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  1. #1
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Opel HD Fuel injector

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    I was told to purchase these because they flow better than S3 injectors they come built into fuel rail. Anyone every used or heard of them?

    https://zzperformance.com/products/o...fuel-injectors

    My performance shop recommended them to me...


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  2. #2
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    No one? interesting.....

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  3. #3
    Established Member Two Rings brundy's Avatar
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    What are you running now? Are you running out of fuel? Do you have a larger PRV?


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  4. #4
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    S3 injector n Rs4 RRV

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  5. #5
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brundy View Post
    What are you running now? Are you running out of fuel? Do you have a larger PRV?


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    Yes i am running out of fuel

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  6. #6
    Established Member Two Rings brundy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A4 Quattro Joe View Post
    Yes i am running out of fuel

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    Changing to a 155 PRV will get you another 7% flow. 175 PRV will get you 13%.

    Or just add a 5th injector.




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  7. #7
    Established Member Two Rings brundy's Avatar
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    I donít think running ecotec injectors is a good idea.

    Might as well run RS4 injectors. If you donít like any of those options.


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  8. #8
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by brundy View Post
    Changing to a 155 PRV will get you another 7% flow. 175 PRV will get you 13%.

    Or just add a 5th injector.




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    How much high pressure fuel you need is 100% controlled by the tune. All a PRV does is open at a certain bar. If the ECU never asks for 155bar, a 155 valve wonít give you more fuel than a 136.

    And if his car is anything like everyone elseís, if heís not getting enough fuel itís probably from the low side not because heís running too small of a PRV. We would need to see his high pressure logs in order to see what PRV he should be running.
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  9. #9
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Joe, run the injector your tune or tuner says to run. The tune will be written for the injector. When you deviate from known performers is when you usually get into trouble.

    If youíre running out of fuel maybe you need a better in tank fuel pump or controller as that is the biggest road block we have in tuning.
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  10. #10
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Iíll use my own logs as an example. Here is my high pressure log. The ECU requests 130 bar all the way through this pull and it is met all the way through this pull. The tune asks for 130 bar and I have a 136 PRV. A 155 would not allow more fuel. It would only allow more pressure to build before it vents and puts that pressure back into the fuel stream.


    Hereís my low pressure log. My tune asks for 4.5 bar and it gets it through most of the pull but tapers down to 3.8 bar which is below requested but not enough to be a real issue. Iím on the stock pump with an RS4 controller. My car could benefit from a better low pressure pump but itís not vital. I might be leaving some power on the table or I might not. A better in tank pump would probably give me 6 bar down low and still allow me to meet requested fuel pressure at redline.



    The taper at the end of this graph is what kills big turbo performance. Not really the high pressure side because the high pressure side canít work properly with a weak low pressure side.
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  11. #11
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Just to give you an idea of what different fuel pump set ups do, look at this pic from JHMís website.

    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  12. #12
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
    Iíll use my own logs as an example. Here is my high pressure log. The ECU requests 130 bar all the way through this pull and it is met all the way through this pull. The tune asks for 130 bar and I have a 136 PRV. A 155 would not allow more fuel. It would only allow more pressure to build before it vents and puts that pressure back into the fuel stream.


    Hereís my low pressure log. My tune asks for 4.5 bar and it gets it through most of the pull but tapers down to 3.8 bar which is below requested but not enough to be a real issue. Iím on the stock pump with an RS4 controller. My car could benefit from a better low pressure pump but itís not vital. I might be leaving some power on the table or I might not. A better in tank pump would probably give me 6 bar down low and still allow me to meet requested fuel pressure at redline.



    The taper at the end of this graph is what kills big turbo performance. Not really the high pressure side because the high pressure side canít work properly with a weak low pressure side.
    I know I am running a RS4 controller with APR HPFP and RS4 PRV on my Td05hr and was running out of fuel up top. He recommended these so I guess I'll give it a try also bought the IE intake manifold so might help some idk though, kinda iffy from what I've been told you dont see any difference really. Canadian I know your running it

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  13. #13
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brundy View Post
    Changing to a 155 PRV will get you another 7% flow. 175 PRV will get you 13%.

    Or just add a 5th injector.




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    Thought about 5th injector but would need something to run that injector which makes tuners very limited at that point

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  14. #14
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
    Iíll use my own logs as an example. Here is my high pressure log. The ECU requests 130 bar all the way through this pull and it is met all the way through this pull. The tune asks for 130 bar and I have a 136 PRV. A 155 would not allow more fuel. It would only allow more pressure to build before it vents and puts that pressure back into the fuel stream.


    Hereís my low pressure log. My tune asks for 4.5 bar and it gets it through most of the pull but tapers down to 3.8 bar which is below requested but not enough to be a real issue. Iím on the stock pump with an RS4 controller. My car could benefit from a better low pressure pump but itís not vital. I might be leaving some power on the table or I might not. A better in tank pump would probably give me 6 bar down low and still allow me to meet requested fuel pressure at redline.



    The taper at the end of this graph is what kills big turbo performance. Not really the high pressure side because the high pressure side canít work properly with a weak low pressure side.
    What LPFP would you upgrade to? I heard you can modify a RS3 pump and will work on our platform I think seal has this done...

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  15. #15
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    Since you are going EFR Iíd go with a 340 LPH pump. Look at Texasboy21ís thread. He just put in a 340 pump from JHM and he has fuel pressure for days now.

    And look at the graph I posted from JHMís website. They are getting 4.5 bar at redline. Thatís great.

    Pulling and swapping the guts of a TTRS pump and putting it in the A4 basket is an option too but install can be a little tricky.
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  16. #16
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Low pressure is the weak link. You already have the RS4 controller which will help but the OEM pump runs out of steam once you go over K04 fueling needs. Mine barely keeps up at redline. Itís adequate but not optimal.
    Last edited by EvolutionArmory; 12-07-2018 at 08:47 PM.
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  17. #17
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by A4 Quattro Joe View Post
    I know I am running a RS4 controller with APR HPFP and RS4 PRV on my Td05hr and was running out of fuel up top. He recommended these so I guess I'll give it a try also bought the IE intake manifold so might help some idk though, kinda iffy from what I've been told you dont see any difference really. Canadian I know your running it

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    Different injectors wonít give you more fuel pressure so if you want to spend that money and probably get no more performance, go ahead. The same with the intake manifold. More air in wonít get you more fuel. Youíd be spending money better used for making sure your low side can handle the fueling requirements the EFR will need.

    Has anyone running an EFR here even maxed out S3 or RS4 injectors yet?
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  18. #18
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
    Different injectors wonít give you more fuel pressure so if you want to spend that money and probably get no more performance, go ahead. The same with the intake manifold. More air in wonít get you more fuel. Youíd be spending money better used for making sure your low side can handle the fueling requirements the EFR will need.

    Has anyone running an EFR here even maxed out S3 or RS4 injectors yet?
    So like a Walbro would net better results is what your boiling down too? I already bought everything the injectors bigger valves to port and polish getting done once I get time to find the poly drive to remove the head bolts i just cant justify buying one...I am trying to conserve the race car funds for real sheet

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  19. #19
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Yes. The RS4 controller can power an aftermarket pump pretty good according to JHMís pump flow chart. If you get lack luster results you could always go aftermarket controller.

    Those injectors probably wonít do any better than the S3ís as they already flow 15% more than stock and the injectors only flow what the ECU tells it to anyway unless of course it simply isnít capable of handling the volume. Injectors arenít really a problem until you go crazy big turbo. Those injectors could end up being a waste of time and money. I canít say for sure because Iíve never heard of anyone using them and if they were better than S3ís, we probably would have heard of them by now 13 years after the first B7 rolled out and weíd all be using them 😉
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  20. #20
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
    Yes. The RS4 controller can power an aftermarket pump pretty good according to JHMís pump flow chart. If you get lack luster results you could always go aftermarket controller.

    Those injectors probably wonít do any better than the S3ís as they already flow 15% more than stock and the injectors only flow what the ECU tells it to anyway unless of course it simply isnít capable of handling the volume. Injectors arenít really a problem until you go crazy big turbo. Those injectors could end up being a waste of time and money. I canít say for sure because Iíve never heard of anyone using them and if they were better than S3ís, we probably would have heard of them by now 13 years after the first B7 rolled out and weíd all be using them
    This is true for sure never heard of them I'll snap some pic of the actual rail in a few so u guys can tell me how I fucd up some moar lol

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  21. #21
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    No buddy. I just want your car to run right when you turn the key for the first time. Low pressure fueling will be your weakest link. Get a good in tank pump, make sure you run the right PRV for what your tune is asking for and check wastegate preload before you install your turbo and you'll probably be GTG. It is way better to verify that it is set correctly out of the car than in. I found a EFR training PDF online. It tells you what proper pretension and travel should be. There is also 3 different wastegate canisters for EFR turbos. Low, medium and high. I believe they all ship with the medium canister which is for 12-18 PSI. If you're going to run higher than that you might want to get the high boost canister.

    Page 25 starts talking about wastegate settings and boost levels.

    http://www.turbos.borgwarner.com/fil...ical_brief.pdf
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  22. #22
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvolutionArmory View Post
    No buddy. I just want your car to run right when you turn the key for the first time. Low pressure fueling will be your weakest link. Get a good in tank pump, make sure you run the right PRV for what your tune is asking for and check wastegate preload before you install your turbo and you'll probably be GTG. It is way better to verify that it is set correctly out of the car than in. I found a EFR training PDF online. It tells you what proper pretension and travel should be. There is also 3 different wastegate canisters for EFR turbos. Low, medium and high. I believe they all ship with the medium canister which is for 12-18 PSI. If you're going to run higher than that you might want to get the high boost canister.

    Page 25 starts talking about wastegate settings and boost levels.

    http://www.turbos.borgwarner.com/fil...ical_brief.pdf
    I know always been great EVO just giving u a hard time. I appreciate that, I'll read up on this later. How hard is it to install these engine i might just try to tackle it alone...idk will see

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  23. #23
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Who knows if GM fuel injectors will even fit.
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr

  24. #24
    Senior Member Three Rings
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    The LPFP system on our cars is a bitch, been battling it for a month or two now.
    I had the TTRS pump upgrade which worked great for over a year than I suddenly started to get pressure loss issues, replaced fuel filter, LPFP sensor, LPFP to OEM and then a "DW300 340lph", so it turned out the DW300 pump was a fake unit, but seller was kind enough to give me my money back so now I have a new one on its way from a different site which I hope fix the fuel drops.
    Something really weird is going on because sometimes when the fuel drops all the way to 1.X bar and car shuts down and wont start, and I have to physically remove the fuel supply line from the basket and plug it back in and wallah! car starts first try.. which I cant wrap my head around WHY? its nuts..

    But anyways I run EFR 6258 and also have run 6758 and wouldnt recommend more than around 20-22psi with RS4 PRV and S3 injectors + autotech hpfp, injectors pulse was reaching upto 8ms+ at 140bar tune and a functional upgraded LPFP system(TTRS PUMP and torqbyte cm-5LT + Pm3 as LPFP controller).
    Which EFR are you running? Do you know how much you peaked at your MAF?
    [ B7 2.0TFSI Avant Quattro 07 ] [ Maestro tuned ] [ EFR 6758 .80 TS SP QSV ] [ S3 injectors ] [ Autotech HPFP ] [ ER FMIC ] [ Neuspeed Catback ] [ ARD V-Band Manifold ] [ TTRS LPFP + Torqbyte PM3 + CM5-LT ] - Build Thread

  25. #25
    Veteran Member Four Rings seal66's Avatar
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    I run the Opel injectors. We used the zzp kit and BW made the sleeves for the injectors to fit in the fuel rail. They worked wonderful and have had no issues. They were able to handle my e85 setup so a win lol

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    2008 Audi A4 2.0T
    320awhp/420awtq...E85---UnitedMotorsports Tuned

    2015 A3 8v P-Stock
    2003 A4 Avant 3L-sold

  26. #26
    Established Member Three Rings A4 Quattro Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seal66 View Post
    I run the Opel injectors. We used the zzp kit and BW made the sleeves for the injectors to fit in the fuel rail. They worked wonderful and have had no issues. They were able to handle my e85 setup so a win lol

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    This is who recommended BWP Ben actually recommended. Is your car running again Seal?

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  27. #27
    Established Member Four Rings
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    Hereís some reading about injectors you might find interesting. Page 6 and 7 is relavant to this conversation.

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...-the-FSI/page7

    The Opel injectors may be capable of flowing more fuel volume but they may need more power to open properly. So it is possible that even though they are capable of flowing more fuel, they may not be operating to their full potential in our cars and might not be an upgrade over a S3 injector when actually installed.

    This is pretty interesting stuff.

    I still believe that low pressure fueling is going to be your weak link running the OEM fuel pump, even with the RS4 controller. The high side (HPFP, injectors, ETC) canít run optimally if the low side isnít supplying enough fuel to do so.
    2005.5 A4 Avant: JHM K04R, GIAC K04 tune, NGK BKR8EIX plugs, RS4 PRV, RS4 fuel pump controller, Treadstone TR6 intercooler core with JHM pipe kit, CTS Turbo test pipe, ECS Tuning snub mount, 034 street tranny mount, 034 street motor mounts, ECS Tuning turbo inlet pipe, ECS Tuning RA4 clutch conversion, Billy Boat Stealth cat back, Fluidampr



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