My Son Decided to take my project car to WOT! Here's what happened

[Yogibara]

<Moderator, I accidentally posted this in the B8 forum>

Hey everyone,
Some of you may remember me when I bought a 2007 A4 and rebuilt the engine on my YouTube Channel Yogi’s Garage. Well I'm happy to report that the engine was running great up until last week. I gave the car to my son as a daily driver and recently he took it to top speed and the car threw a Low Oil Pressure alarm. He brings it to me and I drain the oil and inspect the filter to start. The filter was kinda grey and there were silver flecks of glitter. I've sent the oil off to be analyzed. Oil pressure isn't great either. Cold is ~17-20psi, 3K revving goes up to 50psi. I can get it up to 60 with a high rev. Warm is hovering around 7-10psi!! Oil plug is magnetic, only had the creamy grey stuff, no chunks, thank god.

Meanwhile, I took the valve cover off and inspected the top end. No issues. I also scoped the cylinders, no issue. Aside from the issues with the oil and pressure, the car now makes a really bad rattling sound when revving. I've linked a private video to this thread. Take a listen and let me know what you think.

Engine build deets:
Full bearing replacement
new oil pickup
old oil pump
new belts,
new cam chain
new oil cooler
new rings
new plugs
new coils
new injectors
age of engine: <10K miles

All the best,
Yogi

This is a private video, so no thumbnail

https://youtu.be/E7CJTwdrcRk

Oil Filter

[james12lucy]

Yogi; I’m sorry to hear this has happened. I followed the build and now your Porsche, so let’s see how many more followers are here.

Im going to assume it’s a jenky balance shaft issue. The first engine I over rotated sounded very similar before the tear down. You might want to drop the pan and inspect the oil pump/ balance shaft assembly. Mine fired up and ran when cold, then started having real issues once up to temp. You might be able to get away with clipping the balance shaft gear, cleaning everything up, and continuing to run it without a major tear down.


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[Yogibara]

Yo! Thanks for the cylinder head. Still going strong. Aside from a couple of stripped m6 bolts.

That sound must be resonating from the sump then because it’s so loud up top. If I remember correctly, dropping the sump requires lowering the subframe. Not a HUGE deal but a PITA none the less.


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[VinnysS4]

Yogi; I’m sorry to hear this has happened. I followed the build and now your Porsche, so let’s see how many more followers are here.

Im going to assume it’s a jenky balance shaft issue. The first engine I over rotated sounded very similar before the tear down. You might want to drop the pan and inspect the oil pump/ balance shaft assembly. Mine fired up and ran when cold, then started having real issues once up to temp. You might be able to get away with clipping the balance shaft gear, cleaning everything up, and continuing to run it without a major tear down.


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I came here to say this as well. I'd drop the oil pan and inspect the balance shafts and balance shafts sprocket. They tend to size and can snap the bolt holding the sprocket on. If the engine is fairly new i wouldn't expect the pickup to be clogged, but also check that out.

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[james12lucy]

Yo! Thanks for the cylinder head. Still going strong. Aside from a couple of stripped m6 bolts.

That sound must be resonating from the sump then because it’s so loud up top. If I remember correctly, dropping the sump requires lowering the subframe. Not a HUGE deal but a PITA none the less.


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Glad it’s still holding up, despite the stripped M6 bolts. I recall a great video fixing them.

Yeah, dropping subframe helps, as does disconnecting the trans mount and jacking the engine. That said, getting the pan back on with out leaks is a pain in the rectum.


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[Yogibara]

Yeah I feared that as well. It may be easier to just pull the engine, minus the transmission. Or I could just toss it in the trash and source a new engine. 😎 Hurts my feelings just looking at it in that condition. I must have failed somewhere because I could have sworn I taught my boys how to respect a car and keep it clean. But alas, this car looks like it's been lived in. The engine was practically new. I'm going to do a follow up video on Olaf, "When Tragedy Strikes" or something like that.
@vinnys4 Thanks for the tip.

It would be easier if the cam chain tensioner was bad. It's a pain but at least I don't have to drop the subframe. Either way, looks like I have some decisions to make.

[VinnysS4]

I feel your pain man. Last September I bought an 07 4.2L Q7 from a little old lady. It had just hit 100k miles. Extremely clean. Huge stack of receipts came with it.
On my drive home, the oil pressure light came on and very quickly afterwards the engine gave way. I spent about $5000 rebuilding a wrecking yard engine for it, only to have it develop a rod knock 5k miles after the rebuild. Very disheartening because it was the only 4.2L BAR engine in my state. Not sure what I'm going to do with it now. I basically bought a huge expensive paperweight.

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[Mister J]

@Yogibara I followed your build too. I don't have anything useful to add. Sorry about the bad luck. I look forward to seeing your follow-up vid

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[Yogibara]

Thanks, my wife and I are actually discussing this right now. Do I pull the engine and drop the sump and hope it’s the oil pump and repair it? Or do I sell it as-is and use the proceeds towards another one? Or let him drive it as-is until it blows up. The latter would suck but there has to be a lesson learned here, right? You break it, you bought it. But he’s a college student working a full time job so I can’t just give him a ticking time bomb. Ugh. The other issue is my channel, right? The Project Olaf didn’t get much traction early on so I might lose some viewership, which puts me in a hole. If I had the big ad-revenue coming in I’d just get another car and be done with it. So much to think about.


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[Yogibara]

Update. I got the engine out, sans the transmission (it's not that hard to take the engine out w/o it). Here's a pic. Note one is not like the other.


So I guess the question is, can this be saved?

[PhireSideZA]

Whoa! That oil pump is toast!

I reckon if the pump itself is good you can delete the balance shafts and plug the holes, but I would personally not trust a pump like that again. I'd also be worried about oil pressure to the rest of your engine and whether there would be damage to the other areas of the motor.

Brand new second-hand engine time?

[Yogibara]

Whoa! That oil pump is toast!

I reckon if the pump itself is good you can delete the balance shafts and plug the holes, but I would personally not trust a pump like that again. I'd also be worried about oil pressure to the rest of your engine and whether there would be damage to the other areas of the motor.

Brand new second-hand engine time?

So yes, there was a grey sludge in the sump. I've flushed the oil once already and will do it a couple more times. I'm going to find a refurb on ebay and send it. I personally put the engine together so everything else looks good inmho. There is a slight slop on the big end side of the conrods but I've been told it's because there aren't thrust washer for each rod. I may remove a cap and inspect the bearings. The head shows no sign of journal damage.

[Jayz691]

You would need to find out what damage ya have, from all that metal in your oil. At min, id pull the cam cradle, to check journals. Usually first thing to damage. If bad, check bearings, etc. Could need a head, maybe not, or more... Ya want really know till ya do some digging. Def a used pump, id do a freewheel(wasa), check cooling jets, tensioner, etc. Thats if the engine isn't destroyed.

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[Yogibara]

You would need to gind out what damage ya have, from all that metal in your oil. At min, id pull the cam cradle, to check journals. Usually first thing to damage. If bad, check bearings, etc. Could need a head, maybe not, or more... Ya want really know till ya do some digging. Def a used pump, id do a freewheel(wasa), check cooling jets, tensioner, etc. Thats if the engine isn't destroyed.

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The top end appears to have been saved. The car was not operated with LOP warning going but was stopped and parked and the engine was allowed to cool. It was then brought to me, albeit 37 miles away, and I immediately flushed the oil and restored most/all oil pressure. I think another flush and a new pump might save my arse. Engine w/o turbo is selling for 2500 in Houston, so that's pretty much off the table. Even though the engine is out of the car right now, I just can't bring myself to slap another used engine in there after I rebuilt the first one to almost factory new. The one single point of failure was that damn pump and I should have taken the advice I was given at the time and deleted the shafts. I just didn't expect my son to run it at WOT with a oil change due and probably at least a 1/2 a quart down. Oh well, lesson learned, he's paying for the parts out of his own pocket as I GAVE him the car. I remember doing stupid stuff like that when I was his age and somehow I never nearly blew up an engine.

[Jayz691]

Well, that balance shaft had to be worn for a WHILE, to get that bad. Thats not from givin her hell once or twice.
But if everything up top is good, id say bottom end is fine. Grab a used pump assembly off ebay for $150-$200,
A freewheel from was a for about the same. Takes about a week to get, surprisingly, from Sweden. If ya didn't check your cooling jets when rebuilding, if check the front 3. Replace any that are bad. Throw it back in, and cross your fingers..

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[Theiceman]

Well, that balance shaft had to be worn for a WHILE, to get that bad. Thats not from givin her hell once or twice.
But if everything up top is good, id say bottom end is fine. Grab a used pump assembly off ebay for $150-$200,
A freewheel from was a for about the same. Takes about a week to get, surprisingly, from Sweden. If ya didn't check your cooling jets when rebuilding, if check the front 3. Replace any that are bad. Throw it back in, and cross your fingers..

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yeah i was thinking the same thing .. that is an absolutely massive amount of metal gone from that pump . i have no idea how the engine could survive this or how this went for so long without a low oil pressure message . Id sure be interested in what the inside of that oil filter looks like.

[Yogibara]

Alright, the video is up. Check it out and see what I found. Good stuff.

https://youtu.be/7msJCr3qVNA

[Jayz691]

Cool video. Gotta say though, that little plug it the end, there was a lot more water left on the fender on that GT shine, below the body line. Stick with the Griots
But for as the engine, used pump and you'll prob be good. Did you inspect the BS's when you did the rebuild? Did that start wearing, and get to that point, in the short time since the rebuild? That would be crazy..

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[Yogibara]

Cool video. Gotta say though, that little plug it the end, there was a lot more water left on the fender on that GT shine, below the body line. Stick with the Griots
But for as the engine, used pump and you'll prob be good. Did you inspect the BS's when you did the rebuild? Did that start wearing, and get to that point, in the short time since the rebuild? That would be crazy..

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Ha! GTShine has 15% SiO2, not sure about Griots but they’re both really good.
I did indeed. They were both tight. It makes me wonder how many times my son gave it the beans. Poor car. The new, FCP water pump gave it up too. Seems to have been leaking for a bit cuz there was a significant amount of dry coolant around the crank sprocket. The timing cover sealed it up really well!

[Jayz691]

Well, just from that little demo, id say Griots is the winner..
What failed on the water pump? Was it leaking where its goes into the block? Well, at least you'll get store credit when you replace it. But strange to see it failed already. Was it a Graf/Hepu?

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[FatMongo]

Update. I got the engine out, sans the transmission (it's not that hard to take the engine out w/o it). Here's a pic. Note one is not like the other.


So I guess the question is, can this be saved?

Lol,

My first 2006 A4 had the EXACT same issue. I have a thread about it on here. Everything about mine was exactly like yours. Here's my oil pump:

[Yogibara]

Yo, I was wondering if you were gonna chime in. Looks like your channel is growing! It's painful and sometimes and it's like watching paint dry but the needle does move.

[PhireSideZA]

And here I am on the other side of the spectrum, sitting with two balance shafts that won't move at all! Seized solid in the bores as if they were welded in

[FatMongo]

Yo, I was wondering if you were gonna chime in. Looks like your channel is growing! It's painful and sometimes and it's like watching paint dry but the needle does move.

Yes Sir! Not worried too much about it growing - I do the content for fun, the subscribers are a side benefit. Now dont get me wrong - I love to see it grow, but I dont sweat the pace at which it does.

- - - Updated - - -

Yo, I was wondering if you were gonna chime in. Looks like your channel is growing! It's painful and sometimes and it's like watching paint dry but the needle does move.

Let me know if you need anything. By now I know you are more than familiar with the inner workings of a 2.0 FSI. But if you need any tools, bolts, or parts - give me a shout.

[Yogibara]

Yes Sir! Not worried too much about it growing - I do the content for fun, the subscribers are a side benefit. Now dont get me wrong - I love to see it grow, but I dont sweat the pace at which it does.

- - - Updated - - -



Let me know if you need anything. By now I know you are more than familiar with the inner workings of a 2.0 FSI. But if you need any tools, bolts, or parts - give me a shout.

Cool, thanks!

[Yogibara]

Ok it arrived today. I’m going to cut the gear to delete the BS. Olaf will be back on the streets in no time!

Question. Is freewheeling the left sprocket necessary?

[VinnysS4]

I believe so. Or you can cut the shaft before the gears so the balance shaft doesn't turn. That's atleast what I did on the last 2.0

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[Yogibara]

Cool, thanks. That's what I'll do. I'll cut the small sprocket and let it freeball... err. freewheel.

[Theiceman]

image deleted not to mislead anyone as something better was identified.

[Jayz691]

When people do the "poor mans delete", I'm pretty sure they cut this gear off.
Better choice is a freewheel though, as the dampened sprocket is still a failure point. Though its "less" likely, without the BS's engaged. Best way to do it, if cutting the gears, is run a solid sprocket..Screenshot_20230622-132155~2.jpgScreenshot_20230622-132531.jpg

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[Gosser]

I have cut it off where Jayz691 highlighted in blue, the smaller gear. Takes three cuts with a dremel cut off. Its been 15,000km since and zero issues. I was thinking of a free wheel, but why spend $300cad when the cutting is free. Without the balance shafts connected and all that resistance, the dampening sprocket will never fail. I replaced the dampening sprocket bolt though for good measure.

PB Garage here ;) thanks for the kind words! Good luck with the reassembly.

[Jayz691]

I have cut it off where Jayz691 highlighted in blue, the smaller gear. Takes three cuts with a dremel cut off. Its been 15,000km since and zero issues. I was thinking of a free wheel, but why spend $300cad when the cutting is free. Without the balance shafts connected and all that resistance, the dampening sprocket will never fail. I replaced the dampening sprocket bolt though for good measure.

PB Garage here ;) thanks for the kind words! Good luck with the reassembly.

Can't say "it'll never fail", but can say its "less likely"..

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[Yogibara]

It’s almost all buttoned up and ready to go back in!

[VinnysS4]

Yes thats the gear i cut off the last 2.0

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[Yogibara]

Hey guys here's the conclusion of this journey with this car. I cover all the details on the oil pump and showed first engine start. All good! Enjoy!

https://youtu.be/ISemKRJzOQ8

[Jayz691]

Well, hopefully it'll be good for a long time now.
Few things id add to this. If the balance shafts are deleted, theres no need to time the sprockets on the pump. Thats only if BS's are still engaged. They spin at double the rpm of the engine, and they need to be timed correctly.
If for some reason ya don't get new hardware for it, ya should at least replace the one with the o-rings on it. Its runs through and oil ports, and those keep it sealed.
Curious where ya get the pump from, almost looks like its was painted silver, lol. Got mine used on ebay, but there's ones that say theyre "remaned", but all those are from china. I would avoid those personally. When getting a used pump, its also a good idea to inspect the pressure valve, for any wear, and to ensure it moves freely.
Overall a success though.
Hopefully ya wont have to pull the engine again.

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[Yogibara]

Well, hopefully it'll be good for a long time now.
Few things id add to this. If the balance shafts are deleted, theres no need to time the sprockets on the pump. Thats only if BS's are still engaged. They spin at double the rpm of the engine, and they need to be timed correctly.
If for some reason ya don't get new hardware for it, ya should at least replace the one with the o-rings on it. Its runs through and oil ports, and those keep it sealed.
Curious where ya get the pump from, almost looks like its was painted silver, lol. Got mine used on ebay, but there's ones that say theyre "remaned", but all those are from china. I would avoid those personally. When getting a used pump, its also a good idea to inspect the pressure valve, for any wear, and to ensure it moves freely.
Overall a success though.
Hopefully ya wont have to pull the engine again.

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The bolts to the OP were replaced when I rebuilt the engine. It was so clean that I thought the same thing. The seller is alujingheart

Thanks for taking the time to reply!