Data from ARD GT Kit?

[jaychen]

Anybody have any data from the ARD GT kits? I am mainly interested to see trap speed and dyno numbers second.

Please state what turbo's the car was running

[christianb5s4]

Here's a couple I've found, dynos and power levels are all over the place but offer a few data points at least. I haven't found much on trap speeds or times.

591whp, E85, 28 psi tapering to 24 psi on a baseline file



740chp, 27 psi tapering to 24 psi, 93oct

[jaychen]

Damn, was hoping to see some trap times.

[1thenaton1]

Well high boost 30+ psi is coming soon so hold on

[jaychen]

Well high boost 30+ psi is coming soon so hold on

GTX28?

Any more info ?

[1thenaton1]

Sorry joking about the video from 5 yrs ago with no follow up

[jaychen]

Sorry joking about the video from 5 yrs ago with no follow up

i see

[christianb5s4]

I've seen people comment trap speeds in the 130+mph range but it's hard to find definitive evidence. There's this thread:

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...-s-performance

[landfill]

@Jay speak to member BlueAWD. He just sold his twin GTX28 ARD car. He
said it made over 550 maybe it was 570whp on straight 93 pump and under
30 psi.

[Drehmoment]

^
They all "made" high numbers on dynos but finding credible street/ strip numbers is literally looking for a needle in a hay stack

AFAIK the Ard kit in the classifieds got blown up by Vast after it sat there for years being "completed " and the owner never ran the 1/4 with it

[jaychen]

^

Thats what im after. Trap speed..

I'd like to see what monty would do at the track given his car has 'dyno'd' 700hp or so. An accurate dyno should have him at 140mph-145ish

[NOTORIOUS VR]

^
They all "made" high numbers on dynos but finding credible street/ strip numbers is literally looking for a needle in a hay stack

Agree Same old story for most high power S4's. Dyno numbers don't seem to be much of a problem... Trap numbers to back it up just not possible

[Monty23]

Agree Same old story for most high power S4's. Dyno numbers don't seem to be much of a problem... Trap numbers to back it up just not possible

Why is that do you think? I mean I just built my car, had it tuned, and then took it to a shop to get dyno'd for fun to see what it made. It's not like the shop has any skin in the game to cheat the numbers.

I don't expect my car to be in the 140s. I'll be happy with mid 130s. If you notice in my dyno, torque drops off pretty bad above 7K. So it made 700hp at one point in the power band, but the average power band is what gets you the real world performance...

[jaychen]

Why is that do you think? I mean I just built my car, had it tuned, and then took it to a shop to get dyno'd for fun to see what it made. It's not like the shop has any skin in the game to cheat the numbers.

I don't expect my car to be in the 140s. I'll be happy with mid 130s. If you notice in my dyno, torque drops off pretty bad above 7K. So it made 700hp at one point in the power band, but the average power band is what gets you the real world performance...

only one way to find out. let her rip potato chip

[christianb5s4]

only one way to find out. let her rip potato chip

Only if Cleetus gives the go ahead.

[NOTORIOUS VR]

Why is that do you think? I mean I just built my car, had it tuned, and then took it to a shop to get dyno'd for fun to see what it made. It's not like the shop has any skin in the game to cheat the numbers.

I don't expect my car to be in the 140s. I'll be happy with mid 130s. If you notice in my dyno, torque drops off pretty bad above 7K. So it made 700hp at one point in the power band, but the average power band is what gets you the real world performance...

I don't think the numbers are cheated at all...

Why S4's don't generally perform in the real world? IMO, it's a mix of power band of most cars (falling off in the top end which is where you are in a race), ME7 tuning (stock ECU is programmed to be soft, predictable and safe), and driver skill (S4 isn't an easy car to drive fast (gearing kinda sucks, gearbox doesn't like to be rushed, etc).

[christianb5s4]

In what sense do many of these cars not perform in the real world?

[Zba]

Look at other makes with similar dyno numbers; they all have higher trap speeds. Forget ET for a minute because that is driver skill and look at a 600hp Vette trap speed vs a 600hp S4 trap. Report back

[christianb5s4]

In that comparison, weight has a lot to do with it. I'd agree, however when it comes to roll racing or timed 60-130 runs, S4s hold up to times their power numbers would suggest.

[NOTORIOUS VR]

however when it comes to roll racing or timed 60-130 runs, S4s hold up to times their power numbers would suggest.

They do?

[christianb5s4]

Taking dynos out of the equation since there are so many variables, I'm sure you've read through this thread:

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...d-and-improved

Now, in subjective terms personally I've run many cars (most at stage 2) and some at stage 3 including cars that should have roughly the same if not more power as mine (3 second fats, no dyno yet) and my car has surprised not only me but many others punching above it's weight. Gearing and power band make B5 S4s into a pretty strong roll car.

[Drehmoment]

^

The first five on that list have some serious motor coin invested, probably close to 150 k combined and that most likely does not include $$$$ engine failures they experienced
so definitely not your garden variety Zine build.

Plus it looks like only the Hardcore car is a successful 3.0 build with performance figures, at least here in the US they croak while breaking in

[Zba]

Regarding 3.0L build failures; how many people around here are dropping the 3.0L crank in and leaving the bore alone? From the information available it seems like many headaches would be alleviated by leaving taking this route.

[christianb5s4]

The first five on that list have some serious motor coin invested, probably close to 150 k combined and that most likely does not include $$$$ engine failures they experienced
so definitely not your garden variety Zine build.

Oh, I'm sure those are some very well built S4s on that list. I was just providing a response contrary to the statement that "S4s don't generally perform in the real world." Heck, I'm always happy to run my car to see what it can do in the real world because that matters more (to me) than any dyno sheet.

[Zba]

Oh, I'm sure those are some very well built S4s on that list. I was just providing a response contrary to the statement that "S4s don't generally perform in the real world." Heck, I'm always happy to run my car to see what it can do in the real world because that matters more (to me) than any dyno sheet.

DISCLAIMER: This post is not meant to elicit riots from the people!!!
Let's use this forum as an example of the real world, real people, real builds (ie. not a shop car). 9 out of 10 cars do not perform anywhere near what the build specs say. This is generally followed by excuses as to why it doesn't perform: It's not a drag car, the gearing is not ideal for racing blah blah blah.

I'm not ragging on anyone in particular but it's . With the exception of the very few outliers actually building and trying new stuff instead of making excuses, that's been the scene for a loooong time.

For example: For those that are going all out, how many people have run nitrous? It's a PROVEN power adder but I can't even think of one B5 that has used it, maybe stormtrooper? Usually one person says it's a waste of time, probably with little to no experience and that turns into truth. Just like the 2.8 cam on a K04 car. It's been debated so very few people try it. Same with 2.8 heads on a K04 car. Has it ever been proven that a K04 with 2.8 heads is slower or less street-able than a car with 2.7 heads? I doubt it, just more conjecture.

This place is FULL of knowledgeable people, but it is also full of half truths and bullshit. Stinky, smelly bullshit.

What's this thread about?

[y3ti]

There's a guy on here, username ss4, that used a shot of nitrous on his 2.7 with oem rs6s.

570whp/620wtq, 30psi on 109fuel with a "small shot" of nitrous. 11.1 @ 126. But that's the only s4 I know of with nitrous.

S4M3 went 11.4 @ 133 with his oem rs6 car. E85 w/ meth and 2.8 heads.

There are fast S4s... problem is noone goes to the track to get concrete numbers.

[Zba]

There's a guy on here, username ss4, that used a shot of nitrous on his 2.7 with oem rs6s.

570whp/620wtq, 30psi on 109fuel with a "small shot" of nitrous. 11.1 @ 126. But that's the only s4 I know of with nitrous.

S4M3 went 11.4 @ 133 with his oem rs6 car. E85 w/ meth and 2.8 heads.

There are fast S4s... problem is noone goes to the track to get concrete numbers.

I agree with both counts. I think it's funny how when these cars were new, people could and would pay up the yang for an AWE RSK04 kit. There weren't any other options until the RS6 was adopted but the car was older and probably onto the second owner at that point. These days there are quite a few options to make power but they cost loot. The majority of the cars are on 3rd owner and no one wants to or has the ability to pay the new offerings. And doing highway pulls with your buddy who bought a V6 eclipse are fun enough...

I hope there are enough people buying the high end stuff to incentivise those companies to continue to support and advance the platform.

[y3ti]

Ya, the platform is dying... Unfortunately it's only going to get worse.

034 started discontinuing some of their B5 parts recently (DPs, exhaust, rear BBK). I'm sure most vendors will follow soon.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

[christianb5s4]

This place is FULL of knowledgeable people, but it is also full of half truths and bullshit. Stinky, smelly bullshit.

What's this thread about?

Agreed, I was just playing devil's advocate. Definitely no arguing or riots intended. You're right though, out of all the "builds" that are out there on this platform, relatively few are actually healthy and running their full potential. Even if one isn't pushing the envelope and running a strong, regular stage 3 build, it's still a good thing when the reality is a lot of B5 S4s out there are trashed and far-gone.

[Drehmoment]

IMO

If you want to go fast you need to stay away from the Chinese turbo menu............and no, one 1/4 with a marketing shop car does not count.

The old saying never fails, how fast do you want to go ? How much money do you have ?

The car is getting really old and some are in very poor shape and instead of starting with a perfect fixed platform all the young'ems go stg 3 without addressing the previous 17 owners hack jobs , which leads to endless "help me " post and then it gets parted in the classifieds.

[brandon91891]

Oh man every thread in this forum turns into the shitty Chinese turbo thread haha


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine mobile app

[killerkali]

IMO

If you want to go fast you need to stay away from the Chinese turbo menu............and no, one 1/4 with a marketing shop car does not count.

The old saying never fails, how fast do you want to go ? How much money do you have ?

The car is getting really old and some are in very poor shape and instead of starting with a perfect fixed platform all the young'ems go stg 3 without addressing the previous 17 owners hack jobs , which leads to endless "help me " post and then it gets parted in the classifieds.

literally every single post from you is about chinese turbos and bashing jhm subliminally. salty ******s like you never disappear lol

[S4James]

literally every single post from you is about chinese turbos and bashing jhm subliminally. salty ******s like you never disappear lol

meanwhile the happy chinese turbo users keep taking doors.

[jaychen]

Ya, the platform is dying... Unfortunately it's only going to get worse.

034 started discontinuing some of their B5 parts recently (DPs, exhaust, rear BBK). I'm sure most vendors will follow soon.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

damn.

i was just about to pick this up. apikol still doing it. nm

back to fast cars.. s4's are slow.

thats all.

[y3ti]

damn.

i was just about to pick this up

I would call up 034 and ask them about it, they might be willing to do a small production run. Or check and see if Apikol's website still has some.

[Drehmoment]

[QUOTE=killerkali;11906675]literally every single post from you is about chinese turbos and bashing jhm subliminally. salty ******s like you never disappear lol

Sonny you and your beloved Chicom friends will have a rude awakening when Trump gets sworn in in January....

[Zba]

back to fast cars.. s4's are slow.

thats all.

Haha

[audi-hammer]

WE punch above our weight during highway pulls............... that's about it. Weight reduction helps tremendously in the 1/4 but we still suck. Sadly hardcore hannover is literally the only actual fast b5 s4 with a 2.7v6 in it still. VR6 or 07k or I5 20v is the way to make real power

[armageddon-]

not the only

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qQvrk38MOo

[landfill]

I agree with everyone on here but to me over 550 to the wheels on just pump with no
meth or anything seems promising to me. He had also stated that the car would spool
reasonably fast. I think if someone was willing to put in the seat time at the track with
an ARD kit s4 with twin gtx2863's, 67's whatever that it could yield some pretty interesting
results. Of course this is my opinion because of now there is no real world data and just
dyno figures.

The only two GT cars that had proven results were Gurumans and Sherifs cars if I remember
correctly. Gurumans was almost completely custom and built by agtronic. Sherifs if I remember
correctly was more OEM still running a Ypipe, ME7, and bolt on mods. Both cars ran GT2860's not
the updated GTX line. Guru ran mid 10's and Sherif's ran high 10's on street tires before being stolen.