Engine Strengthening by a4darkness

[igo4uga0586]

I read somewhere about replacing the 3 way check valve with a 2 way valve and use a T fitting to go to the lines. Can this be done? What would be the way this would be hooked up?

[walky_talky20]

So I've had a nasty (vacuum?) leak for about a month that I was able to temporarily remedy with some shrink tube. Now that the hose has completely failed, I need a new one. However, the part number is slightly faded and I want to make sure I buy the correct $80 rubber hose. It runs from the valve cover to the crankcase bleeder valve seen here - crankcase bleeder valve

the part number is 06B 103 217 ?

It looks almost like an S but im not sure. pics for your clicks



where it goes


another temporary shrink tube block off fix


can anyone confirm this?

Yes. (This is probably too late, but thought I'd mention it for others) Looks like you have the version of the hose without a check valve in the middle. It would be this one:
http://www.ecstuning.com/ES279950/
I'm not sure what VINs that applies to as I can't seem to find a reference in ETKA to that exact part number. It seems to suggest this hose actually:
http://www.ecstuning.com/ES263087/

Seeing as there is already a check valve for that outlet built in to the PCV valve housing, the one in the middle of those hose would seem redundant. It would serve to protect crankcase from seeing boost pressure even in the case the PCV's integral check valve fails (which they do on occasion). So I'm thinking the hose you have is a very early version that was replaced by the check valve version of the hose, but I could be wrong.

[igo4uga0586]

what is the difference between the "large" / "WTF" / and normal check valves? Why cant they all be replaced with the USP ones?

[a4darkness]

Seeing as there is already a check valve for that outlet built in to the PCV valve housing, the one in the middle of those hose would seem redundant. It would serve to protect crankcase from seeing boost pressure even in the case the PCV's integral check valve fails (which they do on occasion). So I'm thinking the hose you have is a very early version that was replaced by the check valve version of the hose, but I could be wrong.

No way. I've been looking for this one forever. Same here, not in my ETKA either. And that's for any model with this engine. Nice work man.

Breather Hose / Vent Hose
06B103217AA

what is the difference between the "large" / "WTF" / and normal check valves? Why cant they all be replaced with the USP ones?

They just seem to be more robust or something. However, I found more than a few instances of ppl (other VAG forums) using the USP valves for the entire engine with no issues at all. I was just erring on the side of caution.

[igo4uga0586]

thanks darkness!

I may try to do all USP and see what happens... It would definitely be a litmus test for the rest of us.

Would i need to get 10 USP valves then (1 extra)? Thats what i counted from your parts sheet.

Do you think you could post up a flow direction with each valve?

[old guy]

Do you think you could post up a flow direction with each valve?

The flow direction is always toward the vacuum source (intake manifold) with the exception of the one off of the "Y" connection above the air box. That one flows toward the TIP.

[igo4uga0586]

Sweet! Thanks a ton old guy

[a4darkness]

thanks darkness!
I may try to do all USP and see what happens... It would definitely be a litmus test for the rest of us.
Would i need to get 10 USP valves then (1 extra)? Thats what i counted from your parts sheet.
Do you think you could post up a flow direction with each valve?

No prob. Glad to see this thread is still being put to good use. And now that I'm on break from school I can finally post some updates.

I actually picked up ten so I had some spares. Figured they might come in handy and sure enough I've given a few away to friends with ailing check valves. Buy more and share the love.

And to follow up with OG said, there's actually a small arrow stamped on each OEM check valve.



However, if you look at the check valve itself... the entire thing is shaped like an arrow also pointing in the direction of flow. Kinda neat-o.

EDIT
Realized I do have a diagram with arrows. Really really small arrows. Seems to be a theme today.

I read somewhere about replacing the 3 way check valve with a 2 way valve and use a T fitting to go to the lines. Can this be done? What would be the way this would be hooked up?

I did consider this when mapping out the project but figured it was there for a reason and since it's not overly expensive... ya might just want to order this one. But again, USP for the rest should be fine. Maybe check the USP valves you've replaced for the WTF Valves after a week or two just to be extra sure. But I'm highly doubting there's going to be any issues.

[a4darkness]

God dammit.

Per this thread, looks like its time for a new Thermostat.








No temp oddities, warning lights or other issues to speak of. But still, probably need to get on this ASAP. At least there's a write up. Thanks Devo.

Jace and I were racking our brains trying to figure this one out as this seemed a very odd place for coolant to be collecting. But apparently this is called a 'weep hole' and it's purpose is to warm when a thermo is on it's way out.



Time to make another shopping list.

[boy412]

Hopefully it will be a short list this time.

[A4Avant02]

I have a new t-stat just waiting to be installed, along with the J plug. Time for some fun in the garage!

[a4darkness]

I have a new t-stat just waiting to be installed, along with the J plug. Time for some fun in the garage!

Do let us know how that goes!

Hopefully it will be a short list this time.

Kinda. But since I'm gonna be tearing into the engine I'm going to be sure and hit those hard to reach hoses under the manifold.

Here is the procedure for testing out a thermostat if it's being suspected of failing.





And my tentative list:

* Thermostat: 06B121111K


* Coolant Bleeder Screw: N90534203


* J-Plug: 06B103033A


* J-Plug Bolt: N10063205


* Coolant Expansion Tank: 8E0121403


* Coolant Expansion Tank Cap: 8E0121321


Need to figure out the rest now.

[diagnosticator]

No worries, just rinse off with hot water.

[a4darkness]

And I was all worried n stuff. Thanks John, will do. Right after I fill up my blinker fluid.

[Charles.waite]

Damn you! I was trying to hoard my Bentley Thermostat knowledge. Let us know how it goes. Not excited about doing it to my b7, wont have time to do it until January... At least the B7 doesn't have a J-plug.

[a4darkness]

ROTFL

Yeah, I'm just a sucker for spreadin the info around. I'll certainly do so. Have to plot out the necessary parts for the lower crankcase and whatnot then add them to the list and place an order. Fun fun.





Thanks again to rollaphillie for these pics...

[walky_talky20]

Darkness, I'd suggest you get the 034 billet/silicone solution for the under-the-manifold PCV bits:
http://www.034motorsport.com/engine-...e-p-21950.html

It actually ends up cheaper than the OEM stuff, and won't fail again. Anyway, just a suggestion.

[a4darkness]

Actually, that's exactly what I was thinkin. Good call.

Initially, this thread had me a bit concerned but it appears that 034 has amended said issues.
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...d=12&styleid=8

[boostedAvant]

Do work buddy! Let me know if you need anything. I'm interested to see what route you take....

[igo4uga0586]

Replaced check valves today.









I could not find the "large" check valve anywhere. I spent probably 20 minutes searching for it. Can anyone take a better picture than the ones in the first post to help me find it?

Everything went pretty smooth, and I am finally starting to get rid of most of the single use clamps. I replaced the WTF with a 1/4" USP but it is a little small so for now i just made sure it was very tight. The WTF check valve is 3/8" ID so I have to place an order for a couple of the bigger.

Thanks for the help guys.

[a4darkness]

Nice work, looks like you're tidying things up in there.

The 'large' check aka # 67: 06A 133 528 D (non return / crankcase vent valve) is attached to a hose that comes off a small metal tube from the back of the engine. Actually, if you scroll up and look at both the 2nd ETKA diagram and the part walky posted above (06B103217AA) this shows the valve you're looking for. There is a possibility that your car doesn't have it and therefor would look like the 1sr ETKA diagram. That clear things up?

[old guy]

The "WTF" valve is the larger check valve. You already replaced it.

[igo4uga0586]

SWEET! Thank you both!

So heads up to anyone who wants to replace it with USP.... its 3/8" !!

[Charles.waite]

Nice work on the check valves. By the way, what are you guys using to trim off the excess slack on the screw clamps?

[a4darkness]

SWEET! Thank you both!
So heads up to anyone who wants to replace it with USP.... its 3/8" !!

Thank you, it's been incorporated accordingly.

Nice work on the check valves. By the way, what are you guys using to trim off the excess slack on the screw clamps?

Actually, I usually never cut em as it tends to leave a rather sharp edge in tight places. If need be, just bend them around so it's neat.

[igo4uga0586]

The clamps i got only hardly any extra "slack." They were size #4. 1/4"-3/8"

Thanks for updating the thread with the new info darkness! Just glad i could contribute and be the Guinea pig here for everyone.

Also got around to redoing the area right off of the manifold where the 3 way check valve is.

Parts:
(1) USP 1/4" check valve
(1) Brass 3-way barbed fitting 1/4"
(<1ft) 1/4" ID fuel line



It looks like the 3 way check valve is unneeded since there is a check valve on each side of the "T" anyway. I had no kinks and everything is nice and tight too.

[a4darkness]

Nicely done.

Tried to do a little clean up work on the thread today, hopefully this will make it a tad easier to find everything.

Thread Nav + Global Parts List

Installation of Major Vac System Parts
2002 Details + Part Numbers for Vac + Vent System

Boost Leak Test
Emissions Readiness Test
Throttle Body Alignment/Reset
Vag Com Setup + Info (Mac)

Combi Valve <-> N112 Fix + 16795 Code
Crankcase Breather Hose Info

Gasket Swaps: Valve Cover + Cam Chain Tensioner
Motor Mount Install
Oxygen O2 Sensor Swap

N249 + N112 Explained + Vac Line Routes
N75 Explained

Stereo Wiring + Ground Wire Mount
Intake Manifold Removed Pics

[boostedAvant]

Fantastic Thomas! Good work buddy!

[igo4uga0586]

I am thinking about going the silicone hose route and start to replace most of the vac hoses... do you think I would have any big downsides if I used 1/4" instead of the 3.5mm as long as i used hose clamps?

[a4darkness]

No idea man. First thought in my head would be what's the ID of the 1/4" hose comparatively.




But silicone vac line is uber cheap (see the end of post 1).

[igo4uga0586]

Just trying to figure out why we wouldnt go with hose closer to 1/4" (6mm) ID since thats what check valve fits our current hoses.

Do all the hoses stretch that much from .138" to at least .25" (1/4") from time?

[a4darkness]

You might be over-thinking this one a bit. And they don't stretch that much at all. However, they do move around more than you might think when air is moving around the system.

Rather, I would think that vac lines were tested extensively and the choice for 3.5mm ID was an equal balance of both cost and performance. Also, this is likely an example of two standard items used across many vehicles that work just fine as is. Example, when I replaced the vac lines in my B5 I went to the VW dealer to buy their braided lines (as it was roughly half the price of the Audi equivalent). Exact same stuff they were putting in the newer A4's.

I searched and read a lot about vac lines for this project. Okay, it's pretty much what I do for any project. Never did I find anything about anyone needing or advocating moving to a larger ID line (for performance or better matching of OEM parts). But, just for kicks I ran a quick search again and did find one example here. However, in this instance Zimbu is obviously trying something experimental to solve a surging problem that is unique to his engine/tune/setup etc.

Also, I'm sure you've noticed that the US Plastics checks are quite a bit smaller looking than the OEM checks. This was actually somewhat concerning to me at first but I quickly realized that it was a non-issue and moved on. So, no worries here. Just keep gettin the new pieces in.

[igo4uga0586]

Thanks again darkness. I think we are very similar in how we research a project before we go in to it! I probably read every thread i could find on this before I posted in your thread again.

You are the man! Ill post some pics up once I get everything in the car.

[igo4uga0586]

Just found this 3 way valve that could be a potential replacement.

07C133529A **********$9.45



http://www.amazon.com/Volkswagen-Vac.../dp/B002T2WO92

[a4darkness]

I'd call that a win. MTC is a direct replacement for OEM on all VAG cars. Did a quick sweep and Amazon seems to have the best prices on these. Nice work man.

[boy412]

Thanks for taking the time to create all those shortcuts/links! This is a great reference...

[a4darkness]

Where does the end of the T'd off hose go to? The one that has the plastic black piece at the bottom of the picture?
Another question. On the Vacuum tank in the driver fender there is one side of the tank that goes to a spot under the intake manifold that connects to the two solenoid valves. Where does the other side of the tank go to? I don't have the system in my car so I have no idea. All the diagrams I have seen just show the connection off the solenoid valves.
Thanks.

Didn't have an answer for this one wazzu, but Old Guy just posted about it...and now we both have an answer.

One leg goes under the fender and ultimately to the LDP (leak detection pump) and the other leg went around the back of the block and connected to the N80 evap control valve.
The LDP is located underneath the drivers side rear wheel liner. There is a hard plastic line that runs under the fender, down to the floor pan and all the way to the back of the car.
There is a second line that also runs under the front fender. That one goes to the vacuum reservoir.

[Charles.waite]

I just had to share this. Oh the B7 forum is a special place...


BFI catch can installed and in neutral smokes just like BSH

Edit: Its funny because they are saying they need to ADD check valves. Which is true, but its just funny to hear people advocate ADDING check valves...

[CaRtharsis]

WOndering if I might be able to get some insight from all the knowledge that seems to be sourrounding this thread.

I'm seeing massive vacuum in my block. Last sunday I pulled out of my driveway and got a few hundred feet from home when I looked in the mirror to discover I was fumagating the neighborhood. Some quick troubleshooting, after refilling the oil and I have determined that the block is seeing considerable vaccum at idle as indicated by extreme difficulty removing the oil cap and the engine stalling with the cap off. ANyone have a recommendation on what valve might likely be the immediate culprit? I have replaced the block breather with the 034 silicone/billet setup. I have an'03 post split so I hahe the funky double valve coming off the block breather hose. I have oil seeping through the block breather line and the 3 way line off of the valve cover to the pancake valve, all 034. System is stock configuration except the B7 catch can that has been plumbed in afterthe block and valve breather lines join and before the pancake valve.

I have been through this thread twice and been following it for some time but I havent gotten to replacing anything. Yeah I know, dumb move!

[a4darkness]

Charles, that Catch Can thread is a riot. And now after reading it you've probably kept me out of the B7 board for a few months. Eeeesh.

I'm seeing massive vacuum in my block...

CaRtharsis, for starters inspect the billet check valve included in the 034 kit to see if it's functioning properly. There have been a few isolated instances of it sticking/failing. Could be your issue. However, my guess is that it's somewhere else.
Hit the hardware store and buy some of the screw down worm clamps. Start replacing the one timers... and of course order up some US Plastics Check Valves + silicone vac line. Jet suction pump is an easy inspection too, plus you can always zip tie it back together while you're waiting on a new one... or so I hear.
PRV valve is another problem area and up next. If you prefer, just shoot me a PM or email - a4darkness (at) me (dot) com - and we'll try and figure it out. Then we can post up the findings accordingly.

But this is actually an excellent segway to the next part of the thread... understanding and revamping the crankcase breather system. I wanted to knock this all out at once but will have to piece meal it now that school has started up again.

Nutshell, over the winter break I sat down and mapped the whole thing out starting from the block and going back to the TIP. Also did a crash course on catch cans and related breather systems in Audi's and VWs (1.8t, 2.0t and TDI's as well). Got some stellar help from Jace/BoostedAvant too. It's not quite overly complex, rather the name of the parts and their functions are a tad misleading. Fortunately, I can now break it all down in my head and understand what goes where... and more importantly how to improve it. More on that later.

But for starters I wanted to replace the puck valve.

PRV / Pressure Regulator Valve aka The Puck or Pancake Valve
Current Part : 06A129101F ~$50
* most of us have rev A which has been improved, see pics
* there are alternative / older / smaller versions, avoid these
* provides a one way exit for gasses built up in the crankcase (block -> this -> TIP)
* signs of a bad PRV can be boost lost, dip in performance, rough idle etc. (but not necessarily just this part)
* if you're still running the A version or an old / non-metalized version, swap it... it's probably starting to leak or not holding pressure the way it should be
* 02's have the PRV attached to the TIP, which was obviously relocated to the back of the VC when the 1st round of crankcase breather improvements went in
* nothing wrong with moving this valve to or from either location but one could conclude it's better suited being away from such a heat intensive location near the turbo
* if you're an 02 or did the PVC system delete and want to add this back in, running heater hose in place of the metal hard pipe is fine

Shown here #15 (listed as D, an older version):




This is a pretty basic swap, especially if you've already removed those wonderful one time hose clamps.
As you can see, the internals have been strengthened with a new metal layer (old A vs current F)




Zoom in on this one to see all the gunk that collects in this valve and the associated hoses. Can't wait to swap all this out.




Make sure to inspect this elbow hose for cracks and splits.





And there you have it.



More pics here:
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...=1#post5874341

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