Ready to drop

[DC5]

So I spent more than one day doing the darn turbo. First time touching that and was hoping I would never have to go back there. Biggest PITA on our cars in my opinion. It was a huge sigh of relief when I torqued the last bolt Exhausted!
While I had all my coolant & oil dumped I went on to replace the Thermostat then did the Timing belt change...suprisingly they where easy and finished those up quickly The Timing belt took only two hours, so happy about that! Was a little neurvous going there.

So here is my problem...started the car, sounded good for about 40seconds and then smoke started to come from the manifold and the turbo sort of fluttered, sounded a little like it lost pressure..turned it off. It smelled a little like plastic burning. I know I could have some burn off from the cleaner but this smells more like exhaust fumes. Next day same thing, as soon as I heard the sound with all that smoke I turned it off. Third time trying to start it was like it was choking/studdering.

Want to double check the torque specs for the manifold to the cylinder head are they 21NM / 16 FT LBS? It seemed a little low to me. Turbo to Cat 40NM /29.5 ft.lb? Put all new gaskets and nuts...I did not replace the studs to the cylinder head or to the cat but used the new nuts. I don't even think I could pull the studs out so I don't think that is the problem.

Anyone have any ideas as to what it could be I would appreciate it!

[DC5]

BTW it is a used turbo with 75,000mls. off an A4 Sline...got it locally off a guy that upgraded.

[mtroxel]

I'd take a really good look at the timing marks on your t-belt. Hard to believe that even a bad turbo is giving you problems at idle. But a mis-timed motor sure would.

As for the smells, they always smell after you do that much work. Your greasy hands left residue on the exhaust.

[Low and Behold]

Yep check those timing marks. Maybe look everything over again to make sure hoses and such are connected properly too.


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[DC5]

I'm confident the TB is spot on. I even did a few more rotations than necessary just to be sure my marks where lining up. My sons friend (Subaru mech) took a look yesterday & he said it smelled like exhaust fumes & coming from the manifold. Hopefully he can get his other friend over here to take a look at it, he's new Audi tech. Just hate the idea of dumping all my fresh fluids & pulling that turbo again :(

Are those the correct torque values for the Manifold?


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[mtroxel]

Are those the correct torque values for the Manifold?


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[DC5]

Ok so my values are right I just didn't use that hot bolt paste...necessary?

Just an idea after reading DanKings thread... Could it possibly be shitty plugs? When I pulled them #2 & #3 where leaking oil & they all had a lot of build up on them. Dropped $50 on new oe ones :/ & was going to get them in today.


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[DC5]

Here's the old plugs


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[mtroxel]

I'm kind of lost about your symptoms. Sounds like you've just let it idle a few times, is that right? And since there is no boost at idle, I've had a hard time connecting the turbo to any running problems.

When you talk of smoke, is that out the tail pipe or just coming off the motor?

Does it seem like it's missing? This comment sounds more like it's missing.

Third time trying to start it was like it was choking/studdering.

Is the oil on the plugs just from a leaky valve cover gasket?

[DC5]

First time It sounded fine for about 40seconds then it started to smoke from the manifold area and the turbo fluttered sounded like it lost pressure? so shut it down, few more tries same thing last try it was like it didn't want to start sort of choking sound.
The smoke was mani/cat area


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[mtroxel]

So no smoke out the tail pipe, it's just something burning off the manifold/turbo. Either grease hand prints (seen that one a lot) or an oil leak.

If you don't have a leak, let the greasy handprints burn off. Take a good look around for hanging plugs, or a vacuum line that's disconnected.

Is your turbo healthy? No idea, but keep in mind that ECU isn't asking for boost at idle. And the turbo is spinning, but with no real force.

[DC5]

Hmmm I'm going to change out my spark plugs and do some poking around & try again. Thanks so much for your ideas


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[DC5]

Ok, finally may know what my problem is! My sons friend came over tonight to check out the beast (he's an Audi tech) TG he doesn't think it is the turbo. My K&N filter was sounding not right to me after putting it all back together....first thing he said to me was go back to stock...I don't understand because it sounded ok before tearing everything apart? But, that was the first thing I noticed, I was thinking it is just cleaner so a more robust sound.

Second was the spark plugs...Have to replace the breather tube, could be the source of the oil on my plugs. Did not know there was a valve inside the breather tube, oil on my plugs could be from blowback.

Third is my Exhaust Cam...sensor was covered with oil...replaced my cam follower and I had no idea there was an exhaust one!
Unrelated is my upper oil filter gasket, hence the oil everywhere

On a good note he was impressed with how clean my bay was...my response was 'oh god, it is so dirty compaired to these guys on Audizine' lol
So, I have some more $$$ to shell out...just a little PO'd I threw out my stock intake when I replaced it with the K&N. Anyone have one laying around???

[pezgoon]

Why'd he want you to replace your stock intake? It sounds like you have a cone rather than just a drop in?

[brandonpham]

Ok, finally may know what my problem is! My sons friend came over tonight to check out the beast (he's an Audi tech) TG he doesn't think it is the turbo. My K&N filter was sounding not right to me after putting it all back together....first thing he said to me was go back to stock...I don't understand because it sounded ok before tearing everything apart? But, that was the first thing I noticed, I was thinking it is just cleaner so a more robust sound.

Second was the spark plugs...Have to replace the breather tube, could be the source of the oil on my plugs. Did not know there was a valve inside the breather tube, oil on my plugs could be from blowback.

Third is my Exhaust Cam...sensor was covered with oil...replaced my cam follower and I had no idea there was an exhaust one!
Unrelated is my upper oil filter gasket, hence the oil everywhere

On a good note he was impressed with how clean my bay was...my response was 'oh god, it is so dirty compaired to these guys on Audizine' lol
So, I have some more $$$ to shell out...just a little PO'd I threw out my stock intake when I replaced it with the K&N. Anyone have one laying around???

If you literally just have a Turbo inlet pipe, the adapter with MAF, and a cone filter, i HIGHLY doubt that will be causing any issues. No offense, but thats a typical dealer thing to say lol "bring it back to stock." Verify all connectors are connected and no lines or vacuum lines are pinched. Additionally, are you running stock PCV or catch can? And that amount of oil on the plugs is a bit alarming unless the valve cover gasket is leaking thus causing oil to drip from the top of the plug when pulling them out.

Were you experiencing any oil burn?

[DC5]

Why'd he want you to replace your stock intake? It sounds like you have a cone rather than just a drop in?

Ya, I do have the cone & it is definately not working right. I don't understand why it would sound so different from when I took it off. Today I want to take it off and look at it

If you literally just have a Turbo inlet pipe, the adapter with MAF, and a cone filter, i HIGHLY doubt that will be causing any issues. No offense, but thats a typical dealer thing to say lol "bring it back to stock." Verify all connectors are connected and no lines or vacuum lines are pinched. Additionally, are you running stock PCV or catch can? And that amount of oil on the plugs is a bit alarming unless the valve cover gasket is leaking thus causing oil to drip from the top of the plug when pulling them out.

Ya I know what you are saying 'typical dealer thing to say' but in this case not. He works for Audi but mods his Subaru top to bottom. His point too was, everything on the car is stock & there is no reason to have it. The filter was the first thing he noticed. Something is just not right there.
I'm going to go over every line & bolt just to tripple check today
I have the PCV and replaced that the end of 2014 and replaced my valve cover gasket arround the same time.
Just last year I did the DV so I think I'm pulling that off my old turbo and swapping out the one that is on the new install...the guy I got the turbo from said it was the Revised one but have no idea how old it is and it's not oe.

Were you experiencing any oil burn?[/QUOTE]
I was going through a lot of oil...I figured it was from the bad turbo, my intercoolers had a lot of oil every time I checked too. He said it is running rich....blackish smoke from the exhaust when reving. Didn't notice that before because I didn't let it run very much when I first started it & I just shut it down knowing something was wrong.

[mtroxel]

I think you're chasing your tail here. Rough running is not:

1. Turbo bolt torque specs
2. The KN filter (though I have yet to see any evidence they make a difference)
3. Oil on the outside of your plugs, especially since it appears to have been there well before you did your work.

Even the PCV talk seems a bit weird to me. With the exception of a torn diaphragm, PCV systems don't suddenly cause problems, they deteriorate gradually. And if they were a sudden fail, it would be very unlikely they would break at the same time you changed several things about your car.

You say you smell plastic burning since you did the work. My vote is a plug hanigng down making the rough running as it melts against something hot, probably aginst the exhaust/turbo.

[DC5]

I think you're chasing your tail here. Rough running is not:

1. Turbo bolt torque specs
2. The KN filter (though I have yet to see any evidence they make a difference)
3. Oil on the outside of your plugs, especially since it appears to have been there well before you did your work.

Even the PCV talk seems a bit weird to me. With the exception of a torn diaphragm, PCV systems don't suddenly cause problems, they deteriorate gradually. And if they were a sudden fail, it would be very unlikely they would break at the same time you changed several things about your car.

You say you smell plastic burning since you did the work. My vote is a plug hanigng down making the rough running as it melts against something hot, probably aginst the exhaust/turbo.

ya I feel like I'm chasing my tail at this point
I know the plugs w/the oil where not due to any of the work I did....just another thing that is wrong. The Audi tech suggested it was from the Breather valve, could be blowing oil onto my plugs or it could be my lower gasket. Don't even want to try the lower gasket so praying it is from the faulty valve.
for #4 I was just answering brandonpham...I know there is nothing wrong with my PCV, it is fairly new

I am going to really check everything top to bottom today just to make sure it is not something stupid lol I feel like I'm living under my car lately

[brandonpham]

ya I feel like I'm chasing my tail at this point
I know the plugs w/the oil where not due to any of the work I did....just another thing that is wrong. The Audi tech suggested it was from the Breather valve, could be blowing oil onto my plugs or it could be my lower gasket. Don't even want to try the lower gasket so praying it is from the faulty valve.
for #4 I was just answering brandonpham...I know there is nothing wrong with my PCV, it is fairly new

I am going to really check everything top to bottom today just to make sure it is not something stupid lol I feel like I'm living under my car lately

Just curious, one common issue with oil consumption accompanied by oil pooling in the IC pipes is a bad valve cover. Essentially the glue fails and the passages combine causing the oil to be pushed through the breather into the turbo and press through the IC pipes. Did you replace the VC before hand? I'm still sure the smoke is from chemicals burning off.

Again, I still think it is an unplugged connector or vacuum line. A cone filter will absolutely not cause this.

[DC5]

Ok at least now I know why my K&N sounded weird... The first two photos are of the intake duct hose. A bit of oil in it.
The next three photos are my breather hose with oil pooling where it connects to the turbo. That should not have any oil right?
I think the oil is just choking it.
When I replaced the gasket on valve cover everything looked good in there. Curious though, what glue? It was just a rubber gasket.
Ya I'm not too worried about the smoke, like you said :)
Btw I did use the red gasket silicone around the tb cover thinking maybe that is the stench
Everything else is connected & smooth, nothing crimped.



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[Okedokey]

VC

[DC5]

Ahhh read earlier through the thread: A look inside the valve cover by shiro1745, comprehending how it works now...great design on the German part can't rip too much because I'm German lol is there any way to test these parts? right now torn between replacing the breather or VC shelling out money right & left recently that hurts especially if there is nothing wrong with the part.


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[RakkCity]

Ahhh read earlier through the thread: A look inside the valve cover by shiro1745, comprehending how it works now...great design on the German part can't rip too much because I'm German lol is there any way to test these parts? right now torn between replacing the breather or VC shelling out money right & left recently that hurts especially if there is nothing wrong with the part.


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Welcome to owning a German luxury sedan.

Replace both parts. PCV system is $142 here: https://www.europaparts.com/breather...-late-vin.html

VC gasket is $12, if you need to do your cam follower it's a good time to do it all at once, $40 for VC gasket, CF, and HPFP o-ring here: https://www.europaparts.com/cam-chai...-2-0t-fsi.html

just unselect all the parts except those 3.

You're under $200 all-in, and these are all known failure points on this motor, so might as well get them out of the way now. If your VC is cracked, you'll need a new one of those and they're a little pricier, but you can make that judgement once you get it off.

[brandonpham]

Welcome to owning a German luxury sedan.

Replace both parts. PCV system is $142 here: https://www.europaparts.com/breather...-late-vin.html

VC gasket is $12, if you need to do your cam follower it's a good time to do it all at once, $40 for VC gasket, CF, and HPFP o-ring here: https://www.europaparts.com/cam-chai...-2-0t-fsi.html

just unselect all the parts except those 3.

You're under $200 all-in, and these are all known failure points on this motor, so might as well get them out of the way now. If your VC is cracked, you'll need a new one of those and they're a little pricier, but you can make that judgement once you get it off.

You can also used compressed air or even try blowing through the port on the VC to check if air is leaking.

[DC5]

Welcome to owning a German luxury sedan.

Replace both parts. PCV system is $142 here: https://www.europaparts.com/breather...-late-vin.html

VC gasket is $12, if you need to do your cam follower it's a good time to do it all at once, $40 for VC gasket, CF, and HPFP o-ring he
re: https://www.europaparts.com/cam-chai...-2-0t-fsi.html

just unselect all the parts except those 3.

You're under $200 all-in, and these are all known failure points on this motor, so might as well get them out of the way now. If your VC is cracked, you'll need a new one of those and they're a little pricier, but you can make that judgement once you get it off.

My PCV was replaced end of 2014 oem but never replaced the breather tube....one thing I know I'm ordering.
The VC gasket was replaced last year, so I'm sort of leaning towards a VC :/
Did the cam follower last oil change so wont be needing to do that at least👍🏻
Know I definitely have to replace the N205 valve...leaking oil from the connector, can't believe the price on that 😟

[DC5]

You can also used compressed air or even try blowing through the port on the VC to check if air is leaking.

Thanks, I'm getting ready to pul it. It would be great if I just crimped the gasket when I changed it last time but not thinking that is the case.

[DC5]

What do you guys think? Here's more pictures the gasket seems okay. Second from the back has a little crimp, not sure if that is made like that? I noticed they all have a little section that is smooth & arched, the one just had an extra.


There is one thing on the VC, it's the edge of the chamber where the breather tube flows. Blew air & it didn't seem to leak where that is bugged up but maybe has damage on the separator wall?


Close up:

Not sure if the oil where the gasket fits is from me trying to get the cover off or from a bad gasket:


So tomorrow I'm picking up a new gasket, breather tube & N205 valve from the dealer Hoping a new gasket will solve it. When I pulled my new plugs there was only some oil on the treads half way down, thinking that is just residue from the fouled old plugs.


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[Low and Behold]

Did you blow through the breather port on the VC to make sure its not leaking? Not that its out its even easier to verify that.

[DC5]

Did you blow through the breather port on the VC to make sure its not leaking? Not that its out its even easier to verify that.

Ya I blew through the breather port, didn't seem to be leaking.



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[DC5]

Keeping my fingers crossed this solves my problem Not much for $230


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[DC5]

Update SHE IS ALIVE!!! What a relief to hear that engine! Turns out it was the breather valve causing all the trouble a big relief someone didn't pass off a crappy turbo on me.

So, just something I realized & wanted to pass on. If you're doing a vc gasket Set the gasket & make sure you place the bolts to hold the gasket before attempting to install it. The lip on the bolt holds the gasket in place. Wish I knew this the first time.


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[RakkCity]

Update SHE IS ALIVE!!! What a relief to hear that engine! Turns out it was the breather valve causing all the trouble a big relief someone didn't pass off a crappy turbo on me.

So, just something I realized & wanted to pass on. If you're doing a vc gasket Set the gasket & make sure you place the bolts to hold the gasket before attempting to install it. The lip on the bolt holds the gasket in place. Wish I knew this the first time.


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Good to hear man.

I'm pretty sure you're supposed to replace the bolts each time anyway, but mine actually never came out of the VC itself when I did the gasket. Might be different since mine is the updated silver VC, PO had it swapped out early on in its life for some reason.

[mtroxel]

Nice job DC5!

[Low and Behold]

Very good

So what was wrong with the old breather then? Check valve bad? What happens when you blow through the old one (both ways)? Just curious how you determined that because it's really such a basic functioning part. I've replaced mine a couple times


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[DC5]

Good to hear man.

I'm pretty sure you're supposed to replace the bolts each time anyway, but mine actually never came out of the VC itself when I did the gasket. Might be different since mine is the updated silver VC, PO had it swapped out early on in its life for some reason.

Yikes had to replace a missing one a year ago, not cheap 😏 Can't imagine replacing all of those every time you open the VC!

Nice job DC5!

Thanks, so glad it is finally running👍🏻

Very good

So what was wrong with the old breather then? Check valve bad? What happens when you blow through the old one (both ways)? Just curious how you determined that because it's really such a basic functioning part. I've replaced mine a couple times

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I'm thinking it is just seen better days lol What I understand now is I should have replaced the breather when I replaced the PCV.
Just coincidance it happened to be at the same time I was installing a used K03😏
Still didn't have a chance to put in the N205 valve. My niece & her family just came in from Ohio for a week today so don't know if I'll get to it this week.

[mtroxel]

What I understand now is I should have replaced the breather when I replaced the PCV.

Yea, I don't know the details behind it but the updated PCV should go with an updated breather tube also.

[oVeRdOsE]

good job, you are lucky somewhat to require the ''easy fix'' for this kind of issue.

as mtroxel said, you should updrade the pcv in the mean time.

[DC5]

Yea, I don't know the details behind it but the updated PCV should go with an updated breather tube also.

Wish my dealer parts guy mentioned that would have saved me a lot of aggravation!

good job, you are lucky somewhat to require the ''easy fix'' for this kind of issue.

as mtroxel said, you should updrade the pcv in the mean time.

I know, thank god it was just the breather I have to check if the pcv I installed is the updated version.

Thanks to all you guys that gave me help & advice! I would be totally lost without this forum


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