JHM stage 1 to Stage 2..?

[a4937]

I'm considering upgrading and just wanted to get some feedback from those who may have done so in the past.

How is the difference going from 1 to 2 compared to going from stock to stage 1?

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[Jake@JHM]

Stage 2 is a noticeable difference from Stage 1. However, as with any software the difference between Stage 1 and Stage 2 isn't as big as compared to STOCK to Stage 1. With all of the supporting hardware, Stage 2 is pretty enjoyable.

[Jayz691]

Stock to stage 1 is the biggest difference. Stage 1 to 2 is a little better. Can't speak for JHM, but with Motoza stg 2 included hpfp upgrade. Gave a little more midrange tq and top end. That's going by the butt Dyno. Motoza is a little dif since it's custom, their stg1 is like a stg 1/2 for other OTS tunes. So for an OTS tune it might be a little different.
It shouldn't cost much to go from stg 1 to stg 2.?

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[a4937]

Stock to stage 1 is the biggest difference. Stage 1 to 2 is a little better. Can't speak for JHM, but with Motoza stg 2 included hpfp upgrade. Gave a little more midrange tq and top end. That's going by the butt Dyno. Motoza is a little dif since it's custom, their stg1 is like a stg 1/2 for other OTS tunes. So for an OTS tune it might be a little different.
It shouldn't cost much to go from stg 1 to stg 2.?

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I'm not sure, I believe the lion's share of the cost is in upgrading hardware but I honestly don't have a clue of the cost for the upgraded tune.

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[Jake@JHM]

If you already have our software, the software side is free. Just need the minimum hardware requirements

[a4937]

If you already have our software, the software side is free. Just need the minimum hardware requirements

Thanks, best news I've heard all day!

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[a4937]

If you already have our software, the software side is free. Just need the minimum hardware requirements

So if I already have the high flow cat will a catback be all I need in addition to the upgraded hpfp?

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[Jake@JHM]

So if I already have the high flow cat will a catback be all I need in addition to the upgraded hpfp?

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Yeah a HFC will be minimum and HPFP will depend if you are on 91 or 93 octanes.

[a4937]

Yeah a HFC will be minimum and HPFP will depend if you are on 91 or 93 octanes.

I hadn't thought about 91 octane, honestly can't remember the last time I saw 91 at a station. Most around me go 87, 89, 93. Probably something I can look into if it'll save me the major exhaust upgrade.

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[Jake@JHM]

I hadn't thought about 91 octane, honestly can't remember the last time I saw 91 at a station. Most around me go 87, 89, 93. Probably something I can look into if it'll save me the major exhaust upgrade.

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If you have 93 octane all you would need minimum would be the HFC and the high pressure fuel pump internal upgrade: https://jhmotorsports.com/jhm-high-p...-2-0t-fsi.html

[a4937]

If you have 93 octane all you would need minimum would be the HFC and the high pressure fuel pump internal upgrade: https://jhmotorsports.com/jhm-high-p...-2-0t-fsi.html

What skill level would you say is needed to swap internals?

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[Jake@JHM]

What skill level would you say is needed to swap internals?

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Basic. Watch the video and the install and see if its up your alley. If you want to get a new pump at the same time we sell it with the internals already installed too.

[a4937]

Was just looking on the JHM website. It does say turbo back exhaust is a requirement for the Stg2 93oct. Am I reading that too literally, you don't need the full setup all the way back?

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[Jake@JHM]

Was just looking on the JHM website. It does say turbo back exhaust is a requirement for the Stg2 93oct. Am I reading that too literally, you don't need the full setup all the way back?

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Turbo back is optimal but the software is dynamic enough to get away with just a HFC.

[cobycobie]

Close enough question to on topic:

Does anyone else think the stage 1 is almost unacceptable in traffic? I tuned mine last month and it was great until I sat in slow 1st/2nd gear traffic last weekend. I have never even noticed drivetrain backlash but no matter how careful I am with the gas pedal I get 3 or so aggressive bounces rolling on or off the throttle, even going from from 10% to 5% as slow as I humanly can. It's like the throttle body is slamming open/closed.

Will have to flash stock to make sure I'm not crazy. Car has 208k miles so drivetrain is probably a bit sloppy but I've had some other manual cars with wicked sloppy drivetrains and was able to adapt to it just fine.

I also noticed immediately after I tuned it that if I have the clutch engaged before 2krpm setting off gently the power seems to get really "fluttery" until 2krpm SOMETIMES. A lot like drivetrain slop, but suddenly started happening with the tune.

Edit: I've had the car for 30k miles, it's not like I just bought it and tuned it.

[Jayz691]

Was just looking on the JHM website. It does say turbo back exhaust is a requirement for the Stg2 93oct. Am I reading that too literally, you don't need the full setup all the way back?

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Ya don't need an exhaust for stage 2, or even a K04. Main bottleneck is the cat, so HFC/TP is all ya really need.
Nice exhaust always sounds nice though..

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[Jayz691]

Close enough question to on topic:

Does anyone else think the stage 1 is almost unacceptable in traffic? I tuned mine last month and it was great until I sat in slow 1st/2nd gear traffic last weekend. I have never even noticed drivetrain backlash but no matter how careful I am with the gas pedal I get 3 or so aggressive bounces rolling on or off the throttle, even going from from 10% to 5% as slow as I humanly can. It's like the throttle body is slamming open/closed.

Will have to flash stock to make sure I'm not crazy. Car has 208k miles so drivetrain is probably a bit sloppy but I've had some other manual cars with wicked sloppy drivetrains and was able to adapt to it just fine.

I also noticed immediately after I tuned it that if I have the clutch engaged before 2krpm setting off gently the power seems to get really "fluttery" until 2krpm SOMETIMES. A lot like drivetrain slop, but suddenly started happening with the tune.

Edit: I've had the car for 30k miles, it's not like I just bought it and tuned it.

Who tuned it??

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[cobycobie]

Who tuned it??

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It's the JHM stage 1.

[Cyrik]

I hadn't thought about 91 octane, honestly can't remember the last time I saw 91 at a station. Most around me go 87, 89, 93.

Only a few states have 91 octane where higher octane is not really needed. It's an altitude thing. Out here in Colorado it's 85, 87, 91. Stage 2 JHM without HPFP upgrade can be run with both 91 or 93. (It is listed as "All Octane" for Stage 2 in the JHM flashing program). HPFP upgrade with a HFC/TP is considered "Stage 2+".

Side-note, JHM software moved flashing servers a handful of years ago for this platform so if you used/have the APR "Cheetah" cable to tune Stage 1 you will need the new "PowerConnect" cable from JHM.

Does anyone else think the stage 1 is almost unacceptable in traffic? Car has 208k miles so drivetrain is probably a bit sloppy but I've had some other manual cars with wicked sloppy drivetrains and was able to adapt to it just fine.

I also noticed immediately after I tuned it that if I have the clutch engaged before 2krpm setting off gently the power seems to get really "fluttery" until 2krpm SOMETIMES. A lot like drivetrain slop, but suddenly started happening with the tune.

Edit: I've had the car for 30k miles, it's not like I just bought it and tuned it.

How old is your clutch? Also this might sound a bit random but have you replaced your U-Joints on the driveshaft at all? I found mine pretty worn/sloppy around 140k and replaced both front and rear. It was making an annoying single loud "tick" when sitting in drive-thru's. Given I have an Auto TIP, but maybe that's something to look into? Just spit-balling here.

[a4937]

Turbo back is optimal but the software is dynamic enough to get away with just a HFC.

As someone else just pointed out, there's a new cable. I don't suppose there's any exchange program for the old one??

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[a4937]

Close enough question to on topic:

Does anyone else think the stage 1 is almost unacceptable in traffic? I tuned mine last month and it was great until I sat in slow 1st/2nd gear traffic last weekend. I have never even noticed drivetrain backlash but no matter how careful I am with the gas pedal I get 3 or so aggressive bounces rolling on or off the throttle, even going from from 10% to 5% as slow as I humanly can. It's like the throttle body is slamming open/closed.

Will have to flash stock to make sure I'm not crazy. Car has 208k miles so drivetrain is probably a bit sloppy but I've had some other manual cars with wicked sloppy drivetrains and was able to adapt to it just fine.

I also noticed immediately after I tuned it that if I have the clutch engaged before 2krpm setting off gently the power seems to get really "fluttery" until 2krpm SOMETIMES. A lot like drivetrain slop, but suddenly started happening with the tune.

Edit: I've had the car for 30k miles, it's not like I just bought it and tuned it.

I'm auto tip also so probably wouldn't be much help.

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[a4937]

Ya don't need an exhaust for stage 2, or even a K04. Main bottleneck is the cat, so HFC/TP is all ya really need.
Nice exhaust always sounds nice though..

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Thanks, that's part of the equation too and I found a Milltek catback at a pretty reasonable price. Always loved their tones.

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[simrag]

Close enough question to on topic:

Does anyone else think the stage 1 is almost unacceptable in traffic? I tuned mine last month and it was great until I sat in slow 1st/2nd gear traffic last weekend. I have never even noticed drivetrain backlash but no matter how careful I am with the gas pedal I get 3 or so aggressive bounces rolling on or off the throttle, even going from from 10% to 5% as slow as I humanly can. It's like the throttle body is slamming open/closed.

Will have to flash stock to make sure I'm not crazy. Car has 208k miles so drivetrain is probably a bit sloppy but I've had some other manual cars with wicked sloppy drivetrains and was able to adapt to it just fine.

I also noticed immediately after I tuned it that if I have the clutch engaged before 2krpm setting off gently the power seems to get really "fluttery" until 2krpm SOMETIMES. A lot like drivetrain slop, but suddenly started happening with the tune.

Edit: I've had the car for 30k miles, it's not like I just bought it and tuned it.

I had a manual 07 with a JHM Stage 1 tune and there was some drivetrain slop that was increased by the tune, but not to that degree when I installed @ 160K miles. It felt a little rubber bandy, but no big jerks. I got caught in a huge backup on I80 coming back from skiing last year, and would have definitely noticed it creeping forward for 2 hours. I replaced the motor mounts and did the rear differential bushing inserts from O34, which improved it but didn't completely eliminate it. I did not notice anything fluttery about the power below 2K either.

On a related note, I know the tune is tied to the car, but can the JHM tuner be sold and reused by another person?

[a4937]

I had a manual 07 with a JHM Stage 1 tune and there was some drivetrain slop that was increased by the tune, but not to that degree when I installed @ 160K miles. It felt a little rubber bandy, but no big jerks. I got caught in a huge backup on I80 coming back from skiing last year, and would have definitely noticed it creeping forward for 2 hours. I replaced the motor mounts and did the rear differential bushing inserts from O34, which improved it but didn't completely eliminate it. I did not notice anything fluttery about the power below 2K either.

On a related note, I know the tune is tied to the car, but can the JHM tuner be sold and reused by another person?

If you mean the cable then yes, but there's a new one so if you have the older cheetah cable it's obsolete.

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[texasboy21]

I had a manual 07 with a JHM Stage 1 tune and there was some drivetrain slop that was increased by the tune, but not to that degree when I installed @ 160K miles. It felt a little rubber bandy, but no big jerks. I got caught in a huge backup on I80 coming back from skiing last year, and would have definitely noticed it creeping forward for 2 hours. I replaced the motor mounts and did the rear differential bushing inserts from O34, which improved it but didn't completely eliminate it. I did not notice anything fluttery about the power below 2K either.

On a related note, I know the tune is tied to the car, but can the JHM tuner be sold and reused by another person?

The software may alter the torque management which can cause the engagement to be a little more rough.

[a4937]

I had a manual 07 with a JHM Stage 1 tune and there was some drivetrain slop that was increased by the tune, but not to that degree when I installed @ 160K miles. It felt a little rubber bandy, but no big jerks. I got caught in a huge backup on I80 coming back from skiing last year, and would have definitely noticed it creeping forward for 2 hours. I replaced the motor mounts and did the rear differential bushing inserts from O34, which improved it but didn't completely eliminate it. I did not notice anything fluttery about the power below 2K either.

On a related note, I know the tune is tied to the car, but can the JHM tuner be sold and reused by another person?

If you are selling the cable they use now I will be interested. Thanks!

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[Jake@JHM]

As someone else just pointed out, there's a new cable. I don't suppose there's any exchange program for the old one??

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Unfortunately no, as the cable switched a few years ago now

[a4937]

Unfortunately no, as the cable switched a few years ago now

No rental program for it?

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[a4937]

Unfortunately no, as the cable switched a few years ago now

Thanks for all your help. My last question before I make this move. Are our turbos known to fail? I'm just under 140k 07 2.0 auto and haven't had issues with it and I don't recall hearing a lot about failed turbos but worth asking. Thanks again!

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[oVeRdOsE]

im on the forum for a while, and I rarely see oem k03 failing.

they will piss oil trough the journal bearing, but nothing to be worried about if it's not excessive, Ive noticed oil in my intercoolers around 40k km, and now 160k km, not more, not less.

use good oil.

I would be more worried about balancer shaft and oil pump, but nothing to do with the tune.

I also run stage 2 since 2015, no issue, however I have one of the most conservative flash, which is unitronic. I like the fact I can fill the car with 87 to 94 without any issue.

One more thing, the vacuum actuated waste gate can be more ''lazy'' with mileage and you wont reach full boost resquested by the ecu. Personally I did the spring mod since it was easy safe and cheap. Around 145k km, I was boosting around 17psi , while I had solid 23psi previously. Added springs, and back around 23-24psi.

[a4937]

im on the forum for a while, and I rarely see oem k03 failing.

they will piss oil trough the journal bearing, but nothing to be worried about if it's not excessive, Ive noticed oil in my intercoolers around 40k km, and now 160k km, not more, not less.

use good oil.

I would be more worried about balancer shaft and oil pump, but nothing to do with the tune.

I also run stage 2 since 2015, no issue, however I have one of the most conservative flash, which is unitronic. I like the fact I can fill the car with 87 to 94 without any issue.

One more thing, the vacuum actuated waste gate can be more ''lazy'' with mileage and you wont reach full boost resquested by the ecu. Personally I did the spring mod since it was easy safe and cheap. Around 145k km, I was boosting around 17psi , while I had solid 23psi previously. Added springs, and back around 23-24psi.

Thanks so much! What's the spring mod? First I've heard that.

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[oVeRdOsE]

https://www.vwvortex.com/threads/was...g-mod.5700226/

https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...20-and-20-mins

this is not the right way to do it, but it worked for me, my b7 is now my 3rd car, so I dont really care much putting time and $ into it.

note that is not a 20min job, on the transversal 2.0t you can't see shit and can't use long pliers, you ''guess'' if the spring is on or not. Took me around 1h+ .

[Sa12_gecko]

I recently went from a Stage 1 to 2 with a Motoza Tune. Actually, kind of did it in stages as I got the parts so I had S1 for almost a year, then S1+HFC for a few weeks, S1+HFC+HPFP for a few days, then finally went Stage 2.

Stock to Stage 1 is the most significant improvement.

Stage 1 and a HFC made a nice difference, boost seemed to kick in smoother and earlier.

Stage 1 with the HFC and HPFP, no noticeable difference from the prior as the car isn’t taking advantage of it.

Stage 2 was an improvement, ran even smoother, boost was more noticeable especially at higher RPMs.

If I went back in time, would I still have gone from S1 to S2? Well, I wanted a HFC so yeah you might as well at that point. If I didn’t want a HFC? Nah, would’ve just stayed with S1 as I was happy with it.


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[Phil Audi B7]

I had JHM stage1 for the longest time then upgraded to the Milltek Cat back exhaust and TT downpipe. The downpipe made all the difference. Something to be aware of with the Milltek are the clamps where the downpipe attaches to the Y pipe it’s a common issue where the joints sags and falls on one of the cross members causing a vibration. There are several complaints about this. I had to take it to an exhaust shop and have them modify the 2 ends with V joints and that solved the problem. It’s going to take some time to get the deeper tone as the exhaust has a break in period. Mine now has a lower tone than the OEM and I’m happy with it.
As for the JHM tune , just go straight to Stage 2 . You’ll may also want to flash the TCU and smooth out the transmission of its a tip tronic. I no longer have that 1st gear jump after I flashed the TCU.

The tune completely wakes the car up , it’s like a completely different beast and enjoyable to drive. I’m in California and haven’t had any issues getting smog done.

[a4937]

Honestly I'm kinda confused on flashing TCU vs ECU. I've seen it stated several times but still don't know if that's a completely different tune or what exactly.

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[Jake@JHM]

Honestly I'm kinda confused on flashing TCU vs ECU. I've seen it stated several times but still don't know if that's a completely different tune or what exactly.

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TCU is a transmission tune. Its not required but its definitely helpful in terms of performance. It is purchased separately

https://jhmotorsports.com/jhm-tcu-ti...2009-only.html

[Jayz691]

Honestly I'm kinda confused on flashing TCU vs ECU. I've seen it stated several times but still don't know if that's a completely different tune or what exactly.

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TCU is separate. Did mine recently, got it on sale for like $350. I have the new cable I'd be willing to rent out, if ya only need it to flash and be done.?
I bought it just for the TCU tune, as I'm tuned by Motoza(ECU).

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[a4937]

Hmmm so now I'm choosing between the upgraded hpfp and Stg2 or the TCU. LOL damn it.

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[Jake@JHM]

Hmmm so now I'm choosing between the upgraded hpfp and Stg2 or the TCU. LOL damn it.

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Why not both? ;)

[Phil Audi B7]

Start with the Downpipe and Catback exhaust and go to Stage 2.
You don’t need a HPFP or a HFC with JHM’s stage 2 tune at 91 octane. You won’t max out the OEM fuel pump. Start with that . This upgrade with the tune should run you around 1300.00 plus or minus.

The tune for the Transmission can be done at a later date if funds are tight.

This is just my 2 cents , I use my car as a daily driver.