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  1. #1
    Established Member Two Rings Marlon177's Avatar
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    Need advice on Crank Pulley and Supercharger Pulley

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    Just purchased a 2012 Audi S4 with 80k miles on it few weeks ago, I had been reading up about B8 S4 but I am still confused about the pulleys. Since I will be changing out the front grill because my car came with euro grill and I came across about crank pulley failure thread. Here are my questions;

    I am planning to tune it for sure but it probably wonít be another year, since I will be taking off the front bumper, I think I should replace the crank pulley at the same time.

    As front as the tune, I am undecided on stage 1 or 2.

    There are many different sizes on the crank pulley, what size do I need and what are the difference with all these sizes.

    If I want to upgrade the supercharger pulley, will it be ok without tune for a year or 2?

    I think the crank pulley and the supercharger pulley are running on the same belt, so I think I will need the correct size of the belt if I am gonna upgrade both, which is the part I am confused the most.

    What tools do I need to do all that myself, the grill should be here in a week or 2, so I am planning to do all these at the same time.

    Any help would be appreciated.

    Thanks.

    Edit: I havenít purchase any pulley or belt yet, just the grill.


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    Last edited by Marlon177; 06-14-2018 at 09:24 AM.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Three Rings USAF_Danny's Avatar
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    If you already have a new crank pulley, why not go ahead and swap it out? I haven't done mine yet, but I'm still contemplating on going dual pulley.

    Stage 1 or 2 in this car is great. But if you get the chance to experience going stage 2 in the S4, it's a completely different animal. You can get a larger crank pulley and run stage two on the OEM supercharger pulley. If you're already pulling off the bumper, go this route. You'll take care of the failing crank pulley and be stage two.

    There's no point in upgrading your supercharger pulley and not tuning the car. Your car will bleed off the extra boost but in all reality, don't be that guy.

    Contact EPL, they're running a July 4th sale right now.
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  3. #3
    Established Member Two Rings Marlon177's Avatar
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    Need advice on Crank Pulley and Supercharger Pulley

    Quote Originally Posted by USAF_Danny View Post
    If you already have a new crank pulley, why not go ahead and swap it out? I haven't done mine yet, but I'm still contemplating on going dual pulley.

    Stage 1 or 2 in this car is great. But if you get the chance to experience going stage 2 in the S4, it's a completely different animal. You can get a larger crank pulley and run stage two on the OEM supercharger pulley. If you're already pulling off the bumper, go this route. You'll take care of the failing crank pulley and be stage two.

    There's no point in upgrading your supercharger pulley and not tuning the car. Your car will bleed off the extra boost but in all reality, don't be that guy.

    Contact EPL, they're running a July 4th sale right now.
    Just to clarify, I havenít purchase any pulleys or belt yet and what is dual pulley?


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  4. #4
    Active Member Two Rings
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    I replaced mine with the 179mm JHM Crank pulley and tuned with Chipwerke pro stage 2. All done for ~$600. I heard with larger than 179-mm you'll need to file down/cut off a part to not have the belt rub off.

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...r-2-in-a-jiffy

    No point of upgrading the super charger pulley unless you are going DP setup.

  5. #5
    Established Member Two Rings Marlon177's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ValidatedS4 View Post
    I replaced mine with the 179mm JHM Crank pulley and tuned with Chipwerke pro stage 2. All done for ~$600. I heard with larger than 179-mm you'll need to file down/cut off a part to not have the belt rub off.

    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...r-2-in-a-jiffy

    No point of upgrading the super charger pulley unless you are going DP setup.
    So if I run a bigger crank pulley then I donít need to upgrade the supercharger pulley to run stage 2? And what is the stock crank pulley size?


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  6. #6
    Established Member Two Rings spoolin80's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marlon177 View Post
    So if I run a bigger crank pulley then I donít need to upgrade the supercharger pulley to run stage 2? And what is the stock crank pulley size?


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    correct the crank pulley is alittle easier, although when I did my jhm 179 on my 12 I had to put it into service position, which you can find on youtube from ECS.
    I'd check this thread out, it all comes down to pulley ratio and what can be done to achieve that
    https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...lopment-thread

    basically a crank pulley can give you the same effect of a pulley ratio as it would keeping the stock crank and a supercharger pulley. That thread also gives you ratios and when you should look at cooling upgardes like a heat exchanger
    2012 Ice Silver S4 - CW Stage 1 - HR OE Springs - Roc-Euro Intake

  7. #7
    Stage 2 Banner Advertiser Four Rings Chris@EPL's Avatar
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    The stock crank pulley is about 163mm so if you went with a 179-183mm crank pulley kit that would put you at a Stage 2 ratio and you would not need to replace the SC pulley to go Stage 2. LMK we offer our Stage 2 tunes with our SC pulley or without.
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    Please feel free to contact us with any questions!!

  8. #8
    Established Member Two Rings Marlon177's Avatar
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    What is the difference between 179 and 183?
    Can I run a larger crank pulley without stage 2 tune for a year or 2?
    Which tune can I run with larger crank pulley? I read on the APR site, supercharger pulley is required for stage 2.
    Will the car act differently if I run a larger crank pulley without tune?
    Do I need to file/cut down some area in order to run larger pulley?

    Too many questions lol, sorry.
    Thanks.


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  9. #9

  10. #10
    Established Member Two Rings BigKeshy's Avatar
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    The first page of the thread that theweebabyseamus linked answers most of your questions.

    Sizing up the crank pulley has the same generally effect as sizing down the supercharger pulley in that it simply spins the supercharger faster. Spinning the supercharger faster means that more boost will be generated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marlon177 View Post
    Can I run a larger crank pulley without stage 2 tune for a year or 2?
    You "can" but again there's no point. As USAF_Danny pointed out all you'll do is bleed extra boost.

    I understand the desire to do everything while the bumper is off to save yourself from doing it again. But based on the questions you're asking I'd encourage you to simply do the grille swap this time around, then spend the time between now and when you decide to get a tune reading up on the subject so you can make more informed decisions based on your particular use requirements.
    2013 B8.5 S4 MT

  11. #11
    Veteran Member Four Rings Acejam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marlon177 View Post
    What is the difference between 179 and 183?
    Can I run a larger crank pulley without stage 2 tune for a year or 2?
    Which tune can I run with larger crank pulley? I read on the APR site, supercharger pulley is required for stage 2.
    Will the car act differently if I run a larger crank pulley without tune?
    Do I need to file/cut down some area in order to run larger pulley?

    Too many questions lol, sorry.
    Thanks.


    Sent from my iPhone using Audizine
    1. You can, but it's not ideal, and I personally wouldn't do it.

    2. Many tuners have files for "stage 2" and "dual pulley" setups. APR, EPL, GIAC, and Unitronic are the most popular tuners for this platform. I'd only consider running a tune from one of these four.

    3. It should act mostly the same, but the ECU will constantly bleed off the extra boost. This is not optimal.

    4. From what I've seen 179mm is about the largest you can run without having to cut the extra machining boss off the engine block. I'm sure there are others out there who have run a 183mm setup without issues, but I wouldn't suggest it. The risk is simply your supercharger belt breaking, leaving you potentially stranded somewhere. If you have the proper tools, machining down the extra part of the block only takes a few minutes. I used an angle grinder with a cutting disk, but a file should work too.

    Since you have a 2012 model, I would suggest replacing the crank pulley as preventative maintenance if you an. I would suggest looking into the JHM pulleys - they offer both 179 and 187mm sizes. I personally run a dual pulley setup with their larger 187mm size. Going with the 179mm setup is basically the same as swapping the supercharger pulley for a smaller one. The supercharger just spins - it doesn't know or care which pulley's diameter is changing.

    A quality lightweight solid crank pulley for this platform should cost you anywhere from $300-500. Anything more than that, such as a fancier "dampened" Fluidampr pulley, is a waste of money.
    2014 Brilliant Black S4
    DSG / Prestige / Black Optics / Sport Diff / B&O / Carbon Atlas Inlays / Magma Leather
    Modifications: APR Stage 2 Dual Pulley + TCU, JHM 187mm Crank Pulley, APR CPS, AWE Touring Exhaust (90mm Silver), ECS 10mm/12.5mm Spacers, 034 Mount Inserts, Hawk HPS 5.0, Rotors w/ PSS (Summer), Peelers w/ LM-32's (Winter)

  12. #12
    Senior Member Three Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigKeshy View Post
    The first page of the thread that theweebabyseamus linked answers most of your questions.

    Sizing up the crank pulley has the same generally effect as sizing down the supercharger pulley in that it simply spins the supercharger faster. Spinning the supercharger faster means that more boost will be generated.



    You "can" but again there's no point. As USAF_Danny pointed out all you'll do is bleed extra boost.

    I understand the desire to do everything while the bumper is off to save yourself from doing it again. But based on the questions you're asking I'd encourage you to simply do the grille swap this time around, then spend the time between now and when you decide to get a tune reading up on the subject so you can make more informed decisions based on your particular use requirements.
    I would agree

    Also note the main purpose of all of these higher ratios is to spin the supercharger 2-3K faster, so youre if you're not tuned for stage 2, as noted above, you're creating extra stress/heat on supercharger and components without getting the extra power because of the boost bleed.

    Though it is Ok I wouldn't do it now and then wait for a year or two as was suggested in original post.

  13. #13
    Established Member Two Rings Marlon177's Avatar
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    Thank you for everyoneís input, I believe I got all the info I need.

    I was thinking to replace the pulley as one of the maintenance since I will be taking off the bumper and also afraid the stock crank pulley will fail and cost me more money.


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  14. #14
    Established Member Two Rings wastatepride's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acejam View Post
    1. 4. From what I've seen 179mm is about the largest you can run without having to cut the extra machining boss off the engine block. I'm sure there are others out there who have run a 183mm setup without issues, but I wouldn't suggest it. The risk is simply your supercharger belt breaking, leaving you potentially stranded somewhere. If you have the proper tools, machining down the extra part of the block only takes a few minutes. I used an angle grinder with a cutting disk, but a file should work.
    OR you could get a cts crank pulley which comes with a 6 rib v-band belt and no filing or machining. I have a 187 on mine and donít rub on anything. Been dual pulley for about 2000 miles problem free



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  15. #15
    Veteran Member Four Rings Acejam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wastatepride View Post
    OR you could get a cts crank pulley which comes with a 6 rib v-band belt and no filing or machining. I have a 187 on mine and donít rub on anything. Been dual pulley for about 2000 miles problem free



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    I consider 6 rib belts to be a hacky and temporary solution. Glad itís working out for you, but if you ask me, get a belt that fits.


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    2014 Brilliant Black S4
    DSG / Prestige / Black Optics / Sport Diff / B&O / Carbon Atlas Inlays / Magma Leather
    Modifications: APR Stage 2 Dual Pulley + TCU, JHM 187mm Crank Pulley, APR CPS, AWE Touring Exhaust (90mm Silver), ECS 10mm/12.5mm Spacers, 034 Mount Inserts, Hawk HPS 5.0, Rotors w/ PSS (Summer), Peelers w/ LM-32's (Winter)

  16. #16
    Established Member Two Rings BigKeshy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marlon177 View Post
    Thank you for everyoneís input, I believe I got all the info I need.

    I was thinking to replace the pulley as one of the maintenance since I will be taking off the bumper and also afraid the stock crank pulley will fail and cost me more money.
    If you're just going with an OEM sized (162mm) replacement crank pulley, then that would make sense to do while you've got the bumper off for the grille swap. Good luck, mate!
    2013 B8.5 S4 MT

  17. #17
    Established Member Two Rings wastatepride's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acejam View Post
    I consider 6 rib belts to be a hacky and temporary solution. Glad itís working out for you, but if you ask me, get a belt that fits.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Can you tell me how my belt does not fit? I feel like your the one with the belt that doesnít fit cuz you had to grind your engine block like everyone else that uses a 7 band to each there own.


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  18. #18
    Established Member Two Rings wastatepride's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acejam View Post
    I consider 6 rib belts to be a hacky and temporary solution. Glad itís working out for you, but if you ask me, get a belt that fits.


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    Also, Iím curious how itís temporary Iím eagerly awaiting your response


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  19. #19
    Veteran Member Four Rings Acejam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wastatepride View Post
    Can you tell me how my belt does not fit? I feel like your the one with the belt that doesnít fit cuz you had to grind your engine block like everyone else that uses a 7 band to each there own.


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    Running a 6 rib belt leaves an entire rib exposed that isnít covered/supported and requires using a thinner and thus weaker belt.

    The amount of material that needs to be removed is about 2-3mm tops. Thatís almost a bad surface scratch. My setup wasnít actually touching at static, but I did it as a preventative measure.

    As Iím sure youíre aware, these belts move a bit. Thatís why the pulleys have a taller ďedgeĒ on them, something you loose out on with a 6 rib belt.


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    2014 Brilliant Black S4
    DSG / Prestige / Black Optics / Sport Diff / B&O / Carbon Atlas Inlays / Magma Leather
    Modifications: APR Stage 2 Dual Pulley + TCU, JHM 187mm Crank Pulley, APR CPS, AWE Touring Exhaust (90mm Silver), ECS 10mm/12.5mm Spacers, 034 Mount Inserts, Hawk HPS 5.0, Rotors w/ PSS (Summer), Peelers w/ LM-32's (Winter)

  20. #20
    Established Member Two Rings wastatepride's Avatar
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    The cts crank pulley only has 6 ribs. So ya, Iím good. Do your homework.


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  21. #21
    Veteran Member Four Rings Acejam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wastatepride View Post
    Also, Iím curious how itís temporary Iím eagerly awaiting your response


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    Itís temporary because almost all folks run 7 rib belts but when they snap one (cause they didnít grind or for any other reason) they have to run a 6 rib temporarily because a properly fitting 7 rib is tough to find at local auto part stores.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    2014 Brilliant Black S4
    DSG / Prestige / Black Optics / Sport Diff / B&O / Carbon Atlas Inlays / Magma Leather
    Modifications: APR Stage 2 Dual Pulley + TCU, JHM 187mm Crank Pulley, APR CPS, AWE Touring Exhaust (90mm Silver), ECS 10mm/12.5mm Spacers, 034 Mount Inserts, Hawk HPS 5.0, Rotors w/ PSS (Summer), Peelers w/ LM-32's (Winter)

  22. #22
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by wastatepride View Post
    Can you tell me how my belt does not fit? I feel like your the one with the belt that doesnít fit cuz you had to grind your engine block like everyone else that uses a 7 band to each there own.


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    I think both setups have merit but I'd definitely consider grinding my engine block to be the more 'hacky' of the two options. Lol

  23. #23
    Established Member Two Rings wastatepride's Avatar
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    If there was an empty rib on my pulley I definitely gone with a 7 rib. But since it came with the 6 rib and thereís only 6 ribs on my pulley... seemed like a no brained but who am I lol


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  24. #24
    Veteran Member Four Rings Acejam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wastatepride View Post
    The cts crank pulley only has 6 ribs. So ya, Iím good. Do your homework.


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    I think you are confused: https://www.ecstuning.com/b-cts-part...-hw-266-187~c/

    Edit: Zoom in on those machined ribs, and the belt too. 7PK1320 means 7 rib, 1320mm length.

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    Last edited by Acejam; 06-14-2018 at 12:10 PM.
    2014 Brilliant Black S4
    DSG / Prestige / Black Optics / Sport Diff / B&O / Carbon Atlas Inlays / Magma Leather
    Modifications: APR Stage 2 Dual Pulley + TCU, JHM 187mm Crank Pulley, APR CPS, AWE Touring Exhaust (90mm Silver), ECS 10mm/12.5mm Spacers, 034 Mount Inserts, Hawk HPS 5.0, Rotors w/ PSS (Summer), Peelers w/ LM-32's (Winter)

  25. #25
    Established Member Two Rings wastatepride's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Acejam;13153379]I think you are confused: https://www.ecstuning.com/b-cts-part...-hw-266-187~c/

    You are totally correct I just went out and counted mine. *inserts foot in mouth*


    Sent from my iPhone


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  26. #26
    Established Member Three Rings MSq5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marlon177 View Post
    Thank you for everyoneís input, I believe I got all the info I need.

    I was thinking to replace the pulley as one of the maintenance since I will be taking off the bumper and also afraid the stock crank pulley will fail and cost me more money.


    Sent from my iPhone using Audizine
    Can't say with absolute certainty about crank pulley clearance on the S4, but I think it is identical to my Q5. On the Q5 I was able to install the JHM 179mm crank pulley completely from below without taking off the front bumper (service position). It is tight, but not difficult. Entire process took me about 45 minutes to remove the lower shield, lock the belt tensioner, remove the stock belt, remove OEM crank pulley, install JHM 179, loop new belt in place, unlock the tensioner and put the lower shield back.

    Regardless of method you use, note that one of the crank pulley holes is offset. That hole location must be marked and visually indexed to a reference point so that all bolts will fit properly. You can also put a longer stud temporarily in that offset hole on the front of the crank and slip the offset hole of the crank pulley over it first, fasten down all the others, unscrew the stud and replace the offset bolt last.
    2017 Q5 3.0T S-Line | Brilliant Black | EPL Stage 2 93 octane tune | JHM 179mm crank pulley | K&N E-1987 in "modified" stock air box
    034 silicone throttle body hose

  27. #27
    Established Member Two Rings
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    If I read the OP's requirements correctly then the best strategy might be to fit a 162mm now to solve the OE pulley problem. Then when ready to tune, fit a Vdamper over it. Just need the right size to give the ratio suitable for the remap file chosen.
    2015 monsoon grey S5 sportback (yes the one with 4 doors)
    - MRC stage 2 (189mm Vdamper/Fluidampr crank pulley)



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