2009 A4 APR Stage 2 vs Stock DYNO pulls (Bonus 2010 S4 numbers)

[rckymtn3L]

Hello AZ,

It's been a LONG time since my last post but I figured that the board could/would use the info that I had gotten my hands on.

I picked up a "low" mileage (70k) 2009 A4 back in May and finally got some time to do a little modding/dyno pulls. I put in R8 coils but besides that the car is a bone stock 6MT 2.0t (new factory pistons installed around 60k for oil consumption issue).

The APR HFC/Down pipe and Stage 2 flash was installed last week after several baseline dyno pulls were performed (unfortunately I didn't get stage 1 numbers before the install.... sad story). I have attached the stock dyno sheet, stage two pull(s) sheet, stock vs stage 2 and as a bonus two additional graphs with stock S4 (2010) numbers. I have splatted names for the sake of privacy. *EDIT* Images added to AZ successfully! Hopefully some AZ peeps will enjoy these/find them useful.


















TLDR:

Stock: 181 awhp/ 211 lb ft
Stage2: 236 awhp/ 305 lb ft
Increase: 55 awhp/ 94 lb ft
S4 (stock) is more powerful than a APR stage 2 A4.... duh

Cheers,
-Spencer

*EDITED with images instead of links

[umairg35]

Thanks a lot OP... This is great info. I have 2011 A4, I did stage 1 APR, recently installed APR carbonio intake and waiting for eurocode HFC in the mail to do APR stage 2 upgrade. How are you liking stage 2 for daily driving?


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[Zach L]

Great info... the overlaid graphs give so much perspective. Thanks!

[rckymtn3L]

Thanks a lot OP... This is great info. I have 2011 A4, I did stage 1 APR, recently installed APR carbonio intake and waiting for eurocode HFC in the mail to do APR stage 2 upgrade. How are you liking stage 2 for daily driving?


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Stage 2 for daily driving is great, though I can see it getting me into trouble too. The 1-2 extra MPG doesn't hurt either when I cruise down the interstate (30 mile commute).

Cheers,
-Spencer

[helldriver]

Nice and good to know, definitely feels like the numbers you got there, thanks...

-Scott

[rckymtn3L]

Nice and good to know, definitely feels like the numbers you got there, thanks...

-Scott

Glad to be able to put hard numbers out there for people.

Additionally, I forgot to add that this is the 93octane V2 tune.


Side question @helldriver, what is the "legal" tint limit for cars in OH? Looking to get that done in the next week or two and want to know. CO had pretty high legal limits on tint.

[helldriver]

Ohio AD code is 70% light transmitted windshield, and 50% sides and rear window, I had mine done by "the tint guy" in fairfield oh, he told me 35% is doable without getting into trouble, most cars I see here in cincy you can't even see the person driving, can't imagine driving in low light or at night.


Side question @helldriver, what is the "legal" tint limit for cars in OH? Looking to get that done in the next week or two and want to know. CO had pretty high legal limits on tint.[/QUOTE]

[earhythmic]

Curious on how APR stage 2 running e85 would perform against the S4

[petraman]

Ohio AD code is 70% light transmitted windshield, and 50% sides and rear window, I had mine done by "the tint guy" in fairfield oh, he told me 35% is doable without getting into trouble, most cars I see here in cincy you can't even see the person driving, can't imagine driving in low light or at night.

That's not right. Just had my windows tinted and had to look up the code... 70% windshield, 50% front side, no limit on rear windows.

Willing to live dangerously with my 35% all around. I honestly don't think it's worth it for anything less, just my opinion.

http://tintlaws.com/ohio-window-tint-law.php

OP, let me know if you're ever down in the Hudson area as I'd love to feel the difference with a tune!

[rckymtn3L]

That's not right. Just had my windows tinted and had to look up the code... 70% windshield, 50% front side, no limit on rear windows.

Willing to live dangerously with my 35% all around. I honestly don't think it's worth it for anything less, just my opinion.

http://tintlaws.com/ohio-window-tint-law.php

OP, let me know if you're ever down in the Hudson area as I'd love to feel the difference with a tune!

I live on East 4th Street in downtown Cleveland and commute out to Mentor for work. The farthest south I have made it was to the Akron area for the dyno (Smokey's Dyno). That being said I'm always down for a cruise. Are there any decent roads (scenic/empty) out that way? Only been in OH since April so I am still finding my way around.


Cheers,
-Spencer

[petraman]

Are there any decent roads (scenic/empty) out that way?

There's a reason I moved out here . Lots of great roads throughout the Cuyahoga Valley, which is just a couple miles away from me. They're short drives, but a lot of fun. Not too many cops, either. Just watch out for bikes on the road.

And if you just want something more relaxed, Riverview's a great drive, too, although it can be a bit congested at times.

[A4x]

So stock tune dynos at 181 wheel HP, which means the drivetrain losses are 30 hp if Audi rates the 2.0T at 211 hp.

APR stage 2 advertises 291 horsepower, so using that logic, the dyno should show about 260 wheel HP. But you are showing 236. So we're missing 25 hp from APRs claim. APR's torque numbers look dead on though.

[hyperunion]

Curious on how APR stage 2 running e85 would perform against the S4

Boomtime's Numbers were 292,awhp and 380awtq.. on around e65... So I'd say pretty close.. way more torque as well....

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[rckymtn3L]

So stock tune dynos at 181 wheel HP, which means the drivetrain losses are 30 hp if Audi rates the 2.0T at 211 hp.

APR stage 2 advertises 291 horsepower, so using that logic, the dyno should show about 260 wheel HP. But you are showing 236. So we're missing 25 hp from APRs claim. APR's torque numbers look dead on though.

It is my understanding that the drivetrain loss is not fixed, it is a percentage (which varies w/ driveline stress). With that said even using the factory crank HP numbers is not a safe way to go for calculating the % loss as manufacturers can under claim their numbers so that they over deliver on the street. That also doesn't take into account the dyno being used. The operator asked me if I wanted numbers that would mimic a mustang dyno, but I wasn't interested. The base line and stage 2 numbers are only useful when compared against themselves, IMO. Someone more informed please chime in, but this is how I have always thought about dyno numbers:

181 awhp (stock) to 236 awhp (stage 2) is a 55awhp increase, or rather a 30% increase over stock.
211 lb/ft (stock) to 305 lb/ft (stage 2) is a 94 lb/ft increase, about 45% increase over stock.

If audi claims 211 crank hp and the car delivered 181 awhp, then the 30 hp loss equates to 14% driveline loss. That just seems very low for awd, IMO. I could be way off, it happens all the time, but all my previous dyno experience (which isn't insignificant) hints that the crank numbers are a bit higher than 211 awhp. That being said, most of my previous experience was in CO and above 5280' so the numbers are much lower and gains are way more "precious" (thin air and mediocre gas-> 91 oct).

I was hoping for around 250 awhp. The number wouldn't have changed how fast the car is now w/ stage 2.. and it is WAY faster now which is really all that matters. I just wanted to share the % gains that were had when going from stock to "stage 2" (read -> just a HFC/DP with a tune).

Wall of words should be taken with a healthy dose of salt.


Looks like the B8.5 w/ ethanol is the best route for serious gains w/ the factory turbo.


Cheers,
-Spencer

**EDIT spelling typo