2001 S4 will not start, or crank over. EPC light and CEL on

[projectvoltron]

As the title states I can not start my car.

I just bought the car a week ago and drove it 850 miles home and started it plenty of times. Drove it to my brothers house last night and I come out to go start it and nothing happens. The EPC light is on as is the Check engine light. The battery light is also on. But we put the battery charger on it and put it on "jump start mode" and nothing still happens.

The vdo screen says push clutch to start. I am making sure the clutch is all the way to the floor. Still nothing. I unplug the upper clutch switch and jumper it and nothing still happens. I am getting 12.3 volts to the starter.

I was just wondering if anyone else has had this problem.

The car is up on jack stands right now and I am getting ready to pull the starter out.

I will try to clean the terminals on the starter and go from there.

Please help me so I don't start hating my S4 in less than a week of ownership.

I took the starter, alternator, and battery in and had them checked and tested. They all tested good.

I borrowed a friends VAG-com and read the following.

Thursday,17,November,2016,17:14:08:10805
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 16.8.3.1 (x64)
Data version: 20161010 DS267.0
www.Ross-Tech.com





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Chassis Type: 8D - Audi A4/S4/RS4 B5 (1995 > 2002)
Scan: 01 02 03 08 15 16 17 25 35 37 45 55 56 57 67 75 76 77

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Address 01: Engine Labels: 078-907-551-AZA.lbl
Part No: 8D0 907 551 M
Component: 2.7l V6/5VT G 0002
Coding: 06711
Shop #: WSC 87119
VCID: 3467D01E04115AE268-5140

1 Fault Found:
18010 - Power Supply Terminal 30
P1602 - 35-10 - Voltage too Low - Intermittent
Readiness: 0110 0100

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Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 8D0-907-389.lbl
Part No: 8D0 907 389 E
Component: ABS/ESP allrad D56
Coding: 04395
Shop #: WSC 06435
VCID: 3561ED1A0F6B43EA5F-5122

No fault code found.

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Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 8D0-820-043-1D.lbl
Part No: 8D0 820 043 P
Component: A4 KLIMAAUTOMAT D58
Coding: 00160
Shop #: WSC 63351
VCID: 2D51C57AE73B0B2A27-2592

3 Faults Found:
00779 - Outside Air Temp Sensor (G17)
30-00 - Open or Short to Plus
01273 - Fresh Air Blower (V2)
17-10 - Control Difference - Intermittent
01206 - Signal for Duration of Ignition Off Time
27-10 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent

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Address 15: Airbags Labels: 8D0-959-655-AI8.lbl
Part No: 8D0 959 655 G
Component: Airbag Front+Kopf 2002
Coding: 00304
Shop #: WSC 63351
VCID: 3A7BFE262675AC92B2-5140

No fault code found.

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Address 17: Instruments Labels: 8D0-920-xxx-17.lbl
Part No: 8D0 920 981 B
Component: B5-KOMBIINSTR. VDO D12
Coding: 02264
Shop #: WSC 63351
VCID: 2B55CB62D92F051A39-5122

3 Faults Found:
00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30
53-10 - Supply Voltage Too Low - Intermittent
00562 - Sensor for Oil Level/Temperature (G266)
30-00 - Open or Short to Plus
00562 - Sensor for Oil Level/Temperature (G266)
29-10 - Short to Ground - Intermittent

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Address 35: Centr. Locks Labels: 8D0-862-257.lbl
Part No: 8L0 862 257 N
Component: CV-Pump, Alarm, RC D16
Coding: 16140
Shop #: WSC 63351
VCID: 408F8CCE40A9F642FC-4EEA

9 Faults Found:
01367 - Central Locking Pump Run Time Exceeded (Likely Leak)
35-00 - -
01371 - Alarm triggered by Door Contact Switch; Driver's Side
35-00 - -
01374 - Alarm triggered by Terminal 15
35-00 - -
01370 - Alarm triggered by Interior Monitoring
35-00 - -
01369 - Alarm triggered by Hood Switch
35-00 - -
01365 - Lock/Unlock Switch; Interior
29-00 - Short to Ground
00991 - Interior Lights
28-00 - Short to Plus
00955 - Key 1
09-00 - Adaptation Limit Surpassed
00956 - Key 2
09-00 - Adaptation Limit Surpassed

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Address 45: Inter. Monitor Labels: 4B0-951-173.lbl
Part No: 4B0 951 173
Component: Innenraumueberw. D03
Coding: 00101
Shop #: WSC 63351
VCID: 60CF6C4EE0699642DC-4B1A

No fault code found.

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Address 55: Headlight Range Labels: 4B0-907-357-AUT.lbl
Part No: 4B0 907 357
Component: LEUCHTWEITEREGLER D004
Coding: 00012
Shop #: WSC 63351
VCID: 65C17D5AFF4BF36A2F-5198

1 Fault Found:
01537 - Vehicle Level Sensor; Supply Voltage
31-00 - Open or Short to Ground

End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 04:05)--------------------------

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Address 01: DTCs cleared
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Address 03: DTCs cleared
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Address 08: DTCs cleared
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Address 15: DTCs cleared
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Address 17: DTCs cleared
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Address 35: DTCs cleared
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Address 45: DTCs cleared
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Address 55: DTCs cleared

[cjt671]

Check battery cables for poor fit or corrosion

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[cjt671]

Check battery cables for poor fit or corrosion

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And terminal ends

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[projectvoltron]

And terminal ends

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I checked and cleaned the terminals on battery terminals both on battery and cable ends and on the terminal on the starter and cable that connects to the starter.

I am getting power to the starter when I put the multi meter on it.

[RocksForsSale]

Try jumping it from a running car, maybe the battery is too far drained for a jump pack. Give it a few minutes to charge, and have the other person give it some throttle when you go to crank.

Hope the TB didnt break, that would cause it not to crank at all if the motor is locked up.


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[RocksForsSale]

Not sure if it wouldn't crank over with all that alarm stuff being triggered. I think you just hit the unlock on the fob a few times to disengaged the alarm.


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[projectvoltron]

Try jumping it from a running car, maybe the battery is too far drained for a jump pack. Give it a few minutes to charge, and have the other person give it some throttle when you go to crank.

Hope the TB didnt break, that would cause it not to crank at all if the motor is locked up.


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We tried to jump it from a running Toyota Tacoma and he did rev it up a little bit and still nothing. The battery charger I am using plugs into the wall and we tried it on the "jump Start" mode which is 225 amps and still did nothing.

[james 408]

when you jumped the clutch position sensor did it remove the clutch disengagement message?

Is it turning the starter just not turning over the engine?

fuel spark compression air.

[RocksForsSale]

I don't think any things gonna happen with the car in alarm mode.


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[james 408]

can't you just pull a plug and see if it's sparkin?

[blitz2190]

he said it doesn't crank, OP there is a heavy single wire connection that runs to your starter that should be clipped into or near the right side of the engine(left if your looking at the engine) on the firewall, you can try and jump the starter from here to the positive on the battery, make absolutely sure its not in gear as this bypasses the relays that prevent this from happening, if it works problem lies in your wiring, again be very careful and I dont take responsibility if something or someone gets hurt just relaying information.

[projectvoltron]

he said it doesn't crank, OP there is a heavy single wire connection that runs to your starter that should be clipped into or near the right side of the engine(left if your looking at the engine) on the firewall, you can try and jump the starter from here to the positive on the battery, make absolutely sure its not in gear as this bypasses the relays that prevent this from happening, if it works problem lies in your wiring, again be very careful and I dont take responsibility if something or someone gets hurt just relaying information.

Thanks for the input. I am going to give this a try when I get home and do it with the starter handing off the car since I have not installed it back onto the car. I might just go get a new battery tonight and try that so I can eliminate that as an option once and for all.

[Cgoon009]

If I were you I would start with the easy stuff first, change the bat, you tired to jump it, but nada. See if changing it helps. Rule out the battery, check it with a volt meter.

Then clear all your codes. See what comes back.

Next, listen for the starter, check for spark and make sure your grounds, other wire connections all tight and good.

If you still hear not a single thing, but are getting power and the "depress clutch" message, you may have an electrical fault.

Does the car have an aftermarket alarm system? If so, look for a kill switch or shorts in that wiring

Check your relays for shit stains and make sure no obvious parts are missing or damaged. Verify everything for yourself.

If you cant find anything there, inspect the tbelt, make sure its still there. look at the easy stuff first. Can you manually turn the motor over with a bar? Does the clutch fully disengage?

Other problems that can lead to a no start or hard start are bad sensors, or even a shit throw out bearing. (Im assuming the car is MT)

Start simple, typically its a small thing.


Also be very careful with the starter, its one of the few things that can actually hurt you badly on the car. Good luck and welcome to owning an S4.

[projectvoltron]

If I were you I would start with the easy stuff first, change the bat, you tired to jump it, but nada. See if changing it helps. Rule out the battery, check it with a volt meter.

Then clear all your codes. See what comes back.

Next, listen for the starter, check for spark and make sure your grounds, other wire connections all tight and good.

If you still hear not a single thing, but are getting power and the "depress clutch" message, you may have an electrical fault.

Does the car have an aftermarket alarm system? If so, look for a kill switch or shorts in that wiring

Check your relays for shit stains and make sure no obvious parts are missing or damaged. Verify everything for yourself.

If you cant find anything there, inspect the tbelt, make sure its still there. look at the easy stuff first. Can you manually turn the motor over with a bar? Does the clutch fully disengage?

Other problems that can lead to a no start or hard start are bad sensors, or even a shit throw out bearing. (Im assuming the car is MT)

Start simple, typically its a small thing.


Also be very careful with the starter, its one of the few things that can actually hurt you badly on the car. Good luck and welcome to owning an S4.

Thank you for the warm welcome!

I cleared the codes and nothing else popped up again.

I am going to change the battery out tonight and see what that does.

I tested the current battery with a multi meter and read around12.1-12.3 volts. A little low for my liking

The crank does turn when I put wrench on it and the Clutch does fully disengage.

I figured if there were a faulty sensor it would still throw a code and at least turn over.

I really think it is either a battery issue or a starter issue.

Car does not have an aftermarket alarm.

Thanks for all the help. I really appreciate it.

[SACTOWNB5]

Are electronics in the car working and it just won't start?

Check Grounds or try swapping the ignition switch.
There is also 'starting interlock relay' in the Central Electric panel.

[AvantGuard]

If he is getting 12 volts to the starter and it isn't trying to start he has a bad starter.

[getslideways]

I tested the current battery with a multi meter and read around12.1-12.3 volts. A little low for my liking

Seems fine to me for a car were the engine isnt running, maybe a smidgen low, as something closer to 12.6 would be ideal, but depending on the meter you are using, that might be within the margin of error.

If he is getting 12 volts to the starter and it isn't trying to start he has a bad starter.

It depends on where the 12 volts is. If I recall, as its the case with most other starters, there is a constant 12 volts power wire, and a separate relay/solenoid that only gets 12 volts when the key is turned to the "cranking" position. The constant 12v source should be the large thick wire, and the smaller gauge wire the "trigger" wire. You need to be sure you are getting 12v to the trigger wire when turning the key.

Also, not sure if i saw what James asked answered:

"when you jumped the clutch position sensor did it remove the clutch disengagement message?"

If you jumped it, but the message is still present, it will not start and is not jumped correctly or a sign of another issue.

Check the trigger (relay/solenoid) wire at the starter to see if you have 0 volts when the key is in the run position, and 12v when the key is help in the "start/crank" position

If the trigger wire is not sending 12v only when turned to the "start/crank" position, then something is preventing it (bad clutch switch, bad ignition switch, etc)

[RocksForsSale]

Just make sure that alarm stuff isn't showing back up. In your description, im sure that doesn't allow for a crank right


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[projectvoltron]

Seems fine to me for a car were the engine isnt running, maybe a smidgen low, as something closer to 12.6 would be ideal, but depending on the meter you are using, that might be within the margin of error.





It depends on where the 12 volts is. If I recall, as its the case with most other starters, there is a constant 12 volts power wire, and a separate relay/solenoid that only gets 12 volts when the key is turned to the "cranking" position. The constant 12v source should be the large thick wire, and the smaller gauge wire the "trigger" wire. You need to be sure you are getting 12v to the trigger wire when turning the key.

Also, not sure if i saw what James asked answered:

If you jumped it, but the message is still present, it will not start and is not jumped correctly or a sign of another issue.

Check the trigger (relay/solenoid) wire at the starter to see if you have 0 volts when the key is in the run position, and 12v when the key is help in the "start/crank" position

If the trigger wire is not sending 12v only when turned to the "start/crank" position, then something is preventing it (bad clutch switch, bad ignition switch, etc)

I got a new battery today and I did all the tests that you asked.

I ran hot wires to the starter and ran a hot wire to the "trigger wire" and the starter worked just fine. Then I tested all the connections and I am getting the constant 12 volt and when I turn the key I get 12 volts on the "trigger wire".

The connection on the trigger wire was kind of dirty and corroded so I think that might have been my problem. I am going to throw everything back together in the morning and see if it starts up.

I will report back after that.


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[getslideways]

hope thats all it ends up being, and you can get back to scooting down the road. Keep us posted

[projectvoltron]

IT WAS THE GROUNDING STRAP!

After all of that work I did I took the ground strap off and cleaned all the ends of everything involved and boom. Starts every time now.

Since I have it apart I'm going to bake and paint the headlights black and remove the amber corners. I got some of the black chrome spray cover so hopefully it will still be able to reflect the brights. We will see.

Thanks to everyone who chimed in and helped out.

I feel like an idiot. But oh well it runs


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[getslideways]

Glad to hear you got it running.

[cjt671]

IT WAS THE GROUNDING STRAP!

After all of that work I did I took the ground strap off and cleaned all the ends of everything involved and boom. Starts every time now.

Since I have it apart I'm going to bake and paint the headlights black and remove the amber corners. I got some of the black chrome spray cover so hopefully it will still be able to reflect the brights. We will see.

Thanks to everyone who chimed in and helped out.

I feel like an idiot. But oh well it runs


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Glad to hear lolol

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