6+ Hours to replace Engine Mounts?

[Bordom]

This statement is talking shit to all mechanics "Profit should not come through deceitful business practices." let me know when you go to get the top nut off and the whole mount is torn in half and your trying to get a pair of channel locks in there to hold the mount because the nut is damn near seized . 6 hours isnt crazy time at all .

dealerships and shops charge 1.5 book time straight from all data

I did mine at a shop with a hoist, proper tools, and engine brace and expert help. The job took 10hrs because I was also doing downpipes. I'll never do motor mounts without removing the front end again. What a bitch that was.

Fucking hilarious.

I didn't invest 60k in tools and equipment, along with the thousands of hours of personal time on training, education, and experience so that my time would be worth less.

You're also asking for an R&R on aftermarket parts, on a modified car. Book time goes out the window in that scenario. They're covering their ass, plain and simple. Or maybe they just don't like you.

Take it somewhere that will charge for 4 hours and I promise they'll make up the difference with the other shit they break in the process.

You're not just paying someone for nut and bolt work. You're paying them because you trust them to do the job correctly and not screw anything else up.

Check yourself.



That's the worst. I always remove the bottom mount brackets and remove from underneath for that reason.

Yep, identifix shows 4 hours for it too.



Technically, you can torque it using the adapter with the offset crow's foot. Similar to the ones you use with high pressure fuel lines. Not the point though.

I agree, wholeheartedly.

Everything graciously mispelled by Android

[0396]

Flat rate time does not equal real time.

Doesn't matter how fast anybody here can do their mounts. With flat rate, if you actually charge a 1:1 paid vs real time, you aren't making money.

Gotta pay to play.


For example, Ford Explorers pay 5 hours for ball joints, and I would have them done in an hour. I was very good at doing them, and hustled so that I could get onto the next job. The fact that I am good at my job and faster than the other guy doesn't mean I should make less money.

Sorry, it just bugs me when people try to say a shop is overcharging for X because "I can do X in half that time.". That's not how this works.

Funny as I've encountered this with my good high school friend that is a Master Porsche tech. When I asked if he would like to work on my S/4 during his work hours at the Porsche dealer, he decline and would suggest that I use one of his Audi buddies. He mentioned that they know more than him about my S4 , thus he can focus on his expertise, the Porsche's...he knows short cuts that most people don't know ..especially since he's been wrenching them for years and years.
Since I try to wrench my S4 "little " items, and since I have other cars to drive..I can take my time.
I replaced the TDS for the timing on the top back between the firewall and engine.
I read up on the procedure, sounds easy...it took me four days working about 1 to 2 hours an attempt before I gave up. Some things sound easy but if its your first time..its going to be a B...h. Looking back, I should have just paid an Audi tech and be done with it in one day / visit.
These techs get paid to be efficient than they can move on to another "customer pay " job. He mentioned that factory warranty sucks and pay 1/2 of the time to actually get it done...efficiency rewards

[MacDaddy]

I just want to know how to get to the top bolts, looks like im pulling inlets?

[Bordom]

I just want to know how to get to the top bolts, looks like im pulling inlets?

Just the bottom ones to the turbos

Everything graciously mispelled by Android

[rockcandy]

You all make this job too hard. Inlets this, bumper that, blah blah blah. No need to even pop the hood. To all the driveway mechanics talking crap- does it make you feel better that I could line up 6 cars and do the motor mounts on all of them in the time it took you to do yours? It's quite laughable that you all think the guy is getting ripped off at $600 labor to install his motor mounts. I haven't seen anyone volunteering to do his motor mounts for him for the $2-300 you guys think it should cost. Drive to his house and help him out why don't ya!

[S4inMN]

You all make this job too hard. Inlets this, bumper that, blah blah blah. No need to even pop the hood. To all the driveway mechanics talking crap- does it make you feel better that I could line up 6 cars and do the motor mounts on all of them in the time it took you to do yours? It's quite laughable that you all think the guy is getting ripped off at $600 labor to install his motor mounts. I haven't seen anyone volunteering to do his motor mounts for him for the $2-300 you guys think it should cost. Drive to his house and help him out why don't ya!

Mic drop!

[rockcandy]

I think most people completely understand where DieselElectric is coming from. OP just wants a ballpark figure on time to gauge whether he might consider doing it himself, or whether it is worth the labor and "flat rate" charge at that shop. If OP knows he/she is going to spend 4hrs laying on the ground under his car versus the 6hrs the shop is charging, that makes the judgement call easier.

I understand the premise behind charging flat rate, however even as DieselElectric points out in their example for Explorer ball joints, I don't agree with the flat rate charge for labor being 5x the actual time it takes to do the job. In the case of OP's shop, that is not what is happening.

I don't think you get it. There is a massive spectrum of times that it takes people to do jobs. If you think it's not okay to charge 5x the actual time it takes, yet you think it's okay to charge 4 hours to do motor mounts, you're lost. I can do 8 sets in 4 hours AND take a decent lunch break halfway through. So why aren't these people charging 4 hrs crooks?

You know what though? There are jobs I completely hate and would happily let someone else do them. Usually, everyone has their thing. The things they like and the things they despise. Just remember that Audi paid their techs for many many years 13+ hours to do this. If they thought they could pay less, they would have. Don't hate.

[themadscientist]

No need to even pop the hood.

[MacDaddy]

[Zba]

dental plan! Lisa needs braces is now a song on constant loop in my head. Thanks dick

[aysix]

I don't think you get it. There is a massive spectrum of times that it takes people to do jobs. If you think it's not okay to charge 5x the actual time it takes, yet you think it's okay to charge 4 hours to do motor mounts, you're lost. I can do 8 sets in 4 hours AND take a decent lunch break halfway through. So why aren't these people charging 4 hrs crooks?

You know what though? There are jobs I completely hate and would happily let someone else do them. Usually, everyone has their thing. The things they like and the things they despise. Just remember that Audi paid their techs for many many years 13+ hours to do this. If they thought they could pay less, they would have. Don't hate.

I bent a wrench exactly how you have it and it's easier.

[Hulksmash]

What I used.

[landfill]

It DOES NOT MATTER what amount of time
someone on here can do the job in. In the
auto repair business there's something called
book time. Which every single manufacturer
has set the maximum time a job should take
to get done. If fucking all-data says the job takes
6 hours you pay for 6 hours of labor. No more or
no less. It doesn't matter if the tech can get the job
done in one hour you will still pay for 6. This is how
shops are able to keep people fed and their god damn
lights on.

[DieselElectric]

It's also how you get through the seemingly months on end where you are just going oil changes or sitting around with your thumb up your ass because every car you write up gets traded in.

Good industry to be in when the economy is good and everyone has money.

Unfortunately everyone wants their shit for free or doesn't value a Tech's time. For the most part, Tech's are underworked/underpaid, or flooding with oil changes/tire rotations that pay .5 combined at best, if you're lucky. I can't remember how many times I got the "You can give yourself a raise by just turning 2 extra hours a day!".

Mother******, if you could get cars in my bay, I'd make that happen.

/Rant. I spent 10 years in the industry (dealership line tech, maybe it's different in the Indy shops, I don't know as I got our as soon as the opportunity presented itself), most of it was struggling. So it frustrates me to see discussions like this that tend to demonize the repair shop. It is not easy to make it as is, and everyone wants you to work for nothing.

[Burrito951]

.,

[redline380]

Reminds me of the time my 1.8t blew a serpentine belt 70 miles from home. I was in a suit and sitting on the side of a freeway, so I was forced to have it towed to a shop.

They quoted me something like 2 hours book time for the job, and I was furious. Not a chance in hell it would take a retarded monkey that long to change out a belt. Now, I understand it was a Friday night at 6pm, and the shop needs to make money. If you want to extract $XXX out of the install, fine, then charge me a flat rate. But don't justify your bullshit price by some made up book time when it is a 30 min job at home. I watched them like hawk and they hardly touched my car the 1.5 hours it was sitting in their shop. Like I said, I understand the shop has overhead and they have to keep the lights on, but 2 hours to change a fucking serpentine belt? Come on! These guys are suppose to be professionals.

FWIW, $600 to change motor mounts isn't too bad. $200 in parts, and $200 per side in labor. But in the end, if you are going to bitch about paying labor, get a wrench and do it yourself. I was simply in an unfortunate situation with my belt and I had to have someone else do it. It would have cost $50 more to have the car towed all the way home. I have since purchased AAA Gold and get 100 mile tows so I will not have this problem again.

[themadscientist]

It's also how you get through the seemingly months on end where you are just going oil changes or sitting around with your thumb up your ass because every car you write up gets traded in.

Good industry to be in when the economy is good and everyone has money.

Unfortunately everyone wants their shit for free or doesn't value a Tech's time. For the most part, Tech's are underworked/underpaid, or flooding with oil changes/tire rotations that pay .5 combined at best, if you're lucky. I can't remember how many times I got the "You can give yourself a raise by just turning 2 extra hours a day!".

Mother******, if you could get cars in my bay, I'd make that happen.

/Rant. I spent 10 years in the industry (dealership line tech, maybe it's different in the Indy shops, I don't know as I got our as soon as the opportunity presented itself), most of it was struggling. So it frustrates me to see discussions like this that tend to demonize the repair shop. It is not easy to make it as is, and everyone wants you to work for nothing.

That's the big trend I've noticed in recent years. In more urban areas, people just trade the car in as soon as it needs any remotely substantial repair or maintenance. I had a 2012 Passat 2.5 that was supposed to come in for re-sealing on her vacuum pump that was leaking oil. She called me the day before to let me know she decided to trade the car in for a 2016 Jetta because she "didn't want to deal with the headaches". People just want to use the revolving door of credit and negative equity. $300 repair? Oh it's cool I'll just lose several thousand on a trade in AND take all of the sticker shock right in the ass.

Indy's are the saving grace for the industry right now, IMO. Not talking bullshit chains, but line specific shops that have their shit together and aren't trying to hustle air filters. With the economy coming back up, I know a lot of dealer techs that left as soon as they could, to go indy or start their own thing. Regardless, I'm going to transition careers in the next 5 years to something else. The writing is on the wall for where the industry is going. One A tech for every 10 lube/tire guys. Parts are going more and more modular (ie, idiot proof but too expensive) and the manufacturers are locking indy shops out of more and more work with things like component protection and ridiculous specialty tools.

[Cgoon009]

HA! It took me 45 hours to do my motor mounts. Didn't sleep for 2 days. Am I doing it right?


On a serious note, as some one who does their own work, I can understand why it would be really annoying to pay shop time for the job. But at the same time, the shop is here to make money. And they have tons of overhead. You don't have to use any shop you don't want to, just go someplace else. Or do it yourself. And while I think its fair to ask people what a reasonable or the best BOOK TIME they have found would be, everyone who comes in and tells you what amount of time they were able to do on there own isn't helping. Look at it like this:

Your friend did his mounts in 2 hours hypothetically. You tell the shop you are only paying 2 hours of work, the shop says great! They do the job in two hours and you get the bill. It looks like this:

Labor @ 2 hours: 100 +
5% Business tax
2% Trash Desposal
8% Tool Manit and purchase
2% Shop supplies
1.5% Utility
5% Tech pay
3% Education
1% Office Supplies
9% Building rent
4% Insurance and health care
etc.

You say what the FUCK, why do i have to pay all these fees. They say well that's what it costs to run the business and you don't know how to do it yourself. You slam them on yelp for "hidden fees"

Orrrr the bill looks like this:

Labor @ 2 hours: 600 dollars @ 300/hour

You say What the hell! That's sooo high, the shop down the street only charges 100 per hour! They say well that's what it costs to run the business and you don't know how to do it yourself. They go out of business because price looks too high.

Finally your third shop has no extra fees and they charge 100 per hour. They tell you 6 hours and you say: what my friend can do it in 2...

They say: well that's what it costs to run the business and you don't know how to do it yourself.

[MacDaddy]

Are you guys still swinging your dicks at each other about this?

[Bordom]

Are you guys still swinging your dicks at each other about this?

Dick swing or GTFO
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Lol

Everything graciously mispelled by Android

[mikeb17]

As a college student I do a lot of auto mechanic work as side gigs while I'm working on my education. I never charge by the hour. I charge by the job. I did the timing belt water pump service on someone's b5 s4 (motor mounts too ironically, super easy with the front end off anyways) and I told them it would be $500 for labor and they had to use oem or better quality parts. It took me maybe 3 hours total to do the job. Did I overcharge them? Possibly. Was it cheaper than having someone else do it? Definitely.

[a4kamila6]

As a college student I do a lot of auto mechanic work as side gigs while I'm working on my education. I never charge by the hour. I charge by the job. I did the timing belt water pump service on someone's b5 s4 (motor mounts too ironically, super easy with the front end off anyways) and I told them it would be $500 for labor and they had to use oem or better quality parts. It took me maybe 3 hours total to do the job. Did I overcharge them? Possibly. Was it cheaper than having someone else do it? Definitely.

Dont really think you overcharged them when a timing belt job is usually around 800 for our cars, just in labor.