when will they make performance headers for the s3?

[949]

so where are the performance aftermarket headers?
do you guys think they will make it for the S3?


the headers should not only give a bit more performance but the sound should also change, which depends on how each manufacturer creates the design.

[RupertPupkin]

S3 is a turbo charged 4 cylinder with the exhaust manifold built into the head of the engine. There is no such thing as headers for this platform or turbo charged cars. A downpipe accomplishes what you are after.

headers are for naturally aspirated or roots type supercharged vehicles. not turbo cars.

so where are the performance aftermarket headers?
do you guys think they will make it for the S3?


the headers should not only give a bit more performance but the sound should also change, which depends on how each manufacturer creates the design.

[949]

thanks for your post.

S3 is a turbo charged 4 cylinder with the exhaust manifold built into the head of the engine. There is no such thing as headers for this platform or turbo charged cars. A downpipe accomplishes what you are after.

headers are for naturally aspirated or roots type supercharged vehicles. not turbo cars.

I will have to disagree with your justification (because this is a turbo car) of why there are none.

these are some examples of cars that came stock with a turbo but they do have aftermarket header parts available. this is with a quick search of cars that came to mind.

Subaru wrx/sti are turbo cars but have many aftermarket parts. headers are available.


https://www.google.com/#q=headers+subaru+sti&tbm=shop

Mitsubishi evo's are turbo cars. headers are available.

https://www.google.com/#tbm=shop&q=m...hi+evo+headers


Mini Cooper S is a turbo car. headers are available.

https://www.google.com/#q=mini+coope...mance&tbm=shop


ford fiesta ST is a turbo car. headers are avaialbe.
http://www.protuninglab.com/11fofi16...d=140848870138




...but if the header is built into the head then that sucks. that limits a lot of fun in this area.

[forbiddenbeat]

S3 is a turbo charged 4 cylinder with the exhaust manifold built into the head of the engine. There is no such thing as headers for this platform or turbo charged cars. A downpipe accomplishes what you are after.

headers are for naturally aspirated or roots type supercharged vehicles. not turbo cars.

While there aren't any for this car because of the engine design, headers and turbos are not mutual exclusives. I had ceramic-coated headers on my Stage 3+ B5 S4.

[hbracer93]

Ok so first, Rupert is correct. Turbo cars have exhaust manifolds not "headers" and the word "headers" means more than one which would not be the case, it would be "header". V8's have headers not 4 cylinders. Second the Mini Cooper link you posted is for the supercharged car so sure it will have a header. The fiesta link you posted is not for a turbo fiesta, so again it will have a header. As far as the sti and evo links go they are exhaust manifolds not headers.

[diztek]

curious, is the s3 design due to it being direct fuel?

[saxon]

curious, is the s3 design due to it being direct fuel?

its cheaper and more compact for manufacturers to cast the cylinder head with one outlet feeding directly into the turbocharger

[949]

Ok so first, Rupert is correct. Turbo cars have exhaust manifolds not "headers" and the word "headers" means more than one which would not be the case, it would be "header".
V8's have headers not 4 cylinders. Second the Mini Cooper link you posted is for the supercharged car so sure it will have a header. The fiesta link you posted is not for a turbo fiesta, so again it will have a header. As far as the sti and evo links go they are exhaust manifolds not headers.

why do turbo cars have manifolds and not headers?

I'm no expert so here is an article on the subject.


quoted:
"While exhaust manifolds and headers play the same role in engines, namely channeling exhaust away from the cylinder head to the exhaust pipe and eventually out the back of the vehicle, there are important differences between them. Essentially, headers are upgrade parts designed for performance applications, while exhaust manifolds are more utilitarian. There are advantages and disadvantages to each, and which one you choose will be influenced by your needs.

Exhaust manifolds are frequently formed of cast iron in a block-like configuration. This gives them sturdiness and longevity. Because the cast iron material is thick, it holds on to heat well, which is good for emissions and keeps heat from leaking to other nearby parts. The thick walls do, however, mean there is a small space for exhaust gases to pass through, and the iron casting makes the interior rough which can slow the flow of exhaust gases. This creates back pressure which keeps the exhaust from being cleared as efficiently as possible. This reduces the efficiency and ultimately the power of the engine because exhaust must go out to allow fresh fuel and air in."


http://www.1aauto.com/content/articl...lds-vs-headers


here is a video explanation of the difference.





I don't see how only turbo cars have manifolds and non turbo have headers.

[hbracer93]

You are like the media, you find useless information on the internet that has nothing to do with your questions or statements and post it because it uses key words.

A turbo car will need to have "TURBO exhaust manifold" I'm so sorry for leaving out the word TURBO. the information you posted is useless to your question. You cannot install a Turbo at the end of a header and a header is meant to bolt up to the rest of your exhaust. A TURBO exhaust manifold bolts to the head much like a header but is much shorter and has a place for the turbo to bolt to, then has a down pipe that connects to the exhaust. You should spend your time looking up how a turbo works instead of the difference between a header and an exhaust manifold.

[will13k7]

the aftermarket honda turbo exhaust manifolds kind of look like headers, but their not.

[will13k7]

As with other modern turbocharged engines from Audi like the 4.0 TFSI, the exhaust manifold is integrated into the cylinder head...

[Slo.Mo.Shun.]

What did I just walk in to ???
The turbo is also attached to the head on these cars for efficiency and power. All the heat energy lost to the atmosphere in conventional turbo manifolds is insulated by the water jacket in the head. Thus allowing the energy to travel where is needed. The turbine housing. Allot of cars are using this premise now a days.

[949]

You are like the media, you find useless information on the internet that has nothing to do with your questions or statements and post it because it uses key words.

A turbo car will need to have "TURBO exhaust manifold" I'm so sorry for leaving out the word TURBO. the information you posted is useless to your question. You cannot install a Turbo at the end of a header and a header is meant to bolt up to the rest of your exhaust. A TURBO exhaust manifold bolts to the head much like a header but is much shorter and has a place for the turbo to bolt to, then has a down pipe that connects to the exhaust. You should spend your time looking up how a turbo works instead of the difference between a header and an exhaust manifold.

its because you didn't even answer the original question and now your having an issue with having references to back up the information I'm presenting. it seems like you like to post useless debates as you dont even try to answer the original question. you should start your own thread if you want to try to preach to others about that. but if you forgot what the original question was try to scroll up and check it out before posting useless comments.



the explanation is in the information posted manifolds vs headers. if you don't like the video then read the article.

as for the original question, the answer to the question is already posted.

[hbracer93]

its because you didn't even answer the original question and now your having an issue with having references to back up the information I'm presenting. it seems like you like to post useless debates as you dont even try to answer the original question. you should start your own thread if you want to try to preach to others about that. but if you forgot what the original question was try to scroll up and check it out before posting useless comments.



the explanation is in the information posted manifolds vs headers. if you don't like the video then read the article.

as for the original question, the answer to the question is already posted.

Your question was answered and you disagreed with the person about something you cannot disagree about. It's not an opinion it's fact. Turbo cars run turbo manifolds not headers. The links you posted do not apply to turbo applications. If this was an all-motor thread you would have a point but it's not. Again your video and article don't add anything to the thread and has nothing to do with turbos. I'm not debating anything because the fact of the matter is turbo cars have turbo manifolds and supercharged or naturally aspirated cars have headers.

So to recap turbo cars run turbo exhaust manifolds and down pipes. No, there will never be an aftermarket header for the S3 because the S3 is turbo charged.

[949]

he was talking about headers and manifolds. I was asking about performance headers. now your adding turbo manifolds to nothing I was even asking about. this is no longer the same subject. I was clarifying information on the initial statement. you keep trying to explain something that is not the same as the initial question.

so what help have you brought to the this discussion that doesn't help answer the initial question? your recap is a little late to the post.

No, there will never be an aftermarket header for the S3 because the S3 is turbo charged.

http://stainlessworks.net/products/p.../turbo-headers

http://www.cxracing.com/mm5/merchant...gory_Code=HDMF

just because there wont be one for the S3 doesn't mean there aren't any for turbo'd cars.
ill quote this:

While there aren't any for this car because of the engine design, headers and turbos are not mutual exclusives. I had ceramic-coated headers on my Stage 3+ B5 S4.

unless your saying this guy is wrong?

I put links because I am not all knowing , but I will research the information to back up what I am saying.

[hbracer93]

He and I said the same thing, you tried to apply information that was not related to your question. You asked about performance headers, he told you they don't exist. You argued with him and posted crap links to 2 cars that are not even turbo'd. I backed him and you twisted what I said posting more nonsense about the difference between headers and manifolds, then I added turbo in front of exhaust manifold as to not confuse you further and you are now throwing in V8's that are completely different. It would be like if I posted asking if they were going to make performance carburetors of the S3.

Hell I never would have added anything to this thread, but I saw your response to Rupert and had to correct the junk in your post, I'm by no means all knowing but some facts are not debatable. It's really just your terminology that is flawed, like when people call tires, wheels. Now if your question was will anyone ever make a performance turbo manifold for the S3...that is the question you should have asked, the answer would have still be no but at least you would have asked the right question.

[GramCracker]

Jesus christ. I didn't chime in earlier as I knew where this would lead.

hbracer93, I applaud you for trying to tackle this simple concept that appears too complex to some.

[reyoasian]

..

[S3Danny]

Wow.

[onequick4door]

Good news - the whole head that incorporates the exhaust manifold is really restrictive and has tons of porting potential! APR actually commented on that fact and showed some pictures of the crappy( I mean crappy) casting on the inside of our cars.

[PsiBlast]

Good news - the whole head that incorporates the exhaust manifold is really restrictive and has tons of porting potential! APR actually commented on that fact and showed some pictures of the crappy( I mean crappy) casting on the inside of our cars.

Awesome! I'm looking forward to upgrading my "turbo exhaust header manifold"!

[forbiddenbeat]

That escalated quickly.

I'll actually correct my previous statement - we all called AWE's aftermarket ceramic-coated manifolds "headers" just to colloquially reference them as being aftermarket. They also appeared to be more similar in construction to a header (independent runners with a collector) than a manifold (shared chambers): http://www.myaudis4.com/2015/06/17/e...fold-velocity/. But, AWE calls them manifolds, so *shrug*.

[949]

of course this escalated quickly. some like to just correct others with their "all knowing but wrong terms". he went to the next level, all I did was follow.

he just uses his terms in the argument, but he didn't follow it with backed up facts. as the term has been explained in the video and articles, you should tell them they are wrong by differentiating it that way. even though they are pretty versed in the subject.

[hbracer93]

of course this escalated quickly. some like to just correct others with their "all knowing but wrong terms". he went to the next level, all I did was follow.

he just uses his terms in the argument, but he didn't follow it with backed up facts. as the term has been explained in the video and articles, you should tell them they are wrong by differentiating it that way. even though they are pretty versed in the subject.

What backed up facts would you like...a turbo cannot bolt to a header, it has to bolt to a manifold. Thus making it a turbo manifold. My terms are not wrong. Calling me all knowing has no effect on me. I simply responded to your horrible use of misinformation. Your video and article had nothing to do with turbos, it was directed at all-motor applications and was from summit that primarily deals in naturally aspirated V8's

this is a header.



this is a turbo manifold.



Do you see and understand the difference?

Here are links.

http://www.bwrusa.com/category_s/239.htm

http://www.full-race.com/store/turbo...urbo+Manifolds

Here is everything you need to know about turbo manifolds

http://www.themotorhood.com/themotor...urbo-manifolds

http://www.davidenglish.com/swift/Te...ld_design.html

http://www.gencoupe.com/2-0t-discuss...-manifold.html

I hope this helps.

[949]

the whole thing was not saying "turbo" manifolds. try rereading the original question. it was about performance after market headers.

"when will they make performance headers for the s3? "
I hope this helps.

again people. this guy is trying to do something that was never asked in the first place.

also this company makes turbo headers.
http://stainlessworks.net/products/p.../turbo-headers
this definitely helps.

calling you all knowing was not meant to affect you.


but again I wasn't asking about that and eventually you tried to change what I posted to the other guy which was about "headers and manifolds" and not turbo headers and turbo manifolds. let me repeat to your face the statement to him so if you plan on butting in then read it carefully and follow the idea. because I pointed out through looking on vendors sites, the cars with turbo can have a performance header or manifold as per the links above and why doesn't the S3 have any. wow. trying to change the info.

guys like you don't seem to really read and understand on this site. all you did was to jump on the band wagon, such as you did on here. then added the word "turbo" which in most cases a word can define something totally different.

[RudyH]

Let's go back then...

so where are the performance aftermarket headers?
do you guys think they will make it for the S3?


the headers should not only give a bit more performance but the sound should also change, which depends on how each manufacturer creates the design.

No, the S3 doesn't use or need headers. If you would like to build a different turbo set-up, that can utilize for say a generic GT-series or such turbo, I am sure you can get something custom fabricated.

</thread>

[949]

Let's go back then...



No, the S3 doesn't use or need headers.

</thread>

I know you just erased your original first (bandwagon) comment but yeah this would have been a simple and easier answer, which I had no idea the S3 didn't have that on it.
you guys do understand that after searching on the internet, many people like myself ask simple questions on here for the answers.

[RudyH]

I know you just erased your other (bandwagon) comment but yeah this would have been a simple and easier answer which I had no idea it didn't have that on the S3.

I was just adding on why you might consider a custom exhaust manifold. Use to have a Genesis Coupe 2.0T more so around the track, and they had the same design Audi used. If you wanted to use a TD04<memory is failing> or TD05<again memory> you would could bolt it right up. If you wanted to go into a Garrett GT series, a custom exhaust manifold would be needed. It would be more inefficient, but the bigger turbo kinda made that a null point.

I am stuck in B5 S4 K03 K04, and the TD04 TD05 - and I don't care anymore cause I don't own either car to research exact turbo names

[949]

I was just adding on why you might consider a custom exhaust manifold. Use to have a Genesis Coupe 2.0T more so around the track, and they had the same design Audi used. If you wanted to use a TD04<memory is failing> or TD05<again memory> you would could bolt it right up. If you wanted to go into a Garrett GT series, a custom exhaust manifold would be needed. It would be more inefficient, but the bigger turbo kinda made that a null point.

I am stuck in B5 S4 K03 K04, and the TD04 TD05 - and I don't care anymore cause I don't own either car to research exact turbo names

I am getting old and don't remember very much at all now a days. so I am in the same boat as you and don't really care for names unless its to order food correctly. my car moding days are getting slower. I don't plan on changing the turbo. without changing out the muffler I wanted to see if there are any other parts I can change to enhance the sound. the power from this car is fine but I'm looking for the fun factor which can include the sound. in past cars changing out the headers can do something like that. so I was curious why I didn't see any on the market. this is the whole premise of the question originally... and not on how to name parts, which I can care less about.

[XLR8 Craig]

Someone should cast a new head with the necessary changes to the integrated manifold and make that integrated manifold T4 divided. stock like design, direct bolt on T4.... APR has proved that there are HUGE gains to be had from a ported head... this design would be highly beneficial to this motor making power.

Who will do it ;)

[reyoasian]

Someone should cast a new head with the necessary changes to the integrated manifold and make that integrated manifold T4 divided. stock like design, direct bolt on T4.... APR has proved that there are HUGE gains to be had from a ported head... this design would be highly beneficial to this motor making power.

Who will do it ;)

Are the internals beefy enough to support that power though....

Sims like a full build project ;)

[GramCracker]

I know you just erased your original first (bandwagon) comment but yeah this would have been a simple and easier answer, which I had no idea the S3 didn't have that on it.
you guys do understand that after searching on the internet, many people like myself ask simple questions on here for the answers.

I'm all for asking questions, but the first post after the OP literally had the answer. I'm not sure why RudyH needed to restate that in a different way 26 posts later, but whatever helps you understand.

I am getting old and don't remember very much at all now a days. so I am in the same boat as you and don't really care for names unless its to order food correctly. my car moding days are getting slower. I don't plan on changing the turbo. without changing out the muffler I wanted to see if there are any other parts I can change to enhance the sound. the power from this car is fine but I'm looking for the fun factor which can include the sound. in past cars changing out the headers can do something like that. so I was curious why I didn't see any on the market. this is the whole premise of the question originally... and not on how to name parts, which I can care less about.

Again, this post (quoted below) can answer your question (in bold, which was also noted in the op) here:

S3 is a turbo charged 4 cylinder with the exhaust manifold built into the head of the engine. There is no such thing as headers for this platform or turbo charged cars. A downpipe accomplishes what you are after.

headers are for naturally aspirated or roots type supercharged vehicles. not turbo cars.

[XLR8 Craig]

Are the internals beefy enough to support that power though....

Sims like a full build project ;)

That is exactly who this would be intended for. Those who are building the motor to make full use of this power potential. The Motor can do it, with the right parts. :)

[tateltot]

Heh. Man, I remember when I was first learning how internal combustion engines work. Then forced induction. Then proper use of your and you're, their, there and they're. So many good memories.

I would encourage anyone who's new to auto ownership to read a few encyclopedia entries. Have an academic adventure. Teach yourself how your car works. It would save us all from so many "...if I replace my bypass valve with an HKS EagleCry BOV, will it add 20 horsepower?" "Why do I need a boost gauge?" "How is babby formed?" questions.

[RudyH]

I am getting old and don't remember very much at all now a days. so I am in the same boat as you and don't really care for names unless its to order food correctly. my car moding days are getting slower. I don't plan on changing the turbo. without changing out the muffler I wanted to see if there are any other parts I can change to enhance the sound. the power from this car is fine but I'm looking for the fun factor which can include the sound. in past cars changing out the headers can do something like that. so I was curious why I didn't see any on the market. this is the whole premise of the question originally... and not on how to name parts, which I can care less about.

Audi was using a sound actuator on the 2013+ S4's...pretty sure they were using one on the S3 too, I remember reading.

Maybe it would be cheaper to just upgrade that to say a RS7, C63 AMG or M5

[forbiddenbeat]

I am getting old and don't remember very much at all now a days. so I am in the same boat as you and don't really care for names unless its to order food correctly. my car moding days are getting slower. I don't plan on changing the turbo. without changing out the muffler I wanted to see if there are any other parts I can change to enhance the sound. the power from this car is fine but I'm looking for the fun factor which can include the sound. in past cars changing out the headers can do something like that. so I was curious why I didn't see any on the market. this is the whole premise of the question originally... and not on how to name parts, which I can care less about.

You want a downpipe then and a stage 2 tune (makes use of the downpipe).

[Jake@JHM]

Are the internals beefy enough to support that power though....

Sims like a full build project ;)

A MK7R recently ran 10.5@130 with a stock motor. However they tried pushing it a little further and popped it.

[Blaine]

Someone should cast a new head with the necessary changes to the integrated manifold and make that integrated manifold T4 divided. stock like design, direct bolt on T4.... APR has proved that there are HUGE gains to be had from a ported head... this design would be highly beneficial to this motor making power.

Who will do it ;)

I believe APR addressed the problems encoutered of porting the heads of an S3 or an aftermarket manifold on the S3 in another post where this was brought up.

APR related that the problem was with the tuning after the heads were ported was a problem. The gains were not worth the $$ in problems it caused?? But it has been done already. What exact problems they encountered? I'm not sure.

[selp]

Love the ignorance some people have, and the willingness to win an argument based on what they think they know.
Cute.

[949]

Audi was using a sound actuator on the 2013+ S4's...pretty sure they were using one on the S3 too, I remember reading.

Maybe it would be cheaper to just upgrade that to say a RS7, C63 AMG or M5

those cars are super large for me. I like small powerful cars. I would have bought the rs3 if it was available at the time. as for changing cars right now after I have purchased the s3 is a no go on the check book. I usually try to keep a car for 6-10 years unless something really bad happens then it would go sooner. I do like the sound actuator in the S3. I have read about the complaints but its kinda fun and again for me its all about fun when driving and not so much just pure power and 0-60 times.

as for fun, I had a lot of fun on my other cars such as a Honda civic. I decided that I wanted to mess around on an older car so I purchased an older civic. the performance parts were in abundance everywhere. it took some time to learn all that were to do with the car but I decided to turbo the NA car. I built all of it from the ground up from my garage. I ported the head, installed supertech springs, supertech valves, regrinded the cam shaft for higher lift and a more performance oriented lobe. I got lower compression cp pistons with eagle rods. sleeved the piston. got custom made engine mounts where there were non available for the car at the time. the manufacturer used my car as a prototype. got the complete rywire engine harness with vtec conversion. custom made exhaust from a local popular muffler guy. had a full bbk conversion made for my car which still kept the car's 4wd system in tact. I used hondata s300 to tune, which I tuned myself on a dynapack dyno. tuning for turbo, vtec, boost by gear, and different mapping for different driving event was very timing consuming but very rewarding. as for ecu, I used a p28 with the hondata s300. for entertainment, I did a full stereo with custom cnc brackets for two amps and rear speakers.
to get here I have tried many things and learned a lot from experts and I appreciate that they shared their knowledge. I believe every car has enough differences from other makes and models. so no one can be versed in everything, plus when we get old our memories fade.

not to the full extent of the civic but I did mod my Subaru sti and acura nsx. those were moded more for driving around with a little bit more feel, if that makes sense.