More TD1 info?

**audisarecool** · 03-21-2012 07:46 AM

Just wanted to share this with you guys and hear some thoughts..

So I had the squeaking brake TSB done on monday and my SA called me today saying he needs me to bring the car back and leave it with him for an hour because "diagnostic information" needs to be pulled and sent over to Audi.

Apparently Audi isn't paying dealers for warranty work if the car isn't hooked up to the OBDII port and diagnostics sent to Audi. Seems awfully suspicious considering all the recent developments regarding TD1 markings.

Now my SA is a close friend, so I already spoke to him about all the TD1 nonsense and "automatic reporting" that is supposed to be happening. He continues to re-assure me that I have nothing to worry about and even if the car is flagged as TD1, that Stasis will cover any issues.

As it stands now, my car does not have the TD1 notation in elsaweb, however I'm willing to bet that it will shortly after this scan..

I'm thinking maybe this is my chance to strong arm the dealer into putting on paper that they will cover any warranty claims that Audi might refuse based on all of this.. and maybe put some clause in there regarding a certain time limit for repair to avoid having any long standoff between the dealer and stasis should a warranty issue come up.

Thoughts?

**ENV²** · 03-21-2012 07:53 AM

Don't take it back. Say you are busy

**helix139** · 03-21-2012 08:17 AM

If they are going to insist on unnecessary diagnostics they better not be charging customers labor for it.

**audisarecool** · 03-21-2012 08:22 AM

Originally Posted by BaLLZDeePNYC

Don't take it back. Say you are busy

Well there is no avoiding this, its going to have to go back eventually..whether its going to be this time or next time..

Originally Posted by helix139

If they are going to insist on unnecessary diagnostics they better not be charging customers labor for it.

I'm not being charged anything, I'd lose it if I was charged labor for something like this.

**A4Blitzkrieg** · 03-21-2012 08:40 AM

Originally Posted by helix139

If they are going to insist on unnecessary diagnostics they better not be charging customers labor for it.

Agreed, but what about your time? S4 owners generally have fairly well paying jobs. Why does Audi think you are willing to give up several hours of your time/labor at work (or valuable free time on a weekend) to come into the dealership for a diagnostic that is completely unnecessary for the customer? This is a weird situation.

**wwhan** · 03-21-2012 08:59 AM

Originally Posted by A4Blitzkrieg

Agreed, but what about your time? S4 owners generally have fairly well paying jobs. Why does Audi think you are willing to give up several hours of your time/labor at work (or valuable free time on a weekend) to come into the dealership for a diagnostic that is completely unnecessary for the customer? This is a weird situation.

Let it go, relax, it will set you free. Why fight it?

Focusing on this just brings more strees and anxiety.

**memphis_s4** · 03-21-2012 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by wwhan

Let it go, relax, it will set you free. Why fight it?

Focusing on this just brings more strees and anxiety.

"Take the blue pill, you wake in your bed and you believe whatever you want to believe. Take the red pill...see how deep the rabbit hole goes"

**Brooklyn** · 03-21-2012 11:05 AM

Why would your dealer agree to this? In what possible way could you strong arm them?

Originally Posted by audisarecool

I'm thinking maybe this is my chance to strong arm the dealer into putting on paper that they will cover any warranty claims that Audi might refuse based on all of this.. and maybe put some clause in there regarding a certain time limit for repair to avoid having any long standoff between the dealer and stasis should a warranty issue come up.

Thoughts?

**throwaway1** · 03-21-2012 11:05 AM

Countdown until this thread is locked or moved to chatterbox.......

**Axxlrod** · 03-21-2012 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by audisarecool

Just wanted to share this with you guys and hear some thoughts..

So I had the squeaking brake TSB done on monday and my SA called me today saying he needs me to bring the car back and leave it with him for an hour because "diagnostic information" needs to be pulled and sent over to Audi.

Apparently Audi isn't paying dealers for warranty work if the car isn't hooked up to the OBDII port and diagnostics sent to Audi. Seems awfully suspicious considering all the recent developments regarding TD1 markings.

Now my SA is a close friend, so I already spoke to him about all the TD1 nonsense and "automatic reporting" that is supposed to be happening. He continues to re-assure me that I have nothing to worry about and even if the car is flagged as TD1, that Stasis will cover any issues.

As it stands now, my car does not have the TD1 notation in elsaweb, however I'm willing to bet that it will shortly after this scan..

I'm thinking maybe this is my chance to strong arm the dealer into putting on paper that they will cover any warranty claims that Audi might refuse based on all of this.. and maybe put some clause in there regarding a certain time limit for repair to avoid having any long standoff between the dealer and stasis should a warranty issue come up.

Thoughts?

Why would your dealer offer to cover repairs that Audi won't? If something breaks, and Audi refuses to cover it, then asking Stasis to cover it seems like the only avenue you will have left. No?

**audisarecool** · 03-21-2012 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by Brooklyn

Why would your dealer agree to this? In what possible way could you strong arm them?

Well I'm hoping they will not need to be strong-armed, and that they'll agree to this willingly. I'm family friends with upper management there including GM and owner's family.

We've got a relationship with this dealer spanning close to 8 years that includes almost 10 cars purchased/leased. So a lot of my faith in everything working out is based on this relationship.

But I also know that relationship or not, they won't exactly eat up the cost of something expensive if Audi decided to deny coverage and the last thing I want is to get caught in between a tug of war between the dealer and stasis.

As it stands now, Audi will not pay the dealer for the brake tsb job until they get the diagnostic info from my car. If I need to strong arm them, I will put my serious face on and let them know that I will not bring the car in until they put something on paper. I'm hoping it won't get to that though.

Originally Posted by Axxlrod

Why would your dealer offer to cover repairs that Audi won't? If something breaks, and Audi refuses to cover it, then asking Stasis to cover it seems like the only avenue you will have left. No?

Yes, this is true. But considering how much work the dealer put in to push the stasis tune on me using the warranty as their selling point, there is no way I'd let them escape scotch free if something were to go horribly wrong.

Again, I may not have much choice... I'm just trying to protect myself as best as possible.

Thanks for all the responses, If a mod thinks this belongs in chatterbox, go ahead and move it..Just wanted to share this tidbit of info.

**CJ_S4** · 03-21-2012 11:34 AM

If the dealer had a large role in influencing you to buy the Stasis tune, then yes, I agree it makes sense to get the GM or SM to put something in writing saying they will cover repairs if AoA or Stasis doesn't. Should be easy if they told you off the bat that Stasis will cover "any issues".

I've been saying this from the beginning.

**audisarecool** · 03-21-2012 11:36 AM

Originally Posted by CJ_S4

If the dealer had a large role in influencing you to buy the Stasis tune, then yes, I agree it makes sense to get the GM or SM to put something in writing saying they will cover repairs if AoA or Stasis doesn't. Should be easy if they told you off the bat that Stasis will cover "any issues".

I've been saying this from the beginning.

Yep, my thoughts exactly.

**Axxlrod** · 03-21-2012 11:36 AM

Originally Posted by audisarecool

Well I'm hoping they will not need to be strong-armed, and that they'll agree to this willingly. I'm family friends with upper management there including GM and owner's family.

We've got a relationship with this dealer spanning close to 8 years that includes almost 10 cars purchased/leased. So a lot of my faith in everything working out is based on this relationship.

But I also know that relationship or not, they won't exactly eat up the cost of something expensive if Audi decided to deny coverage and the last thing I want is to get caught in between a tug of war between the dealer and stasis.

As it stands now, Audi will not pay the dealer for the brake tsb job until they get the diagnostic info from my car. If I need to strong arm them, I will put my serious face on and let them know that I will not bring the car in until they put something on paper. I'm hoping it won't get to that though.

Yes, this is true. But considering how much work the dealer put in to push the stasis tune on me using the warranty as their selling point, there is no way I'd let them escape scotch free if something were to go horribly wrong.

Again, I may not have much choice... I'm just trying to protect myself as best as possible.

Thanks for all the responses, If a mod thinks this belongs in chatterbox, go ahead and move it..Just wanted to share this tidbit of info.

I think a lot of dealers are going to have some very angry customers on their hands if Audi starts voiding warranties due to stasis products being on the car.

When I took a testdrive a few months ago, the salesguy was went on and on about the stasis products, and how I "just had" to do it because the stasis mods wouldn't affect my warranty, but any other mods I did would.

Many dealers might have to eat some crow now...

**S-Fore** · 03-21-2012 11:49 AM

Don't bring that thing to a dealer until its time to return it. The only issue is that, at this point, Stasis is the only tune without switching capabilities. Maybe APR will be fixing that soon though. Remember, NY State has no inspection for Lease Returns. I returned my B7 with GIAC. Loaded the stock map and dropped it off.

**ultra** · 03-21-2012 12:02 PM

ibtl and more head up info on TD1 check here http://www.facebook.com/td1crew

**willyspub** · 03-21-2012 12:43 PM

Why would this be moved to chatterbox? This is new information, and I don't think it's presumptuous to say that this is currently far and away the most interesting and concerning issue for users of this forum.

**CJ_S4** · 03-21-2012 12:50 PM

Originally Posted by willyspub

Why would this be moved to chatterbox? This is new information, and I don't think it's presumptuous to say that this is currently far and away the most interesting and concerning issue for users of this forum.

I agree. There is a small contingent that seems to be very dismissive of all of these threads. Believe it or not: There are other people out there who can "pay to play" but still care about keeping their factory powertrain warranty...who would have thunk it???

**throwaway1** · 03-21-2012 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by willyspub

Why would this be moved to chatterbox? This is new information, and I don't think it's presumptuous to say that this is currently far and away the most interesting and concerning issue for users of this forum.

I agree with you that it is very interesting and very important. It will be moved to chatterboc or locked, not because we the users don't like it, but because the sponsors don't like it. They'd rather you stop thinking about TD1 and just buy their stuff. And the owner is happy to comply obviously.

**Hokie S4** · 03-21-2012 01:17 PM

Originally Posted by throwaway1

I agree with you that it is very interesting and very important. It will be moved to chatterboc or locked, not because we the users don't like it, but because the sponsors don't like it. They'd rather you stop thinking about TD1 and just buy their stuff. And the owner is happy to comply obviously.

Agree 100%. The original TD1 thread I started was locked and the title was changed by the mods to make it look like a joke. Then I started another discussion regarding my car heading into the shop this week that was removed within hours. If more people voice both their interest in this topic and their issues with the mods moving/closing threads discussing it, maybe they'll manage to stay open.

Just an update, my car has been in the shop since yesterday at Audi of Tysons. They were able to determine that what may have looked like a diff leak was just uncollected oil from the filter housing dripping down the backside of the engine following an oil change and this was evaluated and concluded upon without pulling the TD1 excuse. It turned out to be nothing but they could have refused to even look at it as it presented as a diff leak. I am still waiting to hear back on my TCM update as there are discrepancies between what transmission is actually in the car and what Audi paperwork says I have. For some reason, my paperwork in the Audi system says I have a tiptronic transmission even though my TCM is correctly reporting I have an S-tronic. They can't do any kind of flash until this gets sorted out. Hope to have more info in the next day.

***Anthony*** · 03-21-2012 01:22 PM

Originally Posted by throwaway1

I agree with you that it is very interesting and very important. It will be moved to chatterboc or locked, not because we the users don't like it, but because the sponsors don't like it. They'd rather you stop thinking about TD1 and just buy their stuff. And the owner is happy to comply obviously.

Totally untrue. I didn't receive a single email, PM, or phone call from an Audizine sponsor for threads of this topic to be shut down. The last one was locked because it had gone completely off topic thanks to a few chatty members (for whatever reason). If this thread, and any thread, stays on topic and with useful information related to the platform, then they shall remain open and in the main forum.

**marty was here** · 03-21-2012 01:26 PM

Originally Posted by audisarecool

Just wanted to share this with you guys and hear some thoughts..

So I had the squeaking brake TSB done on monday and my SA called me today saying he needs me to bring the car back and leave it with him for an hour because "diagnostic information" needs to be pulled and sent over to Audi.

Apparently Audi isn't paying dealers for warranty work if the car isn't hooked up to the OBDII port and diagnostics sent to Audi. Seems awfully suspicious considering all the recent developments regarding TD1 markings.

Now my SA is a close friend, so I already spoke to him about all the TD1 nonsense and "automatic reporting" that is supposed to be happening. He continues to re-assure me that I have nothing to worry about and even if the car is flagged as TD1, that Stasis will cover any issues.

As it stands now, my car does not have the TD1 notation in elsaweb, however I'm willing to bet that it will shortly after this scan..

I'm thinking maybe this is my chance to strong arm the dealer into putting on paper that they will cover any warranty claims that Audi might refuse based on all of this.. and maybe put some clause in there regarding a certain time limit for repair to avoid having any long standoff between the dealer and stasis should a warranty issue come up.

Thoughts?

ive mentioned this before, the dealer has no liability towards your warranty or the parts they sell.

stasis, yes, and they gave you an explicit warranty already when you purchased the software.

**audisarecool** · 03-21-2012 01:29 PM

I set up a meeting with the GM tomorrow.

I'll report back.

**DUBSPORTN** · 03-21-2012 01:29 PM

Still allot of confusion. My dealers gm sm Sa and tech are telling me not to worry.
Time will tell

**tomh009** · 03-21-2012 02:38 PM

Originally Posted by Anthony

Totally untrue. I didn't receive a single email, PM, or phone call from an Audizine sponsor for threads of this topic to be shut down. The last one was locked because it had gone completely off topic thanks to a few chatty members (for whatever reason). If this thread, and any thread, stays on topic and with useful information related to the platform, then they shall remain open and in the main forum.

Thanks, Anthony. And agree about the other thread having derailed **** but maybe an alternative would have been to just delete the offending posts, without losing the rest of the thread as well? Just a suggestion, without knowing the mechanics of modern forum moderation ...

***Anthony*** · 03-21-2012 02:58 PM

Originally Posted by tomh009

Thanks, Anthony. And agree about the other thread having derailed **** but maybe an alternative would have been to just delete the offending posts, without losing the rest of the thread as well? Just a suggestion, without knowing the mechanics of modern forum moderation ...

But we didn't lose the thread. It's still there for all to see/read/review. There were just a lot of nonsense posts made towards the end, and frankly it had run its course. Leaving it open would not have helped matters, even if fully cleaned up.

**svander** · 03-21-2012 03:17 PM

Originally Posted by throwaway1

I agree with you that it is very interesting and very important. It will be moved to chatterboc or locked, not because we the users don't like it, but because the sponsors don't like it. They'd rather you stop thinking about TD1 and just buy their stuff. And the owner is happy to comply obviously.

**mdma2004** · 03-21-2012 06:57 PM

actually...it is a conspiracy against tuners...:)

I've gotten word from my master tech today that cars have to be connected to the system.

I had my car in for new tires + look into oil consumption cause my car likes to eat 1 qt every 3-4K. They had to send some data to audi...and audi flashed my shit...all my vag-com mods got wiped. Checked tune...apr switcher still works...but I bet soon I will be joining the TD1 club :)

**dawei213** · 03-21-2012 07:34 PM

Originally Posted by mdma2004

actually...it is a conspiracy against tuners...:)

I've gotten word from my master tech today that cars have to be connected to the system.

I had my car in for new tires + look into oil consumption cause my car likes to eat 1 qt every 3-4K. They had to send some data to audi...and audi flashed my shit...all my vag-com mods got wiped. Checked tune...apr switcher still works...but I bet soon I will be joining the TD1 club :)

Remember to add it to the list of mods in your sig! lol

I'll be doing the same if/when that time comes.

**patinsd** · 03-21-2012 07:58 PM

Originally Posted by mdma2004

actually...it is a conspiracy against tuners...:)

I've gotten word from my master tech today that cars have to be connected to the system.

I had my car in for new tires + look into oil consumption cause my car likes to eat 1 qt every 3-4K. They had to send some data to audi...and audi flashed my shit...all my vag-com mods got wiped. Checked tune...apr switcher still works...but I bet soon I will be joining the TD1 club :)

My car was at the dealer for 25k service today (I have Audi care)
They did what was recomended by Audi for that service.
I have a bunch of VAG mod and everything still there ,no change .
Since I have Stasis ECU ,I showed him some concern about loosing some of the warranty .
His answer was the same as OP general manager "don't panic ,we have a good relationship with Stasis and the fact they offered 4years 50k was the main reason with worked with them "
Last thing :my car was'nt flash today .

**Boostrules** · 03-22-2012 06:35 AM

It's too bad Audi has made it so hard to tune the S4 to what it's capable of. I've been tuning my Audi's since 2000 & almost pulled the trigger on a Revo flash in Feb. but had to bail due to work related issues. In retrospect I'm so glad I didn't because of the TD1 bullshit & possible ramifications to warranty repairs in the future. This is going to affect APR, GIAC & Revo as far as people doing this mod in the future. I doubt that the tune will adversly affect the car but the bottom line is if you have a major problem, Audi will deny the repair & blame it on the tune. I for 1 can't afford to void my warranty on a >$50,000 car for some additional horsepower above 5000 rpm's. I hope there is a way around the TD1 blackball in the future but until there is I will keep my car stock. To those of you who have flashed or otherwise modified your cars keep us posted to your experence with the warranty work going forward. Let hope Audi's stance is more bark then bite.

**NWS4Guy** · 03-22-2012 07:42 AM

Originally Posted by DUBSPORTN

Still allot of confusion. My dealers gm sm Sa and tech are telling me not to worry.
Time will tell

Because they haven't had this issue show up yet, as was reasoned before, Audi requires ALL cars now to be hooked up and scanned if the dealer wants Audi to pay for any work. Most likely they will still change the oil, check fluids, replace pollen filters and the like with a TD1 flag, however once it's flagged anything requiring work on the drivetrain will be refused.

**IanVr6** · 03-22-2012 08:04 AM

So it seems it is hard fact now that any tuned S4 will be refused of any drivetrain warranty work. Correct?

**NHS4** · 03-22-2012 08:25 AM

I'm curious if anyone has gotten feedback on the mods that aren't automatically detectable. Audi specifically calls out short-shifters which many have. Has anyone addressed that with their SA?

**A4Blitzkrieg** · 03-22-2012 08:28 AM

Originally Posted by IanVr6

So it seems it is hard fact now that any tuned S4 will be refused of any drivetrain warranty work. Correct?

Too early to draw that conclusion. It's a likely hypothesis but not yet proven out by fact.

**NWS4Guy** · 03-22-2012 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by NHS4

I'm curious if anyone has gotten feedback on the mods that aren't automatically detectable. Audi specifically calls out short-shifters which many have. Has anyone addressed that with their SA?

Search around, there was someone on here no long ago who had their transmission horked and the dealer said they wouldn't warranty it due to the short shifter. At the time, it was laughed at that the dealer was stupid for saying this, but in retrospect that could have been the canary in the coal mine.

** edit - found the post: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...ifter+warranty

**mdma2004** · 03-22-2012 10:44 AM

So found out today...my car was flaged as TD1, this sucks...so much for that 100K 5 year warranty

The good: you can still get the repair work done under warranty, but everything will be reviewed by audi of america...meaning 90% of warranty work under code TD1 will be denied. Ain't that some bullshit.

There ya go:

**mdma2004** · 03-22-2012 10:47 AM

Well, its about that time to add that TD1 mod...:) I need a badge on the back of the car..."TD1" instead of 'S4

Originally Posted by dawei213

Remember to add it to the list of mods in your sig! lol

I'll be doing the same if/when that time comes.

**Killaapp** · 03-22-2012 10:57 AM

I'm curious to see if/how Audi's view on this changes, over time, if they start to see a material #/% of customers with tunes. I clearly don't work in the automotive/warranty industry, but if a large enough group of customers had tunes, I would think their collective voice could demand, at least partial, recognition of the drive train warranty / make it harder for Audi to deny 100% of drive train claims that clearly have nothing to do with the ECU tune.