Push to Start Issue? Official Extended Slave Cylinder Thread (aka Ghetto Spacer Fix)

[NixonKB]

Jbullin2 is the man. :) Helped me solve my push to start issue temporarily, with long term fix enroute. The slave is EASY to access - don't be afraid to do this mod!

[Sunhilda]

Just to confirm what is already known:

JBullin’s extended slaves are legit. Had the clutch/start issue 20k miles ago, along with a timing chain issue. Replaced clutch at that time (@150k miles) and clutch start issue stopped, until about a month ago when it resumed and even worse than the first time.

I contacted JBullin late on a Thursday night, and he had a slave in the mail the following morning, and it arrived that Monday - he was easy and a pleasure to work with, and stands by his product.

The result: Slave is in and the issue is GONE. Clutch feel is great and the car is back to being a problem free rocket. I got so used to having the clutch buried in the floor board to start, and have tried multiple times with the clutch NOT depressed to the floor, and she still fires up immediately, first try,

I highly recommend this mod, and highly recommend Jay. Great guy, great product, great fix.

[DrGT]

Exact same comment / experience here. Very satisfied.
New slave installed for about a month. Problem never came back.
I still have to learn not to push the clutch through the floor ;-)

Just to confirm what is already known:

JBullin’s extended slaves are legit. Had the clutch/start issue 20k miles ago, along with a timing chain issue. Replaced clutch at that time (@150k miles) and clutch start issue stopped, until about a month ago when it resumed and even worse than the first time.

I contacted JBullin late on a Thursday night, and he had a slave in the mail the following morning, and it arrived that Monday - he was easy and a pleasure to work with, and stands by his product.

The result: Slave is in and the issue is GONE. Clutch feel is great and the car is back to being a problem free rocket. I got so used to having the clutch buried in the floor board to start, and have tried multiple times with the clutch NOT depressed to the floor, and she still fires up immediately, first try,

I highly recommend this mod, and highly recommend Jay. Great guy, great product, great fix.

[flightlessgreeb]

Just wanted to post a thank you to JBullin! I took the part in to my local shop and they completely didn't believe me that it would fix my issue. They were convinced I was wasting time/money because the hall effect sensor is in the master not the slave. idk if it's because I'm a woman or w/e but I stood my ground and had them install the part and it completely fixed the issue! The master tech apologized to me when I went to pick the car up and only charged me a diagnostic fee to do the install.

Its been raining a lot lately and I don't have a garage plus I'm not super mechanically inclined etc etc thats my excuse for not doing the work myself lol

Anyway thanks again!

[Jay@JXB]

Just wanted to post a thank you to JBullin! I took the part in to my local shop and they completely didn't believe me that it would fix my issue. They were convinced I was wasting time/money because the hall effect sensor is in the master not the slave. idk if it's because I'm a woman or w/e but I stood my ground and had them install the part and it completely fixed the issue! The master tech apologized to me when I went to pick the car up and only charged me a diagnostic fee to do the install.

Its been raining a lot lately and I don't have a garage plus I'm not super mechanically inclined etc etc thats my excuse for not doing the work myself lol

Anyway thanks again!

That’s an awesome story. Can’t tell you how many times I’ve had to talk to X shop/dealer tech directly to convince them to install the part in the customers car. “Yes I promise it will work” haha. Good for you holding your ground with them, bet they felt like a bunch of fools haha.


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[BlackJon]

Amazing stuff here

Drive It Like You Stole It

[OHIO_S4]

What pressure should I use during the bleed process?

My start/stop issue is so bad now at 125k miles that I even have trouble now during the summer weather.

Just bought the slave cylinder and a bleeder.

[Jay@JXB]

Use about 3-5 psi. You don’t need too much.


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[OHIO_S4]

Use about 3-5 psi. You don’t need too much.


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Thank you. That was my order from last night, lol.

[Stuart little]

Is this 3-5PSI referring to the pressure of the air compressor tank? I ask as I ordered up a power bleeder and it says the PSI in requirement is 90-120PSI. Thanks ahead of time, going to try to install this extended slave I just got in the mail!

[Jay@JXB]

Is this 3-5PSI referring to the pressure of the air compressor tank? I ask as I ordered up a power bleeder and it says the PSI in requirement is 90-120PSI. Thanks ahead of time, going to try to install this extended slave I just got in the mail!

Yes 3-5 psi in the tank. Most of us use a hand-pump pressure bleeder.


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[OHIO_S4]

Ended up having the switch replaced at the dealer.

The charge was 2.2 hours including a brake fluid flush.

[Jay@JXB]

@nasif your messages are full can’t respond to your PM. Reach out at [email protected]


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[Senseless]

Coming up on 3 years of flawless operation with Jay's fix, now at 110,000 miles on the original clutch. I almost dropped $3000 to replace the clutch at 75,000 miles; damn. This problem should have been addressed earlier by the OEM, but at least there's a solution. Thanks again, Jay!

[madoku]

[mention]jbullin2 [/mention] I’m sure you do great work, but you can’t just ship stuff like this and charge people $120



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[Jay@JXB]

[mention]jbullin2 [/mention] I’m sure you do great work, but you can’t just ship stuff like this and charge people $120



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Sorry it arrived like that; it's definitely not typical for USPS to damage shipments like that.

I would like to respond to the "charge people $120 comment". Most people (myself included until I started doing it) don't realize the true cost of a product like this, so I'll break it down:

Sachs SH6514 slave cylinder - $55 and nobody ever has enough in stock so I bounce around from one seller to the next to get enough.
Length of tube - $2 of material plus shipping
Shipping - $4 because it weighs just under 8oz. With another box it would be $1 for the box and $2 more to the shipping cost.
PayPal fees - 3% = $3.60

Total $64.60 or $67.60 with another box.

Time:
Unpackage slave, unbox - 2 mins
Cut the tube to length and chamfer edges - 2 mins
Cut the rod in half, slide into sleeve, make 4 crimps - 3 mins
Repackage - 1 min
Print shipping label and apply, send tracking, mark order fulfilled through website, transfer money from paypal to bank account - 5 min

Total: 13 mins, probably closer to 15 with getting things set up, shopping around for companies that actually have slaves in stock at reasonable prices.

Here's the big one though. Explaining to everybody how this thing works. I used to spend at least an average of 20 mins, sometimes hours, walking people through why their car isn't starting, exactly how the whole hydraulic system interacts with the start switch in the master cylinder, how the geometry changes over time, and then how to actually install it, and troubleshooting when they're having problems bleeding the system (also you wouldn't believe the number of people that lead me down rabbitholes saying the car still won't start and it turns out they did a slave line install at the same time and knocked the sensor loose in the master cylinder). Now I at least have a website to point to with some good information to save my thumbs. On top of that, I'm now the resident clutch system expert (somehow lol), and I field tons of unrelated questions every time something's wrong with someone's clutch. I always answer questions, and I never ignore people. Most of the time those interactions don't lead to a sale.

So at the end I'm left with $55 to show for anywhere from 15 minutes to well over an hour of time on a $120 product, and that money is taxed of course too. If you asked any of the big companies if they'd bother with a product like this knowing the time commitment, they'd tell you you're out of your mind. Resellers want at least 30% just to do customer service and fulfill orders. Companies like ECS and 034 are clearing 50-70% on their own products, without nearly the time commitment of a product like this.

TL:DR, I'll consider double boxing them. The slave is very robust and would be very hard to break in the box unless a seriously heavy sharp thing was placed on it. It's too light to hurt itself. If there is damage, I'd certainly replace it no questions asked. To date I haven't had an issue with product damage.

Sorry to go on my soapbox; this is the first thing I ever did to push this platform, and it's very dear to my heart. It's not worth my time from an accounting standpoint, but it's a huge benefit to the community (who often is faced with the option of this or a new clutch), which has shown me fantastic support the last 7 years while I built my car from bone stock to one of the fastest autocross cars in the country, and more recently supported my JXB Performance endeavors. I'm going to keep doing everything I can to keep people clutch problem free :)

-Jay-

[madoku]

Sorry it arrived like that; it's definitely not typical for USPS to damage shipments like that.

I would like to respond to the "charge people $120 comment". Most people (myself included until I started doing it) don't realize the true cost of a product like this, so I'll break it down:

Sachs SH6514 slave cylinder - $55 and nobody ever has enough in stock so I bounce around from one seller to the next to get enough.
Length of tube - $2 of material plus shipping
Shipping - $4 because it weighs just under 8oz. With another box it would be $1 for the box and $2 more to the shipping cost.
PayPal fees - 3% = $3.60

Total $64.60 or $67.60 with another box.

Time:
Unpackage slave, unbox - 2 mins
Cut the tube to length and chamfer edges - 2 mins
Cut the rod in half, slide into sleeve, make 4 crimps - 3 mins
Repackage - 1 min
Print shipping label and apply, send tracking, mark order fulfilled through website, transfer money from paypal to bank account - 5 min

Total: 13 mins, probably closer to 15 with getting things set up, shopping around for companies that actually have slaves in stock at reasonable prices.

Here's the big one though. Explaining to everybody how this thing works. I used to spend at least an average of 20 mins, sometimes hours, walking people through why their car isn't starting, exactly how the whole hydraulic system interacts with the start switch in the master cylinder, how the geometry changes over time, and then how to actually install it, and troubleshooting when they're having problems bleeding the system (also you wouldn't believe the number of people that lead me down rabbitholes saying the car still won't start and it turns out they did a slave line install at the same time and knocked the sensor loose in the master cylinder). Now I at least have a website to point to with some good information to save my thumbs. On top of that, I'm now the resident clutch system expert (somehow lol), and I field tons of unrelated questions every time something's wrong with someone's clutch. I always answer questions, and I never ignore people. Most of the time those interactions don't lead to a sale.

So at the end I'm left with $55 to show for anywhere from 15 minutes to well over an hour of time on a $120 product, and that money is taxed of course too. If you asked any of the big companies if they'd bother with a product like this knowing the time commitment, they'd tell you you're out of your mind. Resellers want at least 30% just to do customer service and fulfill orders. Companies like ECS and 034 are clearing 50-70% on their own products, without nearly the time commitment of a product like this.

TL:DR, I'll consider double boxing them. The slave is very robust and would be very hard to break in the box unless a seriously heavy sharp thing was placed on it. It's too light to hurt itself. If there is damage, I'd certainly replace it no questions asked. To date I haven't had an issue with product damage.

Sorry to go on my soapbox; this is the first thing I ever did to push this platform, and it's very dear to my heart. It's not worth my time from an accounting standpoint, but it's a huge benefit to the community (who often is faced with the option of this or a new clutch), which has shown me fantastic support the last 7 years while I built my car from bone stock to one of the fastest autocross cars in the country, and more recently supported my JXB Performance endeavors. I'm going to keep doing everything I can to keep people clutch problem free :)

-Jay-

Definitely didn't mean anything by the $120 comment, the main thing I wanted to convey here was the poor packaging and I would not have any problems paying more for the peace of mind knowing my package is secured properly - hell I'd pay the OEM price of $180+ without a second thought considering these things should last years. You clearly spent a lot of time creating this business, making a professional website with high quality products, and created a streamlined ordering experience, but all that hard work is thrown out the window when a customer receives their product in such a state.

With that said, the slave cylinder works well and I appreciate the efforts that went into fixing this problem; thank you!

[Scoop149]

Hi Jay, I am a new member experiencing this issue and wanted to inquire on how to purchase one of these.

[Jay@JXB]

Hi Jay, I am a new member experiencing this issue and wanted to inquire on how to purchase one of these.

Sent you a PM.


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[Jay@JXB]

Hi Jay, I am a new member experiencing this issue and wanted to inquire on how to purchase one of these.

They’re at jxbperformance.com


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[greenturbo]

They’re at jxbperformance.com


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Just ordered one, thanks Jay!

[Callandor]

Cross-posting this if you guys are in there messing with the slave:

Guys, just wanted to share an experience with my stainless steel USP line to avoid you getting stranded like I did.

O-ring failed on clutch line where it meets the slave. I pulled the line out and found that the o-rings had completely degraded after 10K miles.

I found that USP uses Viton (type of material) for their o-ring. Based on my research, Viton is NOT compatible with DOT4 fluid. I replaced it with a 010 (.375" OD, .25" ID) size EPDM o-ring.

Just a heads up, you may want to have a spare o-ring around. I am not saying that the improper material caused my failure, and maybe something else in my system did. Truthfully I had some indication a few days before hand (slow leak, clutch got much softer), before total failure but I was lazy getting under the car.

$0.03 part can leave you stranded. Something like this: https://www.grainger.com/product/FAB...ard-EPDM-1WND7

[Austinjross]

I didn't see if anyone had asked this already but would an extended slave be good for preventive maintenance? I'm not having any starting issues but I am about to do a clutch and lightweight flywheel job and I'm trying to decide if I should do this at the same time too

[Jay@JXB]

Yes, a lot of people replace them to restore smooth pedal feel and prevent the push to start issue. A lot of aftermarket clutches will cause it, but there’s generally no way to tell until it’s installed.


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[jimrobbington]

Yup, it's a cheap way to avoid trouble in the long run imo

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[evanstonjohn]

Yup, it's a cheap way to avoid trouble in the long run imo

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Just a shout out to Jay who sells this solution. Worked like a charm and worth every penny and probably more. No more struggling and burying the clutch to get it started. Thanks

[RDMW13]

Hey guys, I’ve been experiencing this issue since I replaced my gearbox and I had my clutch replaced by Audi back in February.

Whilst I understand the reasoning behind using the extended slave, and clearly have plenty of testimonials in this thread that show it fixes the issue, I always come back to the same question that I can’t seem to get an answer to no matter who I ask or which thread I read:

Why did this issue not exist prior to Audi replacing my clutch?

I never had the issue in the 50k+ miles I drove my A5, from 55k to 105k miles. I took it to Audi and had a new OEM clutch + DMF put back in and Audi gave me back the car with this issue. I can’t get my head round WHY. What changed?!

[Krusty]

Hey guys, I’ve been experiencing this issue since I replaced my gearbox and I had my clutch replaced by Audi back in February.

Whilst I understand the reasoning behind using the extended slave, and clearly have plenty of testimonials in this thread that show it fixes the issue, I always come back to the same question that I can’t seem to get an answer to no matter who I ask or which thread I read:

Why did this issue not exist prior to Audi replacing my clutch?

I never had the issue in the 50k+ miles I drove my A5, from 55k to 105k miles. I took it to Audi and had a new OEM clutch + DMF put back in and Audi gave me back the car with this issue. I can’t get my head round WHY. What changed?!

Don't have the answer for you, however, I can tell you that extended slave rod is the permanent fix.

[RoseJ22]

Jay, You still selling these? If so PM me price shipped to 24370. Thanks!

[JudeA5Quattro]

Hey guys, I’ve been experiencing this issue since I replaced my gearbox and I had my clutch replaced by Audi back in February.

Whilst I understand the reasoning behind using the extended slave, and clearly have plenty of testimonials in this thread that show it fixes the issue, I always come back to the same question that I can’t seem to get an answer to no matter who I ask or which thread I read:

Why did this issue not exist prior to Audi replacing my clutch?

I never had the issue in the 50k+ miles I drove my A5, from 55k to 105k miles. I took it to Audi and had a new OEM clutch + DMF put back in and Audi gave me back the car with this issue. I can’t get my head round WHY. What changed?!

Hi Everybody,
I am new to the forum - this is my first post! - As the clutch pedal started to sometimes only come back half way and having changed the clutch master and slave cylinders but with this not solving the problem - I just had my 2007 Audi A5 3.0 TDI Quattro 240HP CAPA engine with my mechanic for the last couple of days and he installed a new OEN Luk clutch kit and fly wheel along with the Clutch Fork Kit -0B1 141 719 K - My Mechanic informed me that he didn't install the new ball stud or plastic intermediate piece as the ball stud included in the fork kit was about a centimetre longer than the original and the original ball stud and intermediate piece was still in very good shape - having completed the job he could not get the car to start - I informed him that I had read about the TSB
30 13 18 2028229/2 and forwarded details on to him where it discusses:
Customer may report that the vehicle does not start or only starts when the clutch pedal is pressed very firmly.
The message “Press clutch pedal to start vehicle” may appear in the instrument cluster.
..And I went to the workshop to see if I could help - To my mechanics surprise and relief, I was able to get the car started with a very firm press of the clutch pedal and we then followed the following procedure from the TSB:
Check the clutch hydraulics and electrics as follows:
Depress the clutch pedal to the perceived end stop.
While the clutch pedal is depressed, have a second technician open the bleeder screw on the clutch slave cylinder.
If the clutch pedal can now be moved further and the vehicle can be started, or if the message in the instrument cluster goes out, the sender of the clutch mechanism is correct. The issue is clutch mechanism wear; see the ElsaWeb Repair Manual for instructions. Do not replace the clutch master cylinder or slave cylinder, as doing so will not resolve this condition.
I was able to feel the additional movement in the pedal mentioned above as my mechanic had the bleeding port open which he then shut and I was then able to start the car a few times in a row on the lift but still with a relatively hard press on the clutch pedal - It was getting late and I had to leave the work shop - later my mechanic informed me that he had put the rest of the parts back etc... and could start the car to drive it out of the work shop but still with a very hard press on the clutch pedal! - I never had an issue starting the car before this clutch job - any ideas how to resolve this issue? - do you know if he should have installed the new longer ball stud and plastic intermediate piece supplied in the kit instead of the original parts? -
Also I am reading in the forum and getting conflicting answers regarding the slave cylinder rod - some people say extending the slave rod length will remove start problems while others are saying shortening the slave rod slightly may remove starting problems???? - Can you please advise which would be correct in my situation?

Sorry for the long post but we are stumped! - any help is greatly appreciated?

Best regards and thank you for any help you can provide!

Jude.

[Sleeper Sedan]

Jay, I'm looking for one as well. Changed the slave under warranty 3 years ago, Changed to USP stainless steel lines 1 year ago, had the push button issue last year then it resolved, and now its back requiring even more pressure all the way to the floor to start the car.

Shipped to 33067. Thanks!

[RoseJ22]

www.jxbperformance.com for all future needs.

[RockJGC]

This is a great thread. I'm actually considering going the other way and slightly shortening my slave cylinder rod. Here's why---A few months ago I installed a SouthBend Stage 2 clutch along with an OEM dual mass flywheel. Everything works perfectly and the clutch feels exactly like stock. But that's the problem--I never really liked the high engagement point on my stock clutch in the first place. I prefer an engagement point that is more toward the middle of the clutch pedal travel rather than engaging toward the top of the pedal travel. And when I installed the Southbend unit, it behaved exactly like the OEM clutch, engaging way up high in the clutch pedal travel.

So my idea is to remove the slave cylinder rod and shorten it by a few millimeters. The theory is that I will change the engagement point of the clutch to be a little lower in the clutch pedal travel. My only real concern is that I'd end up causing issues getting the car to start like everyone is describing here. But I don't have any issues whatsoever now, so maybe I'll be okay.

Thoughts?

[SteveYem]

In my 2015 S4 6MT I had a stainless clutch line installed a few years ago and I'm pretty sure that's the point when the car became more difficult to shift. And it may be placebo but it seems like the clutch doesn't fully disengage unless I get the pedal all the way down to the floor. One indicator of this (I think??) is that when I am looking at the instantaneous gas mileage readout, if I shift 'normally' as far as clutch pedal travel is concerned, the readout does not change when I shift; however if I very deliberately push the pedal literally as far as it will go, the readout will momentarily go to ' - - ' (no reading) while I shift, and then resume reading out a value when I get into the next gear.
I have also notice that there is apparent lag in the throttle response, regardless of drive select mode, when I start to give it gas while letting the clutch pedal out, i.e. when starting out in 1st gear from a stop. I am wondering if the ECU is reading the clutch position from the Hall effect sensor in the master cylinder (and someone please correct me if I am making any of this up) and it's not getting the reading it wants, thereby affecting throttle response? This may also be placebo but it seems that if I very deliberately mash the clutch as far as it will go (hurting my foot) then the throttle response is more immediate as I would expect it to be - but if I start out with the clutch pedal in a more normal position applying a civilized amount of force to it, i.e. not putting a dent in the floor board, this throttle hesitation exists.

So - I've been dealing with it for a few years and it really saps the driving experience. Any idea whether the extended slave cylinder would solve any of these issues? Or does this sound indicative of hydraulic lines that need to be bled? Or Both?

To clarify, I have never experienced the "push to start" issue, and all things considered I don't wail on this car so at 76k miles currently I doubt the root issue is a worn/failing clutch, also considering that these symptoms started at around 40k miles.

[greenturbo]

For slow throttle response just get a pedalbox or Sprintbooster

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[SteveYem]

For slow throttle response just get a pedalbox or Sprintbooster

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Slow may not be the right word - it may be more an issue of how far I have to push the gas pedal until I get any throttle activity. I would estimate that within the first 1/4" of travel of the pedal, nothing happens. Maybe that's a separate issue - in any case, I have a stage 1 tune so I don't think I'd want to stack something like a Sprintbooster on top of that. It also does seem that there is still a clutch engagement point vs. pedal position issue, maybe mutually exclusive from a throttle mapping issue which only makes the clutch engagement issue more noticeable.

[WettRally]

The extended slave will not fix a self adjusting issue rather a clutch replacement would fix that? Right now my car will not start and I am getting "push to start" message. I have stock clutch and stock slave. If I install the JXB extended I should be good??

[Jay@JXB]

The extended slave will not fix a self adjusting issue rather a clutch replacement would fix that? Right now my car will not start and I am getting "push to start" message. I have stock clutch and stock slave. If I install the JXB extended I should be good??

The extended slave will fix your problem. It doesn’t stop the SAC mechanism from continuing to overadjusting, but that’s not an issue of the extended slave is compensating for it.

Just to confirm, has this problem come on over time for you, or did it happen immediately after some work was done on the car?


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[WettRally]

The extended slave will fix your problem. It doesn’t stop the SAC mechanism from continuing to overadjusting, but that’s not an issue of the extended slave is compensating for it.

Just to confirm, has this problem come on over time for you, or did it happen immediately after some work was done on the car?


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I bled my brakes after changing all my pads. It would not start after that, I then bled the slave but same thing.

[Jay@JXB]

Gotcha. So the car won’t start no matter how hard you press?

If that’s the case you likely dislodged the sensor from the side of the master cylinder. It sits near the slave line attachment. You can get in there with a long flat screwdriver and push it towards the driver side to reseat it. It’s extremely common for it to become slightly dislodged, then it’s too far to read the position of the clutch pedal to allow the car to start. If you could start it fine before now all of a sudden can’t start it at all, it’s 100% either that sensor is dislodged or unplugged. There’s literally nothing else it could be. That start sensor is 100% reliant on the clutch pedal traveling all the way to the floor and that sensor reading the position of it.


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