ECS Tuning magnetic drain plug for S6. Torque question; please help.

**elptxjc** · 05-05-2018 10:54 AM

Hey gang, sorry for the bother, but ECS doesn't answer the phone. I'm in the middle of my first oil change at 4,420 miles, and need your help. The black ECS Tuning magnetic drain plug I bought is substantially smaller than the factory plug, barely covering the flat surface that the factory plug covered by 1/4" more. In addition, the plug is looser than the factory one, meaning it can take less torque before stripping. After analyzing the situation, I think the paltry 20Nm factory spec (about 15 ft/lbs), won't seal properly, and I won't be able to check if it leaks before putting all the panels together. I'd like to use 25 ft/lbs, which is the typical torque for a drain plug, and it'd surely seal properly, but don't know if the plug can take it. Those with this plug, which torque did you use without leaking? Hope somebody can help before I have to put it back on. All suggestions welcome

. Many thanks.
JC

**s4nicetry** · 05-05-2018 11:05 AM

The torque specs shouldn't change at all. I never even use a torque wrench when tightening drain plugs as your intention is to just compress the crush washer, I go by feel. If you need to use the wrench start with the factory 20nm, you'll feel if the washer crushes or not. If it doesn't (it should) just give it a little more.

**elptxjc** · 05-05-2018 01:34 PM

In this case it's different, since the washer is contacting a hell of a lot less surface. I've done it by feel for decades, but sometimes, they leak, like when surface is not perfectly flat. On cars with everything covered, I don't like to chance it with feel, so go by torque. If you have seen our sump, it's really weird at the drain plug. It's like a sandwich of metal, and the ECS washer barely goes past the serrated part of the inner one, barely touching the outer surface that the stock washer makes plenty of contact. You probably won't understand what the hell I'm talking about until you see it up close. Ha ha. Didn't want to lower the car, drive it, then raise it again to put the damn panels back. Guess will go halfway, at 20 ft/lbs, if nobody else chimes in, and hope it's flat enough that doesn't need any more than that. I've even had plugs leak at 25, like my Porsche's, so had to go with the outrageously high 37 ft/lbs factory spec. But being an aluminum plug, I was VERY concerned. Ha ha. But that one had a very tight fit, not wobbly like this one. Thanks for your help anyway. Take care.

EDIT: Hey guys, just picked up the correct filter from Audi. It came with a small O-ring that I have no idea where it could go. The smaller O-ring on top of the oil filter is already fitted. And parts guy said the sealing washer on the oil filter cap that I didn't use this time (for not having a replacement washer) is metal, not an O-ring. Hopefully somebody knows. Don't want to finish the job and leave an O-ring missing. Thanks.

**gk1** · 05-05-2018 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by elptxjc

In this case it's different, since the washer is contacting a hell of a lot less surface. I've done it by feel for decades, but sometimes, they leak, like when surface is not perfectly flat. On cars with everything covered, I don't like to chance it with feel, so go by torque. If you have seen our sump, it's really weird at the drain plug. It's like a sandwich of metal, and the ECS washer barely goes past the serrated part of the inner one, barely touching the outer surface that the stock washer makes plenty of contact. You probably won't understand what the hell I'm talking about until you see it up close. Ha ha. Didn't want to lower the car, drive it, then raise it again to put the damn panels back. Guess will go halfway, at 20 ft/lbs, if nobody else chimes in, and hope it's flat enough that doesn't need any more than that. I've even had plugs leak at 25, like my Porsche's, so had to go with the outrageously high 37 ft/lbs factory spec. But being an aluminum plug, I was VERY concerned. Ha ha. But that one had a very tight fit, not wobbly like this one. Thanks for your help anyway. Take care.

EDIT: Hey guys, just picked up the correct filter from Audi. It came with a small O-ring that I have no idea where it could go. The smaller O-ring on top of the oil filter is already fitted. And parts guy said the sealing washer on the oil filter cap that I didn't use this time (for not having a replacement washer) is metal, not an O-ring. Hopefully somebody knows. Don't want to finish the job and leave an O-ring missing. Thanks.

Two things:
-If the ECS bolt fits wobbly in the pan then don't use it. It is most likely the wrong one for the job. Go back to the original until you can at least find a properly fitting magnetic plug. Not worth the risk.
-The small O-ring that comes with the filter is indeed for the small drain plug on the oil filter cap.

**elptxjc** · 05-05-2018 02:52 PM

Originally Posted by gk1

If the ECS bolt fits wobbly in the pan then don't use it. It is most likely the wrong one for the job.

It's the correct part number. When I say 'wobbly' I mean by comparison. It's just a hair looser than factory, but all such bolts I've used never fit like factory. Therefore, you can torque them less, since there's less of the threads holding the torque. So that O-ring is for the oil cap? Stupid parts guy said the sealer for that small drain plug was metalic too. Thanks for the heads up. I didn't use it this time, but made a mess. At least I know next time it's for that purpose. No wonder the factory spec is just 4Nm, which is nothing. Definitely not enough to compress any aluminum washer. Thanks man. Need to finish now, so guess will put 20 ft/lbs and hope for the best. By the way, the 15 lf/lbs factory torque for the drain plug was torque easily to 40 ft/lbs, like it's typical. But strangely, I was bracing to find the oil cap much tighter, since it specs about 20 ft/lbs, and it wasn't tight at all, and I mean nothing. But they don't really have to be tight; I only tighten them to 15 ft/lbs, since the O-ring makes the sealing.

**s4nicetry** · 05-05-2018 03:04 PM

I've done it for decades myself and never had a leak going by feel, just make sure the contact surface is clean, if the pan is warped you have bigger issues. I always use oem plugs though, and will replace it with a new one after a certain amount of use. Even on my Porsche Turbo I go by feel on all four of the crush washers needed for an oil change and have never had a leak in any of them over the years. I've heard a number of complaints about ECS magnetic plugs once upon a time for their poor fitment and ease of stripping from being very soft. I thought the issue was straightened out long ago, but maybe not. I'd toss the plug and buy oem.

Did you get 2 o-rings? One larger for the housing cap and one smaller which sits in the bottom of the housing itself.

**gk1** · 05-05-2018 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by elptxjc

It's the correct part number. When I say 'wobbly' I mean by comparison. It's just a hair looser than factory, but all such bolts I've used never fit like factory. Therefore, you can torque them less, since there's less of the threads holding the torque. So that O-ring is for the oil cap? Stupid parts guy said the sealer for that small drain plug was metalic too. Thanks for the heads up. I didn't use it this time, but made a mess. At least I know next time it's for that purpose. No wonder the factory spec is just 4Nm, which is nothing. Definitely not enough to compress any aluminum washer. Thanks man. Need to finish now, so guess will put 20 ft/lbs and hope for the best. By the way, the 15 lf/lbs factory torque for the drain plug was torque easily to 40 ft/lbs, like it's typical. But strangely, I was bracing to find the oil cap much tighter, since it specs about 20 ft/lbs, and it wasn't tight at all, and I mean nothing. But they don't really have to be tight; I only tighten them to 15 ft/lbs, since the O-ring makes the sealing.

The factory 20Nm spec for the pan drain plug is because the oil pan is aluminum and the bolt is steel. Mangle the oil pan and that's no fun to replace. Plus as others have said no need for more than that, once the washer is crushed it's tight enough. Never had a leak. Not sure why you ever would. Also magnetic plug is not really needed. Engine will die from something else long before anything the magnet picks up could hope to prevent any damage. Maybe made more sense in the days of cast iron blocks, but the Alusil block in the S6 doesn't have any iron sleeves as such...which incidentally may be its downfall. Maybe some fine metal from the timing chain wear or from rings, but nothing the filter system wasn't designed to pick up anyway. But to each his own.

**elptxjc** · 05-05-2018 09:45 PM

Originally Posted by gk1

The factory 20Nm spec for the pan drain plug is because the oil pan is aluminum and the bolt is steel.

I was going to comment on this, so perfect timing. He he. Where the plug sits is STEEL. That's the 'weird' sandwich I mentioned. The magnetic plug attaches with ferocity to that area, but not to the rest of the pan. FYI. Porsche is aluminum, but beefier. The oilpan in a much thinner aluminum sheetmetal, rather than a casting. Anyway, the factory plug had at least 40 ft/lbs, so decided to put 25, which is the most common spec. Porsche uses 37 ft/lbs on aluminum plug and pan, which is ridiculously high IMO. Never owned a car with more than 25 ft/lbs until the Porsche. Hopefully the threads will hold over time on that ECS plug, but if I don't see much debris accumulated on the magnet next oil change, might revert back to the stock steel plug. Otherwise will try to use it until it fails, to see how beefy it is. The fit is fine, but since the plug is aluminum and the threads steel, it needs space to expand, hence being 'wobblier' than the OEM steel plug (by necessity). By the way, don't know what Audi used on my pan before (maybe during engine testing) that marked the drain plug's area much wider than the factory crush washer. After fishing the factory plug and washer from the oil container, turns out it's basically the same size as the ECS. The washer also had only about 1mm of contact after the 'serrated' stamping, so barely sealing, just like the ECS. That's why I decided on 25. With 15, or even 20, it wasn't going to crush enough to reach that flat area IMO, so went with 25. Won't know if it leaks, but really doubt it. Cleaned all the underpanels perfectly, so next time I'll know if anything leaked. The oil filter is basically impossible to install wrong; don't understand what happened with those turbo failures that said improper oil filter installation. Once you sit the filter on the cap, which 'clicks' into place with a loud noise. You really have to be a rookie not to sit it properly. After that, it's impossible to install wrong. My car will need about 9-1/2 qts to full after draining it overnight. Didn't leave the container, and even though it was barely dripping, found a lake of oil in the morning. Put about 9-1/4 qts, and it's still about 3/4 to full, but will top it off after coming from my long trip, once it's cold. Won't have time tomorrow. Hope to have luck, and suffer less damage than usual. Have a good one folks.

**goliath1** · 05-06-2018 08:09 AM

My god. 40? That’s like brake caliper torque

**elptxjc** · 05-14-2018 06:41 PM

Almost, but remember the crush washer takes a lot of the extra torque. At any rate, ALL my new cars have had the freaking drain plug (and oil filter) torqued to hell, for some reason. After torquing them to factory specs, it's cake to break them loose on subsequent oil changes.

**p3u** · 05-14-2018 06:58 PM

Two words...fluid extractor.

**elptxjc** · 05-14-2018 09:06 PM

It's much better to drain the sump IMO, due to removing all crap from the bottom of the pan (especially with the car on ramps), but to each his own. And with a drain plug under the oil filter housing, it's not a hard job at all. The underpanel is very easily removed. I'd only use a fluid extractor (I have one) if the drain plug was at the front of the pan, but fortunately it's at the rear, so when car is put on ramps, it drains properly.

**p3u** · 05-14-2018 09:09 PM

Originally Posted by elptxjc

It's much better to drain the sump IMO, due to removing all crap from the bottom of the pan (especially with the car on ramps), but to each his own. And with a drain plug under the oil filter housing, it's not a hard job at all. The underpanel is very easily removed. I'd only use a fluid extractor (I have one) if the drain plug was at the front of the pan, but fortunately it's at the rear, so when car is put on ramps, it drains properly.

If there is sediment at the bottom of your pan to drain you have bigger issues.

**elptxjc** · 05-14-2018 09:15 PM

You always going to have some 'sediments' if you don't drain oil properly (oil hot, sump has a slope for full draining, etc). But with proper OCIs and proper draining, your sump would always be clean (no sludge). Doesn't happen overnight, but not draining oil properly eventually turns the sediments into sludge. But again, to each his own.