Stage 3 engine rebuild-need advice

[Sonicboom]

Hey all, I'm in the process of rebuilding a fully built 2.0t from a 2006 MT Quattro with 290,000km. Here's a little background on the car: The previous owner was selling it due to a loss of oil pressure and said he shut it off right away when the light came on, so "no internal damage". I bought it knowing that the bottom end was likely ruined, and expected to see a failed oil pump/balance shaft. Turns out, the previous owner already did the 1.8t pump conversion. I pulled off my rod caps and the bearings were shot and had definitely spun. Fast forward a few weeks and I had the engine out and on a stand.
Here's the carnage: Pulled the crank and the rod journals have deep grooves/score marks. All bearings, mains and rods are destroyed. Spun bearings also caused bad damage to rods.
Luckily I did a compression test before tearing it apart and had 210psi on each cylinder (top end should be fine).
The previous owner went stage 3+ ish about 40,000km ago, including engine build, Garret gtx3071(I think, not 100% sure about turbo), and full 3" exhaust. He must've done the 1.8t pump conversion during that time too. I've done countless hours of research on the conversion and seem to get the general idea that you can run it with the stock 06f filter housing(please correct me if you think I'm wrong because no one seems to have a definitive answer to this). The pickup tube was very clogged and likely the reason for low pressure although, the previous owner said the car randomly gave him the idiot light so I'm not so sure anymore. It was also missing the plastic oil baffle, something which I cannot find any info online for(is it needed after the conversion?).
Another potentially big problem I just found: the intake side turbo fins are bent. Only 3 out of 5 are curved in at the end which leads me to believe it ate something. Do some turbos come stock like this? There is a tiny tiny amount of end play but no round play.

My plan is to buy a used stock forged crank, ie drop in rods, ACL race bearings-main and rods (will these fit my 2.0t or do I have to go with Mahle?). I also need to 100% confirm the real cause for low oil pressure or I'll be back to square one.
Does the rotating assembly on these engines absolutely need to be balanced during the build or is it more to get rid of annoying vibrations? If I can do everything at home(Im very lucky and have a big, well equipped shop) it would make things much easier as money is the main issue for me.

I'm a completely self taught kid with very little experience working on Audi's but I'm slowly getting a better understanding of these engines. If anyone has answers to any of my questions or tips/advice for this rebuild, I'll appreciate every bit I can get. Thanks!

[Theiceman]

curious .. what was the pickup clogged with ?

[EvolutionArmory]

You’d probably be fine with a new/used crank and only balancing the rods/pins/pistons. You could have the whole rotating assembly completely balanced but it might be a diminishing return. Especially if you run a lightweight flywheel.

You might just be able to achieve the same result with a Fluidampr to tame any vibration instead of having the crank balanced. Having said that, you’re going to be into it that deep anyway so maybe you should have the crank balanced because why not at that point? Know what I mean?

[canadianA4B7]

Balance crank if using the 1.8 pump the brand new crankshaft I bought had to be balanced and it was new off the shelf, who ever built it last completely fucked up that build. Plastic piece is mandatory for the bottom end.

Garrett requires replacement chra. Some have disassembled to rebuild but no guarantee if you go that route.

It also sounds like they had used incorrect thrust washers (pretty common mistake even engine builders have used in correct ones)

Where in Ontario? Stop wasting money on a 300,000 car. Come buy mine and save yourself some $$$

[Theiceman]

Hey wait a minute .... i have a 300,000 car !


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[Charles.waite]

Hey wait a minute .... i have a 300,000 car !


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

Might want to peek in your garage and make sure it hasn't spontaneously combusted then.That happens over arbitrary amounts of miles people on the internet consider "too much".

[Joshlc1988]

If your main bearings have spun I would take a good look at the block and main caps. Take it to a machine shop to check it out. IÂ’ve torn down 2 engines for other platforms with spun mains and the blocks were unusable. When they spun they like to gouge the block/ caps. One could of been line honed but thatÂ’s added $$$. If the block is ok a rebuild is not that hard. IÂ’d have everything balanced or use a fluidamper since you gotta use a different crank and your running a 1.8t pump setup. ItÂ’ll help vibrations.

If you want a good no nonsense build that works do a good ball hone on your block, run whatever bearings you like, find some early bpg factory forged pistons and use the ie drop in rods. Get a good used 2.0t oil pump and do a balance shaft delete, updated pickup tube, ie crank gear, and get a fluidamper. You can also open the ring gaps a bit if you want to run high boost. I donÂ’t recomend decking the block or head unless you absolutely have to, I personally wouldnÂ’t touch the head unless you want to do valve seals.

[Sonicboom]

Thanks for the info. Maybe low oil pressure was due to a combination of missing baffle and clogged pickup tube? Not good to hear about the turbo, I was hoping I could just go with it. I'm near Orangeville--the car itself is so clean and well done that I figured it was worth it. Now I'm starting to doubt myself lol.

[Sonicboom]

If your main bearings have spun I would take a good look at the block and main caps. Take it to a machine shop to check it out. IÂ’ve torn down 2 engines for other platforms with spun mains and the blocks were unusable. When they spun they like to gouge the block/ caps. One could of been line honed but thatÂ’s added $$$. If the block is ok a rebuild is not that hard. IÂ’d have everything balanced or use a fluidamper since you gotta use a different crank and your running a 1.8t pump setup. ItÂ’ll help vibrations.

If you want a good no nonsense build that works do a good ball hone on your block, run whatever bearings you like, find some early bpg factory forged pistons and use the ie drop in rods. Get a good used 2.0t oil pump and do a balance shaft delete, updated pickup tube, ie crank gear, and get a fluidamper. You can also open the ring gaps a bit if you want to run high boost. I donÂ’t recomend decking the block or head unless you absolutely have to, I personally wouldnÂ’t touch the head unless you want to do valve seals.

Thanks, luckily my mains didn't spin, just my rod bearings so the block should be fine. I'll have to do a little research but a fluidamper sounds like a good idea. Especially with the 1.8t pump. I do have a 2.0t pump handy and I'm starting to think I should put that in. I'm hoping that everything top end is still okay, not looking to spend more money than I need to.

[Sonicboom]

Hey wait a minute .... i have a 300,000 car !


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

😂😂 what do you think? Rebuild it or nah? The project just keeps getting bigger and bigger the more I start to tear things apart.

[Sonicboom]

curious .. what was the pickup clogged with ?

Lots of gasket maker. Not a whole lot of metal which is a good sign.

[Sonicboom]

You’d probably be fine with a new/used crank and only balancing the rods/pins/pistons. You could have the whole rotating assembly completely balanced but it might be a diminishing return. Especially if you run a lightweight flywheel.

You might just be able to achieve the same result with a Fluidampr to tame any vibration instead of having the crank balanced. Having said that, you’re going to be into it that deep anyway so maybe you should have the crank balanced because why not at that point? Know what I mean?

Ok I'm definitely going to go with a fluidamper. How much do they normally charge to balance the whole rotating assembly?

[canadianA4B7]

Ok I'm definitely going to go with a fluidamper. How much do they normally charge to balance the whole rotating assembly?

Depends who your taking your stuff too. Your close to Toronto so you’ve got active engines in Mississauga, there’s also a cylinder head shop who does balancing too. There’s a handful of Indy shops and JDM shops who do 4 cylinder builds. As I mentioned I could save you a ton and put you in a car far beyond what you’ve got.

[Sonicboom]

Depends who your taking your stuff too. Your close to Toronto so you’ve got active engines in Mississauga, there’s also a cylinder head shop who does balancing too. There’s a handful of Indy shops and JDM shops who do 4 cylinder builds. As I mentioned I could save you a ton and put you in a car far beyond what you’ve got.

Oh cool, that will come in handy. I didn't know we had that many tuner shops around--couldnt seem to find anything online lol. As for your car I may be interested, PM with more details?

[Theiceman]

what do you think? Rebuild it or nah? The project just keeps getting bigger and bigger the more I start to tear things apart.

If mine died id just look for the worlds biggest recycling bin and drop the whole car in
Its worth about 2500’working. Even less with a dead engine


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[Theiceman]

Lots of gasket maker. Not a whole lot of metal which is a good sign.

Gasket maker ?
Po obviously used the wrong stuff. That stuff will kill your engine. Thats what killed your oil pressure.


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[Sonicboom]

Gasket maker ?
Po obviously used the wrong stuff. That stuff will kill your engine. Thats what killed your oil pressure.


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

It probably wasn’t gasket maker, just white silicone(is that what the proper stuff?). Way too much was put on so it was bulging out everywhere, breaking off and getting sucked up by the pump.

[Sonicboom]

If mine died id just look for the worlds biggest recycling bin and drop the whole car in
Its worth about 2500’working. Even less with a dead engine


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

Well sh*t. You think $3500 CAD was reasonable for a blown stage 3?

[canadianA4B7]

Would you buy 1 lemon for $3500? Or wait you already did!

[Sonicboom]

Would you buy 1 lemon for $3500? Or wait you already did!

Haha this doesn’t look good. How much are you asking for yours?

[Theiceman]

Well sh*t. You think $3500 CAD was reasonable for a blown stage 3?

I think cars as they get to this age and milage are basically worth what you could sell the engine for.

So no




Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[EvolutionArmory]

I would never buy someone else’s project car. Maybe if it was like an APR or GIAC built demo car. 😀

Way more headaches and who knows if it was done right and the mods don’t add any value to the car.

Way too many unknowns. It’s way better to start with a stock car. You’ll pay more but you’ll have more control over the quality of the project.

[Sonicboom]

Ok so the plan is to drop in a stock wrecker engine for now as I need the car for work. I will rebuild the other engine properly later. I found an engine for a very good price but it is from an automatic. Will this work or does something have to be done to get it to mate properly with my manual trans? Also planning on swapping a stock ecu so I don't have to detune. How is a stock engine going to work with my 3" straight pipe?

[i3oricua]

Ok so the plan is to drop in a stock wrecker engine for now as I need the car for work. I will rebuild the other engine properly later. I found an engine for a very good price but it is from an automatic. Will this work or does something have to be done to get it to mate properly with my manual trans? Also planning on swapping a stock ecu so I don't have to detune. How is a stock engine going to work with my 3" straight pipe?

Most of our B7 blocks are the same. I think they only think you can't mix is a crank from a manual and automatic but not 100% on that.

Instead of spending tons of money on Mahle bearingz (race) look at King Racing bearings. My advice is buy the rods, pistons, whatever crank you're gonna get, and your flywheel and have them all balanced together. The fluidampr will help the vibrations but you'll still have some if you do a balance shaft delete on the 2.0t pump. I'm currently rebuilding mine again because I washed out the cylinders but my build was solid until I ran the car rich too long. Have fun. It's quite an expensive adventure.

[Brillo]

Thanks, luckily my mains didn't spin, just my rod bearings so the block should be fine. I'll have to do a little research but a fluidamper sounds like a good idea. Especially with the 1.8t pump. I do have a 2.0t pump handy and I'm starting to think I should put that in. I'm hoping that everything top end is still okay, not looking to spend more money than I need to.

A Fluidampr will not help with the 1.8t pump rebuild. It's for torsional crank vibrations, and a harmonic balancer is for first order crank imbalances - the type that occur due to imbalanced crank/rods/pistons. Unless you're referring to something else, the balance shafts of the 2.0L counteract second order imbalance inherent in the inline 4 cylinder engines. You're SOL with these imbalances if you go with the 1.8 pump. Most folks with the 1.8 conversion admit to greater vibration but mostly tolerate them.

[EvolutionArmory]

Most of our B7 blocks are the same. I think they only think you can't mix is a crank from a manual and automatic but not 100% on that.

Instead of spending tons of money on Mahle bearingz (race) look at King Racing bearings. My advice is buy the rods, pistons, whatever crank you're gonna get, and your flywheel and have them all balanced together. The fluidampr will help the vibrations but you'll still have some if you do a balance shaft delete on the 2.0t pump. I'm currently rebuilding mine again because I washed out the cylinders but my build was solid until I ran the car rich too long. Have fun. It's quite an expensive adventure.

Yup. I’m building an engine build wish list on ECS and I’m already at 1700 bucks and that’s not including an oil pump (my cart would then double) and then there’s things I’m forgetting. 🤣🤣

[i3oricua]

Yup. I’m building an engine build wish list on ECS and I’m already at 1700 bucks and that’s not including an oil pump (my cart would then double) and then there’s things I’m forgetting.

I wouldn’t spend the money on a new pump. Delete the shafts or just take it off, clean it up and replace the pick up tube. I’ve had a 1.8t pump sitting on my shelf for a few years and will probably never use it. I also have my original pump and it never gave me problems. We just read about them seizing every once in a while on this forum but it’s preventable in my opinion.

You can shop around and find parts for good deals if your patient. It took me 2 or more years to gather my parts. It’s mostly been recent that I got impatient and started buying more parts quicker. I’ve also replaced almost every stock component in the engine at this point. There’s almost no original parts on the engine at this point.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk