stupid question: why arent there air-condition to air intercoolers? ACAIC

[alien_brain]

would the power increase be worth the expenditure with regards to the torque requirements of the AC compressor? seems logical to me. and you could simply fit the stock AC unit up to an AWIC. why is this idea not a brilliant one? does anyone know if anybody has attempted it?

ok before you invoke the facepalm, ill do it for you.

[Bordom]

The AC system has nowhere near the capacity to cool charge air at the demands of the motor. So no.

How do I know this? I contemplated the same thing for my B5 and searched google prior to.

EDIT: Also been contemplating converting to water-air intercoolers

Everything graciously mispelled by Android

[glennda5id]

iWKad22.jpg

[bakedziti]

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...ir-Conditioner


http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...iller-Thoughts

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...p-options-quot

[5spdJunkie]

Laws of thermodynamics are so annoying.

[PaperToast]

just pack dry ice around the ic's whenever you want to show off

[Brandywine050]

they have sold these for zr1/zl1/ctsv's.if this is the idea you're referring to http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/eng...ooler-install/

[Strong]

Because running the air conditioner to cool air going into the motor will rob the motor of more power than it will create. It would be a net loss of power because of inefficiency in cooling and combustion. Plus your cars air conditioner can't cool enough air to feed an engine. The only way this would work is if there were a secondary power source to power the AC, and even then you'd be better off just using any other conventional means to increase output.

[alien_brain]

good answer. thank you.

maybe its only good for cooling water in an AWIC setup in between runs, and only for initial temp as a partial solution meaning you would still need W/M or that cryo stuff? maybe NOS? i heard they use it to externally cool an IC by spraying it direct

[brokenwrench]

We can do some simple math to find out, I've had the same thought at least once.

Anyone know the intake/manifold air temp for a K03 2.7t under full boost? Mine isn't running, so I can't just to look at it right now.....

[PaperToast]

We can do some simple math to find out, I've had the same thought at least once.

Anyone know the intake/manifold air temp for a K03 2.7t under full boost? Mine isn't running, so I can't just to look at it right now.....

just a guess, 150-200 F depending on the outside air temp
lower if the air coming in is 10F and colder

[brokenwrench]

OK, here we go......

Based on several approximations and assumptions:

For a change in the intake air temp of 50F from 200F, this equates to roughly 7% increased air density, which allows roughly 7% more fuel (the primary mechanism for increased power through cooler charge air) and thus ROUGHLY 7% more crank power (remember I said there were some approximations used here). For a stock 2.7 producing 250hp, this comes out to about 17.5hp increase (YEA!! more power, right?).

HOWEVER....in order to cool the charge air by 50F and using a very generous assumption of 0.1 seconds of exposure of the intake air to the intercooler interface, not to mention an almost perfect thermal transfer coefficient -- I'll spare you guys all the math -- it would require over (drumroll please) 90hp applied to cooling system. OUCH!!


However, again.....But I know what you're thinking: for an actual application in a daily driver type of situation, using the refrigeration (a/c) system to cool the charge air directly wouldn't be necessary since most people are not going to hold full throttle all the time. What a person COULD try is to use an intermediate cooling system, say a second a/c compressor, water pump with antifreeze or similar and a reservoir of some size. The second a/c system would be able to apply a smaller power input continuously, which could potentially provide power gains for short periods of time. But such a setup would require, say, 10hp from the crank NEARLY ALL THE TIME for maybe 5 seconds with an overall 7hp increase. Not to mention the 200+ lbs of weight the secondary cooling system would add to the car.


So now everybody knows the fundamentals at play and why this isn't practical. Bummer! But this also explains why it's important to allow as much air as possible to pass THROUGH the engine's radiator and not around it. Any time there isn't enough airflow through the radiator from the vehicle moving, the engine fan(s) have to compensate which kills gas mileage (so, like, people who think it's a good idea to remove the fan shroud or the front air dam for example).

[Terry.Reese]

OK, here we go......

Based on several approximations and assumptions:

For a change in the intake air temp of 50F from 200F, this equates to roughly 7% increased air density, which allows roughly 7% more fuel (the primary mechanism for increased power through cooler charge air) and thus ROUGHLY 7% more crank power (remember I said there were some approximations used here). For a stock 2.7 producing 250hp, this comes out to about 17.5hp increase (YEA!! more power, right?).

HOWEVER....in order to cool the charge air by 50F and using a very generous assumption of 0.1 seconds of exposure of the intake air to the intercooler interface, not to mention an almost perfect thermal transfer coefficient -- I'll spare you guys all the math -- it would require over (drumroll please) 90hp applied to cooling system. OUCH!!


However, again.....But I know what you're thinking: for an actual application in a daily driver type of situation, using the refrigeration (a/c) system to cool the charge air directly wouldn't be necessary since most people are not going to hold full throttle all the time. What a person COULD try is to use an intermediate cooling system, say a second a/c compressor, water pump with antifreeze or similar and a reservoir of some size. The second a/c system would be able to apply a smaller power input continuously, which could potentially provide power gains for short periods of time. But such a setup would require, say, 10hp from the crank NEARLY ALL THE TIME for maybe 5 seconds with an overall 7hp increase. Not to mention the 200+ lbs of weight the secondary cooling system would add to the car.


So now everybody knows the fundamentals at play and why this isn't practical. Bummer! But this also explains why it's important to allow as much air as possible to pass THROUGH the engine's radiator and not around it. Any time there isn't enough airflow through the radiator from the vehicle moving, the engine fan(s) have to compensate which kills gas mileage (so, like, people who think it's a good idea to remove the fan shroud or the front air dam for example).

lot of thought and process went into that answer, kudo's and you made it understandable to the simple folk like me! I had thought of that also, especially in the furnace I call the V8 in my S4.

[estomax]

http://autoweek.com/article/car-news...ne-performance

does exist, i read an article a looong time ago, found it again. 25 lbs of stuff to give a ~45 second boost

[brokenwrench]

http://autoweek.com/article/car-news...ne-performance

does exist, i read an article a looong time ago, found it again. 25 lbs of stuff to give a ~45 second boost

Touche, although I haven't heard a word about this since then....dunno, maybe this kind of system deserves more thought.