6 Speed Compatibility

[kid]

I've asked this question on 3 other Audi forums, and the threads just died.

I have an '01 allroad with a 2.7 and tip. I have purchased a conversion "kit" that included everything except the pig tails, mount brackets, and some bolts.

The problem is, The transaxle is a GBE, which I've found 2 differant applications for. One is the '03-04 A4 3.0, the other is a 90 something with a v8.

I'm wondering if the bell housings were all the same, and if the starter will fit. Also wondering if the axles will work. Here are a ton of pics. I can take more if needed.

[rollerton]

I'm just going to go with a couple easy details- it's not good news for you unless that stuff was free.

Looks like you have the B6/A4 01E . There are several things about that transmission that make it NOT easy to use in an A6. one is the trans mounts- notice your has that fitting for a crossmember, the A6 trans uses trans mounts on either side. So physically bolting it in would be a custom job. The gearing is wrong- but you have the rear Diff, so that helps. Not sure the rear diff bolts into an A6 now that I think about it..?
The front axle flanges are different; unless someone has swapped them you have to do that. Also no provision for wheel-speed sensor on the left front axle flange housing. So you have to deal with getting signal to the ABS module.
The trans will bolt up to the engine, the trans case/ dimensions are physically pretty much the same; so it CAN be done. I think JHM has installed one in a monster Allroad they built- but their advice is don't bother, it's a mess of work that you can avoid by just using an A6 or Allroad trans.

[kid]

Thanks for the info. Unfortunately, it was very much not free.
For the mounts, the tranny has the bolt holes on the sides for A6 style mounts. Does that help?
For the axles, could I swap the trans ends to my AR axles? They need a rebuild anyway. And I thought the wheel speed was picked up through the abs sensors at the hub.
If I have to sell things off, I could actually make some money. It came with a brand new stage 3, 4 puck clutch anf dm flywheel.

[rollerton]

Thanks for the info. Unfortunately, it was very much not free.
For the mounts, the tranny has the bolt holes on the sides for A6 style mounts. Does that help?
For the axles, could I swap the trans ends to my AR axles? They need a rebuild anyway. And I thought the wheel speed was picked up through the abs sensors at the hub.
If I have to sell things off, I could actually make some money. It came with a brand new stage 3, 4 puck clutch anf dm flywheel.

I didn't know they came with the casting for the side trans mounts-- it's possible they line up, which is helpful. Wheel speed sensor though-- that is picked up via the left front axle, just above the flange on the trans case. I'm sure there's a work around..but don't know exactly what it is in the A6. In the B6 I know people have been able to tap the ABS signal @ the harness, probably similar on the A6...but don't know if anyone has done it. Maybe the speed sensor would be the biggest hurdle...?
Here's the thread/ video about JHM's Allroad with the B6/B7 01e (0A3) -- It should be basically the same trans you have there?--- watch the 2nd video starting at about 7:00.

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...3-6-Speed-Swap

[kid]

If you look at the last pic, you will see a wire coming of the drivers side of the bell housing. Is it possible that's the speed sensor? It has a grayish/White plug that be seen haning free.

[brokenwrench]

The wire coming off the bell housing is the crank position sensor. See the yellow arrow below for the wheel speed sensor on the C5 01E.

[kid]

Thanks, I found that online this morning. For some reason, I thought the CPS was in the block, under the cam sensor.

Ugh...who wants a 6-speed conversion for an '03-04 allroad?

[kid]

Okay, not to drag this thread out, but I looked a little closer at the tranny today(the weather has been brutal). I found this over the driver's side flange. Appears to be a block off plug.



Judging by the location, it appears the tranny may have been used in cars with either type of speed input?

I also looked at the area where the mounts should go. They don't look tapped in the photo, but they are.

[Scotty@Advanced]

If all that stuff is from a B6 then it's useless.

[kid]

I looked over everything today, and have confirmed the 2 things that concerned me the most, are non issues.

The black cap is in place to cover up the speed sensor location when not needed. I pulled it, and the opening went directly to the ring location.

The holes on the side of the case are also tapped for allroad mounting brackets. Just need to find or fab some.

[rollerton]

Don't get too excited-- research the gearing and whether or not you need to use the rear diff + whether or not it will even bolt in. I don't know that stuff off the top of my head, but you could be good to go if that stuff checks out.

[kid]

Don't get too excited-- research the gearing and whether or not you need to use the rear diff + whether or not it will even bolt in. I don't know that stuff off the top of my head, but you could be good to go if that stuff checks out.

I'm unsure on the gearing, but I have the matching diff. It has the same rear mount holes, and the same side mount. I will probably upgrade all of these mounts to poly, to avoid replacing them down the road.

The GBE comes in 4.11, and I have heard some allroads have 4.11, some have higher around 4.30. I would prefer the 4.11, as this is still a driver. I'd like to get decent MPG out of it.

[Scotty@Advanced]

The black cap is in place to cover up the speed sensor location when not needed. I pulled it, and the opening went directly to the ring location.

The magnetic ring isn't on the diff. Speedo won't work.

- - - Updated - - -

The GBE comes in 4.11, and I have heard some allroads have 4.11, some have higher around 4.30. I would prefer the 4.11, as this is still a driver. I'd like to get decent MPG out of it.

All Allroad are 4.375.. Going from 4.375 to 4.11 won't yield a measurable fuel economy increase.

[kid]

The magnetic ring just pops on the diff. The speedo will then work.

And going from 4.375 gears with a 5 speed auto, to 4.11 with a 6 speed standard should give quite a differance in mpg.

Sent from my SM-G930P using Audizine mobile app

[8520]

01e casings are physically the same to my knowledge. I have an 03 b6 a4 with a 3.0 and have had multiple 2.7 01e's, and the mount holes are there for both b6 mounting and c5/b5 mounting, it's the mounts that are different. Your externals like VSS, CPS, and axles flanges may be different, however. In theory the trans would work, but the rear diff and driveshaft being a bolt on affair is highly unlikely.

Also not sure on gearing ratio difference between b6a4 and b5/c5 2.7

[kid]

01e casings are physically the same to my knowledge. I have an 03 b6 a4 with a 3.0 and have had multiple 2.7 01e's, and the mount holes are there for both b6 mounting and c5/b5 mounting, it's the mounts that are different. Your externals like VSS, CPS, and axles flanges may be different, however. In theory the trans would work, but the rear diff and driveshaft being a bolt on affair is highly unlikely.

Also not sure on gearing ratio difference between b6a4 and b5/c5 2.7

Not concerned about the gearing. I have the matching rear diff, along with all the axles and driveshaft.

There is a provision for the VSS in the driver's side cover that has a plastic plug in it. I popped it out, and I could see the hole where the sensor picks up the ring. The original CPS is still in the bell housing, so I'm good on sensors.

I will have to look hard at the axles. I may try to swap the flange ends when I rebuild the axles.

[RyanB]

So my reading around on this thread on various others is that the 0A3 is not native to the Allroad? I ask because I have a line on one and much of the ancillary stuff for a swap for a pretty good deal. Seller claims that the 0A3 front diff has same final drive as the Allroad, but this doesn't seem right per the above. So I would need the rear diff and driveshaft? And the JHM speedsensor adapter.

Basically what he's listed so far is: 0A3 transmission, engine/bellhousing spacer, bell housing and bolts, shift linkage, shifter, driveshaft, axles, slave/master cylinder, clutch line for like $400. Offered to flash my ECU to a stage 2 tune and code out my SAI and rear O2s causing check engine light. Just seems like I'd be missing quite a few parts and the swap seems not as straightforward as an 01E that came with these cars.

As best I can gather, the seller has a B6 or B7 S4 that probably had timing chain issues and that is what the 0A3 is from. They were advertising an allroad parts car that I think they were trying to use the 2.7T from and it didn't match up so easily easily. Dude seems fairly straightforward enough. Just wondering if this deal is going to leave me still trying to source hard to find parts vs. just paying for the kit from AudiS4parts.com.