Roundabout And Back Again, A B5 S4 Story

[Tjtalan]

Well folks It’s been a Journey for sure. I’ve been maintaining and modifying these cars for 20+ years at this point. It is what I do for a living, and I’ve personally been through more Audi chassis then I would care to admit. However, It always has, looks like it always will be, the good old B5 S4 for me. So here I am back again, let’s do another build thread.

These cars are getting harder to find. With the whole part out trend starting years back. Good ones are fewer, and further between. I have said this before, It’s just at this point, I think this truly might be my last one. The forever car, the keeper, the old man garage queen.

I introduce you to my hi mileage, and relatively unmolested, 2000 Laser manual B5 S4.

First photos from the day I picked it up!




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[Tjtalan]

First things first, replace the damn wheels. A friend of mine had some RSe52’s in 18x8.5, with a ET of 45. The car came with some BC racing coilovers already installed, so I dropped it down about another 20 mm. I’m now happy with the way it’s sitting.

Honestly, I was always a BC hater. Never even would’ve considered them, had they not come on the car. I’m surprisingly impressed so far. At least enough to put money elsewhere first.




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[Tjtalan]

Also, I hate wood trim. With sport trim so much harder to come by these days. I called oCarbon, had Matt make me some belt line trim. Decided to go with the Audi atlas, same stuff that’s in all of the new chassis. I only did the beltline trim, this is my personal opinion, I think carbon on the console is a bit much. So I stayed with the sport trim style.

The steering wheel had also seen better days. So I had an eBay manufacturer from overseas send me out a recovered stock wheel. Finished it all of with some RS4 style door pulls from project B5.

After these pictures were taken, I removed the gauges from the vents. It was just too much going on. I think I might install them in the glove box, if I can’t find a better solution. Also, I plan to install the factory head unit. I feel anything aftermarket in that position just looks tacky.

I think the interior came together nicely .






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[Tjtalan]

I got a box today! Radiator support from VanBuren!




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[LJS]

NICE- thanks for sharing!
The ride height looks perfect!!
Agree with your decision on the head unit--the "old" analog stuff better suits the Audi.
PS-
I tried that glove box trick with my gauges and quickly moved back to a single pod gauge setup(on steering wheel)-Innovate PSB-1 gauge (boost with AFR)

[CELison]

I don’t understand the glovebox thing and I know it’s been popular across platforms forever. You drive around with it open? Or hope it’s open when something goes wrong and you need to see the gauges? Or only open it if you think something is wrong?

[Silverex]

Nice man looks like a good base.

For a clean gauge setup, you really can’t beat a FIS-Control

[ShelbyM3]

I’ve always been a big fan of the P3 gauge. I have one in both my 2.7’s. It’s clean and matches the lighting. Analog boost sensor and you’re good to go. It’s also a code reader!

I’m with CELison, being in the glove box is cool and discrete, but not helpful.


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[Tjtalan]

NICE- thanks for sharing!
The ride height looks perfect!!
Agree with your decision on the head unit--the "old" analog stuff better suits the Audi.
PS-
I tried that glove box trick with my gauges and quickly moved back to a single pod gauge setup(on steering wheel)-Innovate PSB-1 gauge (boost with AFR)

Thanks man, the interior of these cars is just so classy and perfect. Anything other than the factory head unit, just doesn’t suit it.

I’ll definitely look into that gauge idea.


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[Tjtalan]

I don’t understand the glovebox thing and I know it’s been popular across platforms forever. You drive around with it open? Or hope it’s open when something goes wrong and you need to see the gauges? Or only open it if you think something is wrong?

My thoughts on it, with the gauges in the glove box, I’ll have access if required. Boost and lambda, both with peak hold ability. I’m not going crazy with this car, K04 and some E. So in my humble opinion, I think I would get a cell before a lean condition could cause any damage.

Nice man looks like a good base.

For a clean gauge setup, you really can’t beat a FIS-Control

Definitely a good option. I’ve been looking into it.

I’ve always been a big fan of the P3 gauge. I have one in both my 2.7’s. It’s clean and matches the lighting. Analog boost sensor and you’re good to go. It’s also a code reader!

I’m with CELison, being in the glove box is cool and discrete, but not helpful.

I’m still undecided, I had a VADpro in a different chassis. They seem to have a good option for the B5. I think that’s kind of the way. I’m leaning at this point.


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[Tjtalan]

Parts ordered from SEP, K04’s, charge pipes, inlets, Y-pipe, Bi-pipe, catch can. I have the Bi-pipe, and catch can in my possession. I’m impressed with the quality so far. I have a set of SRM, and a set of AWE intercoolers left over from other builds. Still undecided what set will go in this car.







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[CELison]

The car has narrowband O2s, so it has no idea what AFR is at WOT. It can only throw a lean code from LTFTs at cruise and idle, which can be perfectly fine while stilling having a major issue in boost. Be careful with SEP, I’ve know him for a very long time. He’s a nice guy, and means well, but I wouldn’t trust anything coming out of there.

[Tjtalan]

The car has narrowband O2s, so it has no idea what AFR is at WOT. It can only throw a lean code from LTFTs at cruise and idle, which can be perfectly fine while stilling having a major issue in boost. Be careful with SEP, I’ve know him for a very long time. He’s a nice guy, and means well, but I wouldn’t trust anything coming out of there.

You are right, I guess I just don’t worry about it as much with this car. The plan is to run my old Daz file for now, same box code. If I remember that file only made 18 psi on 550’s, and E. It may end up getting a VADpro either way.

With SEP, I guess I’ll need to learn my own lesson. I’ve heard stories, It’s just as you stated, I’ve had multiple conversations, and I like the guy. The examples that I have in my possession I’m impressed with so far. I always worked with Daz, then Blake, and Blake sells his stuff. So that was my reasoning.

I appreciate you lookin out!


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[TwoSnelz]

I actually kind of liked the gold Avus' lol

Regardless, nice pickup.

Heres to never selling cause we like the punishment.

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[Tjtalan]

I actually kind of liked the gold Avus' lol

Regardless, nice pickup.

Heres to never selling cause we like the punishment.

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Honestly when I initially swapped them out. I felt like the car looked better with the Avus’s also. The RSe52’s are growing on me, and I definitely need the room for bigger brakes here shortly.

Also I think with the bigger brakes, and red calipers behind the black wheels, it will help with the contras. Make them stand out more. Right now they get lost in the black abyss of the wheel wells.


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[zatch_303]

Welcome back!

[Tjtalan]

Welcome back!

Thank you, kind of feels like home again haha!


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[Tjtalan]

Well, a friend of mine back home was having trouble getting back into a B5 S4. Could not find the right car. An offer was made on my laser, I took the offer. So this thread is going to change up a bit. We are going to move forward with another car that I picked up. All of the available funds from the laser sale will go into one of two cars. I can either build my silver S4 manual, or sacrifice that car, and use all of its components for my cactus 1.8 auto Avant. I honestly need help with this decision.

Starting from scratch, I’m going back to my roots. Chassis, brakes, and suspension components will be first. This is the list already ordered and hopefully in the mail soon.

Torque factory spec, FEAL coilovers.
034 fully spherical front upper control arms.
034 fully spherical rear upper control arms.
034 spherical rear tire rod set.
034 rear sway bar, and subframe reinforcement kit.
034 billet subframe mounts, front and rear.
034 spherical swaybar links, front and rear.
034 billet engine mounts.
034 billet transmission mounts.
034 snub mount.

In the next day or so, I will order Wavetrac differentials, and JHM 4.1 center, with JHM trans components.

The 2000 silver car, interior is decent, would require paint. The 2001 cactus A4, its also in decent condition, would require paint. My dream car is a cactus Avant. My only issue is it’s not technically an S4. When I was done with it however. I don’t think anyone but me would ever know the difference.






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[LJS]

FWIW-
Be sure to get the protective boots for your spherical rods ends--will extend the service life of those ends...I had these items on an earlier project car(LONG time ago) and found this out the hard way....
Good luck with the new project!

[Tjtalan]

FWIW-
Be sure to get the protective boots for your spherical rods ends--will extend the service life of those ends...I had these items on an earlier project car(LONG time ago) and found this out the hard way....
Good luck with the new project!

That’s great advice, not my first rodeo with these components. Previously in California, so honestly, I didn’t have much trouble. Now I’m in Oklahoma, they will definitely get installed.


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[ShelbyM3]

I say build the cactus. While’s it’s not an S4 technically, it’s your dream and it’s going to get harder and harder to make that happen the longer you wait. Life is cruel, parts are NLA, and Cactus. Everybody needs more Cactus in their life! Go all out and like you said, nobody will even have to care that the VIN is an A4. I think at some point the overall quality of a really nicely built car from a shell will far outweigh the originality factor of an S4. So much is changed on both after a build that neither are really anything like their original forms.


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[Tjtalan]

I’m still leaning heavily towards the cactus. However, I am still completely undecided. I think it’ll end up being a spur of the moment decision haha.

Well, I spent another round ordering parts. Entirely too much money. However, I’m looking at this as my last real project. I’ve decided to do some things differently.

Torque factory complete Y-pipe with upper, lower inlets.
JHM trans overhaul kit, with the 1-2 collar.
JHM drive shaft support insert.
JHM 4.1 center.
Wavetrac front and rear LSD’s.

This is gonna be a ride!


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[Tjtalan]

Picked this up used. Ordered the maf housing and lower inlets from torque factory to round out the monster kit. This thing is huge!




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[craigt1985]

Looks lovely, very envious! What turbos are you going for?

[Tjtalan]

I was always happy with K04 power levels. So I went with SEP billet K04’s. The car will go together initially with an unopened long block. I have a spare engine sitting on my stand, so that may change in the future.


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[Tjtalan]

Parts either in the mail, or boxes in my living room haha!

Cooling system
CSF aluminum large capacity radiator

Induction.
SEP billet K04’s
SEP charge pipes
SEP V-band bi-pipe
SEP catch can
AWE intercoolers, carbon shrouds
Torque factory monster Y-pipe
Torque factory maf housing
Torque factory upper, lower inlets
034 diverter valves

Fueling.
Walbro 450
Bosh 4bar regulator
Bosh 550 EV14 injectors

Drivetrain, chassis.
JHM full transmission kit
JHM 4.1 center diff
JHM trio package
JHM center support inserts
Wavetrac front LSD
Wavetrac rear LSD
AWE drivetrain stabilizer
034 billet B7 RS4 conversion flywheel
034 billet engine mounts
034 billet trans mounts
034 stub and cage
ECS diff mount.
VanBuran aluminum core support
Ringer racing Stage 4 clutch kit

Suspension
Torque factory FEAL coilovers, 12-15k springs.
034 fully spherical front upper arms
034 fully spherical rear upper arms
034 spherical rear tie rods
034 rear sway bar
034 subframe reinforcement kit
034 billet subframe bushings, front and rear
034 spherical sway bar links, front and rear

Exhaust
XS 3in V-band down pipes
SEP 3.5 in single exhaust.

Wheels
034 forged ZTF01, 18x8.5, ET45

Brakes
18Z front


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[bakedziti]

I’m biased but the cactus wins for me too, but I’ll just be happy to get mine up and running in stock s4 form

[Tjtalan]

I’m biased but the cactus wins for me too, but I’ll just be happy to get mine up and running in stock s4 form

Haha, great minds!


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[ShelbyM3]

Parts either in the mail, or boxes in my living room haha!

Cooling system
CSF aluminum large capacity radiator

Induction.
SEP billet K04’s
SEP charge pipes
SEP V-band bi-pipe
SEP catch can
AWE intercoolers, carbon shrouds
Torque factory monster Y-pipe
Torque factory maf housing
Torque factory upper, lower inlets
034 diverter valves

Fueling.
Walbro 450
Bosh 4bar regulator
Bosh 550 EV14 injectors

Drivetrain, chassis.
JHM full transmission kit
JHM 4.1 center diff
JHM trio package
JHM center support inserts
Wavetrac front LSD
Wavetrac rear LSD
AWE drivetrain stabilizer
034 billet B7 RS4 conversion flywheel
034 billet engine mounts
034 billet trans mounts
034 stub and cage
ECS diff mount.
VanBuran aluminum core support
Ringer racing Stage 4 clutch kit

Suspension
Torque factory FEAL coilovers, 12-15k springs.
034 fully spherical front upper arms
034 fully spherical rear upper arms
034 spherical rear tie rods
034 rear sway bar
034 subframe reinforcement kit
034 billet subframe bushings, front and rear
034 spherical sway bar links, front and rear

Exhaust
XS 3in V-band down pipes
SEP 3.5 in single exhaust.

Wheels
034 forged ZTF01, 18x8.5, ET45

Brakes
18Z front


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[Tjtalan]

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Yeah, lots, with more to come. I’m old now, it’s time to do it right. The AWE intercoolers are getting sold, the tuner wants SRM’s, also getting bigger injectors.


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[Tjtalan]

Parts started rolling in. It’s getting real!

Sway bar
Chassis reinforcement kit
Snub,and cage
Engine mounts
Billet Front subframe bushing
Front sway bar end links




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[RMode]

There’s a very good chance those wheels aren’t going to come close to fitting those brakes. Something to be aware of.


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[Tjtalan]

There’s a very good chance those wheels aren’t going to come close to fitting those brakes. Something to be aware of.


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I printed the template, looks close. I’m hoping it just clears. If not, at an ET of 45, I have room for spacers. I like the wheel size, because I should be able to fit a 245. So fingers crossed.


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[RMode]

I printed the template, looks close. I’m hoping it just clears. If not, at an ET of 45, I have room for spacers. I like the wheel size, because I should be able to fit a 245. So fingers crossed.


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Caliper template doesn’t really tell you wheel clearance without the corresponding rotor template. Rotors have offsets to them just like wheels do, and there are multiple rotors for those calipers.

Don’t get hung up on the number on the sidewall, it’s not an actual measurement at the end of the day. There are 225s as big as some 245s.


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[Tjtalan]

Caliper template doesn’t really tell you wheel clearance without the corresponding rotor template. Rotors have offsets to them just like wheels do, and there are multiple rotors for those calipers.

Don’t get hung up on the number on the sidewall, it’s not an actual measurement at the end of the day. There are 225s as big as some 245s.


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I used a full-size wheel template that 034 provides. You’re definitely right about the tires, even between brands with the same sizing, you’ll find drastic differences.

I do a lot of autocross, so I’ve learned a bit about tires. Definitely not an expert though. I’m trying to fit the RE71RS, in a 245/40, it’s a big tire.

Thanks for making me more nervous than I already was haha!


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[Tjtalan]

Radiator just showed up!




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[Tjtalan]

Received a few pictures from Andrew over at SEP. He started on my exhaust!




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[Tjtalan]

Traction, all the traction please!


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[Tec_Nine]

Looks like you're sourcing all the good parts, one of the mods I want to do to my car is a lsd rear diff at some point. Looking forward to the build

[Tjtalan]

Looks like you're sourcing all the good parts, one of the mods I want to do to my car is a lsd rear diff at some point. Looking forward to the build

Thanks, just trying to take what I’ve learned previously with this chassis, and some good information from others. Hoping to put it together into a fun little car.


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