RS6/7 problems and warranty claims

[Corgiman30]

Input your VIN here at NHTSA site; https://www.nhtsa.gov/


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum

That shows recalls but can’t find TSBs

[spomm]

https://www.nhtsa.gov/vehicle/2021/A...Communications

Look at manufacturer communications.

That shows recalls but can’t find TSBs

Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[Gecon]

Knowing the sequence of events leading up to the failure, the best advice I can give is recognizing the early signs of impending doom. If and when you see these signs, you have but a short while before the car dies and your day is ruined and your disappointment immeasurable.

1. Auto start / stop system stops working "Vehicle starting system: Malfunction! Please contact Service" is the message you will see. The start stop system button will be greyed out (deactivated). This itself is the first early warning sign, but it is NON-SPECIFIC. This in fact happens all the time for no apparent reason and it doesn't mean you're heading down the path of death. I always always disable the start/stop system everytime I turn on the car, so keep a close eye on this. If you see this, be on alert that something more sinister could happen.

2. Sequence of YELLOW colored malfunctions such as "Sport differential malfunction" , "electric system malfunction" . These mean you're very likely headed towards doom. It is the consequence of the 48V system not getting enough juice and the car is intelligently disabling things that require that power to conserve what remains for more essential functions. That's also why the auto start stop system is the first thing to go because it is least essential.

3. Dreaded RED colored warning message of death "Electric system: Malfunction! Safely stop vehicle." This is different because it is red colored. The red triangle icon will illuminate also above the digital screen. Seeing this means you have about 5 minutes at maximum before critical total system failure. They are not kidding. STOP DRIVING immediately. The next messages that come right after this one are "Parking brake: malfunction" and then "Steering system: malfunction" and then you will loose power steering. This is when it gets extra exciting. Let me tell you it will cause a real tingle down your spine. Suddenly you're trying to pull off the road and it's like the steering has died. Good luck and pull hard is all I can say.

4. Everything else fails immediately in sequence. The throttle stops working. You press the gas and it revs but no power goes to the drivetrain. So now you've got a dead steering wheel and a dead gas pedal. Life is simple! You only have the brakes. So conserve momentum because you won't be able to speed back up again. Find a place to softly land / crash. AC system stops. Music dies. You are denied any epic music to accompany your glorious landing, this isn't the movies unfortunately.

5. You are now stopped and the car shakes and vibrates, feels like it is going to stall. The primary gauge cluster dims. The rev meter turns all red and flashes. Windows will start to stop working about now, or at least move very very slowly. There's only a tiny bit of battery left at this point, so you're on minimum life support - be prudent what you use energy for at this time. You want to conserve power for the hazard lights.

6. As you wait by or in the road for a tow, contemplate your life choices that got you here. Meditate on the positive. Try not to get hit by traffic. Watch as the screens in front of you dim further and further until they die completely. Watch as your hazard lights dim and dim until they die too. Now you've hit rock bottom, congratulations.

Iguana1500, thank you for making me laugh at an otherwise awful issue! I have had a few quirks that all have been mentioned but the only one puzzling is my auto start feature does not work, nor is it grayed out, nor do i have any warnings. frankly, I may be lucky. But today I noticed my Audi app (which somehow seemed to think I just enrolled in the app) says my car is not parked safely...WTF. It says I may have a door, trunk, or hood open but I do not. The auto start won't work if the hood is open i think?? anyway, I will just wait for the recalls to stack up before bringing it to the dealer.

I will also add that when i bought my RS6 used from the Audi dealer, i ended up buy their "Gold Standard' extended warranty for $4000...maybe $4500. It is good for 20 years and 500,000 miles. it covers everything mechanical as well as all the electronics. The warranty has options you can buy such as the hi-tech option which is the one to cover sensors, GPS, touch screens. Of course, like all warranties, you have to read the fine print. mostly the fine print states that the car must be serviced per the recommended schedules and you must have proof (obviously). It partly means you cannot change the oil yourself if that's something you like to do.

thank you again for the laugh but mostly for the information as I will be ready to deal with this crisis if and when it happens.

Oh, did anyone pickup in the video that the guy said to put your foot on the brake before engaging into neutral? I would highly doubt that it would have changed your outcome but worth noting.

[Gecon]

I forgot about one problem I have not read about. The cell phone charging pad is always quite warm. On a recent road trip, after an hour or two of charging, my I-phone 13 got so hot that it shut down. needless to say i now just use the USBc port for charging. It would be nice to use the charging pad because the manual says it will sync with the car antennae for better coverage.

Has anyone else had this problem and was it fixed. I am just thinking it is one of those issues that cannot be fixed...like my driver's seat that sometimes doesn't move back into position when I get into the car. my other favorite is my AC comes on at full blast when i first start the car. after one minute it goes back to normal mode, which is usually off when its cold outside and the engine is not yet warm enough for heat

[OneFastBMW]

I forgot about one problem I have not read about. The cell phone charging pad is always quite warm. On a recent road trip, after an hour or two of charging, my I-phone 13 got so hot that it shut down. needless to say i now just use the USBc port for charging. It would be nice to use the charging pad because the manual says it will sync with the car antennae for better coverage.

Has anyone else had this problem and was it fixed. I am just thinking it is one of those issues that cannot be fixed...like my driver's seat that sometimes doesn't move back into position when I get into the car. my other favorite is my AC comes on at full blast when i first start the car. after one minute it goes back to normal mode, which is usually off when its cold outside and the engine is not yet warm enough for heat

I think this is more an issue with wireless charging in general. Wireless charging works by running current through a copper coil. A similar coil is located in the back of the phone. If the two coils are not lined up you get inefficiencies in the form of heat, so it is very important that the phone be in the exact right spot. This is why Apple introduced their MagSafe features in iPhones. There is a magnet in the phone and on the wireless charger that “snap” the phone into the correct spot.

Also, with wireless charging the kind of case that you use is very important. Not all cases are compatible with wireless charging. While it may receive a charge, it could get very hot as the case moves the two could further apart. If there is any metal in the case it is even worse.

[afrozenfyre]

Got hit with the "Stage 2" failure today - all yellow. I was able to continue driving about 10 miles to get to the dealer where they confirmed alternator failure. They have 16 A6/3.0 cars waiting for alternators since November 2022, but supposedly the 4.0 alternator is more available? 2021 RS6, 17k miles.

Interestingly, the handling was noticeably worse with the sport differential disabled.

[Jimminez@Nemesis]

Got hit with the "Stage 2" failure today - all yellow. I was able to continue driving about 10 miles to get to the dealer where they confirmed alternator failure. They have 16 A6/3.0 cars waiting for alternators since November 2022, but supposedly the 4.0 alternator is more available? 2021 RS6, 17k miles.

Interestingly, the handling was noticeably worse with the sport differential disabled.

Sucky but good you were able to get to the dealer and avoid towing.

Yes, I have heard the same with A/S cars having a longer wait for parts vs RS, and a significant one too.

[Gecon]

All great points! There is not much room for the phone to sit in the charging bay but I will pay attention to it. perhaps my case is not the best and i hate it anyways!
many thanks!

*** I was referring to phone charger issue...

[Corgiman30]

I just saw that there is a TSB for the RS6/RS7 with a production date before January 27th, 2022. The TSB is for a valve spring that can break off. If a valve spring breaks the repair is to replace either all intake or all exhaust valve springs, or in some cases replace all 32 valve springs. This is IF the valve with the broken screen does not contact the cylinder head.

IF the valve contacts a piston or drops down into the cylinder you are looking at a new engine.

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...11720-0001.pdf

Does anyone know if this issue is affecting Porsche/Bentley/ Lamborghini? I think they all use this engine.

[DeputyDog95]

Thank you, Captain.

[Iguana1500]

Iguana1500, thank you for making me laugh at an otherwise awful issue! I have had a few quirks that all have been mentioned but the only one puzzling is my auto start feature does not work, nor is it grayed out, nor do i have any warnings. frankly, I may be lucky. But today I noticed my Audi app (which somehow seemed to think I just enrolled in the app) says my car is not parked safely...WTF. It says I may have a door, trunk, or hood open but I do not. The auto start won't work if the hood is open i think?? anyway, I will just wait for the recalls to stack up before bringing it to the dealer.

I will also add that when i bought my RS6 used from the Audi dealer, i ended up buy their "Gold Standard' extended warranty for $4000...maybe $4500. It is good for 20 years and 500,000 miles. it covers everything mechanical as well as all the electronics. The warranty has options you can buy such as the hi-tech option which is the one to cover sensors, GPS, touch screens. Of course, like all warranties, you have to read the fine print. mostly the fine print states that the car must be serviced per the recommended schedules and you must have proof (obviously). It partly means you cannot change the oil yourself if that's something you like to do.

thank you again for the laugh but mostly for the information as I will be ready to deal with this crisis if and when it happens.

Oh, did anyone pickup in the video that the guy said to put your foot on the brake before engaging into neutral? I would highly doubt that it would have changed your outcome but worth noting.

Glad I could offer some humor in an otherwise humorless topic.
That extended warranty you bought sounds like the longest ever warranty lol. 20 years?! Mechanical and electronics? Sounds comprehensive.
I do not use the myAudi app, I hear it is junk.
Yes, foot on brake when forcing car into Neutral. All doors closed too.

[Iguana1500]

Got hit with the "Stage 2" failure today - all yellow. I was able to continue driving about 10 miles to get to the dealer where they confirmed alternator failure. They have 16 A6/3.0 cars waiting for alternators since November 2022, but supposedly the 4.0 alternator is more available? 2021 RS6, 17k miles.

Interestingly, the handling was noticeably worse with the sport differential disabled.

I'm so happy you made it to the dealer!

Yes, when sport differential stops working you definitely feel it, more so when driving in a parking lot. Not only does the turning radius dramatically increase, the steering effort goes up.

[FBAnder]

Audi is supposedly extending the warranty to 7 years / unlimited miles on the BSG. There is not a new part # yet so any installed replacements are subject to the same issue until the manufacturer starts making an updated/fixed BSG. The software update is NOT a guaranteed fix...some reports that proactively having a dealer install the updated BSG software resulted in BSG failure shortly thereafter. The whole if it ain't broke don't fix it thing. Soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo yeah, still kinda a crapshoot nightmare in the wait until a revised part comes into existence at which point I would not be surprised if a full blown recall happens.

Interestingly enough, the revised TSB from September 2022 that lumps in MY2023 vehicles doesn't include the RS6 anymore...since it does include the RS7 and RSQ8, I assume that is in error.

[Nsd991]

Audi is supposedly extending the warranty to 7 years / unlimited miles on the BSG. There is not a new part # yet so any installed replacements are subject to the same issue until the manufacturer starts making an updated/fixed BSG. The software update is NOT a guaranteed fix...some reports that proactively having a dealer install the updated BSG software resulted in BSG failure shortly thereafter. The whole if it ain't broke don't fix it thing. Soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo yeah, still kinda a crapshoot nightmare in the wait until a revised part comes into existence at which point I would not be surprised if a full blown recall happens.

Interestingly enough, the revised TSB from September 2022 that lumps in MY2023 vehicles doesn't include the RS6 anymore...since it does include the RS7 and RSQ8, I assume that is in error.

Sorry for my ignorance: What is the BSG?

[FBAnder]

Sorry for my ignorance: What is the BSG?

belt starter generator. The 48V alternator/generator that has been dying all over the place.

[DeputyDog95]

Sorry for my ignorance: What is the BSG?

I was just calling it the alternator...

Mine went out about a month or so ago at 20k miles. Took a week to fix it, which I guess is fast for this repair.

[Nsd991]

Thanks, that’s good news because that’s the failure that would tip me over the edge to sell this car (I really like it otherwise)

[rusq5]

Took my car in today for the alternator. I was able to make it home when all the warning lights came on. I hooked it up to a tender for a few days and the car started right up and had no errors/warnings. I was able to drive it around before taking it to the dealer. It seems like if I wasn't on a stock flash, I could have flashed back to stock with no issue. I was trying to burn through my tank of 91 so I could flash to E85 when I got the errors.

Was told that a customer with a 3.0T car had waited 2 months for just the alternator, but fingers crossed mine comes quicker.

[OneFastBMW]

I got a note today that the BSG warranty has been extended to 7 years, also the letter says that if you have paid for this repair you may be entitled to reimbursement.

[Jimminez@Nemesis]

I got a note today that the BSG warranty has been extended to 7 years, also the letter says that if you have paid for this repair you may be entitled to reimbursement.

but not if you paid out of pocket due to being TD1 flagged, according to my local dealer.

[OneFastBMW]

but not if you paid out of pocket due to being TD1 flagged, according to my local dealer.

I personally would fight them on that (likely a discussion with Audi Corporate, not the dealer). Audi has now acknowledged that this part is prone to failure. I would tell them that the engine modifications did not alter to function/use of the BSG and the repair should be covered. A tuned vehicle doesn’t give a manufacture the “all-clear” to deny warranty claims.

At the very least I would pay an attorney who specializes in warranty work a few hundred to discuss the matter and if warranted (no pun intended) write a letter to Audi.

[Junkmail9]

I just brought home a 2023 RS7 and am in love - hopefully I'm in the clear from the dreaded alternator issue, but keeping my eyes peeled for the symptoms - thanks everyone for the write ups on this topic! There were some strange error warnings the first night after bringing it home, but haven't happened since and figured they were from it sitting in the dealership for however long.

The two issues I do have is the steering wheel has some popping/thud feelings in it (not very audible) when reversing, either direction of 0-degrees until about 15-degrees and all at realitively low speeds. From the angle of my driveway backing in is the only way to not scrape the beautiful bumper. That, and the passanger door handle occasionally makes a strange electronic motor noise when the door is being opened - only happens when the handles are pulled (in the open position). If you pull and hold the handle out, the motor winds up and up and up - like a whirring sound. I have a feeling its part of the soft-close mechanism...but who knows. Waiting until the plates come in at least until i bring it in as neither issue is too crazy :) *knocks on wood*

[TFarrell]

just got my car back from the electrical system malfunction. took 7 weeks and didnt get a loaner the whole time. hope she dont break down again, i want to do more go fast bits lol

my 2021 rs6 just broke down on the highway again leaving me stranded. 38k miles. round 2... made it 8k miles since they fixed it last. wondering if i should sell the car now... the time without the car is the wurst. wonder how good the cayenne turbos are....

has this happened twice or multiple times to people?

[Jimminez@Nemesis]

my 2021 rs6 just broke down on the highway again leaving me stranded. 38k miles. round 2... made it 8k miles since they fixed it last. wondering if i should sell the car now... the time without the car is the wurst. wonder how good the cayenne turbos are....

has this happened twice or multiple times to people?

Dang. Repair done 8k miles ago was for alternator and this time you had same symptoms?

[GR8VTen]

my 2021 rs6 just broke down on the highway again leaving me stranded. 38k miles. round 2... made it 8k miles since they fixed it last. wondering if i should sell the car now... the time without the car is the wurst. wonder how good the cayenne turbos are....

has this happened twice or multiple times to people?

I switched to a Cayenne Turbo GT back in October and will never look back... the build quality and materials of the Porsche is in a league of its own, the precision of steering, ride quality and acceleration (2.8s) is simply mind boggling, the RS6/7 can't remotely touch the TGT on any of these vectors, I did a couple of weeks of side by side driving. Same curb weight as the RS6 BTW.

[CanuckRS]

I just came from a Cayenne GTS and while the Cayenne handles well for an SUV, it can't make up for it's high center of gravity.
The materials are definitely better in the Porsche, you get what you pay for but I found the porsche tech outdated and annoying most of the time.

[TFarrell]

Dang. Repair done 8k miles ago was for alternator and this time you had same symptoms?

no my check engine light was on right when i got home last night, then this morning on the way to work on the highway the car just shut down while driving with the same symptoms as before. i do wonder if i ran out of gas today and the float was off but, electrical malfunctions happened as well as differential when the car stopped today. i love the car but dont want to deal with this

[TFarrell]

I just came from a Cayenne GTS and while the Cayenne handles well for an SUV, it can't make up for it's high center of gravity.
The materials are definitely better in the Porsche, you get what you pay for but I found the porsche tech outdated and annoying most of the time.

i do love the rs6. no doubt about that. it drives so well. just hate my car breaking down and my dealer never has a loaner for me.

[TFarrell]

I switched to a Cayenne Turbo GT back in October and will never look back... the build quality and materials of the Porsche is in a league of its own, the precision of steering, ride quality and acceleration (2.8s) is simply mind boggling, the RS6/7 can't remotely touch the TGT on any of these vectors, I did a couple of weeks of side by side driving. Same curb weight as the RS6 BTW.

see i do need a heavy car so i can write if off again. thats part of why im looking at the cayenne turbos. ive been told the newer cayennes with the 4 wheel steering handle really well. the interior on the new cayennes look really nice.

[The_Capt]

my 2021 rs6 just broke down on the highway again leaving me stranded. 38k miles. round 2... made it 8k miles since they fixed it last. wondering if i should sell the car now... the time without the car is the wurst. wonder how good the cayenne turbos are....

has this happened twice or multiple times to people?

Do you happen to know when your ‘21 RS6 was produced?

Mine was produced 0321 and sitting at 18k miles with zero issues. *Knock on wood*


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum

[OneFastBMW]

see i do need a heavy car so i can write if off again. thats part of why im looking at the cayenne turbos. ive been told the newer cayennes with the 4 wheel steering handle really well. the interior on the new cayennes look really nice.

I will try to avoid giving specific tax advice, but some things to consider. An RS6 and a Cayenne both have a GVWR over 6,000 pounds. This makes them eligible for additional first year depreciation (AKA bonus depreciation) under IRC 168(k) since they are not subject to the passenger automobile rules under IRC 280F. A vehicle with a GVWR over 6,000 is not considered a “passenger vehicle” with respect to the tax code.

So, from the IRS’s eyes there is really no difference between an RS6 and a Cayenne.

Having said that, this accelerated depreciation is only available IFthe vehicle is used at least half for business and logs are maintained (commuting from home to the office and office to home don’t count as business use). The vehicle must also be “ordinary and necessary” for the business operations. Even if the vehicle is below 6,000 you don’t “lose” tax benefits, you receive a smaller benefit for more years instead of front loading that benefit. Generally speaking, no matter the weight of the vehicle you will get a tax deduction for the vehicle cost times the business use percentage of the vehicle. The 6,000 pound rule isn’t really as big of a deal as people make it out to be. Your aggregate deduction will mostly be the same no matter the weight.

Also don’t forget, any tax saved from depreciating that asset will cause to have to recognize ordinary income when the vehicle is sold under something called IRS 1245 Recapture.

[FBAnder]

no my check engine light was on right when i got home last night, then this morning on the way to work on the highway the car just shut down while driving with the same symptoms as before. i do wonder if i ran out of gas today and the float was off but, electrical malfunctions happened as well as differential when the car stopped today. i love the car but dont want to deal with this

Holy cow if this is two 48V generator failures that is bad news for everyone since that seems to indicate there is no real fix yet.

[carguyshu]

I will try to avoid giving specific tax advice, but some things to consider. An RS6 and a Cayenne both have a GVWR over 6,000 pounds. This makes them eligible for additional first year depreciation (AKA bonus depreciation) under IRC 168(k) since they are not subject to the passenger automobile rules under IRC 280F. A vehicle with a GVWR over 6,000 is not considered a “passenger vehicle” with respect to the tax code.

So, from the IRS’s eyes there is really no difference between an RS6 and a Cayenne.

Having said that, this accelerated depreciation is only available IFthe vehicle is used at least half for business and logs are maintained (commuting from home to the office and office to home don’t count as business use). The vehicle must also be “ordinary and necessary” for the business operations. Even if the vehicle is below 6,000 you don’t “lose” tax benefits, you receive a smaller benefit for more years instead of front loading that benefit. Generally speaking, no matter the weight of the vehicle you will get a tax deduction for the vehicle cost times the business use percentage of the vehicle. The 6,000 pound rule isn’t really as big of a deal as people make it out to be. Your aggregate deduction will mostly be the same no matter the weight.

Also don’t forget, any tax saved from depreciating that asset will cause to have to recognize ordinary income when the vehicle is sold under something called IRS 1245 Recapture.

That’s why leasing is usually a better choice for deductions. No recapture.

[Corgiman30]

Holy cow if this is two 48V generator failures that is bad news for everyone since that seems to indicate there is no real fix yet.

+1

[WTF its Arturo]

Holy cow if this is two 48V generator failures that is bad news for everyone since that seems to indicate there is no real fix yet.

Paging @partsbytopher.

He showed me that the alternators have 3 different part numbers. 1) original part number, 2) a remanufactured alternator and 3)Part number most recently revised in early 2023

This leads me to believe that all of the replacement alternators up to early 2023 may still be prone to the same failure at another point in time down the line. This is an assumption on my part, of course, given the lack of failure data points. TFarrell seems to be the only one up to this point that I'm aware of with 2 failures.

@TFarrell - Is it confirmed that the second issue was the alternator?

[PartsByTopher]

Paging @partsbytopher.
He showed me that the alternators have 3 different part numbers. 1) original part number, 2) a remanufactured alternator and 3)Part number most recently revised in early 2023

Yes that is correct. According to the Electronic Parts Catalog:

4N0-903-028-R: Used in Production Until 02.27.2023
4N0-903-028-T: Used in Production from 02.27.2023---> Forward.

4N0-903-028-RX is also available as a remanufactured part.

At this moment in time it's still an unknown whether the part ending in "T" carries any differences compared to the "R" unit used in production/replacement.

[svra42.8]

Other than the recalls everyone has had come their way I have had two issues addressed at 26,000 miles.

1. Rear Passenger door actuator (soft close) would stick and not allow the car to lock the door at times. Numerous central lock errors.

2. Thermostat failure. (open)


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum

[Atabeygi]

Got hit with the "Stage 2" failure today - all yellow. I was able to continue driving about 10 miles to get to the dealer where they confirmed alternator failure. They have 16 A6/3.0 cars waiting for alternators since November 2022, but supposedly the 4.0 alternator is more available? 2021 RS6, 17k miles.

Interestingly, the handling was noticeably worse with the sport differential disabled.

21 RS6 with 20k miles. I got this as well a few weeks back. Wasn't able to get to dealer for a few days but by then it seemed to have self cleared and the dealer didn't have any idea what it could have been even though I had captured the errors on video (which seems ludicrous now after reading this thread). Luckily it hasn't happened since so not sure what to make of it. I guess just wait and see?

[TFarrell]

my 2021 rs6 just broke down on the highway again leaving me stranded. 38k miles. round 2... made it 8k miles since they fixed it last. wondering if i should sell the car now... the time without the car is the wurst. wonder how good the cayenne turbos are....

has this happened twice or multiple times to people?

got car back. just a recall with the fuel sensor. i ran out of gas but through a bunch of codes. had it back for a month and its been good.

[tinmanwpk]

Glad it wasn't "serious" and you're back cruising again.