Yet another dipped headlight post, unlike anything i have read here

[ErikG]

Hey all,

I have an 2003 3.0L quattro and i need a little assistance with a dipped headlight error. I have done a fair amount of reading about this issue and i yet i have not seen anything quite like my symptoms. HID lights, both lights work and have never had an issue with either one going out. So here is what i have going on.

The dipped headlight icon is almost always on, and it does not say whether it is the left or right headlight. Occasionally it will go away and display the radio station information. But more often than not, the icon is on the display. When it goes from showing the radio info to dipped headlight error, there is a nice loud beep.

Then, 80% of the time, the error icon is on the display and doesnt really do anything but the initial loud beep on engine start up.

For 20% of the time, the loud beep is always happening. Beep quiet beep quiet etc. If i accelerate hard in this condition, the beep will be delayed but as soon as i let up, the beep happens. When it is in this state, turning the headlights on gets the beeping to stop but the dipped icon is still displayed.

When turning the headlights on, there does not seem to be any motion of the headlights. From what i have read, if i turn the headlights on before starting the car, the headlights should move down and then back up again to settle into place. This does not happen. Although i have also never been able to test this with out the dipped headlight error so perhaps the error supersedes the attempt at moving the headlights?

I have looked at tons of posts here including this one: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...Leveling-Light Looking at post #12 and comparing the headlight adjustment sensor in post 12 to how it is set up on my car, it seems as though my car has the adjutment arm on the back of the A-arm. I swapped it to the front but didnt change the error.

With out a VAG-Com is there a way to determine if its on the left, right or overall headlight adjustment sensor circuit? Also where is the headlight control module located, as it seems this is almost like a loose connection. I have removed and reseated both adjustment sensor connections and that didnt make a difference.

My plan is to take the headlights out and have a look at the insides. Perhaps there is something in there that is preventing the headlights from moving and throwing an error. Im really at a loss after browsing and trying a lot of different things on this forum.

Thanks for taking the time to read and (hopefully) respond to my post with an idea of what to try next.
-Erik

[MetalMan]

With out a VAG-Com is there a way to determine...

If I may, this is where I'll stop you.
The headlight leveling system is inactive when there is a fault. This may be true even if there's a fault code stored (but I can't be sure).

VAG-COM or VCDS will allow you to pinpoint the problem. Without it you're grasping at straws.
Recently I made a thread pertaining to the chronicle of my headlight leveling issue. Might be worth a read:
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...r-possible-fix

In my case it would have been near-impossible to diagnose the issue without VCDS. Sure, I could have spent $100+ on a new motor and gotten lucky with replacing it, but I spent $0 to fix the problem.

BTW if you're ever in Orange County I could help out with VCDS, but there are probably people closer to you who could help out.

[imnuts]

With out a VAG-Com is there a way to determine if its on the left, right or overall headlight adjustment sensor circuit? Also where is the headlight control module located, as it seems this is almost like a loose connection. I have removed and reseated both adjustment sensor connections and that didnt make a difference.

You're just wasting your time not finding someone with VCDS to scan the module and see what the issue is. Even if you did find and correct the issue, you're still going to have to get VCDS to go through the alignment procedure and clear the fault code. I had a lot of level issues previously, and it ended up being a faulty module that I had to replace. If you want to temporarily stop the beeping and warning until you can get VCDS, or don't feel like fixing it and want the beeping/warning to go away, pull the fuse for the auto-level system by the driver's door.

[ErikG]

Thanks for input, i kinda figured i needed to do the VAG-com, but i just bought the vehicle and had to do the timing belt first and some other things, and now im on to the other minor things that need fixin. Vag-com will probably be coming in the next few weeks.

Oh i forgot to mention in my post that if i remove the fuse, the beeping and error is still present... Fuse #10 i believe it is...

-E

[ErikG]

Metal man- i which i would have posted this earlier, i just passed through OC on my way to san diego. Ill probably pick up a VAG-com shortly. Good work on finding a bad solder joint and fixing your issue.

Interestingly the error does go away from time to time, so i dont think ill need VAG-com to remove the error if i can find the problem. But im probably wrong, still new to the world of audi..

Still doesnt make sense why the error doesnt go away with fuse 10 removed..

thanks for the replies.

[MetalMan]

Metal man- i which i would have posted this earlier, i just passed through OC on my way to san diego.

Will you be driving back through OC?

[ErikG]

I was down on friday and back on sunday. If i head back down that way i will hit you up if i havent picked up a vag-com by then. What vag-com setup are you using? as in obd2 to usb device?

[MetalMan]

When I bought my first B5 in 2010, I got the Ross Tech KII USB, which is one of the cheaper options @ $249:
http://store.ross-tech.com/shop/VCKII.html
It's definitely paid for itself.
This cable works up to the B6, but won't work on B7 and newer (anything which requires CANBUS for communication; B6 still has K-line for diagnostics).

[ErikG]

Cool thanks for the info, at that price i will probably have to hold off a little bit longer than i want but so it goes. I like to tinker so i may have a look around the various aspects of the range control stuff. kinda strange that removing fuse 10 does nothing to remove the error light.

[diagnosticator]

Other than troubleshooting, you need VCDS to reset and adjust the headlights level to the default value using an aiming pattern on a wall. That should restore normal operation to the auto leveling function.

[B6_Dolphin]

I had dipped headlight issues after I changed from factory HIDs to the blacked-out Depo lights. It was intermittent, and sometimes prone to flicker. After changing out bulbs and ballasts, it turns out the issue was the main plug was not seating fully in the mating Depo light socket. Once I made some slight modifications, the socket mated and clicked-in. No more dipped indication :).

Speaking of which - I got bulbs, ballasts, and the OEM housings sitting in a box in the garage. Looks like I'll be posting on the Classifieds here.

[ErikG]

Ahh interesting B6_Dolphin, it seems to me like a loose connection some where. I may have a look at the connectors on the lights and see if there is any corrosion on the connectors or if they are seated properly.

Does anyone know where the light control module is? i looked under the dash by the main fuse panel but didnt find anything there except for the main ECU. I also looked behind the glove box but also didnt seem to find anything there.

Also, anyone want to wax poetic about why removing fuse 10 in the fuse box doesnt remove the error? (and dont tell me to vag-com it, im working on picking one up, just wanted to hear some theories about why i cant seem to remove the error with a fuse pull)

Thanks and cheers all,
-E

[imnuts]

The leveling module is behind the glove box. If you remove the glove box, get under the dash and look up, it should be almost centered if I remember correctly.

Sent from my DROID Turbo 2

[diagnosticator]

The CECM is behind the knee bolster on the driver's side, above a row of relays. The CECM controls all of the exterior lighting.

[ErikG]

imnuts and diagnosticator, thanks for the replies.

If i am understanding both your posts, the leveling module and the CECM is not the same device. And that if i had a problem with the exterior lights, i would check the CECM(driver side kick panel) but since i have an issue with the leveling, i may have a look at the leveling module(above and behind glove box).

I was under the impression they were one and the same so this clearing some stuff up. I really need a vag-com....

-E

[ErikG]

Hey guys thought i would give you an update.

So i looked at the leveling module and ohmed a few things out based on another thread and that seems to be working ok. I have checked the resistance of the leveling motors on both sides and they check out.

After checking on all of these things, i have put the error in a state where it is mostly off. But bumps or heavy acceleration or braking will bring it on for a second.

The other way to get the error to show up is doing electrical things in the car, IE rolling up or down windows, blinker, brake lights. I checked battery voltage with the car off, and on and i get 12.7v and 14.0v respectively. When i roll up a window, i get 13.9v which isnt enough to really write home about but it happens so i figured i would mention it.

Thoughts? and thanks for helping out.
-E

[imnuts]

Doing one thing shouldn't be enough to get the voltage to drop with the car running. Maybe you have an alternator on its way out and it's causing your issues. My car is at 14.3-14.5 VDC all the time with the car running. The only things that affect voltage for me at all are high energy items like the rear defroster or the seat heaters.

Sent from my DROID Turbo 2

[ErikG]

Ok that makes sense. thanks for the numbers from your car. I will keep looking into this. I wish there was a way to get more info without a Vag-com, especially considering removing fuse 10 doesnt remove the error.

I am assuming the headlights have a way of sensing whether the bulb is good or not and imagine its done via current sensing, so if i have a noisy alternator or one that is not producing the correct output, i could see that causing some issues. I have access to an O'scope so i may have a peek at the alternator output to see what the noise levels look like. It may have a diode that is failing and may be fixable with out a new alternator.

I will let you know what i find.
-E

[imnuts]

You may be able to get away with just replacing the brushes in the alternator. There is a thread around here that details the process.

Sent from my DROID Turbo 2

[ErikG]

yeah im going to do a few more tests, i want to see waht the voltage is with everything high power item on, headlights, rear defrost, climate control fan etc. and see what happens. Ill dig around for the DIY at some point.

[ErikG]

So just in case any one is following along, i want to update on the latest. Still no Vagcom but just got back from vacation and now that it is out of the way, i can budget for one.

This vacation required a modest 300 or so mile drive each way and didnt want to hear the beeping all the way down and back. So i decided to disconnect the adjustment motors on both headlights. I was expecting it to light up the error and keep it on, but i surprised to find that the error was still intermittent. Strange. Then after driving the 300 miles there, with the occasional beep, the drive home and about a week or so after the drive, the error was very dormant. Its back now, beeping every time it can. Strange. Anyways just wanted to update those who care.

I also wanted to get some thoughts on the fact that the motors were disconnected and the error was intermittent. based on what i have read about this error, the motors are checked for opens and shorts, thusly should have triggered the error and kept it on. But i may be making assumptions.

Thanks for reading and passing along your thoughts.
-Erik

[maccalo]

Did you replace your ride height sensors? Front left side, rear left side. You should really get your self a copy of VCDS. Even the free version with an ebay cable will show you the fault codes.

I've had this fault code when my sensor went bad.

[ErikG]

maccalo, I have not replaced anything on the car in regards to this issue yet. I have checked both sensors to make sure they are physically connected to the A-arms and that the connectors are fully inserted. It seems logical that the ride height sensors may be the culprit but there are times when there is no error, and i can roll up any window and the car will beep at me with the dipped headlight issue. This is stationary so its not like i hit a bump at the same time as the error. Very strange. Seems like some form of electrical gremlin.

When i look for an ebay cable what am i looking for? Just a standard USB OBDII reader? i saw a post indicating that i needed one that can read K-lines, or something like that.

Thanks for your input.
-E

[maccalo]

Well I've had this issue come and go when the sensor was nearly dead. But as for the interference with window motors etc. I don't know...

I bought an OBDII-USB cable for my KTM Duke 690 many years ago, and it has been working fine with my B6 =)

[EuroxS4]

If the light comes on during heavy accel I would assume it has something to do with level sensors on the control arms.Further more are you using factory xenons or aftermarket??If aftermarket do you have a relay harness installed??I would be inspecting the level sensor harness clostly and make sure it installed correctly.You can take a look inside the headligth make sure no wires are burnt or the insulation is cracked or missing from any wires.

[ErikG]

Mac- thanks for the info on the obd2 cable, also slightly jealous of the duke.

Euro - these are stock HIDs, and its more likely for the light to go off under acceleration or revving the car up a bit, almost like the alternator doesnt is happier at higher revs and can supply more stable voltage? Just throwing thoughts out. I have inspected the wires but i will look more into it. I miss the summer months when i could still work on the car after work in the daylight and not freeze my balls off haha.

Thanks for the input guys
-Erik

[ErikG]

Hey guys, its been a while and i thought i should update this post.

I still have not found the issue yet but i have a few new details to share.

1. When it rains, the error goes away. no more blinking and beeping. It even says 'OK' on the driver info screen. When its dry out, it comes back and and intermittently beeps.
2. i have removed one wheel level sensor and disconnected the other, strangely this did not cause a permanent "dipped headlight" fault
3. I didnt notice before but there is water on the floor board on the drivers side after heavy rains. I assume the CECM is getting wet and may be why its ok when it rains.

My questions:
Would the CECM be cause of the intermittent dipped headlight fault? If so, is there a relay that controls the headlights dip angle? do i need a new CECM?

Thanks for the suggestions everyone.