Questions About Buy Back For 2015 S3

[kfreiberg]

tl;dr - My car has been in the shop for 54 days for the same issue and is going back in again next week for the same issue. What should I do?

Hey Guys,

I'm trying to figure out what I should do with my car. I'll first tell you guys the situation, then tell you what Audi suggested and then ask my questions. I appreciate any feedback- and apologies in advance as the post is a bit long.

I've had it in the shop 4 times for the same issue and will be taking it in again next week - for the 5th time for this issue. Issue is the engine cuts out when accelerating.

1st visit was on July 25, 2016 (car returned July 29, 5 days total): They said there was a fuel pressure sensor malfunction, so they replaced it (G247). Took the car for a 100 mile road test to confirm it was fixed.

2nd visit was on Aug 12 (note, my birthday :( car returned Aug 18, 7 days total): They said there was faulty wiring to the G247 sensor (fuel pressure) - they removed the intake manifold to expose the sensor (because it tested fine) and found the wiring going to the sensor was pinched between the fuel rail and the cylinder head. They removed fuel rail to free up wiring and inspected for damage. They found two of the wires were pinched and needed repair. THey over-layed two wires in harness to eliminate the bad portion Reinstalled the fuel rail and intake manifold. Did another 100 mile road test to confirm it was fixed.

3rd visit was on Nov 7 (car returned Nov 30, 24 days total): They opened a TAC case (not sure what this is, but I think this is when they worked with Audi corporate on what to do). They replaced the High Pressure fuel pump. They took it for another 100 mile road test to confirm it was fixed.

4th visit was on Dec 13th (car returned Dec 30th, 18 days total): They opened another TAC case and it was recommended that they put on a wiring overlay harness. When they were doing this, they found a bent pin in the 14-pin connector under the intake. The pin is located in slot #10 of the 14-pin connector and comes directly from the #1 slot in the three-pin connector of the G247 sensor (this sensor that they previously replaced). They replaced the 14pin connector and performed the over-lay of harness to the ECM. They requested to do a 100 mile road test, but I declined (because they already put 300 miles on the car when they had previously "fixed" it), so they did a 20 mile test instead.

5th visit is next week on 3/8. Issue is the same, the fuel cuts out when I accelerate. Engine light finally came on, which is why I made the appointment.
Total time at the shop: 54 days.

The last time I was at the shop, they said if the issue isn't fixed, they would get the head technician for all of northern california to come in and have a look at it. Which should be next week.

I spoke with Audi today and the lady said that when they consider whether or not to buy back a car, they look at total days in the shop. She suggested waiting until after they "fix" it again this time to start the process of getting them to buy back the car because it'll be additional time added to overall total time in the shop for this issue.

I'm concerned that if they "fix" the car (I use the word fix in quotes, because they keep saying it's fixed, when it's not) that they won't buy it back.

My questions are:
a) What advice / experience / feedback do you have about going through a buyback with Audi?
b) Is there anything I should be concerned about when going through this process?
c) Any suggestions as how to best handle this would be great as well.

Thanks in advance!

[MkUrMark]

You need to contact Audi of America and request for a buy back(lemon). Stay firm on the amount of visits and lack of a fix and how this can be a serious safety issue. They will do their investigation, with your ongoing issue they shouldn't really fight back, you just need to stay firm.

I did this years ago with Nissan, I recommend you google California lemon laws, know your rights, you should be entitled to a complete refund (including finance charges and taxes/fees) unless the car is completely trashed. The car should be returned with reasonable use and adequate tire tread.

You shouldn't need a lawyer for this if you're well informed

[jpy1980]

My buddy is a lemon law atty on LOs Angeles. Message me if you'd like to talk to him directly.

[kfreiberg]

Thanks Mark! The car is definitely in good shape and the tires are fairly new (I had a flat a few months ago and had to replace all 4 - couldn't just replace 1 :( ). Any thoughts on if I should wait until after they do this upcoming repair like the lady at Audi suggested? Or should I just start the process now? I have all of the service records (done through them), so they should be able to verify the number of days it was in the shop, as well as what was done.

Also, here's a pic of the little lady! :) http://imgur.com/a/AiO7I

[kfreiberg]

Thanks! I'm hoping to manage without an attorney, but will definitely let you know if that changes!

[salvadorik]

It sure looks to me your case qualifies under lemon law in the state of California. I believe it is 30 days in total or 3 repair attempts to fix same problem while the vehicle is under manufacturer's warranty. In your case it exceeded by far both thresholds. They will deduct the mileage computed as the first day you took the vehicle up to the first day the vehicle started to exhibit the issue. Yeah, Cali is a very consumer friendly state and we are lucky that we live here. Sorry that is happening to you anyways and good luck with your case.

[rowlands57]

Personally I would take it up right now to get it bought back under the Lemon Law. I hate to say it but whatever repairs they are making cannot be up the to same standard as the factory assembly. Albeit they did mess up your car at the factory, but you know what I mean. If they were replacing complete wiring harnesses then perhaps they'd be doing it right but it sounds to me that they are patching it as they go. Changing a harness is not a trivial matter either but I have to think it's better than splicing things. I think you will always be driving this thing with a sense of pending issues, I know I would. You are perfectly within your rights to get a buy-back and given how much these things cost I'd say you are entitled to it. Best of luck.

[5l33P3R]

You're in CA and the process is much faster here. You're already far above the min required attempts/time to fix the car. VW bought back my mk6 gti and it was a breeze. Honestly, I'd be more aggressive if I were you. They're just now getting a field engineer involved??? Jesus! I'd start planning on a replacement car... all your money back etc. It's a no brainer. You have an extensive paper trail, have a case created as I read it...

Call Audi and say, you no longer want to attempt going through with the car. Period. I'm in Ca and it was no problem once I filed with VW. Our laws are very strict, where many manufacturers give up easily. Start planning what you want to do. Talk to Audi in absolutes. It's a slam dunk.

[Cairo94507]

You are on rock solid ground. The buy back will happen.

[DWP]

I agree with the other opinions - do not wait any longer. Start the lemon buyback claim right away.

Go ahead and keep the appt anyway - you need to show that you have cooperated throughout this painful process.

[MkUrMark]

Yep don't wait any longer... get it done

[Skyler@Achtuning]

I had a flat a few months ago and had to replace all 4 - couldn't just replace 1 :(

Just a heads up to all that Tire Rack offers tire shaving services so as long as they sell the same make, model, and size of tire you need replaced you can call them to let them know what tread depth you need and they should be able to help. I'm not sure what the charge for this service is though. I believe Quattro allows a tread depth variation of 2/32" so for those with very new tires you may not need shaving at all.

[Scotty@Advanced]

Buyback or "Lemon" rules aren't dictated by the manufacturer they are specified by law.

[kfreiberg]

Wow! Thanks everyone for the responses! This is super helpful and encouraging. I'm going to call audi corporate back today and start the process since it sounds like I have a good case.

I think I was not wanting to do this before because I seriously love this car and will be sad to have to turn it over. But I think what rowlands57 said is what's been in the back of my mind which is: "whatever repairs they are making cannot be up the to same standard as the factory assembly" and that I "will always be driving this thing with a sense of pending issues."

So I should get this process started sooner rather than later.

Also to Skylar@Achtuning - a coworker told me about the tire shaving option from tire rack (after I replaced all 4), so I definitely will do this in the future!

[MkUrMark]

It happens to all manufactures... lemons are bound to spring up... the S3 is pretty reliable overall

[mdhollis]

Bummer man gl with everything

[Cairo94507]

If you love the car just ask Audi to get you a new one. The Lemon Law is fairly easy to navigate and most manufacturers, once they realize you have a legitimate Lemon Law case, will do the buy back on their own to keep it from counting as an official Lemon Law return. That's your chance to upgrade, get a different color, get an RS3 (you pay the difference), etc. Or get a completely different Audi product, SQ5, etc.

[Anthony]

It happens to all manufactures... lemons are bound to spring up... the S3 is pretty reliable overall

There have been a lot of issues with early build S3's. Mine has been the least reliable Audi I've ever owned. I've experienced similar problems as the OP, as have a number of others I know.

[MkUrMark]

I hardly every buy first year generations for that very reason.

[ChrisF1]

I'm sorry to hear you're going thru this. It takes a really good car and makes it really unpleasant to own. I had a 2012 S4 that I had to force Audi to buyback.

- car was in the shop 4x for DSG surging without cause. First 2 times dealers said "normal". Finally after a call to AoA, I went to a different dealer and the shop foreman took it seriously and also said he'd seen the behavior before but usually they had to replace the transmission and other parts to fix it.

- After the 4th attempt to fix it, I contacted AoA and told them I wanted a buyback. They responded similarly to what you have written "give it one more try to fix it". I declined.

- I wrote a demand letter to AoA stating the criteria required for buyback under CA law; how my situation clearly qualified under those criteria and that I demanded they buy the car back. I also wrote that I preferred not to involve a lawyer due to the added expense but that if they refused, I would. They refused.

- I hired a local Lemon Law specialist and gave him the facts. He agreed - clear cut case. He wrote a demand letter and within 48hrs, he had their attention and they agreed to a buyback. They asked first if I would consider a replacement S4 but I declined having been fed up with how they handled the whole situation. In the end, they paid for the car, they paid for the attorneys fees. I was out of pocket about 1200 for using the car 17 months.

My advice is to follow the same path and tell them you prefer not to involve an attorney but that you clearly qualify under the law. Tell them you want a written response within 48 hrs so they don't drag their feet. Then use the response to put their feet to the fire with a lawyer if necessary.

Don't let them screw you around. Make them buy it back. Period.

[rowlands57]

I'm sorry to hear you're going thru this. It takes a really good car and makes it really unpleasant to own. I had a 2012 S4 that I had to force Audi to buyback.

- car was in the shop 4x for DSG surging without cause. First 2 times dealers said "normal". Finally after a call to AoA, I went to a different dealer and the shop foreman took it seriously and also said he'd seen the behavior before but usually they had to replace the transmission and other parts to fix it.

- After the 4th attempt to fix it, I contacted AoA and told them I wanted a buyback. They responded similarly to what you have written "give it one more try to fix it". I declined.

- I wrote a demand letter to AoA stating the criteria required for buyback under CA law; how my situation clearly qualified under those criteria and that I demanded they buy the car back. I also wrote that I preferred not to involve a lawyer due to the added expense but that if they refused, I would. They refused.

- I hired a local Lemon Law specialist and gave him the facts. He agreed - clear cut case. He wrote a demand letter and within 48hrs, he had their attention and they agreed to a buyback. They asked first if I would consider a replacement S4 but I declined having been fed up with how they handled the whole situation. In the end, they paid for the car, they paid for the attorneys fees. I was out of pocket about 1200 for using the car 17 months.

My advice is to follow the same path and tell them you prefer not to involve an attorney but that you clearly qualify under the law. Tell them you want a written response within 48 hrs so they don't drag their feet. Then use the response to put their feet to the fire with a lawyer if necessary.

Don't let them screw you around. Make them buy it back. Period.

That sounds just about perfect in terms of how to handle the matter. I had a similar problem years ago with Mercedes and it went just about the same way. They made me work just a bit too hard to get to where we ended up and left a very bad impression on me. Haven't had one since. They kinda did me a favor though as I have had a few Audi's since and truly enjoy them. Oh, I'm in NY and I believe the laws here are very similar to CA.

[kfreiberg]

I'm sorry to hear you're going thru this. It takes a really good car and makes it really unpleasant to own. I had a 2012 S4 that I had to force Audi to buyback.

- car was in the shop 4x for DSG surging without cause. First 2 times dealers said "normal". Finally after a call to AoA, I went to a different dealer and the shop foreman took it seriously and also said he'd seen the behavior before but usually they had to replace the transmission and other parts to fix it.

- After the 4th attempt to fix it, I contacted AoA and told them I wanted a buyback. They responded similarly to what you have written "give it one more try to fix it". I declined.

- I wrote a demand letter to AoA stating the criteria required for buyback under CA law; how my situation clearly qualified under those criteria and that I demanded they buy the car back. I also wrote that I preferred not to involve a lawyer due to the added expense but that if they refused, I would. They refused.

- I hired a local Lemon Law specialist and gave him the facts. He agreed - clear cut case. He wrote a demand letter and within 48hrs, he had their attention and they agreed to a buyback. They asked first if I would consider a replacement S4 but I declined having been fed up with how they handled the whole situation. In the end, they paid for the car, they paid for the attorneys fees. I was out of pocket about 1200 for using the car 17 months.

My advice is to follow the same path and tell them you prefer not to involve an attorney but that you clearly qualify under the law. Tell them you want a written response within 48 hrs so they don't drag their feet. Then use the response to put their feet to the fire with a lawyer if necessary.

Don't let them screw you around. Make them buy it back. Period.

Wow thanks for the response! Question - How important is the mileage? I think in California it's 18k miles - and the first time I took the car in, it was at 21k. I did file the claim with Audi yesterday, but yeah, I've decided if they deny my claim I'm going to get a lawyer. 54 days in the shop just seems crazy the more I think about it!