thus far this winter, w/daytime highs no lower than 65 or so, most days 75-80's. In addition, my commute is ~45 miles round trip, 99% of that highway at speeds usually > 75. I'm curious if those who don't have the issue drive 1) in warmer weather, and 2) longer (say > 15 mile) trips at a time, with some or most of those miles at higher than surface street speeds. Just something to think about, as "adaptive" control system software could be affected in unexpected ways depending upon operating conditions and usage patterns.

edit: ~4200 miles on the odo

[thedollardoctor]

Well, the fact that it resets itself by restarting would point to an electrical or programming fault of some kind. Any type of mechanical defect is not going to fix itself with a reboot.

I have thought the same thing! In fact my tech initially said HE thought it was a faulty steering angle sensor (another guy on here who is a former Audi tech eluded to thinking the same thing. It definetly "feels" like an electronic issue, not a structural or mechanical issue. I agree if it were mechanical it would likely be more consistent.

[au5]

What is the number referencing the software update for the electronic steering? I want to make sure I ask my SA about it before I take delivery.

Check out post #45 in this thread for the actual update codes. Although your SA should have this based on your VIN whether or not this is needed.

[Pilfer]

Thank you.

[BzzzBom]

Maybe I am an older and crappier driver than most posters on this thread but IMO this situation is more than an inconvenience. It is dangerous - several times on the freeway I have over corrected and moved into the adjacent lane. I think the safety aspect is the best way to get the attention of Audi of America. I also agree with previous posters who feel that this is a software or sensor issue rather than hardware.

[visualguy]

I also agree with previous posters who feel that this is a software or sensor issue rather than hardware.

Sensors are hardware...

[Mrads]

seeing more B8.5 owners with the steering issue is quite upsetting and disappointing.
it might be helpful to list who has the issue vs. who does not, so we can see how widespread this issue is (though limited to AZ only).

would everyone with B8.5 A4/S4/A5/S5 please list your id accordingly?
thx!

B8.5 w/ steering issue
1. Bclippard
2. thedollardoctor
3. kooltechie
4. BzzzBom
5. msngrey13s4
6. sjones630
7. Stereodude
8. stactum
9. bbhbba
10. TayTay
11. thirddecay
12. Bdawson
13. treginginco
14. holmes4
15. spl1011
16. u2nelson
17. Tvall13
18. kenglehardt
19. mrjoco
20. a5sport
21. SixShifter




B8.5 w/o steering issue
1. offthewall
2. proman
3. JohnEnglish
4. au5
5. visualguy

Add mrads to the list of problem cars.

Edit: 09/12 built date

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[guestlinger]

no issue for me

nov12 build. 2700 miles. no dynamic steering option. i drive lots of cold (freezing) short journeys too. have sports diff / ads

[kooltechie]

Mrads, foobert, guestlinger added to the appropriate list.
Thx!

[CharlieG]

seeing more B8.5 owners with the steering issue is quite upsetting and disappointing.
it might be helpful to list who has the issue vs. who does not, so we can see how widespread this issue is (though limited to AZ only).

would everyone with B8.5 A4/S4/A5/S5 please list your id accordingly?
thx!

Add CharlieG to the currently unaffected list. My build date is 9/12.

Thanks!

[Elitex]

Add EliteX to the problem list. So far I've felt it one time, and in my mind I was like WTF just happened? I am really not liking the EPS, both my cars have it and I think manufacturers are taking a step back.

[BzzzBom]

Sensors are hardware...

Sorry -- I meant to say software or sensor issue but not steering rack

[stactum]

Maybe I am an older and crappier driver than most posters on this thread but IMO this situation is more than an inconvenience. It is dangerous - several times on the freeway I have over corrected and moved into the adjacent lane. I think the safety aspect is the best way to get the attention of Audi of America. I also agree with previous posters who feel that this is a software or sensor issue rather than hardware.

+1

Completely agree with you. Couple of days ago while entering the highway I passed truck and quickly changed lines to the left to move in between 2 trucks and while doing that almost shit my pants (excuse my french) since felt NO STEERING whatsoever I felt like I am on the boat.


I do believe we need to do something as a group - send a petition to Audi or do something but I just can't drive like that. And I agree with posters here, some days issue is more pronounced than others - like this morning I haven't felt it that much, but sometimes it's just plain annoying.

[S4dad]

+1

Completely agree with you. Couple of days ago while entering the highway I passed truck and quickly changed lines to the left to move in between 2 trucks and while doing that almost shit my pants (excuse my french) since felt NO STEERING whatsoever I felt like I am on the boat.


I do believe we need to do something as a group - send a petition to Audi or do something but I just can't drive like that. And I agree with posters here, some days issue is more pronounced than others - like this morning I haven't felt it that much, but sometimes it's just plain annoying.

What about this?
https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/index.cfm

NHTSA Office of Defects Investigation

Taken from the website:
"Why your complaint is important

Your complaint information will be entered into NHTSA-ODI's vehicle owner's complaint database and used with other complaints to determine if a safety-related defect trend exists. More...

•If a safety-related defect exists in a motor vehicle or item of motor vehicle equipment, the manufacturer must provide a remedy at no cost to the owner. Your complaint is the first step in the process.
•We do not have to receive a specific number of complaints before we look into a problem. We gather all available information on a problem. Your complaint is important to us."

If enough folks make the complaint, especially citing safety concerns, NHTSA might put pressure on Audi to look into it, or expedite it if they're already doing so.

[jg 4/c]

I'm pretty sure you can ad me to the "no issue" list... however, it feels like I'm having the mild version of this issue. Unless, it's just the nature of the EPS...

Build date is 8/12. Picked up the car 10/6. Currently 1,700 miles. No dynamic steering option. No notchy feeling at all. From day one, at speed on the highway,
there is that mild, float that requires more correcting than I'd like to keep the car on track. Alu Kreuz (only mod) helped take out the slop and improved the
steering, but not a permanent solution. SA confirmed that the steering update was done on the car before I picked it up, assuming at the factory.

Thanks to all who are posting... here's to a speedy, permanent solution....such a great car, shame we have to deal with a steering issue like this.

[Killaapp]

guys, I have a 2011 B8 S4 and I have been experiencing this EXACT problem for the last ~year. Was told it was due to the car being out of alignment but I've had it realigned 3 times and of course it still persists. Only happens when I'm actively pressing the gas pedal on the highway... does my B8 have the same steering hardware as the B8.5?

[visualguy]

guys, I have a 2011 B8 S4 and I have been experiencing this EXACT problem for the last ~year. Was told it was due to the car being out of alignment but I've had it realigned 3 times and of course it still persists. Only happens when I'm actively pressing the gas pedal on the highway... does my B8 have the same steering hardware as the B8.5?

No, it's completely different.

[boss2k]

i believe the issue is happening only on freeways and i haven't driven much yet on freeways. Let me drive more on freeways and report back. I really want to know whether my car has the issue or not.

[kooltechie]

CharlieG, jg 4/c, EliteX added to the appropriate list.
thx!

[kooltechie]

i believe the issue is happening only on freeways and i haven't driven much yet on freeways. Let me drive more on freeways and report back. I really want to know whether my car has the issue or not.

the issue is NOT limited to the freeway driving only.
it's more noticeable on freeway, but it also happens on local streets at much lower speeds.
I've experienced it at 20-25mph a few times.

[kooltechie]

quick update on the list:

23 owners with the steering issue

9 owners without the issue

btw, the shop foreman told me the steering rack costs more than $3,000.
to replace the steering rack on 23 cars, it'll cost Audi $70,000 for parts.
with an assumption that dealers will take at least a day to install the replacement parts at $100+/hr for labor, that's $18,400 ($800 x 23 cars).
so it'll cost Audi $90,000 at the minimum to repair our 23 cars.
however, if the replacement steering rack is not the fix to the issue, then I'm sure some of us will take a legal action and Audi will have to buy back more than a handful number of cars, each at $60,000.
Audi will lose a lot of money and their reputation....remember what happened to Toyota?

[stactum]

quick update on the list:

23 owners with the steering issue

9 owners without the issue

So what's the plan? What are we going to do with this information?

[BzzzBom]

quick update on the list:

23 owners with the steering issue

9 owners without the issue

Are you pulling owners from the S5 forum also?

[kooltechie]

Are you pulling owners from the S5 forum also?

I've added a few S5 owners based on the similar thread in A5/S5/RS5 section, but I'm sure there are more.

[13S4]

Count me for no issue please. You should start a poll thread? it's much easier to keep a tally.

[Jimmy Dark]

What about this?
https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/index.cfm

NHTSA Office of Defects Investigation

Taken from the website:
"Why your complaint is important

Your complaint information will be entered into NHTSA-ODI's vehicle owner's complaint database and used with other complaints to determine if a safety-related defect trend exists. More...

•If a safety-related defect exists in a motor vehicle or item of motor vehicle equipment, the manufacturer must provide a remedy at no cost to the owner. Your complaint is the first step in the process.
•We do not have to receive a specific number of complaints before we look into a problem. We gather all available information on a problem. Your complaint is important to us."

If enough folks make the complaint, especially citing safety concerns, NHTSA might put pressure on Audi to look into it, or expedite it if they're already doing so.

I think this is the right track. I would expect Audi to respond more quickly to anything that remotely resembles a model and/or sub-system 'safety issue'. Faulty and/or inconsistent steering could be a potential contributor to an accident resulting in injury and or death.

Back in the late eighties, Audi's sales collapsed on reports of 'unintended acceleration' in the 5000 models... from 74k units in 1984 to 12k by 1991. I owned a 5000T at the time and while I never thought the issue was real (NHTSA findings exonerated Audi), they did issue a recall where an brake interlock was installed (had to push the brake pedal to put the car into gear). Audi is doing very well in the U.S. market today. They don't want another '5000 unintended acceleration issue' to arise now. Based on the consistent descriptions of the problem here on AZ, it is clear a steering issue exists. They just need to get on it with ZF or whoever supplies the EPS. If it were me, in addition to the actual symptom conditions, I would be advising my dealer and AoA that the steering feels 'unsafe'.

Been watching this thread closely as I have a car on order and I don't have the time nor inclination to babysit a problematic vehicle. Kudos to you all for communicating amongst one another, working to define the problem from the user perspective, and pushing for a resolution.

[kooltechie]

So what's the plan? What are we going to do with this information?

not sure....I for one would like to hear from Audi IF the replacement steering rack is the fix.
should we start filing complaints via NHTSA as S4dad mentioned?

[Sjones630]

the issue is NOT limited to the freeway driving only.
it's more noticeable on freeway, but it also happens on local streets at much lower speeds.
I've experienced it at 20-25mph a few times.

+1

I have a nice sweeping corner near my home (signage says it's a 45 mph corner: 50-60 mph if you're feeling sporty). Recently, the car has begun "tugging" through the steering as I drive through the corner. Definitely not your typical freeway tram lining.

[kooltechie]

Count me for no issue please. You should start a poll thread? it's much easier to keep a tally.

maybe so....but thought keeping everything here in this thread would be better?

added to the list.
thx!

[handruin]

maybe so....but thought keeping everything here in this thread would be better?

added to the list.
thx!

Please add me to the list of noticing the issue also. I plan to ask my dealer about it soon.

[kooltechie]

Please add me to the list of noticing the issue also. I plan to ask my dealer about it soon.

added.
thx!

[gpwizard]

Add me to the list. 2013 s4 Avant with 6k on the clock. It has had the steering issue described for about the last 2k. I thought I was going mad, it seems more noticeable when I change modes I.e dynamic to individual etc.

It's quite disconcerting driving with this dead area/notch effect and I will discuss with my local dealer on its first service.

Thanks for your help with this guys.

[guestlinger]

I read the following on the S5 forum. Does it help the S4 guys here with this problem:

Kris on another forum is at the beginning of a test run with a new allroad and in another thread says he's experiencing the same issue.

He said he's doing a "lock to lock" steering wheel turn when he first starts up the test car and that seems to help a lot.

I've tried this for two days now and I'll be damned.... it does appear to work on significantly minimizing (almost completely disappearing) the notchiness.

That said... we shouldn't have to turn the steering wheel lock to lock every time we start the car.... but until a fix is found... this is making the car much more liveable.

[kooltechie]

Add me to the list. 2013 s4 Avant with 6k on the clock. It has had the steering issue described for about the last 2k. I thought I was going mad, it seems more noticeable when I change modes I.e dynamic to individual etc.

It's quite disconcerting driving with this dead area/notch effect and I will discuss with my local dealer on its first service.

Thanks for your help with this guys.

added....#25 on the list.
thx!

[spl1011]

So I had an interesting conversation with my SM today.
I have another appt on monday to have another rack installed. Ive delayed it already and am still on the fence about it.
In our chat I asked if there were any new TSB's, any new parts in the pipeline, etc... nope. Nothing new.
He did share that the TSM did find something interesting when they would shut down and restart the car. If you recall from my posts (and sorry if I am in the wrong site/forum) but I noticed that stopping, removing the key, and restarting my car would solve my notchiness problem. So the tech did that and said he noticed something different in the data between starts.
Granted, on the paperwork its noted that they could not duplicate the problem.

So, not sure if I want to deal with the hassle of dropping my car off to get another rack installed. What do you guys think?
Mind you they have already nicked the steering wheel and did 2 alignments and my wheel is still crooked.