Ticking noise under load around 2k rpm

[Mussa]

I'm experiencing a ticking noise since the apr stage 1 v2.0 tune. I can hear the ticking sound (ticky ticky ticky, like a coke can sound) occasionally only when accelerating in the last gear around 1.5-2k rpm (45 mph) and especially on slight ramps. It doesn't do it all the time and only at partial throttle. It goes away after 2-3 seconds. No cels, no other issues.
I also had a surge problem but that seemed to disappear.

Has anyone experienced this?

[pierreb]

How many miles on the turbo? Wastegate TSB performed?

[Mussa]

56k miles. The wastegate is rock solid I checked.

[pierreb]

56k miles. The wastegate is rock solid I checked.

That's not really answering the question. Is this the original OEM turbo without the wastegate actuator rod fix? If so, it's my opinion your turbo is dying, based on your symptoms and age.

[van462]

Could the tick be spark knock; the conditions mentioned, high gear/low RPM while going uphill, are the prime conditions for knock. You may try going a heat range colder on spark plugs. I prefer the copper NGK BKR7E plug pn#4644 over the fancy plugs. Copper conducts better, not only does that deliver more current for the arc but it also allows it to cool faster between sparks. This can reduce the chances of preignition.

[Mussa]

That's not really answering the question. Is this the original OEM turbo without the wastegate actuator rod fix? If so, it's my opinion your turbo is dying, based on your symptoms and age.

Yes it's the factory turbo, but what do you mean by saying turbo without the wastegate actuator rod fix? Is there an updated turbo?
Other than this noise there is no sound, whistle or anything weird.

I'm pretty sure it's something related to the new updated tune , because it started 2-3 days after installing the v2.0 apr tune. Before that I had the v1.3 and no issues.
I'm also worried if it's a detonation but I also used octane boosters, ethanol and nothing changed. So I hope it's not.

So far it may be:

Wastegate actuator rod? as you're saying
Cam follower?
N75 valve?
Piston slap?

Other opinions?

[Mussa]

Could the tick be spark knock; the conditions mentioned, high gear/low RPM while going uphill, are the prime conditions for knock. You may try going a heat range colder on spark plugs. I prefer the copper NGK BKR7E plug pn#4644 over the fancy plugs. Copper conducts better, not only does that deliver more current for the arc but it also allows it to cool faster between sparks. This can reduce the chances of preignition.

This is also something to consider, but the oem ngk pfr7s8eg (heat range 7) which i'm currently using for 10k miles they should be fine. Apr or other tuners says they're fine for stage 1/2 cars. Maybe I should try the colder heat ranged pfr8s8eg (heat range 8) platinum ones?

[pierreb]

Do you have vcds to do some logging with?

Yes the OEM turbo has been updated to include an actuator rod guide clip. Both of my B8s had to have the turbos swapped out. This is a very common issue in all of VW's 2.0t cars from that time.

[Mussa]

Do you have vcds to do some logging with?

Yes the OEM turbo has been updated to include an actuator rod guide clip. Both of my B8s had to have the turbos swapped out. This is a very common issue in all of VW's 2.0t cars from that time.

I ordered the vcds cable, on it's way.
Well I always bring the car to Audi for service, they never mentioned about a turbo update. Maybe my car has the updated version?

[seangrimes590]

My car used to make a tick-tick noise at high load / low rpm. I think it started with stage 1 (but could have been there all along), was more noticeable after going K04. I have a video of the noise, but you need to turn the sound up fairly high to hear it, the sound happens between 3 and 4 seconds in the below video:


Is your car making a noise like that (almost like a BB gun shooting aluminum cans) or is it more like a rattle?

[Mussa]

My car used to make a tick-tick noise at high load / low rpm. I think it started with stage 1 (but could have been there all along), was more noticeable after going K04. I have a video of the noise, but you need to turn the sound up fairly high to hear it, the sound happens between 3 and 4 seconds in the below video:


Is your car making a noise like that (almost like a BB gun shooting aluminum cans) or is it more like a rattle?

Yep it's definitely the exact sound i'm hearing. I'll take a video as well.

So what have you done about this? What was the culprit? It sounds scary:/

[Brandon K.]

I had that exact same problem and know that sound well! Unfortunately the ECU will not log any codes for this, although the VCDS data logging may find something. I had my car in to the Audi dealer about 5 times to fix this and they never could. I had to take it to my APR dealer and they got it 85% resolved. So keep in mind that it may not completely go away.

I believe it to be knocking myself and I have some hunches, but I will start with the solution. Everyone can weigh in on what they think.

Solution:
Put in factory speck NGK PFR7S8EG and check their gap. Factory speck is .032 but my APR dealer recommended .028 (make sure your coil packs are good)

That literally resolved it 85%.

Now for the story:
Bought the car with 60k miles and within 2 weeks of the purchase I had APR stage 1 put on. The car ran perfectly on APR v1.3 (no bad sound)

Found out 3 additional weeks later that it was an oil burner:(

Had stage 1 oil consumption performed although I had to go and have the APR software reinstalled. Version 2.0 had arrived so they put that on (still no bad sound).

Took the car in for an oil change and xx,xxx mile service at dealer a few months later (bad noise materializes!)

Took it back 4 or 5 times for them to fix it but they could not. I even let them keep it one time for 5 days so the lead mechanic could drive it to and from work and on the weekend. I also asked them to check to make sure that they had installed the correct plugs. They said everything checked out ok, but they could hear the noise. They did carbon clean, and it had no effect.

Took it back to APR dealer and he found that they had installed an alternate set of spark plugs and they did not verify gap. Two had gaps out of spec of .034 & .038

Installing and gaping the new plugs resolved the problem about 85%

At 80,000 miles I had the stage 2 oil consumption performed. There was no more oil consumption (but still had the bad sound occasionally).

At about 89k I had APR stage 2 installed the week it was released. NO MORE PINGING!..but now had a new problem. Surging under heavy torque situations form 2100 to 2700 rpm:(

I don't think the surging is harmful, but it sure is annoying. The APR is working to find a solution, but the general consensus is that it's a problem with the tune.



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[seangrimes590]

I don't really have any answers for you here. My engine popped about 3 months after putting the K04 on the car - cylinder 1 died (this seems to be a common cylinder to die). I broke off a piece of the piston top and blew the rings (shitty picture at the bottom). Upon further inspection the bore for cylinder #1 was a bit oblong, but from my not-very-expert view of things, there wasn't any significant wear on the cylinder wall so read into that what you will. New engine (about 12k miles on it now with K04) and no issues whatsoever (knock on wood), no odd sounds at high load / low rpm, though I avoid that kind of situation like I avoid the plague; it's by far the most stressful thing you can do to your engine (on a turbo'd carl) under otherwise normal driving conditions (e.g. not counting money shifts) -- specially when pushing the engine beyond manufacture specs. Now that you're tuned you need to start driving it like a 1990s turbo car instead of a NA car (in my opinion), don't mash the pedal to the floor at low rpm, hell I won't give it full boost below 3k rpm, in 3rd and up, give it plenty of time to warm up, plenty of time to cool down after a hard run.

Before you start freaking out I will say I have no evidence to say that the engine dying and the sound were related (though I agree, it's a scary and abnormal sound). A couple things that I found interesting, the original engine in the car was an absolute dog at very low rpm, say when making a slow >90* turn in 2nd gear (around 1100 - 1300rpm), it would just sit there and very slowly chug along; this was true for me stock, tuned, and with the k04. First thing I noticed about the new engine was it moved the car decently under those same low rpm / low speed conditions. Not like a v8 obviously, but not like a 1992 ford escort either. Point is, based on that and the cylinder shape I'm not convinced this wasn't an issue from day 1, if I was you I'd probably have all the cylinders scoped to see if you have any obvious issues going on.

A couple of other points, I logged the car extensively and couldn't pick up anything on the logs that changed before, during, or after the sound, though VCDS sampling frequency isn't ideal. The overall timing for the original engine was lower under all circumstances compared to the new engine (and saw higher boost to make up for it), but timing wasn't being pulled around when the sound occurred beyond normal timing pull for high-load low rpm conditions -- the few times I logged those conditions on the new engine the logs looked nearly identical. If the P3 gauge is to be believed, the EGTs were higher for the old engine when pushing it hard, which is inline with lower overall ignition timing. The engine wasn't really an oil burner, though consumption seemed to pick up a bit in the month before it died.

I could basically make the sound happen whenever I wanted, 2k rpm in 3rd though 6th, floor it and as soon as boost built to 15+ psi I'd get that sound. The sound did not appear to be temperature dependent, it would happen in 90* weather and 30* weather. It was more common when the exhaust was relatively cool, i.e. cruising along for a while then flooring it which led me down a path of checking all the exhaust hardware connections thinking that rapid thermal expansion could have been an issue -- didn't find anything there. Changed oil, plugs, coils with no change in behavior. Injector pulse looked fine so didn't bother changing them.

So unfortunately I don't really have any idea what was causing the sound, or if it was related to my engine trouble. I linked the video to APR at one point with a bunch of logs, their response was essentially 'it's hard to hear, probably surging, take it to a tuner', unfortunately the engine died a few days later before I got a chance to bring it in.

Good luck with it, I'd be cautious until you can get things fully checked out though, it's definitely an abnormal sound and it has a cause, somewhere, hopefully you have better luck figuring out just what the hell is causing it.

[Mussa]

@Brandon K.

So you're saying to gap the plugs to 0.28 right? I have the plugs you've mentioned and are gapped to 0.28. The coils and plugs were replaced 10k miles ago.
I'm really surprised that it's totally gone on stage 2, while it's there at stage 1. The surging will go away, mine did the same and now no surging.

I just need to solve this ticking noise.

[Brandon K.]

@Brandon K.

So you're saying to gap the plugs to 0.28 right? I have the plugs you've mentioned and are gapped to 0.28. The coils and plugs were replaced 10k miles ago.
I'm really surprised that it's totally gone on stage 2, while it's there at stage 1. The surging will go away, mine did the same and now no surging.

I just need to solve this ticking noise.

Yes, gap them to .028

An interesting thing about the surging on stage 2, it did not have it for at least the first few hundred miles. I have probably had the surging issue for 10k miles.


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[Mussa]

I don't really have any answers for you here. My engine popped about 3 months after putting the K04 on the car - cylinder 1 died (this seems to be a common cylinder to die). I broke off a piece of the piston top and blew the rings (shitty picture at the bottom). Upon further inspection the bore for cylinder #1 was a bit oblong, but from my not-very-expert view of things, there wasn't any significant wear on the cylinder wall so read into that what you will. New engine (about 12k miles on it now with K04) and no issues whatsoever (knock on wood), no odd sounds at high load / low rpm, though I avoid that kind of situation like I avoid the plague; it's by far the most stressful thing you can do to your engine (on a turbo'd carl) under otherwise normal driving conditions (e.g. not counting money shifts) -- specially when pushing the engine beyond manufacture specs. Now that you're tuned you need to start driving it like a 1990s turbo car instead of a NA car (in my opinion), don't mash the pedal to the floor at low rpm, hell I won't give it full boost below 3k rpm, in 3rd and up, give it plenty of time to warm up, plenty of time to cool down after a hard run.

Before you start freaking out I will say I have no evidence to say that the engine dying and the sound were related (though I agree, it's a scary and abnormal sound). A couple things that I found interesting, the original engine in the car was an absolute dog at very low rpm, say when making a slow >90* turn in 2nd gear (around 1100 - 1300rpm), it would just sit there and very slowly chug along; this was true for me stock, tuned, and with the k04. First thing I noticed about the new engine was it moved the car decently under those same low rpm / low speed conditions. Not like a v8 obviously, but not like a 1992 ford escort either. Point is, based on that and the cylinder shape I'm not convinced this wasn't an issue from day 1, if I was you I'd probably have all the cylinders scoped to see if you have any obvious issues going on.

A couple of other points, I logged the car extensively and couldn't pick up anything on the logs that changed before, during, or after the sound, though VCDS sampling frequency isn't ideal. The overall timing for the original engine was lower under all circumstances compared to the new engine (and saw higher boost to make up for it), but timing wasn't being pulled around when the sound occurred beyond normal timing pull for high-load low rpm conditions -- the few times I logged those conditions on the new engine the logs looked nearly identical. If the P3 gauge is to be believed, the EGTs were higher for the old engine when pushing it hard, which is inline with lower overall ignition timing. The engine wasn't really an oil burner, though consumption seemed to pick up a bit in the month before it died.

I could basically make the sound happen whenever I wanted, 2k rpm in 3rd though 6th, floor it and as soon as boost built to 15+ psi I'd get that sound. The sound did not appear to be temperature dependent, it would happen in 90* weather and 30* weather. It was more common when the exhaust was relatively cool, i.e. cruising along for a while then flooring it which led me down a path of checking all the exhaust hardware connections thinking that rapid thermal expansion could have been an issue -- didn't find anything there. Changed oil, plugs, coils with no change in behavior. Injector pulse looked fine so didn't bother changing them.

So unfortunately I don't really have any idea what was causing the sound, or if it was related to my engine trouble. I linked the video to APR at one point with a bunch of logs, their response was essentially 'it's hard to hear, probably surging, take it to a tuner', unfortunately the engine died a few days later before I got a chance to bring it in.

Good luck with it, I'd be cautious until you can get things fully checked out though, it's definitely an abnormal sound and it has a cause, somewhere, hopefully you have better luck figuring out just what the hell is causing it.

Thanks for the details.
I seemed to be scared a bit more now. However, last night I tried to make that sound happen again but couldn't happen, I was gonna take a video. And from now on I will not push the throttle at low rpm/high gear. This was only happening at 7 th (maybe 1-2 times the 6 th as well) gear.
I still think that although you have the new engine, if you make the conditions it will do it again. Because it's totally tune related.
I do have a brand new crate engine, it's been 10k miles. So I do not actually believe that there is any damage at all, but still I'm not comfartable living with this.
I may jump to a stage 2 tune, @Brandon K. stated that the pinging noise stopped after stage 2. So I might be going that route.

Actually APR should be doing something about, I dont think only 3 of us are experiencing this. There are thousands of A4's out there with the same tune and they must be having this sound as well.


Is there anyone having v2.0 stage 1 or 2 APR file who doesn't experience this pinging noise? I really want to here from them.

[A4x]

I have this pinging noise at high load/low RMP. APR stage 2. I notice it to be worse when outside temps are really cold, which makes mebelieve it is not engine knock. The sound is deep and throaty so sometimes I think it is drone, only at a certain RPM, boost, and load conditions.

What exhaust are you guys running? Sometimes I think it is drone...I have a non-res downpipe.

These engines are never supposed to knock. They have knock sensors and will pull timing or cut boost to prevent it. Unless APR has done something with the sensors...

I'm running NGK PFR7 plugs @ 0.032. Going to try 8's @ 0.028 and a TR8 intercooler soon. Maybe it will help if it truly is engine knock.

[Mussa]

I have this pinging noise at high load/low RMP. APR stage 2. I notice it to be worse when outside temps are really cold, which makes mebelieve it is not engine knock. The sound is deep and throaty so sometimes I think it is drone, only at a certain RPM, boost, and load conditions.

What exhaust are you guys running? Sometimes I think it is drone...I have a non-res downpipe.

These engines are never supposed to knock. They have knock sensors and will pull timing or cut boost to prevent it. Unless APR has done something with the sensors...

I'm running NGK PFR7 plugs @ 0.032. Going to try 8's @ 0.028 and a TR8 intercooler soon. Maybe it will help if it truly is engine knock.

Did you watch the video above for the noise? You have the same noise right?

That noise definitely comes from the front. I'm more inclined to believe that it is a pinging sound rather than an exhaust. I have everything stock. I have the 3.0 tdi fmic and use PFR7S8EG plugs gapped with .028

[pierreb]

I went through apr stg1 stg2 and now k04. Never had a pinging noise. Audi did have to replace mine and many original turbos due to bad wastegate actuator rod engineering.

[Brandon K.]

I have this pinging noise at high load/low RMP. APR stage 2. I notice it to be worse when outside temps are really cold, which makes mebelieve it is not engine knock. The sound is deep and throaty so sometimes I think it is drone, only at a certain RPM, boost, and load conditions.

What exhaust are you guys running? Sometimes I think it is drone...I have a non-res downpipe.

These engines are never supposed to knock. They have knock sensors and will pull timing or cut boost to prevent it. Unless APR has done something with the sensors...

I'm running NGK PFR7 plugs @ 0.032. Going to try 8's @ 0.028 and a TR8 intercooler soon. Maybe it will help if it truly is engine knock.

I think the vast majority of people with the stage 1 don't have the problem. If they did, there would be a lot more complaints on the boards about it.

Originally I had believed that It was a combination of the tune and the high oil consumption together. Knowing that oil contamination in the combustion camber will lower the octane value of the mix. It did not seem to change this condition for my car when the stage 2 oil consumption was done. However, the car's sound at idle was very different after the repair. It had been sounding almost identical to a TDI motor. I had assumed that was normal due the the direct injection. After the repair It still sounds different than other cars at idle but not like a diesel anymore.

Here is a video that will explain what I believe is going on inside the combustion chamber at those heavy load conditions and why the ECU's knock sensor can't fix it.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=soJea7xEt-8

One of the reasons the APR stage 2 may have help is that the high flow cat offers better cylinder evacuation and likely some heat reduction. Both of these would reduce the likelihood of preignition.

[Mussa]

Here's another guy with the same exact problem: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...ge-1-version-2

He says he solved it by adding 100 octane fuel. A 91 octane tune shouldn't be requesting 100 octane fuel. If that's the issue than i'm really disappointed with APR.

[A4x]

I also ran a half tank of 100 octane and it didnt change the knocking/pinging/deep throaty metallic noise from the engine. Also like I said it seems worse with colder outside temps (like 20 F) which makes me believe it is not engine knock.

I stil have to verify the sound my engine makes is the same as yours. Any more videos out there?

Like I said I think it may be drone. I did watch the video above but the noise quality is really shit and I couldnt hear anything. I'll give it another try when I get home tonight.

It is definitely not turbo wastgate. I just got a new turbo 5k miles ago because of the wastegate. I know that noise well and it still haunts my dreams.

Also, if it is engine knock, could it be a result of carbon build up on the intake valves? Have your valves ever been cleaned and how many miles? I think my car is due for a good clean. I had stage 1 oil consumption fixed 1.5 years ago and my consumption has been great ever since.

One thing to try is put the car in 91 octane mode or even stock mode. I havn't tried this yet, always run on 93.

[pierreb]

Log. The. Car.

[Mussa]

I also ran a half tank of 100 octane and it didnt change the knocking/pinging/deep throaty metallic noise from the engine. Also like I said it seems worse with colder outside temps (like 20 F) which makes me believe it is not engine knock.

I stil have to verify the sound my engine makes is the same as yours. Any more videos out there?

Like I said I think it may be drone. I did watch the video above but the noise quality is really shit and I couldnt hear anything. I'll give it another try when I get home tonight.

It is definitely not turbo wastgate. I just got a new turbo 5k miles ago because of the wastegate. I know that noise well and it still haunts my dreams.

Also, if it is engine knock, could it be a result of carbon build up on the intake valves? Have your valves ever been cleaned and how many miles? I think my car is due for a good clean. I had stage 1 oil consumption fixed 1.5 years ago and my consumption has been great ever since.

One thing to try is put the car in 91 octane mode or even stock mode. I havn't tried this yet, always run on 93.

It's much noticeable when you listen with a headphone, starting from the 3rd sec. The noise that I have is coming from underneath the engine hood.
I have a brand new engine with only 10k miles on it. Carbon buildup is meaningless for me. And even if I had carbon build up, it doesn't make sense only starting to have this noise just after v2.0 tune.
I ran both 91 and 93 files, no difference. Added octane boosters, ethanol no help.

[seangrimes590]

I have this pinging noise at high load/low RMP. APR stage 2. I notice it to be worse when outside temps are really cold, which makes mebelieve it is not engine knock. The sound is deep and throaty so sometimes I think it is drone, only at a certain RPM, boost, and load conditions.

What exhaust are you guys running? Sometimes I think it is drone...I have a non-res downpipe.

These engines are never supposed to knock. They have knock sensors and will pull timing or cut boost to prevent it. Unless APR has done something with the sensors...

I'm running NGK PFR7 plugs @ 0.032. Going to try 8's @ 0.028 and a TR8 intercooler soon. Maybe it will help if it truly is engine knock.

I got the ticking noise on stage 1 with a completely stock exhaust system, also got what appeared to be the same exact sound later with a Eurocode HFC and K04. I don't think what I was hearing has anything to do with the exhaust system.

Regarding the engines not knocking...That's not really how it works, the knock sensors prevent sustained knocking, or can help mitigate 'severe' detonation by picking up on 'mild' detonation and pulling back on the timing / boost, or dumping in fuel. However, that doesn't really help at all if the ECU is calling for significantly more boost or timing than what it should be calling for during specific high load conditions -- like when you're trying to push 25psi into a 2 liter engine in a 4 thousand pound car at 2k rpm. It's just exceptionally stressful on the internals of an engine and can lead to severe detonation without any real warning that the knock sensors can pick up on. Note, this is really just an example, I have no idea how any of the tunes or stock mapping calibrate the ECU and given the lack of consistent engine failures it seems unreasonable to assume that the tuners are doing something universally wrong during that RPM range. However it's perfectly reasonable that there's an occasional underlying defect that is within tolerances for stock power levels but shows itself only when you put the engine in the most stressful environment it can find itself while also upping the power you're asking it to make.

[seangrimes590]

Thanks for the details.
I seemed to be scared a bit more now. However, last night I tried to make that sound happen again but couldn't happen, I was gonna take a video. And from now on I will not push the throttle at low rpm/high gear. This was only happening at 7 th (maybe 1-2 times the 6 th as well) gear.
I still think that although you have the new engine, if you make the conditions it will do it again. Because it's totally tune related.
I do have a brand new crate engine, it's been 10k miles. So I do not actually believe that there is any damage at all, but still I'm not comfartable living with this.
I may jump to a stage 2 tune, @Brandon K. stated that the pinging noise stopped after stage 2. So I might be going that route.

Actually APR should be doing something about, I dont think only 3 of us are experiencing this. There are thousands of A4's out there with the same tune and they must be having this sound as well.


Is there anyone having v2.0 stage 1 or 2 APR file who doesn't experience this pinging noise? I really want to here from them.

I've tried pushing the new engine to get the same noise from it and can't. However, I'm on a different tune now. Once the new engine was broken in I moved from version 3.0 to version 3.1 (or whatever it is) on the K04 tune that resolves the 3.5k rpm hesitation that was felt when the valve profile changes over. I didn't push the engine in the low rpm / high load range when I was on version 3.0, and since moving to 3.1 I can't get the sound at any RPM or load range. I agree that it's related to the tune, but I'm not convinced that it's specific to the APR tune, rather it could simply be an issue with the additional power. Those conditions are just really stressful on an engine, in the evo / sti / other 4 banger tuning worlds one of the first pieces of advice you get it not pushing full boost under 3 - 3.5k rpm in 3rd - Nth gear because of the potential for catastrophic detonation. Now one could assume APR is more careful than what you might find in the evo world but it's certainly not an assumption I'm going to make going forward...downshift and get into the power instead of playing the low rpm torque game that you can when stock.

[A4x]

Well this is a fucking scary thread. Glad I just dropped $800 on an APR tune if this truely is severe detonation (in October so I can't return it).

Im on NGK 7 heat plugs at 0.032. All the more reason to go to 8s at 0.028 and get the TR8 intercooler on. Both of these should help if it is knock and I will report back after I do this.

So if it is knock, it should be eliminated by switching to the 91 octane tune but running 93 gas? Why does this sound not go away when running 100 octane gas? Why do I notice it to be worse/louder when outside temps are colder? That should help the engine knock.

Why can people not pick up any timing retard or boost release when logging during these sounds? I remember from other threads about this people have claimed they logged these parameters but found nothing. Actually maybe that is the hesitation issue @ 3k rpm when the valvelift actuates.

[seangrimes590]

Well this is a fucking scary thread. Glad I just dropped $800 on an APR tune if this truely is severe detonation (in October so I can't return it).

Im on NGK 7 heat plugs at 0.032. All the more reason to go to 8s at 0.028 and get the TR8 intercooler on. Both of these should help if it is knock and I will report back after I do this.

So if it is knock, it should be eliminated by switching to the 91 octane tune but running 93 gas? Why does this sound not go away when running 100 octane gas? Why do I notice it to be worse/louder when outside temps are colder? That should help the engine knock.

Why can people not pick up any timing retard or boost release when logging during these sounds? I remember from other threads about this people have claimed they logged these parameters but found nothing. Actually maybe that is the hesitation issue @ 3k rpm when the valvelift actuates.

I logged the car fairly extensively and didn't pick up anything that looked significantly abnormal compared to logs posted here and from golfmk6 forum postings. Timing on our version of the engine seems to overall be lower than on the VW side of things, however timing pull from knock sensor readings looked consistent, if not a bit better on my logs vs most GTI logs.

Typically the timing angle in the rpm / load range in question would drop to -3 requested then rise to -1.5, 0, 0.5, then climb fairly rapidly as RPMs rose -- pretty standard for a turbo engine from the research I did looking into this. Knock sensors would give me the occasional -1.5 --> -2.3 retardation around 2.7k rpm at full load. So I'm not sure if that counts as seeing anything in the logs or not but it's a hell of a lot less retardation than I see floating around on GTI logs. For my car specifically I routinely saw timing retardation in cylinder 1 that was greater than the other cylinders, this was most apparent while cruising down the highway as the ECU searched for the most efficient (i.e. most advanced) timing angle...cylinder 1 always seemed to hold the others back.

I don't think I'd worry about it too much if I was you -- your symptoms don't really sound like detonation to me. Like you said, detonation should be less of an issue with colder temps and if the symptoms remain exactly the same with 100 octane fuel on 93/91 map then it's not detonation. The car won't detonate on 100 octane fuel and the 93 map unless you have a fuel supply issue or something else that should otherwise be causing you very noticeable problems. It'd be great if you could get a recording of what you're hearing and post it, based on your description it sounds a bit like compressor surge, do you have the stock intake or something else? My car surges in 3rd / 4th at 3k rpm 75% - 100% throttle when it's cold out, still does it when it's hot but not nearly as much.

I'm not worried at all with my new engine and the K04 (knock on wood, again). I drive the hell out of the car at least once a day. I say this because I never saw anything in the logs that indicated imminent failure, nothing that looked bad, nothing that people with a lot more experience than myself said "oh shit, you've got a problem there." In my opinion the most likely cause of my issue was an underlying defect that manifested itself with the extra power and stress. With that said, it doesn't mean there isn't occasional detonation going on, the damage to my piston and rings is consistent with detonation, but perhaps that damage only happened because of the oddly shaped cylinder bore put additional stresses on the rings and cylinder edge. There's a lot more information over on the golfmk6 forums, a lot of it is more technical with real explanations about what's going on internally with logs to back it up...I got a lot of good info there and a lot of help in looking through the logs. Might be good to check it out and see what they have to say.

[A4x]

My car used to make a tick-tick noise at high load / low rpm. I think it started with stage 1 (but could have been there all along), was more noticeable after going K04. I have a video of the noise, but you need to turn the sound up fairly high to hear it, the sound happens between 3 and 4 seconds in the below video:


Is your car making a noise like that (almost like a BB gun shooting aluminum cans) or is it more like a rattle?

I turned my volume all the way up, lots of wind noise, but I did hear the ticking. It sounds totally different than my car. Yours is more of a high pitched like birds on a tin roof sound. Mine is kind of throaty, deep, but with some knock/ping to it. Like we've been over, I think it is a bit of drone. I will try to get a video of it but it might take a few days.

[Mussa]

I'll be applying this hopefully by the end of the week: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...52519-6931.pdf

Let's see if this is the issue...

Today I tried to repeat the conditions, I heard only a minor ticking sound . However there was also some vibration inside the car around the passenger side. Hoping it's the wastegate rod rattle rather than a piston ping.

[Mussa]

The spring clip for the wastegate actuator rod arrived today. Will get it installed tomorrow hopefully. Let's see what changes.

[hanyoung]

Any updates? I get the same ticking. Apr stage 2. Colder plugs. New coils. Always under load at 1.5 to 2k although not all the time. I get surging as well. Sounds almost like a screw banging around on the driver front or rear wheel well.

[Mussa]

Any updates? I get the same ticking. Apr stage 2. Colder plugs. New coils. Always under load at 1.5 to 2k although not all the time. I get surging as well. Sounds almost like a screw banging around on the driver front or rear wheel well.

I've attached the spring clip, but that wasn't the issue. The wastegate actuator rod wasn't moving. Nevertheless i'm more confident about the turbo now.

I listened to that ticking noise very carefully and it definitely comes right infront of me. It's not a pinging sound. I also got the opportunity to catch the sound while taking logs and no trace of timing pulls.

This ticking noise must be related with something that is making a rattle while the boost comes in. I haven't found absolute solutions to this but have read a thread that mentions about a metal sound coming from the driver side and the culprit turned out to be a cover of a bevel box.
Also another culprit i've read was the fuel lines hitting eachother under certain load. Maybe we need to look at these whether or not it solves this.

I also have to mention that I don't here this sound as often as before and surging is 99% gone.

[Brandon K.]

The ticking never returned after stage 2.

On a side note, the surging stoped a few weeks ago after it was switched to the stock tune then back to the 93 octane tune. The surging is without a doubt related to the adaptation when stage 2. The bizarre thing is that the last 3 or 4 times I switched tunes, the surging always came back.


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[hanyoung]

Mussa - thanks for all your hard work! Good to hear it wasn't the turbo.

[hanyoung]

Maybe tensioner?

I brought the car to the dealer for an intermittent low rpm (1.5-2.5K) ticking sound under load. My car is a 2012 Avant that was special ordered, and delivered in Nov 2011. They looked at the timing tensioner and it was the old model, which they replaced to the new model for preventative maintenance. I hope that this will make the intermittent ticking sound go away, but I thought after reading these timing tensioner threads that it would be good prevention. They charged me $600 total for labor and parts. I'm also stage 2 APR.