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  1. #1
    Active Member One Ring
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    Want to understand how cooling system works

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    I have been reading a lot on the cooling upgrades available for my 15 S4 and want to understand the system a little better. What I see is one radiator and one a/c condenser up front with dual fans attached to the back of the radiator. What I don't know is if the fluid is first sent through the engine and then through the supercharger or vice versa? I can only imagine the coolant is used for both the engine and the supercharger (correct me if I'm wrong).. So with the fear of sounding like I haven't researched at all I am going to ask anyway..... Are all the available cooling upgrades available out there simply larger, more efficient radiators? I keep hearing the term heat exchanger so I guess I need clarification if they are in fact the same thing? If they are the same thing I would assume with these add on's you aren't replacing the factory radiator but simply adding another radiator into the mix? Is its sole responsibility at that point just the supercharger or is it providing cooling to both engine and supercharger and the "upgrade" being the fact its running through two radiators now?

    Next question, I was advised the AWE kit is set up to let the fan continue to run even after the vehicle is shut off which would help between runs at the track... is there not a way to wire the factory fans to perform the same function?

    I hope my questions make sense... I am old school and used to one radiator doing the job with cooling fans to help.. If the radiator wasnít up to the task you simply replaced it with a larger more effcient unit.. but it seems the options for this car are more complex

    If I havenít found the right threads to reference please attach them!

  2. #2
    Veteran Member Four Rings bhvrdr's Avatar
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    My Garage
    997S; Camaro SS; e30 BMW, Toyota FJ
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    2010 Audi A4 Avant 6AT - Unitronic Tuned - Bone Stock Hardware
    13.665 at 97.71mph - 93 octane - +1250DA
    Gone:
    2013 Audi S5 DSG - Unitronic Stage 2++ ECU & TCU, 3.17pr, Revo Charge Cooler, CTS Turbo Intake, ST60 380mm BBK
    11.482 at 118.70mph - 97 octane - +465DA
    --------------------------
    2016 A6 -- 2015 S4 -- 2009 A4 -- 2004 S4 -- 2006 A4 -- 2003 A4 -- 2000 A4

  3. #3
    Active Member One Ring
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    PERFECT!!! Thank you!!
    2015 S4, DSG, Sepang Blue, B&O, Silk Nappa, Tech pkg, Blk optic.
    EPL upper pulley, stage 2 tune, and DSG tune. JHM lower pulley, RocEuro intake.

  4. #4
    Veteran Member Four Rings bhvrdr's Avatar
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    997S; Camaro SS; e30 BMW, Toyota FJ
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    No problem brother. Used to live on Tates Creek btw, miss those roads a lot. Drive 2 miles outside of town and its heaven.

    Mike

    2010 Audi A4 Avant 6AT - Unitronic Tuned - Bone Stock Hardware
    13.665 at 97.71mph - 93 octane - +1250DA
    Gone:
    2013 Audi S5 DSG - Unitronic Stage 2++ ECU & TCU, 3.17pr, Revo Charge Cooler, CTS Turbo Intake, ST60 380mm BBK
    11.482 at 118.70mph - 97 octane - +465DA
    --------------------------
    2016 A6 -- 2015 S4 -- 2009 A4 -- 2004 S4 -- 2006 A4 -- 2003 A4 -- 2000 A4

  5. #5
    Active Member One Ring
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    Could you help me a little with the aftermarket options? Since what you sent me clearly shows the supercharger has its own cooling device (radiator, heat exhanger, whatever lol).. Does that mean the ones you purchase as an upgrade are adding onto the factory system or replacing the factory unit? Like if you purchase the Merc Racing "heat exhanger" are you plumbing that into the factory lines and utilizing both the original cooler and the new cooler from Merc?

    I am really close to Tates Creek area.. intersection of Man O War and Armstrong Mill
    2015 S4, DSG, Sepang Blue, B&O, Silk Nappa, Tech pkg, Blk optic.
    EPL upper pulley, stage 2 tune, and DSG tune. JHM lower pulley, RocEuro intake.

  6. #6
    Veteran Member Four Rings bhvrdr's Avatar
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    Theres a ton of infor in this thread if you ever have a spare 16 hours to read...

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...ervoir-upgrade


    To sum it up, you can do either of the options you are discussing.

    1. yes most of the full size aftermarket heat exchangers (Revo, APR, AWE, AMS) replace the center mounted front heat exchanger for the supercharger cooling loop.

    2. This is not required though. You can buy a medium sized heat exchanger such as one from a jaguar or one from merc racing (the $150 one) or any number of sources and run it in addition to your factory front hx.


    Generally people just choose to replace their hx though since it cuts down on additional bends in plumbing that may reduce flow. With so many options out there that are good and relatively inexpensive (you can spend at little as a few hundred bucks to $1800 bucks) theres plenty for whatever you want to do.


    Generally id recommend:

    1. replace the center hx with a good quality aftermarket
    2. do the "pump mod" or choose a software tuner that already runs your SC pump at 100%
    3. divorce the SC loop (its very cheap and easy to do so why not)
    4. try and run as much distilled water and WW or other coolant conditioner as your climate allows. I've heard if you add as much as 25% antifreeze you may as well add the 50% bc it reduced the capacity to cool just as much.

    Here's a cheap way to divorce the loops...

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...oolant-sensors


    Thats it and you should be good to go. You could do all that for under $500 bucks.

    Mike
    Last edited by bhvrdr; 07-13-2018 at 11:11 AM.

    2010 Audi A4 Avant 6AT - Unitronic Tuned - Bone Stock Hardware
    13.665 at 97.71mph - 93 octane - +1250DA
    Gone:
    2013 Audi S5 DSG - Unitronic Stage 2++ ECU & TCU, 3.17pr, Revo Charge Cooler, CTS Turbo Intake, ST60 380mm BBK
    11.482 at 118.70mph - 97 octane - +465DA
    --------------------------
    2016 A6 -- 2015 S4 -- 2009 A4 -- 2004 S4 -- 2006 A4 -- 2003 A4 -- 2000 A4

  7. #7
    Active Member One Ring
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    And that is..... the perfect answer to all my questions... Dang!! Much appreciated :)
    2015 S4, DSG, Sepang Blue, B&O, Silk Nappa, Tech pkg, Blk optic.
    EPL upper pulley, stage 2 tune, and DSG tune. JHM lower pulley, RocEuro intake.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Three Rings USAF_Danny's Avatar
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    Mar 05 2015
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    2011 Audi S4, 2017 Honda Civic EX
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    Rapid City, SD

    Quote Originally Posted by bhvrdr View Post
    Theres a ton of infor in this thread if you ever have a spare 16 hours to read...

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...ervoir-upgrade


    To sum it up, you can do either of the options you are discussing.

    1. yes most of the full size aftermarket heat exchangers (Revo, APR, AWE, AMS) replace the center mounted front heat exchanger for the supercharger cooling loop.

    2. This is not required though. You can buy a medium sized heat exchanger such as one from a jaguar or one from merc racing (the $150 one) or any number of sources and run it in addition to your factory front hx.


    Generally people just choose to replace their hx though since it cuts down on additional bends in plumbing that may reduce flow. With so many options out there that are good and relatively inexpensive (you can spend at little as a few hundred bucks to $1800 bucks) theres plenty for whatever you want to do.


    Generally id recommend:

    1. replace the center hx with a good quality aftermarket
    2. do the "pump mod" or choose a software tuner that already runs your SC pump at 100%
    3. divorce the SC loop (its very cheap and easy to do so why not)
    4. try and run as much distilled water and WW or other coolant conditioner as your climate allows. I've heard if you add as much as 25% antifreeze you may as well add the 50% bc it reduced the capacity to cool just as much.

    Here's a cheap way to divorce the loops...

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...oolant-sensors


    Thats it and you should be good to go. You could do all that for under $500 bucks.

    Mike
    Under $500 if you buy a used Jag HX no? The Merc kit alone is like $780, and I don't think I've ever seen cheaper lol.
    YouTube: DV Motions | Instagram: daanny.vu

    []S4 | EPL Stage 2

  9. #9
    Active Member One Ring Jwill's Avatar
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    Collegeville, PA

    Quote Originally Posted by bhvrdr View Post
    Theres a ton of infor in this thread if you ever have a spare 16 hours to read...

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...ervoir-upgrade


    To sum it up, you can do either of the options you are discussing.

    1. yes most of the full size aftermarket heat exchangers (Revo, APR, AWE, AMS) replace the center mounted front heat exchanger for the supercharger cooling loop.

    2. This is not required though. You can buy a medium sized heat exchanger such as one from a jaguar or one from merc racing (the $150 one) or any number of sources and run it in addition to your factory front hx.


    Generally people just choose to replace their hx though since it cuts down on additional bends in plumbing that may reduce flow. With so many options out there that are good and relatively inexpensive (you can spend at little as a few hundred bucks to $1800 bucks) theres plenty for whatever you want to do.


    Generally id recommend:

    1. replace the center hx with a good quality aftermarket
    2. do the "pump mod" or choose a software tuner that already runs your SC pump at 100%
    3. divorce the SC loop (its very cheap and easy to do so why not)
    4. try and run as much distilled water and WW or other coolant conditioner as your climate allows. I've heard if you add as much as 25% antifreeze you may as well add the 50% bc it reduced the capacity to cool just as much.

    Here's a cheap way to divorce the loops...

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...oolant-sensors


    Thats it and you should be good to go. You could do all that for under $500 bucks.

    Mike

    Man, this answers a lot of questions I was too afraid/too confused to ask. Thanks!
    2013 Estoril Blue S4 | DSG | Prestige | Sport Diff | B&O | Carbon Atlas Inlays | Black Leather w/ Alcantara
    Modifications: EPL Stage 2 w/ TCU Tune | CR-15 Strut Brace | Alu Kreuz | Bilstein B12 Pro Kit | EuroCode Sway Bars | Borla Exhaust | CTS Turbo Intake | Forgestar CF10 Wheels w/ PSS

  10. #10
    Veteran Member Four Rings bhvrdr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USAF_Danny View Post
    Under $500 if you buy a used Jag HX no? The Merc kit alone is like $780, and I don't think I've ever seen cheaper lol.

    If I was going to buy the large merc hx it would be this one for $399...

    https://mercracing.net/shop/air-to-w...-exchanger-m3/


    An audi reservoir is only about $20. Some clamps and 3/4" heater hose is probably $15 or less.


    Alternatively you could do stacking...

    https://mercracing.net/shop/air-to-w...eat-exchanger/

    You could do that for probably $300 or less all-in with divorcing.

    Mike

    2010 Audi A4 Avant 6AT - Unitronic Tuned - Bone Stock Hardware
    13.665 at 97.71mph - 93 octane - +1250DA
    Gone:
    2013 Audi S5 DSG - Unitronic Stage 2++ ECU & TCU, 3.17pr, Revo Charge Cooler, CTS Turbo Intake, ST60 380mm BBK
    11.482 at 118.70mph - 97 octane - +465DA
    --------------------------
    2016 A6 -- 2015 S4 -- 2009 A4 -- 2004 S4 -- 2006 A4 -- 2003 A4 -- 2000 A4

  11. #11
    Senior Member Three Rings USAF_Danny's Avatar
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    Mar 05 2015
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    My Garage
    2011 Audi S4, 2017 Honda Civic EX
    Location
    Rapid City, SD

    Quote Originally Posted by bhvrdr View Post
    If I was going to buy the large merc hx it would be this one for $399...

    https://mercracing.net/shop/air-to-w...-exchanger-m3/


    An audi reservoir is only about $20. Some clamps and 3/4" heater hose is probably $15 or less.


    Alternatively you could do stacking...

    https://mercracing.net/shop/air-to-w...eat-exchanger/

    You could do that for probably $300 or less all-in with divorcing.

    Mike
    You make it sound too simple. I'm probably going to order my parts tonight lol.

    Thanks Mike!
    YouTube: DV Motions | Instagram: daanny.vu

    []S4 | EPL Stage 2

  12. #12
    Veteran Member Four Rings bhvrdr's Avatar
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    Lol right on brother. Its actually one of the more rewarding diy jobs you can do. Everything is right there for you after you remove the bumper. Very accessible and a relatively easy job. Just get some extra bleed screws for the sc when you strip yours.

    Mike
    Quote Originally Posted by USAF_Danny View Post
    You make it sound too simple. I'm probably going to order my parts tonight lol.

    Thanks Mike!
    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

    2010 Audi A4 Avant 6AT - Unitronic Tuned - Bone Stock Hardware
    13.665 at 97.71mph - 93 octane - +1250DA
    Gone:
    2013 Audi S5 DSG - Unitronic Stage 2++ ECU & TCU, 3.17pr, Revo Charge Cooler, CTS Turbo Intake, ST60 380mm BBK
    11.482 at 118.70mph - 97 octane - +465DA
    --------------------------
    2016 A6 -- 2015 S4 -- 2009 A4 -- 2004 S4 -- 2006 A4 -- 2003 A4 -- 2000 A4

  13. #13
    Established Member Three Rings Ford Prefect's Avatar
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    Jan 20 2017
    AZ Member #
    391171
    My Garage
    2011 Silver S4, Mercedes Benz R350 ('07 & '11), Suzuki SV1000
    Location
    New Hampshire

    Quote Originally Posted by bhvrdr View Post
    Lol right on brother. Its actually one of the more rewarding diy jobs you can do. Everything is right there for you after you remove the bumper. Very accessible and a relatively easy job. Just get some extra bleed screws for the sc when you strip yours.

    Mike

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
    Hey Mike,

    I missed your original thread too, just sub'd to both. I have a stupid question, where is your divorced pump? Or does divorcing only mean at a cross connect point and the same pump is always used? I'm guessing you have a pump just for the SC loop and it's truly divorced.

    Second question, your new reservoir, how did you secure it? I saw one zip tie but that's it.

    Lastly, I saw you said you had a 50/50 chance of getting the right wire for the sensor. When I had the pleasure of serving on submarines, we called it 50/50/90. You have a 50/50 chance of getting it right but will be wrong 90% of the time.

    Thanks for thinking about answering my questions, seems like it should be obvious but this is by far the most complicated car I've owned.

  14. #14
    Veteran Member Four Rings bhvrdr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ford Prefect View Post
    Hey Mike,

    I missed your original thread too, just sub'd to both. I have a stupid question, where is your divorced pump? Or does divorcing only mean at a cross connect point and the same pump is always used? I'm guessing you have a pump just for the SC loop and it's truly divorced.

    Second question, your new reservoir, how did you secure it? I saw one zip tie but that's it.

    Lastly, I saw you said you had a 50/50 chance of getting the right wire for the sensor. When I had the pleasure of serving on submarines, we called it 50/50/90. You have a 50/50 chance of getting it right but will be wrong 90% of the time.

    Thanks for thinking about answering my questions, seems like it should be obvious but this is by far the most complicated car I've owned.
    Hi bud. Haha i sympathize with the 50/50/90 rule.

    You are using the stock pierburg cw50 pump that circulates the sc loop. Its an awesome pump. The sc and engine cooling loops are already 90% divorced. There is a bit of crossover. The main engine water pump circulates the engine side of the coolant loop.

    The reservoir sits very snug where it is. Its wedged in there. I use a couple zip ties bc i overdo things buts its fine.

    Mike

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

    2010 Audi A4 Avant 6AT - Unitronic Tuned - Bone Stock Hardware
    13.665 at 97.71mph - 93 octane - +1250DA
    Gone:
    2013 Audi S5 DSG - Unitronic Stage 2++ ECU & TCU, 3.17pr, Revo Charge Cooler, CTS Turbo Intake, ST60 380mm BBK
    11.482 at 118.70mph - 97 octane - +465DA
    --------------------------
    2016 A6 -- 2015 S4 -- 2009 A4 -- 2004 S4 -- 2006 A4 -- 2003 A4 -- 2000 A4

  15. #15
    Established Member Three Rings Ford Prefect's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 20 2017
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    2011 Silver S4, Mercedes Benz R350 ('07 & '11), Suzuki SV1000
    Location
    New Hampshire

    So, I just read through the cooling part of the manual link you sent. There are two pumps and the cooling system is cross connected so they could use the same reservoir. Lazy bastards. So you divorced the systems but in order to that you need an expansion tank of the charge cooling system.

    Gotcha. Thanks Mike!

  16. #16
    Established Member Three Rings Ford Prefect's Avatar
    Join Date
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    My Garage
    2011 Silver S4, Mercedes Benz R350 ('07 & '11), Suzuki SV1000
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    New Hampshire

    Quote Originally Posted by bhvrdr View Post
    Hi bud. Haha i sympathize with the 50/50/90 rule.

    You are using the stock pierburg cw50 pump that circulates the sc loop. Its an awesome pump. The sc and engine cooling loops are already 90% divorced. There is a bit of crossover. The main engine water pump circulates the engine side of the coolant loop.

    The reservoir sits very snug where it is. Its wedged in there. I use a couple zip ties bc i overdo things buts its fine.

    Mike

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
    I figured it out and should have refreshed my page before my reply above. I guess I never realized there was an electric charge cooler pump. My guess is EPL runs it at 100% but will certainly check.

    Great DIY! Looking at that Merc HX, just have to DIY the plumbing it looks like. Know about the brackets?

  17. #17
    Veteran Member Four Rings bhvrdr's Avatar
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    997S; Camaro SS; e30 BMW, Toyota FJ
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ford Prefect View Post
    I figured it out and should have refreshed my page before my reply above. I guess I never realized there was an electric charge cooler pump. My guess is EPL runs it at 100% but will certainly check.

    Great DIY! Looking at that Merc HX, just have to DIY the plumbing it looks like. Know about the brackets?
    They do report they modify its run time but its not at 100% as several epl folks have posted so not sure. Id just do the mod then myself but up to you.

    The plumbing is easy peasy and i believe the merc may come with brackets now but no quoting me on it

    Mike

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

    2010 Audi A4 Avant 6AT - Unitronic Tuned - Bone Stock Hardware
    13.665 at 97.71mph - 93 octane - +1250DA
    Gone:
    2013 Audi S5 DSG - Unitronic Stage 2++ ECU & TCU, 3.17pr, Revo Charge Cooler, CTS Turbo Intake, ST60 380mm BBK
    11.482 at 118.70mph - 97 octane - +465DA
    --------------------------
    2016 A6 -- 2015 S4 -- 2009 A4 -- 2004 S4 -- 2006 A4 -- 2003 A4 -- 2000 A4

  18. #18
    Senior Member Three Rings USAF_Danny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 05 2015
    AZ Member #
    318751
    My Garage
    2011 Audi S4, 2017 Honda Civic EX
    Location
    Rapid City, SD

    Quote Originally Posted by bhvrdr View Post
    They do report they modify its run time but its not at 100% as several epl folks have posted so not sure. Id just do the mod then myself but up to you.

    The plumbing is easy peasy and i believe the merc may come with brackets now but no quoting me on it

    Mike

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
    It does!
    YouTube: DV Motions | Instagram: daanny.vu

    []S4 | EPL Stage 2

  19. #19
    Established Member Two Rings
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    can we get some info that that jaguar cooler?



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