Recent SCOTUS rulings....

[sepheroth86]

A pregnant woman has a fetus, she does not have a baby (people say unborn child/baby for ease). A baby requires birth.

Hence the slash.

[ericw.]

A pregnant woman has a fetus, she does not have a baby (people say unborn child/baby for ease). A baby requires birth.

So what does that mean to you since differentiating that term appears to be important? ... Abortions should be allowed as long as they are a "fetus"? You don't get the choice to kill every fetus you want, there are limits even with the most liberal of doctors and states.

Using that term to disconnect yourself from the reality isn't doing yourself any favors and it's not fooling us. That's why you have a strong feeling of obligation to correct people on this. It's still the first stage of life.

[JPT]

Hence the slash.

The slash is incorrect, because a pregnant woman can not have a baby inside of her. She has either an unborn child, unborn baby or the correct term a fetus. Not trying to pick a fight, just pointing it out and waiting for someone to respond to your question.

[JPT]

So what does that mean to you since differentiating that term appears to be important? ... Abortions should be allowed as long as they are a "fetus"? You don't get the choice to kill every fetus you want, there are limits even with the most liberal of doctors and states.

Using that term to disconnect yourself from the reality isn't doing yourself any favors and it's not fooling us. That's why you have a strong feeling of obligation to correct people on this. It's still the first stage of life.

Doesn't mean anything. Just correcting the question that was asked, and going back to sitting back and observing. If you want to pick a fight, it is not with me, I have not given any opinions or implied any opinions at all.

[ericw.]

Doesn't mean anything. Just correcting the question that was asked, and going back to sitting back and observing. If you want to pick a fight, it is not with me, I have not given any opinions or implied any opinions at all.

You have given both.

[sepheroth86]

The slash is incorrect, because a pregnant woman can not have a baby inside of her. She has either an unborn child, unborn baby or the correct term a fetus. Not trying to pick a fight, just pointing it out and waiting for someone to respond to your question.

Doesn't mean anything. Just correcting the question that was asked, and going back to sitting back and observing. If you want to pick a fight, it is not with me, I have not given any opinions or implied any opinions at all.

Thanks for arguing the semantics of the question and completely circumventing answering it.

[JPT]

You have given both.

I have not. Don't assume anything.

[JPT]

Thanks for arguing the semantics of the question and completely circumventing answering it.

I corrected an incorrect statement, that's it. I have no idea how the law would handle the scenario you posed. I assume you could be charged with anything, whether it would stick or not, I have no idea. Still a non-answer on my point.

[RPMtech147]

Nm......

[sepheroth86]

I corrected an incorrect statement, that's it. I have no idea how the law would handle the scenario you posed. I assume you could be charged with anything, whether it would stick or not, I have no idea. Still a non-answer on my point.

I covered both ways that the majority would state the situation. You did not correct anything, then ignored the other half of the statement. You made a point over the semantics that is it.

[JPT]

I covered both ways that the majority would state the situation. You did not correct anything, then ignored the other half of the statement. You made a point over the semantics that is it.

Doesn't change the fact that by definition, a Baby requires birth. You made an incorrect statement, regardless of how many other people in the world may or may not make the same error. In a conversation that is discussing the subtilties of specific weeks of development, and when one feels it is appropriate (or not appropriate) for a pregnant woman to undergo an abortion, it matters.

Just like, if someone is discussing the other hot topic of gun control, decides to call a magazine a clip, or believing the acronym AR in AR15 is Assault Rifle. When it comes to the discussion of making laws, definitions matter... I mean you specifically asked a legal question, with an incorrect definition in the question...

No need to reply to this comment. I have made my point enough times. I am well aware I did not answer the question, as I have stated multiple times, I purposely didn't answer.

[ericw.]

Doesn't change the fact that by definition, a Baby requires birth. You made an incorrect statement, regardless of how many other people in the world may or may not make the same error. In a conversation that is discussing the subtilties of specific weeks of development, and when one feels it is appropriate (or not appropriate) for a pregnant woman to undergo an abortion, it matters.

Just like, if someone is discussing the other hot topic of gun control, decides to call a magazine a clip, or believing the acronym AR in AR15 is Assault Rifle. When it comes to the discussion of making laws, definitions matter... I mean you specifically asked a legal question, with an incorrect definition in the question...

No need to reply to this comment. I have made my point enough times. I am well aware I did not answer the question, as I have stated multiple times, I purposely didn't answer.

Thank you for correcting someone's grammar. Much like the importance of correcting the "your/you're" and "there/they're/their" mistakes on social media, nobody would have been able to understand his question without you clarifying his grammatical mistake.. Excellent contribution, sir!

It's exactly why such contribution is a clear indicator of where you stand and what you mean when you want people to not call them babies. It offends you when you have to think about them as humans. The left bias media, activists, and political figures have defined a "fetus" as a "clump of cells" in recent history, so you can feel totally guilt free from the reality of taking lives.

[RPMtech147]

.....................................

[RPMtech147]

.................................................

[ericw.]

I wonder what else they can feel....

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/fetuses...rasounds-show/

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[ericw.]

Question:

If I were to murder a pregnant woman and the baby/fetus also died, would I or would I not be charged with a double homicide?

Happened last Sunday. It's being investigated as a double homicide.

https://www.kcra.com/article/25-year...-hurt/41395137

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[sepheroth86]

Happened last Sunday. It's being investigated as a double homicide.

https://www.kcra.com/article/25-year...-hurt/41395137

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Weird how the Prosecuting Attorney will call that murder, but an abortion is not.

In California of all places.

[ericw.]

Who was it that said this wasn't the end goal?



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[JPT]

Who was it that said this wasn't the end goal?



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I believe that is a false headline. If I am understanding it correctly, all the bill does is repeal the criminalization of abortions in the state, which was on the books from the 1930's.

https://www.michigan.gov/whitmer/new...20their%20jobs.

[ericw.]

I believe that is a false headline. If I am understanding it correctly, all the bill does is repeal the criminalization of abortions in the state, which was on the books from the 1930's.

https://www.michigan.gov/whitmer/new...20their%20jobs.

Decriminalization without limits... Yep that definitely doesn't mean it's legalized. It's just "decriminalized". Maybe you don't understand the implications of what that means so let's check in on marijuana decriminalization in California for example.


Interesting.

[JPT]

Decriminalization without limits... Yep that definitely doesn't mean it's legalized. It's just "decriminalized". Maybe you don't understand the implications of what that means so let's check in on marijuana decriminalization in California for example.


Interesting.

She did NOT sign a bill to legalize abortions up until birth. That is a sensationalizing title, that is not true. We both would say the same thing, if a bill that overturns an assault weapons ban was titled "Blah Blah signs bill to legalize mass shootings." Because a ban is overturned, does not mean the bill is for the fringe limits.

But you know that already and would be the first to point it out if it was the other way around.

You used it as an example to say that it was proof that the ultimate goal was abortions up until birth. So, no. It was not...

[ericw.]

She did NOT sign a bill to legalize abortions up until birth. That is a sensationalizing title, that is not true. We both would say the same thing, if a bill that overturns an assault weapons ban was titled "Blah Blah signs bill to legalize mass shootings." Because a ban is overturned, does not mean the bill is for the fringe limits.

But you know that already and would be the first to point it out if it was the other way around.

You used it as an example to say that it was proof that the ultimate goal was abortions up until birth. So, no. It was not...

It is literally decriminalizing abortion at any stage, week, month, day. It removes the previous limitations so now it is unlimited abortion.

Just because you don't like how that fact is worded doesn't change the facts.

More accurately, it would be like decriminalizing murder and saying they legalized mass shootings.... not relatable to overturning an assault weapons ban being sensationalized into decriminalized mass shootings. Don't gaslight me.

[Avantly]

Funny how a thread like this outs all the redditors

[ericw.]

Funny how a thread like this outs all the redditors

weird necro bump.. who was "outed"? I don't use reddit so the reference is lost on me. Is this another one of those weird attempts at vilifying anyone with a certain opinion?

I guess the word "nazi" and "racist" have lost their power so now people are using "redditors" to describe their boogeyman. lol

[Avantly]

weird necro bump.. who was "outed"? I don't use reddit so the reference is lost on me. Is this another one of those weird attempts at vilifying anyone with a certain opinion?

I guess the word "nazi" and "racist" have lost their power so now people are using "redditors" to describe their boogeyman. lol

I do agree that most of the true "nazi" and "racist" hang out on reddit. I was simply entertained by the thread and the people who were pissing and moaning about SCOTUS ruling that they have to be responsible for their actions instead of flushing another human being into the medical waste bin. Yes, old thread. I was entertained OK

[ericw.]

I do agree that most of the true "nazi" and "racist" hang out on reddit. I was simply entertained by the thread and the people who were pissing and moaning about SCOTUS ruling that they have to be responsible for their actions instead of flushing another human being into the medical waste bin. Yes, old thread. I was entertained OK

From what I've seen people say, it's sounded like Reddit is pretty pro-active in removing opinions that go against the left's agenda. Things fall through the cracks, as with any big social network but the unspoken rules of the game appear to be clear.

[Avantly]

From what I've seen people say, it's sounded like Reddit is pretty pro-active in removing opinions that go against the left's agenda. Things fall through the cracks, as with any big social network but the unspoken rules of the game appear to be clear.

Agreed. It's practically required to be a racist nazi there, but if you say it out loud, you are banned! They make you take the extreme roundabout approach with your words

[Hostile]

I do agree that most of the true "nazi" and "racist" hang out on reddit. I was simply entertained by the thread and the people who were pissing and moaning about SCOTUS ruling that they have to be responsible for their actions instead of flushing another human being into the medical waste bin. Yes, old thread. I was entertained OK

Back in 2017 my wife was pregnant with a baby we very much wanted but at 23 weeks had to have labor induced because the pregnancy was killing our baby and her.

We had to make the choice to end our baby’s life because we knew he would not survive delivery and he was too pre-mature to survive outside of the womb.

According to many of these new anti-abortion laws that have sprung up across the country since Roe was repealed, my wife had an abortion and would have been thrown in prison if this had happened now and in one of those states.

So, maybe you should consider what these laws mean to actual people instead of flippantly accusing me and my wife of not “taking responsibility for our actions and flushing another human being into the medical waste bin.”

You ignorant piece of shit.

[ericw.]

Back in 2017 my wife was pregnant with a baby we very much wanted but at 23 weeks had to have labor induced because the pregnancy was killing our baby and her.

We had to make the choice to end our baby’s life because we knew he would not survive delivery and he was too pre-mature to survive outside of the womb.

According to many of these new anti-abortion laws that have sprung up across the country since Roe was repealed, my wife had an abortion and would have been thrown in prison if this had happened now and in one of those states.

So, maybe you should consider what these laws mean to actual people instead of flippantly accusing me and my wife of not “taking responsibility for our actions and flushing another human being into the medical waste bin.”

You ignorant piece of shit.

All of the anti-abortion laws contain exception for medical necessity.

[Hostile]

All of the anti-abortion laws contain exception for medical necessity.

The exceptions are useless when they are so poorly-worded or over-broad that the doctors providing those procedures are afraid to perform them to the detriment of the mother's health.

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/0...tions-00153317

https://theconversation.com/most-sta...ey-mean-221389

Virtually all states, including Arkansas, North Dakota and Oklahoma, for example, allow an abortion when necessary to save the life of the pregnant person. But the laws don’t explain just how close to death the person must be before the abortion can be performed.

Exceptions are useless when they are so unspecific that doctors don't know when they apply.

And don't get me started on states that don't allow abortions in the cases of rape and incest. It's fucking disgusting.

https://www.axios.com/2024/01/24/rap...ion-ban-states

And even in the states that do allow abortions for rape and incest, good luck finding a doctor to actually do it. There is two abortion clinics in the entire state of Wyoming. Two. And the doctor can get 14 years in prison if the woman they gave an abortion to lied about if it was rape or incest. There are dozens of other states where it's the same.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/0...rtage-00042373

But never mind the over-arching argument of, mind your own damn business.

[ericw.]

The exceptions are useless when they are so poorly-worded or over-broad that the doctors providing those procedures are afraid to perform them to the detriment of the mother's health.

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/0...tions-00153317

https://theconversation.com/most-sta...ey-mean-221389



Exceptions are useless when they are so unspecific that doctors don't know when they apply.

And don't get me started on states that don't allow abortions in the cases of rape and incest. It's fucking disgusting.

https://www.axios.com/2024/01/24/rap...ion-ban-states

And even in the states that do allow abortions for rape and incest, good luck finding a doctor to actually do it. There is two abortion clinics in the entire state of Wyoming. Two. And the doctor can get 14 years in prison if the woman they gave an abortion to lied about if it was rape or incest. There are dozens of other states where it's the same.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/0...rtage-00042373

But never mind the over-arching argument of, mind your own damn business.

It's not at all how you claim. I didn't read any of the politico or axios links because I don't need the liberal media to tell me through the lens of their bias what's on public record.

Any vagueness is because it's left up to the doctors and professionals to recommend and refer treatments, and the professionals decide when it's a necessity. The doctors 100% know when it's a necessity. That level of specifics should never be put into a law.

[Hostile]

It's not at all how you claim. I didn't read any of the politico or axios links because I don't need the liberal media to tell me through the lens of their bias what's on public record.

Any vagueness is because it's left up to the doctors and professionals to recommend and refer treatments, and the professionals decide when it's a necessity. The doctors 100% know when it's a necessity. That level of specifics should never be put into a law.

Riiiight….

[Avantly]

Abortion "laws" and abortion supporters are not about the outliers, these statistical anomalies where the pregnancy threatens the life of mother and child. You never make decisions based on anomalies, doing so would have a 100% chance of resulting in a bad decision.
Abortion is simply a symptom of a morally diseased society which values pleasure above work; Moral relativity above Truth; Imprudence above responsibility; etc.

Along with support for removing an unborn child's choice to live comes all of the other things which have caused the absolute moral and societal decay we see today - Normalization of all manner of bad behavior from drug use to profound laziness. I can hardly find a single person nowadays who understands the meaning of the saying "You are only worth what someone will pay you". I can hardly find a single person who understands how degenerate any pot usage is as compared to the typical level of alcohol usage in the past.

This is what happens when a society starts believing in relative truth instead of absolute truth. Evidence of this is everywhere - We have hordes of screeching roasties wailing about their "democracy", not understanding that in a democracy any human "right" can be erased with a pen - This is why the USA will be a republic until the day it dies, and unless there is a dramatic change in direction that day appears likely to be within our lifetimes.

IF you closely analyze the views of those who support abortion, specifically the root of those views, you suddenly realize that nearly every opinion they have is the result of selfishness and total lack of emotional control. Emotional reactiveness. They say that they support abortion because of "women's rights" but in fact they support it because "I want to be promiscuous without consequence". They support illegal immigration not because they actually genuinely care about some random person in another counrtry (they don't), but because they have been subject to years or decades of emotional assault by the media and politicians, and due to their total lack of emotional maturity (i.e. inability to control their emotions) they must apply the bandaid of "supporting the current thing" in order to convince themselves that they are "making a difference". Gotta do the latest thing every day to try and quell those emotions that are constantly bubbling to the surface, totally out of control. Little children.

The societal shift over the past 20 years, especially since B. Hussein was in the white house has been fascinating - Absolute decay at all levels. I suppose that the apparent sudden increase in rate of decay was actually just a reveal of decay that was already present below the surface. The emotional nature of it all is quite wild nowadays. It's as if we have multiple generations of young people who were never taught how to deal with their emotions at all, and many who actually believe that decisions should be made with emotions (insane people!). Every single small business owner I know has or is giving up on hiring new employees. People don't want to work anymore. Or, rather, like a child they want to work on their own terms. They want to have that 2 bedroom apartment, nice clothes, a decent car, dine out at least once a week, carry around that $800 phone with its stack of app subscriptions, etc etc etc. If they can't find someone to pay them enough to have all of that, they are very unhappy and many can't seem to fathom putting extra effort in to improving their situation. Now we have the real rate of inflation of past decades finally revealing itself and it's not just the "I want to work only 40 hours per week for a certain wage" people feeling the pain, it's literally everyone. Corporations and politicians have squeezed so much value out of our economy that there is little left to go around for the working class. I'll be honest, there was a time when I thought unionized boomers were the laziest person in the country. Boy did these latest generations prove me wrong.

I don't know where I was going with this post, I was waiting for another pot of coffee to brew. Now I'm gonna go play atlas shrugged in the background while I work. jkjk