SOCAL Reputable shop that does walnut cleaning on carbon buildup

[WerkzRS]

Can anyone recommend a shop in SoCal? I’m located in Corona/Eastvale. I need to do a carbon clean and intake flap delete.

[mikedizzzo]

Check out Koromdiv!

[scmguru]

These guys do it and have a great reputation: https://www.bestiale.net/carbon-cleaning-service

[Bestiale]

These guys do it and have a great reputation: https://www.bestiale.net/carbon-cleaning-service

Thanks for the nice words. Let us know if we can help with anything else.

[RAudi Driver]

I'd check out Pacific German. Much nicer facility and they are probably closer to you. I looked in to Bestiale for my CC and just couldn't ring myself leave my baby in that alley.

[maxbhp]

Nicer facility with beautiful fish tanks and probably part of the reason why you will pay twice the price.

[RAudi Driver]

Gotta keep the fish alive

[993140]

Nicer facility with beautiful fish tanks and probably part of the reason why you will pay twice the price.

What is twice the price? Better yet, what is the going rate for CC in So Cal?

[WerkzRS]

I’ve had a range of quotes from 950-almost 2k


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[WerkzRS]

Some don’t do walnut some do


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[GrandMarkie]

Some don’t do walnut some do


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I just tackled this myself for the first time. I can't imagine doing it without walnut blasting...that must take quite a while! Whatever gets them clean, though. I'd say the $1k range is what you should be looking at.

[WerkzRS]

I just tackled this myself for the first time. I can't imagine doing it without walnut blasting...that must take quite a while! Whatever gets them clean, though. I'd say the $1k range is what you should be looking at.

Where did you get the walnut blaster? I’ve been really just thinking I can do this myself.

[TypeRx]

Just DIY it if you are okay with your car being down for 2 days or so (and have a garage space/bay to work). Is there a particular reason why you really want to walnut blast? It can work great but many (like me) have gotten our valves sparkly clean with a chemical clean (gasoline, various gun cleaning products, oven cleaner, etc.) and a picks/swabs.

[musanoadsaba]

Where did you get the walnut blaster? I’ve been really just thinking I can do this myself.

Look at Harbour Freight for the blaster. People have made a custom vacuum that is shaped like the intake. There is a thread somewhere here that has pics.

[S42RS4]

Just DIY it if you are okay with your car being down for 2 days or so (and have a garage space/bay to work). Is there a particular reason why you really want to walnut blast? It can work great but many (like me) have gotten our valves sparkly clean with a chemical clean .

I agree with him. Diesel brush/wire brush along with (gasoline, various gun cleaning products, oven cleaner, etc.) and a picks/swabs works wonders. I normally have the job done in 6-8 hrs.

[Grigor@Bestiale]

I'd check out Pacific German. Much nicer facility and they are probably closer to you. I looked in to Bestiale for my CC and just couldn't ring myself leave my baby in that alley.

Fair opinion, I'd like to add a few facts to paint the full picture:
1. We have a full coverage business insurance (which covers, of course, the numerous R8s (and V10 Pluses) we have had in the shop).
2. The cars are never left in "that alley", they are always inside the shop, which has an ADT alarm system and 24 hr. video surveillance.
3. (If requested) we gladly inspect the car/complete/provide a detailed signed report of the drop off condition and we do the same when the car is picked up/delivered.
4. We are obsessed with perfection, if there are any issues related to labor we will fix it without a doubt as we really stand behind our 101-year labor warranty.

[MYKMAC408]

How much at Bestiale?

[Grigor@Bestiale]

How much at Bestiale?

We customize the quote to each car. Feel free to send us an email ideally with the VIN and a detailed list of engine modifications to [email protected] for a quote or call us.


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[bluebull]

FYI -
While doing a CC:
Flow test injectors and clean/replace them
New spark plugs
Intake spacers

....and re-assemble with a supercharger on top...

[caideN]

Is there a reason why you cant just tell us the price?

[CarterRuss]

Is there a reason why you cant just tell us the price?

Because some cars take more or less time. Posting a price could deter someone from inquiring. (guess)


RS4 should be around $800 (+/-$200) depending on location.

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[993140]

Because some cars take more or less time. Posting a price could deter someone from inquiring. (guess)

That's actually a good guess.

[caideN]

Because some cars take more or less time. Posting a price could deter someone from inquiring. (guess)


RS4 should be around $800 (+/-$200) depending on location.

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We are on the rs4 forum. Why can't they just tell us how much to carbon clean an rs4? They have to crack it open before giving me a price?

[CarterRuss]

We are on the rs4 forum. Why can't they just tell us how much to carbon clean an rs4? They have to crack it open before giving me a price?

What happens if they quote someone $800 but don't know they have a supercharger on the car which would likely add time? Probably takes 2 minutes to call and ask.

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[MYKMAC408]

Because some cars take more or less time. Posting a price could deter someone from inquiring. (guess)


RS4 should be around $800 (+/-$200) depending on location.

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I live in NorCal San Jose I received a quote from some place around here and it was $1400
https://www.cerroneseuropean.com

[caideN]

What happens if they quote someone $800 but don't know they have a supercharger on the car which would likely add time? Probably takes 2 minutes to call and ask.

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OK. @Grigor, hi. I have an 07 rs4 with no engine mods. How much to carbon clean by Walnut blasting? Thanks!

[b6bydesign04]

OK. @Grigor, hi. I have an 07 rs4 with no engine mods. How much to carbon clean by Walnut blasting? Thanks!

Feel free to send us an email ideally with the VIN and a detailed list of engine modifications to [email protected] for a quote or call us.

I would send them an e-mail, might get a quicker response.

[RAudi Driver]

Fair opinion, I'd like to add a few facts to paint the full picture:
1. We have a full coverage business insurance (which covers, of course, the numerous R8s (and V10 Pluses) we have had in the shop).
2. The cars are never left in "that alley", they are always inside the shop, which has an ADT alarm system and 24 hr. video surveillance.
3. (If requested) we gladly inspect the car/complete/provide a detailed signed report of the drop off condition and we do the same when the car is picked up/delivered.
4. We are obsessed with perfection, if there are any issues related to labor we will fix it without a doubt as we really stand behind our 101-year labor warranty.

Amazing! Yes I was scared to leave my car there thinking it would have to be moved every two hours and parks in the streets. Thanks for explaining it. I'll come visit you folks when I'm in your neck of the woods. May just have you do my cleaning if I can't find the time to do it myself. Saw your pictures of the work you do and was very impressed. It was just your shop location that worried me but you have put my worries to rest.

[RAudi Driver]

OK. @Grigor, hi. I have an 07 rs4 with no engine mods. How much to carbon clean by Walnut blasting? Thanks!

I have yet to see one advertiser quote prices on an open forum. At the very best, you have to click on a link. Most of the time, pricing is discussed via a PM.

Caden, this isn't meant for you specifically. I just used your reply to answer the slew of other inquiries as to why pricing isn't in the open forum.

[Grigor@Bestiale]

FYI -
While doing a CC:
Flow test injectors and clean/replace them
New spark plugs
Intake spacers

....and re-assemble with a supercharger on top...

I'd highly recommend injectors/spark plugs and highly advise against spacers (unless you want less power :)).

Is there a reason why you cant just tell us the price?

We are on the rs4 forum. Why can't they just tell us how much to carbon clean an rs4? They have to crack it open before giving me a price?

OK. @Grigor, hi. I have an 07 rs4 with no engine mods. How much to carbon clean by Walnut blasting? Thanks!

Well, because it changes all the time (e.g. roughly every year it increase by 2-5% because of inflation, parts, etc.) and we cannot keep it up to date everywhere. Indeed, most of the times it is different depending on the aftermarket parts also. However, I think we can post our current price for a stock RS4, let me find some time first to prepare it a bit and we'll post it later (we can also hook you up with a special offer maybe :)).

FYI, here are the results of the last RS4 before and after (we always use walnut shell blasting then solvent soak/clean, again walnut shell blasting then solvent soak/clean, check and repeat until clean :) ):
https://www.facebook.com/bestiale.ne...0844940698508/

And for a supercharged R8 V8 :):
https://www.facebook.com/bestiale.ne...84135655191917
https://www.facebook.com/bestiale.ne...69642649974551

[Grigor@Bestiale]

Amazing! Yes I was scared to leave my car there thinking it would have to be moved every two hours and parks in the streets. Thanks for explaining it. I'll come visit you folks when I'm in your neck of the woods. May just have you do my cleaning if I can't find the time to do it myself. Saw your pictures of the work you do and was very impressed. It was just your shop location that worried me but you have put my worries to rest.

I understand, I think I see it in some clients when they come for the first time, but they quickly get over it. Btw, we've been looking for a new place in the area for close to a year and can't find a suitable one, if anyone knows anything definitely let us know please :)). Definitely feel free to stop by anytime, even just for a chat :)

[Fourplay]

I'd highly recommend injectors/spark plugs and highly advise against spacers (unless you want less power :)).

Uhhh, care to back these claims up?

[Grigor@Bestiale]

This is based on:
- the expertise of our trusted partner (GIAC), that’s what they advised us (the GIAC RS4 tune does not support it and they refuse to create a tune for it as it’ll make less power)
- overall quality, attention to detail of (one) spacer manufacturer
- lack of any factual proof that indeed it increases power/torque (haven’t seen any) and any other consequences to engine/car

Uhhh, care to back these claims up?

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[Fourplay]

This is based on:
- the expertise of our trusted partner (GIAC), that’s what they advised us (the GIAC RS4 tune does not support it and they refuse to create a tune for it as it’ll make less power)
- overall quality, attention to detail of (one) spacer manufacturer
- lack of any factual proof that indeed it increases power/torque (haven’t seen any) and any other consequences to engine/car

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So no factual basis for your claims. Gotcha. It's too bad you can't tag Jake@JHM in this forum to see their response to the fact that you say they lack attention to detail. They're the world leader in tuning and providing aftermarket parts for B7 RS4s, whereas GIAC, well not so much...

But sure, GIAC's 8hp tune is definitely great.

[Jake@JHM]

Technically, increasing the runner length increases torque, which is a fact. Same reason Audi used a dual length plenum in the B6-B7 S4 with a flap system to divert air into the longer length or short length plenum for low-end torque and top-end power. However, the entire purpose of intake spacers, specifically our phenolic spacers, is that the material is excellent at not transferring the heat coming from the cylinder head into the intake manifold. By having a cooler intake manifold you are creating a cooler/denser intake charge which creates more HP and TQ. Having the intake spacers also fight against heat soak, so for those doing back to back pulls, drag racing, etc.. you will retain power longer. You also do not need any software to run the intake spacers.

[Grigor@Bestiale]

None is needed, if you want facts for Audi’s engineering: call them/read Audi’s/VW’s SSPs. If anyone is selling a part that claims to improve anything, I’d, at the very minimum, require proof (in this case before/after dyno plots) of the improvement(s). Also, I didn’t mention the company name (and I won’t), if I’ve got anything to tell anyone, I’d have already told them directly.

GIAC’s power/torque improvement may not be a lot, however it’s actually there, not only marketing hype which in the end may actually be a decrease (as the other company’s could be (or not, I’m still very curious to see an independent dyno graphs before/after))

So no factual basis for your claims. Gotcha. It's too bad you can't tag Jake@JHM in this forum to see their response to the fact that you say they lack attention to detail. They're the world leader in tuning and providing aftermarket parts for B7 RS4s, whereas GIAC, well not so much...

But sure, GIAC's 8hp tune is definitely great.

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[Fourplay]

None is needed, if you want facts for Audi’s engineering: call them/read Audi’s/VW’s SSPs. If anyone is selling a part that claims to improve anything, I’d, at the very minimum, require proof (in this case before/after dyno plots) of the improvement(s). Also, I didn’t mention the company name (and I won’t), if I’ve got anything to tell anyone, I’d have already told them directly.

GIAC’s power/torque improvement may not be a lot, however it’s actually there, not only marketing hype which in the end may actually be a decrease (as the other company’s could be (or not, I’m still very curious to see an independent dyno graphs before/after))







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The same Audi engineering that doesn't acknowledge that carbon buildup is a problem on the BNS engine? The idea that a manufacturer's original design and service policies are the end-all be-all for a car is ridiculous; surely as a tune re-seller you already know this.

A shop no one has ever heard of coming in and trashing a long time advertiser who has done more to advance the platform than basically everyone else combined? Hilarious. AZ must really be hurting for cash.

Look, I get it, you have a partnership with GIAC that probably gives you some sort of kickback for every GIAC tune you sell. It's clear where your motivations lie and that you may not exactly be an unbiased source as a result.

But until a GIAC tuned car is running anywhere close to what the JHM cars are running in the quarter mile (time or trap speed), I think you should stop posting about how great GIAC is. In fact, the fastest ever posted B7 RS4 1/4 mile time with a GIAC tune was [email protected], but a bone stock car with JHM Intake Spacers went [email protected]. What were you saying about marketing hype/tunes causing a decrease in power again?

[Grigor@Bestiale]

Indeed increasing the runner increases torque, but (as far as I can remember) only for a very narrow RPM range. I'm also aware of its huge impact on the engine's volumetric efficiency, the use of the Helmholtz resonance property of air, smoothness of the passage, etc.
Much more importantly, increasing the thickness of the gasket disrupts the perfect fitting of the intake flaps to the port separators which I'd assume is bad for torque and that's why you guys recommend removing the separators. This though exposes the channels in the cylinder head where they sit and they mess up any smoothness of in the intake channel and I'd assume causes turbulence&resonance which I'd assume is not good for torque. Not to mention the installation instructions which recommend to use a pry bar to bend (!!!) the high pressure fuel lines which Audi explicitly says not to be bent at all (as extremely high pressure fuel runs there). Also raising the intake manifold by 13mm makes quite a few parts on the rear of it fit very badly, hoses are overstretched.

In any case, I'm just searching for the truth and the above may not matter that much depending on the results, I still would like to see the final results on torque and power, do you have a before and after dyno plots of the same car on the same dyno/conditions where the only difference is with and without the intake spacers?

Technically, increasing the runner length increases torque, which is a fact. Same reason Audi used a dual length plenum in the B6-B7 S4 with a flap system to divert air into the longer length or short length plenum for low-end torque and top-end power. However, the entire purpose of intake spacers, specifically our phenolic spacers, is that the material is excellent at not transferring the heat coming from the cylinder head into the intake manifold. By having a cooler intake manifold you are creating a cooler/denser intake charge which creates more HP and TQ. Having the intake spacers also fight against heat soak, so for those doing back to back pulls, drag racing, etc.. you will retain power longer. You also do not need any software to run the intake spacers.

[Grigor@Bestiale]

I'd like to make something very clear - I'm not trashing anyone, I have only expressed my opinion on the intake spacers based on facts. Also my main goal is to find the truth. This is not easy as financial motivation is behind anything we see these days, but this is what I want in the end. One thing we will never do is compromise quality, we are absolutely obsessed with it and this will never change. Indeed we have a partnership with GIAC, an intelligent person would ask themselves why we chose to do it. There are many reasons:
1. They most closely match our passion for perfection
2. Nobody came close after our 1 year search and sometimes very lengthy discussions with many other companies.
3. Feedback from other shop owners about the quality of different suppliers
And so on… If any of the above changes I will have no issues at all changing my opinion and choice of course as we will never tolerate corner cutting or any decrease in quality (we always demand improvement).

In any case, I would still like to learn the truth about the spacers, do they really give any real power increase or not. And I might overlook some of the installation issues (see above). I'm not sure where you are getting your times, but they do not make much sense to me. Is it the same car, same driver, on the same track with the same approximate ambient temp and pressure and one run is stock with the GIAC tune and the other with stock software and spacers?

The same Audi engineering that doesn't acknowledge that carbon buildup is a problem on the BNS engine? The idea that a manufacturer's original design and service policies are the end-all be-all for a car is ridiculous; surely as a tune re-seller you already know this.

A shop no one has ever heard of coming in and trashing a long time advertiser who has done more to advance the platform than basically everyone else combined? Hilarious. AZ must really be hurting for cash.

Look, I get it, you have a partnership with GIAC that probably gives you some sort of kickback for every GIAC tune you sell. It's clear where your motivations lie and that you may not exactly be an unbiased source as a result.

But until a GIAC tuned car is running anywhere close to what the JHM cars are running in the quarter mile (time or trap speed), I think you should stop posting about how great GIAC is. In fact, the fastest ever posted B7 RS4 1/4 mile time with a GIAC tune was [email protected], but a bone stock car with JHM Intake Spacers went [email protected]. What were you saying about marketing hype/tunes causing a decrease in power again?

[Fourplay]

Indeed increasing the runner increases torque, but (as far as I can remember) only for a very narrow RPM range. I'm also aware of its huge impact on the engine's volumetric efficiency, the use of the Helmholtz resonance property of air, smoothness of the passage, etc.
Much more importantly, increasing the thickness of the gasket disrupts the perfect fitting of the intake flaps to the port separators which I'd assume is bad for torque and that's why you guys recommend removing the separators. This though exposes the channels in the cylinder head where they sit and they mess up any smoothness of in the intake channel and I'd assume causes turbulence&resonance which I'd assume is not good for torque.

Longer intake runner length gives more torque across the entire low end of the rev range. Some interesting reading on the topic: http://www.emeraldm3d.com/articles/e...length-intake/

The intake flaps are only flush with the port separator during low RPM operation. At higher loads or RPMs, the intake flaps are flush with the intake manifold walls. Remember, the intake port shape and flaps are designed to cause turbulence - airflow is not laminar in this region in order to promote more complete/efficient combustion.

Not to mention the installation instructions which recommend to use a pry bar to bend (!!!) the high pressure fuel lines which Audi explicitly says not to be bent at all (as extremely high pressure fuel runs there). Also raising the intake manifold by 13mm makes quite a few parts on the rear of it fit very badly, hoses are overstretched.

How do you think high pressure lines are originally shaped in the factory? As long as you aren't using sharp implements, they are fine. Additionally, I had no issues with re-installation of parts following raising the intake manifold. I simply left off the bottom, difficult to access bolt on the air-oil separator (which I do anyway to make the vehicle easier to service). All hoses fit just fine.

I strongly believe that the spacers increase power and torque, especially over repeated pulls. Otherwise stock cars with spacers have run faster than a lot of tuned RS4s, GIAC included. If JHM sees gains, I trust them a lot more than a competitor who has a financial motivation to trash their products.