3.0t teardown and rebuild, 210k miles, pic heavy

[Junkers]

Im in the process of rebuilding my 3.0t because of a burnt exhaust valve. The engine has 210k miles and ran good up until the valve burnt up. It burned about 1 qt of oil per 1k miles and has the timing chain rattle for a second or two upon startup. This isnt going to be a step by step. I just want to show the internals of a high mileage engine. The engine is already pulled and had the heads off before i started.

Left head cam journals. no noticeable wear


Left head valves. tons of carbon


Left head valves. carbon cleaned about 30k miles ago


Left head. Wear mark from chain rattle


Left head. Valve seats no chips or pits. exhaust is dirty


Left cylinders. tons of carbon


Left Cylinders. close up of walls


Right head cam journals. no noticeable wear


Right head valves. tons of carbon. hole in #3 exhaust valve


Right valves. close up


Right head valves. carbon cleaned about 30k miles ago


Right head. Valve seats no chips or pits. exhaust is dirty


Right Pistons. tons of carbon



Planning on tearing down the lower half tomorrow. I'm curious what the main and connecting rod bearings look like.

[11A6]

Thanks for sharing this with us. what's the model of your engine. I have a first gen 3.0 with 130k miles and hope to do carbon clean summer but after seeing how much carbon was on in only 30k miles wondering if it's worth it. Seems to build up fast.

You note that other than oil consumption it ran well - any sense of what caused burnt exhaust valve? Thanks in advance.

[Junkers]

Its out of a 2012 A7. The carbon that's on the valves now is nothing compared to what was on them before the cleaning. its well worth it. Exhaust valves burn when a piece of carbon or debris get caught between the valve and its seat. During the combustion process the hot gas/air is traveling past the valve and slowly melting it until it creates a large hole big enough to not be able to build compression anymore. I do not know the chances of it happening but it must be very low as i did not find much information of it happening to other 3.0t owners.

[Valpo A7]

Thanks for the pic, so which valve got burned? Cn you post a pic of the damage to it?

[Junkers]

Finished tearing down the engine today, and I'm totally surprised on the condition of the bearings. Also took a close up if the burnt valve. It is one of the exhaust valves on cylinder 3. Also If anyone wants a photo of something just let me know ill try to get it posted. Im going to be dropping off the block and heads to get hot tanked tomorrow. Hopefully i can pick the block back up Saturday and start the reassembly process.

Cylinder 3 burnt exhaust valve


Pistons and connecting rods


Close up of the rings. Its real crusty but all rings move and not broke


Connecting rod bearings. The marks in the center are from me removing the pistons. Had to tap them out


Crank journals. looks good




Crank bearings


Cylinders still have a little of the cross hatch left

[Valpo A7]

Other than the carbon and burnt valve that motor looks great.

[Dippy]

Thanks - I enjoyed looking at those photos. Is the price of some parts (e.g. valves) such that you can choose to replace rather than clean?

[scott99c2]

What all do you expect to replace in the rebuild? Just rings and seals or pistons, valves, etc. Thanks for sharing!

[gk1]

Thanks for the pics. Sucks that this happened to you.

What oil was used and what OCI?
Was any type of Fuel injector cleaner used, top tier fuel?

[Tineo]

nice photos. Thanks for sharing!

[11A6]

Coincidentally someone just posted in the C6 forum (my neck of the woods) that they picked up an 09 A6 with earlier 3.0 tfsi and it also had "burnt exhaust valve" that they associated with an injector issue thought I'm not sure why an injector would burn exhaust valve. he's replaced cly head and injectors and claims it's fine. Thought you might find that interesting.

https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...ightings/page6

[fastboatster]

your rod and main bearings look a lot better than mine, lol:
7BF4D01E-3181-45D7-820D-3525D9BB7864.jpg
22D91099-F8C7-48E3-BEB8-FF7C5E60715D.jpg

[Junkers]

Dang email notifications aren't working. ill try to answer everyones questions

Dippy - I ordered a kit from ebay for about 1200 shipped. https://www.ebay.com/itm/3-0T-Engine...72.m2749.l2649 it is a pretty decent kit. Most of everything has VW part numbers and appears to be decent quality. I could of cleaned and reused the valves but i didnt really want to chance it. i dont plan on pulling the engine for a few more years

scott99c2 - Replacing everything in the kit. New valve springs and connecting rod bolts. pcv valve. I was going to replace the oil pump but i disassembled mine and it looked pretty good. I thought about replacing the water pump and thermostat but they looked good and if they fail they are pretty easy to replace.

gk1 - I mainly used liqui molly 5w30 but the last oil change I used a high mileage mobil 1 because of the consumption of oil. It didnt help. Im not sure what OCI is. If its octane I always use 91 because im tuned and I pretty much always fill up at either the Shell station by my work or the UDF by my house. I heard UDF doesn't have ethanol in their fuels

11A6 - I guess if the injector was leaking it could burn the exhaust valve when it opens.

fastboatster - Dang #2 looks like it got a little warm. did you replace the rod?

Dropped the block and heads off today to get hot tanked. Im going to pick them up tomorrow after work. Forgot to order new rod bolts so now im waiting on the hone paste, valve springs and rod bolts which should be here by the end of next week. I wanted to order ARP bolts but couldn't find any sets and had to get them ordered. I have a lot of cleaning, measuring and valve lapping to do so waiting on parts isn't too bad. Wish i had the funds to do a full build on the motor. forged rods and water injection but i might have enough for the larger crank pulley, larger inter cooler and dual pulley tune.

[Valpo A7]

Are they going to check the block and heads for flatness when they hot tank? Hopefully they do, if not then I would recommend getting it checked. That should help with installing the head gaskets and not experiencing an early failure.

[fastboatster]

@Junkers - no, I didn't replace that rod, I got another engine. This is just what I saw after I decided to tear down the old seized engine. I decided to get another engine right away after I found out the old one doesn't turn over and can't be turned by hand. It spun some main bearings and I'm not quite sure it's cost effective to rebuild.

[gk1]

gk1 - I mainly used liqui molly 5w30 but the last oil change I used a high mileage mobil 1 because of the consumption of oil. It didnt help. Im not sure what OCI is. If its octane I always use 91 because im tuned and I pretty much always fill up at either the Shell station by my work or the UDF by my house. I heard UDF doesn't have ethanol in their fuels

Thanks for the replies.
OCI = Oil Change Interval
Did you go by Audi's 10k mile recommendation or shorter/longer?
Any particular reason you chose a 5w-30 vs 5w-40?

[Junkers]

I changed the oil every 5-6k. Anything longer just doesnt seem right and no real reason using 5w30 instead of 5w40.

Picked up the block and heads today. they look pretty clean. Also the honing paste came today. Its going to be a busy weekend. Ill get some before and after photos up

[Valpo A7]

Mobil 1 synthetic will easily last 15,000 miles. My engine is at 205,000 miles on a 10k OCI. It got Castrol from the dealer for the first 145k then somewhere after that when I bought it went to Mobil 1

[Junkers]

Didn't get much done over the weekend. I did hone the block. It looks exactly the same as before so I didn't take any photos. You can feel the difference with your finger nail. I lapped the new valves, installed new valve stem seals. And checked the main bearing clearances. All with in spec of new bearings. I'm pretty much stuck waiting on parts now. Can't continue until the new valve springs, connecting rod bolts and main cap bolts come in. I also ordered a stage 2 crank pulley, new intercooler, replacement secondary cooler and the stage 2 double pulley tune.

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Didn't get much done over the weekend. I did hone the block. It looks exactly the same as before so I didn't take any photos. You can feel the difference with your finger nail. I lapped the new valves, installed new valve stem seals. And checked the main bearing clearances. All with in spec of new bearings. I'm pretty much stuck waiting on parts now. Can't continue until the new valve springs, connecting rod bolts and main cap bolts come in. I also ordered a stage 2 crank pulley, new intercooler, replacement secondary cooler and the stage 2 double pulley tune.

Subscribed to watch your progress.


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[AudiC7Owners]

Out of curiosity, how many hours did you have into removing the engine, and then breaking it down?

[Junkers]

About 8 beers. I didn't keep track of time. Spent alot of time figuring out how crap comes apart so I didn't break too much. I have to replace the hidden trans mounting bolt and the ac compressor pigtail. Also finding and ordering the correct tools took a while as I did not have any 12 point metric sockets. If I have to do it again and I hope not any time soon. I could probably pull the engine and get it apart in about 8 hours. Also I'm horribly bad at giving time estimates.

[Junkers]

Don't know how to edit on mobile but at a status update. I'm still waiting on the crank cradle bolts and valve springs to come in from ecs tuning. They still haven't shipped yet and the only reason I ordered from them is that they are located in the same state as me so I figured I would get them fast but I was wrong.

[gta7]

Awesome great work. Good luck with reassembly!

[Junkers]

Just got done with ECS customer service. Says the parts are in stock and would ship soon. They were "in stock" when I ordered them. So I just canceled my orders and I'm going to do all my business with fcpeuro from now on. I refuse to do any business with people who do shady stuff like this.

[DRkNESS]

I can’t fault you there...


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[Valpo A7]

I would not say its shady business but rather Covid business at the moment. Because of the needed social distancing they are short staffed in the warehouse.

Order Shipping Update:
We are doing our best to ensure the fastest and safest shipping of your order. Due to delays caused by the COVID-19 pandemic, your order may take slightly longer to arrive.

That is the language on their website at the moment.

But even given that if you feel that FCP can give you better service then go for it. Over the summer they were great to deal with on my timing chain parts. I had good service dealings with Europaparts as well.

[Vinng86]

FCP offers lifetime replacement warranty as long as you ship the failed items back. Even on wear items. It's totally worth it for that reason alone.

[Junkers]

I don't think it's a staffing issue. The pcv valve I ordered a couple days after I ordered the valve springs is already delivered. Unless they have a warehouse in China, they are misrepresenting their "in stock" levels.

[AudiC7Owners]

Fcp is Def the way to go

Sent from my Llama using Tapatalk

[Junkers]

FCP euro is out of stock of the valve springs and no ETA of the next shipment. Which is the correct way to list inventory on a website. So I had to order through genuineaudiparts.com. My order through ECS for the springs and bolts were $371.77 with standard shipping. My order through Genuineaudiparts.com for the exact same parts with next day shipping is only $327.90

I might just use the old crank cradle bolts until the new ones come in so I can continue the build. I just hate doing work twice.


Well Genuineaudiparts.com instantly cancelled my order. Just used my last option and called the dealer. He is able to get me all the parts by Wednesday of next week. And get this the total is $304 lol

[Kael]

Always good to check around, odd surprises for sure. Dealer I'd have expected to be the highest!

[Junkers]

Picked up my parts from the dealer today. They got them in super fast. Worked a little on the heads but the propane heater ran out so work had to stop.

New vs Old spring height. Notice the 3 tighter coils on the bottom? I didnt until i was half way done with one head



easy way to tell the orientation. white marks up



Right head done





Super clean



Bonus photo, aftermath of a minor derailment

[sepheroth86]

Did you gasket match (port) the heads?

[Junkers]

I thought about it. but i want to get my car on the road again ASAP

I was just going over all the parts i have to rebuild the engine. The new head bolts are polydrive while the old ones were triple square. so theres another special tool i need to buy. Luckily amazon has them with prime shipping.

[Junkers]

Got the lower end somewhat assembled. It takes forever to check all the ring end gaps and connecting rod bearing clearances, but you have to do it. Almost made a huge mistake. Some how i mixed up the connecting rod caps for 2 and 5 before i marked them. The engine was really hard to turn until i swapped them around. All is good though everything checked out alright.

Piston Oilers




Main Cap Cradle all torqued to spec




All connecting rods installed and torqued to spec




Shiny Pistons

[Valpo A7]

Check the welds on your cats while I the engine is out. Mine broke the flange at the manifold on the passenger side. And of course this happened 2,000 or so miles AFTER I put the engine back in the car.

[A6sport]

Got the lower end somewhat assembled. It takes forever to check all the ring end gaps and connecting rod bearing clearances, but you have to do it. Almost made a huge mistake. Some how i mixed up the connecting rod caps for 2 and 5 before i marked them. The engine was really hard to turn until i swapped them around. All is good though everything checked out alright.

Piston Oilers




Main Cap Cradle all torqued to spec




All connecting rods installed and torqued to spec




Shiny Pistons

Looks beautiful.

[Junkers]

Got a liitle more work done today. Spent most of my time cleaning up the upper oil pan. I forgot to take it when i got the block hot tanked. Also getting the old RTV off of the lower oil pan was a pain. Ran out of propane again. Ran through 6 tanks already. I also installed the crank locking pin. Notice cylinder 1 isn't at TDC, but cylinder 4 is. I wonder if the timing chain engineer got the firing order reversed. Also found 4 more bolts that i need to order. The Cam shaft sprocket bolts are one time use. They are torqued fairly high and don't want to risk one of them letting go. The only problem i have is that i cant find the part number for them. They arent even included in the "master" timing chain kits from FCPeuro or ECS tuning. Probably just going to call my audi dealer since he hooked me up last time.

Lower oil pan on. With the tray and baffle its almost like a dry sump system






Ready to start on the timing chain and front of the engine, but not with out any heat.

[fastboatster]

bolt p/ns are N91042802 (long one) and n91050201 (short)