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  1. #1
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Have I made 15-20 HP from an intake system? Yes.. yes I have (pretty graphs included)

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    So I'll begin this by saying that although I made my intake 8 weeks ago, I've put off posting my findings until now.

    Why is that you ask? because even I was totally taken by surprise at how well it worked and I wanted to be certain before I posted up my results.

    I also needed to be sure that it worked as I know that I'll be facing a substantial amount of backlash from the lemmings who insist that you can't improve on the stock intake. Fact is, you can, end of story...

    When an OEM manufacturer designs an intake, performance likely isn't even at the top of the list. Noise concerns, cost concerns, fitment, etc.... are all factors that OEM manufacturers take into account when designing an intake system.

    So with no further adieu, here is is...



    I based it on the BMC CDA. However, in my case, I ended up buying a Chinese Knockoff from blinglights https://www.amazon.ca/318i-Intake-Mo.../dp/B01LRELJ48

    Here's a rough idea of what the inside of my intake looks like (it's not exactly the same as the BMC design, but it's quite similar)


    However, when I got it, I found out that it was 2.5 in OD, not 2.5 in ID. so I took some 3 in PVC piping and the bellmouth from an extra S4 airbox I had lying around and opened the intake up to 3 inches so it was perfectly even with the rest of the intake tract.






    From there, I ran the hose that came with the kit into the fender well





    While it felt pretty good that way, I was hoping for a little more. That's when I got the idea to cut down the hose portion that ran above the auxiliary cooler and splice it back into the intake. Now, while this hose may not look like much, it's about 5cm in diameter, which isn't chump change when you consider that the airflow into the intake is pretty much a function of the combined area of all the inlets.
    (sorry, but I didn't get a pic of what it looked like when I was done, I was in a hurry to get it done




    In any event, the addition of that last bit seemed to be just what it needed!!! As soon as I took it out for the first test run I could feel a noticeable difference all through the rev range.

    Now, of course the inevitable response to this is that it's all in my imagination, there's no way that I could have improved on the magic Audi airbox, not without some sort of dark sorcery .

    Well, I contained my enthusiasm and logged the car over the course of the next few weeks and here are the results:

    I'll begin by saying that the gains have been consistent over the last 8 weeks. To demonstrate the end result, I picked three days at random from my logs, plugged them into EFI Analytics 'Megalogviewer HD' and overlaid the pre and post intake MAF readings (close relationship to HP) as well as the ECU measured load (very close relationship to torque).

    As you can see, the intake system MAF readings were consistently 20-25 g/sec above the stock intake (divide by 0.8 for HP) and the ECU measured load was consistently about 10% higher. So, if you were to take the average of the maf delta at 20 g/sec, divide by 0.8 that would equate to an average of 25 CHP. Same with the torque figures, 10% of 300 ft/lb would be an average of a 30 ft/lb increase.

    However, as the title says, I'm gonna go conservative and figure that the intake is worth 15-20 CHP and same for ft/lb.

    Blue line is post intake, Orange line is pre intake.




    So how is it that this intake can make this much of a difference? I suspect that it has to do mainly with fact that unlike the stock airbox, which has the air pulses exiting into a sealed box and only about 18 inches of intake tract, the design that I came up with has the pulses moving along a 3-4 foot intake tract which ends with a straight shot to the low pressure zone at the end of the tube.

    Couple things to note for those familiar with resonance pulse theory.

    1) The air in the intake system is not a constant flow, rather, it is a collection of pulses which are generated when the intake air column hits the closed intake valve, from there, the column of high pressure air reflects back until it encounters a low pressure zone, at which point it reflects back towards the engine. This can occur several times before the air is finally drawn into the combustion chamber ( in fact, most pulse tuning uses the 3rd or 4th harmonic).

    2) the longer the tube, the lower the portion of the RPM band the resonance tuning occurs within. I suspect that the stock airbox intake tube is too short to provide any resonance tuning effect at any speed that the S4 engine operates in. However, by extending the intake tract to 3-4 feet, a resonance effect can occur within the engine's RPM band of 640-6800. Look up some of the Nissan Infiniti long tube ram intakes and you'll see the same effect.

    3) there's some evidence that the BMC design, with it's internal design flows more air than a regular panel filter. Add to that the bellmouth that I used, and I think that the air filter I made flows air quite efficiently.

    4)Finally, although it has nothing to do with resonance theory, I've found that even in the hottest summer months that the IAT's weren't too bad. They would rise if the vehicle was stopped (say at a light), but they dropped off just as fast once I got moving. Further, I think that I'll probably make a partition out of some sheet metal and DEI hear wrap and attach it the frame rail. That ought to insulate things quite nicely.

    In any event, make what you will of my results. I'm sure that there will be some for whom there is no convincing. That said, I couldn't care less about that crowd. The ones who matter are the ones who are interested in making one of these themselves. If you do, let me know how it turns out and as always, if there are any questions I can answer, please go ahead and ask.

    Cheers
    Last edited by ZimbutheMonkey; 11-17-2016 at 10:14 PM.

  2. #2
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    The old Stratmosphere intake from back when the B6 was still new offered a 42 g/second improvement, and yet it made less power...

    G/second doesn't really mean a lot in a comparison of two different setups such as this.

    I await your lengthy response and explain why one man has out smarted Audi, and tried and true tuner JHM on this with just an eBay special.

  3. #3
    Veteran Member Four Rings LINDW4LL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by p3u View Post
    The old Stratmosphere intake from back when the B6 was still new offered a 42 g/second improvement, and yet it made less power...

    G/second doesn't really mean a lot in a comparison of two different setups such as this.
    Due to higher IATs as compared to stock?
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  4. #4
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by p3u View Post
    The old Stratmosphere intake from back when the B6 was still new offered a 42 g/second improvement, and yet it made less power...

    G/second doesn't really mean a lot in a comparison of two different setups such as this.

    I await your lengthy response and explain why one man has out smarted Audi, and tried and true tuner JHM on this with just an eBay special.
    No, I'll await your lengthly response as to how a 25 g/sec improvement on the same car, with exactly the same hardware within 4 weeks doesn't equate into a performance increase.

    or perhaps you can explain how the ECU showing a consistent 10% increase in measured load with the same KFMIRL/KFMIOP (if you even know what those mean....) ECU calibrations doesn't equate to a performance increase.

    Or perhaps you can direct me to the thread where the stratmosphere intake made 42 g/sec more and yet made less power, much like how virtually EVERY naysayer can't or fails to provide a link to back up their claims

    Or I'll await your response as to what you mean by this
    Quote Originally Posted by p3u View Post
    G/second doesn't really mean a lot in a comparison of two different setups such as this.





    Or, better yet, how about I just don't care at all....
    Quote Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey View Post
    In any event, make what you will of my results. I'm sure that there will be some for whom there is no convincing. That said, I couldn't care less about that crowd.
    Last edited by ZimbutheMonkey; 10-31-2016 at 01:03 AM.

  5. #5
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LINDW4LL View Post
    Due to higher IATs as compared to stock?
    G/sec decreases with intake temps, just go compare some logs of your MAF readings on a hot vs cold day.

  6. #6
    Veteran Member Four Rings LINDW4LL's Avatar
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    Have I made 15-20 HP from an intake system? Yes.. yes I have (pretty graphs included)

    Quote Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey View Post
    G/sec decreases with intake temps, just go compare some logs of your MAF readings on a hot vs cold day.
    Right, with all else being equal...
    -Hayden

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  7. #7
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LINDW4LL View Post
    Right, with all else being equal...
    Measured Ignition timing was higher on my post intake logs. That, and I'm running water/meth on 94 octane , so detonation is not an issue.

  8. #8
    Established Member Two Rings
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    Ok this is interesting. Would you mind comparing this setup with a modified airbox? I.e. a 3" cold intake pipe from the airbox going to the foglight or thereabouts.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Two Rings alcatranz518's Avatar
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    Interested in the results definitely but also the science behind it. Keep updating with data, please. I am loving all the juicy experimentation and labwork.

    I understand what p3U means by his comment of Audi and JHM, but this quote from OP: "When an OEM manufacturer designs an intake, performance likely isn't even at the top of the list. Noise concerns, cost concerns, fitment, etc.... are all factors that OEM manufacturers take into account when designing an intake system." is true. Even as a "sport" platform such as ours, the engineers are given parameters to stay within, and although our OEM setup is better performing then majority on OEM cars...its not to say its perfect.

    As for JHM, judging by what I've seen over the years by their output (and I know they did research an aftermarket setup for a time), I would venture to hypothesize it just wasn't a market they wanted to dive into for the cost vs. ROI for them. The OEM setup performed adequate enough for the needs of the masses and lets face it, for ~$600 would you spend it on gains from a differential, suspension, etc for substantial gains? OR would you rather on a true CAI intake with 5-15 WHP gain? I think they knew (most) no one would spend that on an intake for those gains, so they spend their R&D on what they knew the market would invest in so they could have a a better ROI. There are gains performance wise, just not from a financial standpoint to a business. Consider what JHM stated about a turbo setup then look at Q_dubz accomplishments. Same thing, JHM stated turbo'd was possible, but financially wasn't in their R&D interest compared to their current offering of the Vortech route they chose.

    Granted I am not saying the intake improvement isn't worth while, I just think from Audi and JHM's standpoint there is 2 separate reasonings of why, and logical at that. From a consumer standpoint, if I saw proven gains, and a cost of < $200 I would invest in it, but < $600 I wouldn't. However, from an engineer and project manager's standpoint it also makes sense why not. The theory is there for this to prove out, and the constraints of the OEM intake and why most aftermarket versions don't work, OP is overcoming with data to back it up. (Granted the data is alternative to the "normal" type most people are used to seeing such as a dyno, but its still data to backup the results--plus even when people do show dyno results on here people argue 1/4 mile data is better measurement and vise versa).

  10. #10
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    I see this and think of the leaf blower episode of mighty car mods.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Two Rings alcatranz518's Avatar
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    That's very valid point, but there is a lot of science behind OP's experiment and he has some great data here.

    Unfortunately there are some ideas out there that aren't very great (they can't all be diamonds which starts to tip toes in the water of the law of large numbers). However if they (the electric supercharger) are just proving a "gain" they can state that by muddying up the data and using a consumer's assumption of the actuals. Theoretically there is added airflow, which can lead to increase in volume, etc etc. Is it negligible gains, yea. But there is gain. Either way its the science and I personally love it.

    For example, look at what happens at CERN. I know that is an extreme example, but no farther out extreme on one end then the electric supercharger is on the other. Scientists at CERN fight to prove theories everyday, some of which is so out of the box thinking it borders science fiction (some people think it is...). When they do prove a new theory, every scientist and lab out there gets funded to prove it right or wrong. The great part is that's science, and in our TQ obsessed world that's (basically) R&D.

    "I have not failed 10,000 times. I have successfully found 10,000 ways that will not work." - T. Edison

    On the lighter side of things, I always liked this one : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rii3Yar1Z7s

  12. #12
    Veteran Member Four Rings TarlCabot's Avatar
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    subscribed... interesting, yes indeed
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  13. #13
    Senior Member Three Rings
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    Some people are just never happy, you have an idea and try it out, it works... you let people know about it, then you get " where's the proof??" you give them data to back up your claims, and yet, still not satisfied.... ehhh i guess the theory that some people just take up space still holds true..

    at any rate, what if you were to introduce some turbulence into the intake tract? if you can create the turbulence in such a way that it cancels out the first and/or second harmonics, it might just give you a little extra "free power" for doing nothing more then putting in a 30 or 40 degree elbow or 2, plus it might increase that intake charge 1 or 2psi ( that would be alot).. even .5 psi... still.. would be free power for just re-arranging the setup a bit.

    im going to model it and see if i can work out the kinks in my theory.... i think your onto something good here Z....
    My S used to have a tap, a valve slap... now it makes no noise at all! RIP

  14. #14
    Veteran Member Four Rings Terry.Reese's Avatar
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    Subscribed, I was thinking of something similar, but didn't have the time to follow through, just had a baby and things abruptly changed at the house..lol

  15. #15
    Senior Member Three Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terry.Reese View Post
    Subscribed, I was thinking of something similar, but didn't have the time to follow through, just had a baby and things abruptly changed at the house..lol
    Ahhhhh I know the feeling. .. with a 4 year old and a 22 month old... I feel your pain lol. .. makes me think twice when I'm hard on my 17 year old. ...but sometimes, it's just so much fun. .. he doesn't really get sarcasm 100%... kinda strange considering who his father is lolol

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    My S used to have a tap, a valve slap... now it makes no noise at all! RIP

  16. #16
    Senior Member Two Rings Bonz099's Avatar
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    Im subbed, this is very very interesting.....

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    Veteran Member Four Rings q_dubz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey View Post
    No, I'll await your lengthly response as to how a 25 g/sec improvement on the same car, with exactly the same hardware within 4 weeks doesn't equate into a performance increase.

    or perhaps you can explain how the ECU showing a consistent 10% increase in measured load with the same KFMIRL/KFMIOP (if you even know what those mean....) ECU calibrations doesn't equate to a performance increase.

    Or perhaps you can direct me to the thread where the stratmosphere intake made 42 g/sec more and yet made less power, much like how virtually EVERY naysayer can't or fails to provide a link to back up their claims

    Or I'll await your response as to what you mean by this






    Or, better yet, how about I just don't care at all....
    ZING!

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    Veteran Member Four Rings q_dubz's Avatar
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    Increasing laminar flow has always resulted in gains... With all the turbulence that occurs in the factory airbox, this does not surprise me.

    Tyler, did you take care to mitigate any lips/steps inside the intake tract after the bell mouth?

  19. #19
    Veteran Member Four Rings q_dubz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZimbutheMonkey View Post

    Couple things to note for those familiar with resonance pulse theory.

    1) The air in the intake system is not a constant flow, rather, it is a collection of pulses which are generated when the intake air column hits the closed intake valve, from there, the column of high pressure air reflects back until it encounters a low pressure zone, at which point it reflects back towards the engine. This can occur several times before the air is finally drawn into the combustion chamber ( in fact, most pulse tuning uses the 3rd or 4th harmonic).

    2) the longer the tube, the lower the portion of the RPM band the resonance tuning occurs within. I suspect that the stock airbox intake tube is too short to provide any resonance tuning effect at any speed that the S4 engine operates in. However, by extending the intake tract to 3-4 feet, a resonance effect can occur within the engine's RPM band of 640-6800. Look up some of the Nissan Infiniti long tube ram intakes and you'll see the same effect.

    Cheers

    Oh whats that, you mean to tell me that's how the flapper system works inside our intake manifolds!?

    ;)

  20. #20
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    One thing I do have to say Zimbu, the new setup isn't as ghetto rigged as your old one. That made me lol

    http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...s-to-prove-it)

  21. #21
    Veteran Member Three Rings IslandHydro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by p3u View Post
    One thing I do have to say Zimbu, the new setup isn't as ghetto rigged as your old one. That made me lol

    http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...s-to-prove-it)
    ROFL!
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  22. #22
    Veteran Member Four Rings q_dubz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by p3u View Post
    One thing I do have to say Zimbu, the new setup isn't as ghetto rigged as your old one. That made me lol

    http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...s-to-prove-it)
    Guess you have no value to add from first post huh?😉

  23. #23
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by q_dubz View Post
    Guess you have no value to add from first post huh?😉
    Nope. Just some anecdotes.

  24. #24
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Here's the intake I was referring to earlier. I bought one back in 2005 for my S4. Sounded really cool, but that's where it stopped despite have higher g/s. Stock box back in.

  25. #25
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by p3u View Post
    One thing I do have to say Zimbu, the new setup isn't as ghetto rigged as your old one. That made me lol

    http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...s-to-prove-it)
    Well thank 'ya

    I take my compliments like I do my lovin'... any way I can get it lol

    So a couple comments/questions about your old CAI. As I understand it, you said it did offer a reliable g/sec MAF increase? If so:

    1) did you ever do any datalogging between the Hyperflow CAI and your OEM airbox? If so, do you still have the logs? If you do, can you do us all a solid and either a) post the raw logs up or b) plug them into excel and generate some graphs to show what was happening?
    2) How many g/sec increase?
    3) what were the IATs?
    4) if the IAT's were significantly higher, were you pulling timing?
    5) how did you come to the conclusion that it wasn't making any more power? Dyno?
    6) If so, do you have the graph? also, did you do a comparison pull with your OEM airbox?
    7) do you have the graphs anymore? I would be interested to see how the two intakes dynoed relative to each other.

    Also, I think that some of the differences between the Hyperflow CAI and my CAI may be due to the length of the intake piping. As I stated earlier, the longer the tube, the lower it's resonant frequency. From what I've been able to gather, if you want to be able to use pulse resonance tuning with your intake piping, it needs to be at least 3-4 feet long. If it's shorter, it's resonant frequency will be higher than the operating RPM of the engine (i.e. 8000+ RPM).
    Last edited by ZimbutheMonkey; 11-01-2016 at 04:44 PM.

  26. #26
    Veteran Member Four Rings event's Avatar
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    No one said any intake will do nothing, just that the ones being sold don't. Also, JHM did make an intake that had noticeably gains (don't recall how significant they were) but decided it wasn't worth producing because of how it routed and cost to reward if I recall correctly. You seem to constantly do things to your car, just to try and create rifts that don't really exist.
    No longer my "DTM" S4

    Rolling STOCK B8.5 S4 for over a year and happy!

  27. #27
    Established Member Two Rings brianup's Avatar
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    Have I made 15-20 HP from an intake system? Yes.. yes I have (pretty graphs included)

    Quote Originally Posted by event View Post
    No one said any intake will do nothing, just that the ones being sold don't. Also, JHM did make an intake that had noticeably gains (don't recall how significant they were) but decided it wasn't worth producing because of how it routed and cost to reward if I recall correctly. You seem to constantly do things to your car, just to try and create rifts that don't really exist.
    I'm not sure how performing an experiment and sharing data is causing a rift...

    I think some folks don't agree with the measurement being used to come to the conclusion of the HP gains claimed. But to say the OP is trying to cause rifts? This is where this post and others go completely south. The tone some folks take to dispute findings is borderline trolling and useless. Stick with facts. Leave emotion out. If you have neither, I say stfu...

    Now, I don't know enough about science/airflow/benchmarking/tuning to know what is/is not a good method to accurately measure any perceived gains here. What I can tell is that the OP has some serious knowledge in his head and has made an attempt to try something and share his metrics. He should be appreciated for this. I for one appreciate this thread for the info shared. Just need to figure out how to mute the noise, like your post for example.




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  28. #28
    Established Member Two Rings arrogntbastrd06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brianup View Post
    I'm not sure how performing an experiment and sharing data is causing a rift...

    I think some folks don't agree with the measurement being used to come to the conclusion of the HP gains claimed. But to say the OP is trying to cause rifts? This is where this post and others go completely south. The tone some folks take to dispute findings is borderline trolling and useless. Stick with facts. Leave emotion out. If you have neither, I say stfu...

    Now, I don't know enough about science/airflow/benchmarking/tuning to know what is/is not a good method to accurately measure any perceived gains here. What I can tell is that the OP has some serious knowledge in his head and has made an attempt to try something and share his metrics. He should be appreciated for this. I for one appreciate this thread for the info shared. Just need to figure out how to mute the noise, like your post for example.




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    Well said good sir. Thank you Zimbu for always taking great care to detail your experiments and share them with the Audizine community. Much appreicated
    - Do unto others as you would have them do unto you -

    Stock 2006 Audi S4 25quattro Edition

  29. #29
    Senior Member Three Rings
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    Thanks for the information zimbu very informative with proof to back up your statement. Respect on trying out things to improve our platform and sharing it with us. Fuk the haters

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  30. #30
    Veteran Member Four Rings Terry.Reese's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevinye77137 View Post
    Thanks for the information zimbu very informative with proof to back up your statement. Respect on trying out things to improve our platform and sharing it with us. Fuk the haters

    Sent from my SM-G920V using Audizine mobile app
    2nd this, also wanting to know when Zimbu is going to start mass producing for us... muahahaha

  31. #31
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    One born every minute.

    Good night.

  32. #32
    Senior Member Two Rings Bonz099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevinye77137 View Post
    Thanks for the information zimbu very informative with proof to back up your statement. Respect on trying out things to improve our platform and sharing it with us. Fuk the haters

    Sent from my SM-G920V using Audizine mobile app
    you heard it zimbo, start building kits! :)

  33. #33
    Senior Member Three Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by p3u View Post
    One born every minute.

    Good night.
    if your referring to idiots, you are correct good sir...

    but i must clarify.. this statement really pertains to you <--- just imagine thats a middle finger lol

    My S used to tap, now it just ticks!!!!
    My S used to have a tap, a valve slap... now it makes no noise at all! RIP

  34. #34
    Established Member Two Rings arrogntbastrd06's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by p3u View Post
    One born every minute.

    Good night.
    Constructive criticism and doubt is all fair and good, but insults and bigotry just don't fly. Leave these types of comments in your head please.
    - Do unto others as you would have them do unto you -

    Stock 2006 Audi S4 25quattro Edition

  35. #35
    Senior Member Two Rings
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    (bah, Photobucket is down atm, can't see pics.)

    i cetainly appreciate the thought put into this as far as readings go. however, people also thought 3rd party intakes were promising until tuners cut through the flurry of numbers and got the numbers that actually matter: they were put on a dyno. i just flat out don't trust estimated horsepower gains. (at least you're not trying to sell us stuff like dodgy hot rod magazine ads, though.)

    if it can be done DIY for cheaper than 3rd party and get a few horsies out without significantly raising IATs then hooray! i might even try it some day. in the meantime, i have new tires to buy before i go experimenting!

    - emilio
    Vorsprung durch Service Position
    Buy shirts & help me buy tires!

  36. #36
    Senior Member Two Rings
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    I might try this

    Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk
    Current: 2014 Audi S4, 2005 S4
    Past: 2001 S4, 2006 S4

  37. #37
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emilio View Post
    (bah, Photobucket is down atm, can't see pics.)

    i cetainly appreciate the thought put into this as far as readings go. however, people also thought 3rd party intakes were promising until tuners cut through the flurry of numbers and got the numbers that actually matter: they were put on a dyno. i just flat out don't trust estimated horsepower gains. (at least you're not trying to sell us stuff like dodgy hot rod magazine ads, though.)

    if it can be done DIY for cheaper than 3rd party and get a few horsies out without significantly raising IATs then hooray! i might even try it some day. in the meantime, i have new tires to buy before i go experimenting!

    - emilio
    While I don't disagree that dyno results can be useful, I think it bears reminding people that dyno results are equally as disputed as any other metric here on the forums.

    Also, dyno results are subject to a number of environmental issues which wouldn't be present in the course of regular operating conditions.

    The most significant issue for a CAI is the issue of heat soak. Unlike normal road operating conditions, on a dyno, the vehicle is indoors and stationary. While it is possible to replicate the airflow that a vehicle sees at speeds up ro 100+ km/hr, it takes a lot more than a couple of floor fans pointing at the nose of the car.

    The other secondary issue that arises as a result of dyno heat soak is the car pulling ignition timing due to IAT's soaring out of control.

    With respect to my methodology, I think that the way I went about verifying my results is sound.

    -It's a well accepted convention that g/sec divided by 0.8 is a rough estimate for HP. Based on an average 20 g/sec increase in MAF readings, I don't think an estimate of 15-20 CHP is unreasonable.
    -the g/sec MAF readings are reflected in the measured load readings, which are about 10% higher. I've found that measured load mirrors the vehicle's torque curve quite closely. Again a 10% increase applied to even the stock tq readings would suggest at least a 15-20 crank ft/lb torque increase.
    -all 6 data sets are aggregates which consist of just about any operating condition that you could encounter (i.e. stop and go, highway driving, cruising, etc...)
    -the data sets were taken over the course of about 6 weeks and randomized
    -If you look at the design as a whole, it stands to reason that a longer/freer flowing intake tract will flow more air than the stock airbox.

    Really, I don't know what else I could have done to get a more conclusive or representative sample (***not that I think you're being unreasonable, I'm just honestly thinking out loud***).

    Finally, I've tried to think if there was anything I missed which could have skewed the results, but from what I can see, the results are sound. Further, I have yet to see anyone suggest any reasonable criticism of my methodology. Not to say that there can't be any flaws, I concede that NO data analysis is 100% error or confound free. However, I can't see any reason why these results should be discounted.

    That said, if anyone has any counter to the above comments, I'm happy to discuss them. Like you pointed out, it's not like I'm trying to sell anyone anything. I'm just interested in challenging what I feel to be the ill founded belief that you can't improve on the stock intake as well as providing members a reasonably priced way of adding some HP to their ride

  38. #38
    Veteran Member Three Rings IslandHydro's Avatar
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    Now that you have this thing fab'd, is it pretty easy to swap back and forth between the stock and fab'd version? If so some same-day comparisons might be helpful?
    B6 S4 Cabriolet
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    Debadged except the rings, TWM Leopard shift knob.
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  39. #39
    Established Member Two Rings
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    Any chance of a dyno comparison?

  40. #40
    Veteran Member Four Rings ZimbutheMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IslandHydro View Post
    Now that you have this thing fab'd, is it pretty easy to swap back and forth between the stock and fab'd version? If so some same-day comparisons might be helpful?
    Unfortunately, I had to use the bellmouth portion from the inside of the airbox as well as hacking up the portion that runs over top of the auxiliary radiator. So without those pieces, I can't swap back to the stock airbox.

    That, and it's also kind of a pain in the ass altogether

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooblah View Post
    Any chance of a dyno comparison?
    Not very likely, for the reasons I outlined in my last post.

    Ultimately, given how contested dyno results are, I'd way sooner use the dyno time to get a sense of how the cam phasing affects power output as opposed to testing intake types.

    On that subject, I've been mulling around the idea of booking a couple of hours on a dyno when I get my 2004 S4 sedan on the road in the next few months. I think I'm going to install a set of modified SSC headers (I'm going to cut them down to get max VE at 5200 rpm and install some proper angle merge collectors).

    I think it would greatly simplify/speed up the tuning process to be able to just throw it on the dyno and take runs over 5 degree sweeps of the cam timing to get the car dialed in as opposed to doing it all on the highway like I did with my cabrio.
    Last edited by ZimbutheMonkey; 11-04-2016 at 07:31 PM.

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