344 AWHP, 350WTQ - JB1 + FBO '15 Audi S3 (Thank you to JB1 George & Emmanuele Design)

[Chako]

Car: '15 Audi S3
Fuel: 94 Octane Pump Gas only

Power mods:
-JB1 @ 5.5 Setting
-CTS Intake
-Bull X Catted Downpipe
-HG Motorsports Intercooler
-HG Motorsports Turbo Muffler Delete
-Forge VTA BOV

Awesome support from both George @ Burger Tuning JB1 & Thomas @ Emmanuele Design. They were a big help during the install process and I would have no hesitation buying from them again. The car feels quick and very smooth, spools very fast and pulls right to redline. I think the car has an 11 second pass in it at 114-116MPH but we'll see!

Dyno below:


Also, as a sidenote the ED springs look and feel great also!

[jiannu]

That's amazing! I can't wait till all my parts are in....will have to get in touch with George as well as I pretty much have everything you have + boost piping both throttle and outlet as well as silicone pipes. Right now I have it on factory settings (JB1) and love it! Although I don't like open air intakes...as I'm using a completely closed application with a Injen evo 3000.

[matsayswhat]

That must be fun to drive. How nuts does it sound and feel? Have any videos yet?

[Chako]

That's amazing! I can't wait till all my parts are in....will have to get in touch with George as well as I pretty much have everything you have + boost piping both throttle and outlet as well as silicone pipes. Right now I have it on factory settings (JB1) and love it! Although I don't like open air intakes...as I'm using a completely closed application with a Injen evo 3000.

Nice man! I'm interested to see what those boost pipes do as well.
Although the boost increase is only .5-.7 over the preset JB1 setting it actually makes a noticeable difference. Love the look of the CF closed intakes but really wanted the sound of an open intake - I think CTS' metal heat shielding around the filter does a pretty good job keeping the heat out, although I don't think you can go wrong either way.

That must be fun to drive. How nuts does it sound and feel? Have any videos yet?

It's pretty quick! The car is a lot more fun now and seems pretty natural at this power level. The sound is perfect, not too loud or quiet. The intake, BOV, and downpipe combo I'm very happy with; maybe the turbo muffler delete makes a small difference also.

[EmmanueleDesign]

Thanks for letting us be a part of your project! Great results!

[Chako]

Thanks for letting us be a part of your project! Great results!

Thanks Thomas!

As a reference point here is an FBO 335is (Intake, catless downpipes, intercooler, tune) on pump gas making 377RWHP and 405 WTQ on the same dyno:


Looks like pre-drivetrain loss power should be fairly similar, maybe a touch less than the N54 which is great.

[ChrisF1]

Very impressive results!

Can I ask why you went JB1 vs. custom tuned flash?

[Chako]

Very impressive results!

Can I ask why you went JB1 vs. custom tuned flash?

Hey Chris there are several reasons I went with the JB1:
-Easy PnP
-Can be uninstalled and someone will want to buy it preowned
-Change boost settings in 2 minutes for different driving conditions
-Great support from George

As you can see the results are quite strong also

[tekkie]

Hey Chris there are several reasons I went with the JB1:
-Easy PnP
-Can be uninstalled and someone will want to buy it preowned
-Change boost settings in 2 minutes for different driving conditions
-Great support from George

As you can see the results are quite strong also

Not to mention the number one reason, you can keep your warranty by removing it. At least at my dealer they don't bother with bolt ons

[Baggio]

Not to mention the number one reason, you can keep your warranty by removing it. At least at my dealer they don't bother with bolt ons

The JB1 leaves more residual data that a tune that is reflashed to stock. The dealer will see overboost for sure when they scan it.

[JohnnyUtah787]

The JB1 leaves more residual data that a tune that is reflashed to stock. The dealer will see overboost for sure when they scan it.

Got a link to this info? I'm curious.

[Baggio]

Got a link to this info? I'm curious.

The ecu logs boost. The JB1 increases boost. It's common sense that they will be able see the higher boost number. On my 2006 Mazdaspeed6 they were able see overboost with a piggyback. Now will void your warranty? Who knows? Blow turbo, then I guess it could become an issue.

[JohnnyUtah787]

The ecu logs boost. The JB1 increases boost. It's common sense that they will be able see the higher boost number. On my 2006 Mazdaspeed6 they were able see overboost with a piggyback. Now will void your warranty? Who knows? Blow turbo, then I guess it could become an issue.

So if both the JB1 and an ecu tune increase boost, then it would seem equally likely that both could be detected if someone looks hard enough I guess.

[tekkie]

The JB1 leaves more residual data that a tune that is reflashed to stock. The dealer will see overboost for sure when they scan it.

does the ecu store the data after you remove power to it?

[Baggio]

does the ecu store the data after you remove power to it?

Not sure about that. I would think that it would clear it, but who knows these days with these newer ECUs.

[tekkie]

Not sure about that. I would think that it would clear it, but who knows these days with these newer ECUs.

That's what I have always assumed as well, that was my plan anyway :)

[13B]

The ecu logs boost. The JB1 increases boost. It's common sense that they will be able see the higher boost number. On my 2006 Mazdaspeed6 they were able see overboost with a piggyback. Now will void your warranty? Who knows? Blow turbo, then I guess it could become an issue.

It logs the boost from the MAP sensor. The MAP is reading factory boost levels because it is in effect being fooled. The major difference I see between the JB1 and Neuspeed Module is that the JB1 connects to the fuel rail pressure sensor and acts to increase duty cycle which keeps fuel trims in line with the factory settings.

So the claim is that if the dealer looked at a JB1 equipped car they would see factory boost levels with no overboost triggers, as well as STFT and LTFT would be within acceptable norm due to the fuel rail pressure duty cycle increasing with the corresponding boost increase.

[Baggio]

It logs the boost from the MAP sensor. The MAP is reading factory boost levels because it is in effect being fooled. The major difference I see between the JB1 and Neuspeed Module is that the JB1 connects to the fuel rail pressure sensor and acts to increase duty cycle which keeps fuel trims in line with the factory settings.

So the claim is that if the dealer looked at a JB1 equipped car they would see factory boost levels with no overboost triggers, as well as STFT and LTFT would be within acceptable norm due to the fuel rail pressure duty cycle increasing with the corresponding boost increase.

Wait a minute? So the MAP sensor is not seeing actual boost in the throttle tube? Sounds like a recipe for disaster if it isn't seeing the actual boost level and adjusting fuel/timing to the actual boost levels. I thought these piggy backs modified the signals from the ECU to increase boost? That's not fooling the MAP sensors. That is fooling the ECU in what boost levels it is calling for under throttle. There have already been cases of people getting caught with piggy backs because it leaves traces that can be found from the various sensors on the car. I talked to another customer of tuning shop I take make car to and he said the dealer was able to determine he had a piggy back because of sensor data outside of stock parameters. The real question is if that data gets erased by disconnecting the battery.

[Chako]

It logs the boost from the MAP sensor. The MAP is reading factory boost levels because it is in effect being fooled. The major difference I see between the JB1 and Neuspeed Module is that the JB1 connects to the fuel rail pressure sensor and acts to increase duty cycle which keeps fuel trims in line with the factory settings.

So the claim is that if the dealer looked at a JB1 equipped car they would see factory boost levels with no overboost triggers, as well as STFT and LTFT would be within acceptable norm due to the fuel rail pressure duty cycle increasing with the corresponding boost increase.

+1 ECU sees the stock boost because map sensor signals are altered and the ECU only targets programmed boost level, therefore logs of torque and boost are stock.

Wait a minute? So the MAP sensor is not seeing actual boost in the throttle tube? Sounds like a recipe for disaster if it isn't seeing the actual boost level and adjusting fuel/timing to the actual boost levels. I thought these piggy backs modified the signals from the ECU to increase boost? That's not fooling the MAP sensors. That is fooling the ECU in what boost levels it is calling for under throttle. There have already been cases of people getting caught with piggy backs because it leaves traces that can be found from the various sensors on the car. I talked to another customer of tuning shop I take make car to and he said the dealer was able to determine he had a piggy back because of sensor data outside of stock parameters. The real question is if that data gets erased by disconnecting the battery.

AFR is following the stock target, I had a tailpipe sensor hooked up during dyno to monitor this.
BMW tuning scene has been using JB boxes for around 8 years with great results, it's a proven product.

[Baggio]

+1 ECU sees the stock boost because map sensor signals are altered and the ECU only targets programmed boost level, therefore logs of torque and boost are stock.



AFR is following the stock target, I had a tailpipe sensor hooked up during dyno to monitor this.
BMW tuning scene has been using JB boxes for around 8 years with great results, it's a proven product.

I am not doubting the product. I just was doubting the part about the MAP sensor being fooled. It is interesting that it still logs stock boost. The dealers must be able to see other sensor data, because I talked to guy that got caught. Not sure what they can see though.

[13B]

I am not doubting the product. I just was doubting the part about the MAP sensor being fooled. It is interesting that it still logs stock boost. The dealers must be able to see other sensor data, because I talked to guy that got caught. Not sure what they can see though.

The assumption being made is that the factory AFR targets for factory boost levels, as well as timing, are so conservative that the addition of another 4.5 to 5.5 psi are well covered. From personal experience tuning mostly rotary turbos, but also some subaru turbo engines this is reasonable. Especially now that the engines in the VW line operate in closed loop for the very situations we are concerned about.

All that written, if someone got caught with a piggy back rather then all of us speculate they should come on the forum and explain the details. STFT / LTFT would be easy to spot from altering MAP signals, but that is not supposed to apply to the JB1.

[Baggio]

The assumption being made is that the factory AFR targets for factory boost levels, as well as timing, are so conservative that the addition of another 4.5 to 5.5 psi are well covered. From personal experience tuning mostly rotary turbos, but also some subaru turbo engines this is reasonable. Especially now that the engines in the VW line operate in closed loop for the very situations we are concerned about.

All that written, if someone got caught with a piggy back rather then all of us speculate they should come on the forum and explain the details. STFT / LTFT would be easy to spot from altering MAP signals, but that is not supposed to apply to the JB1.

I don't know the guy. I just briefly met him when I was at the shop. I have know idea if he had a JB1. He said he had piggyback and got caught even after he removed it. I wish I had more details.

[JohnnyUtah787]

This is the kind of good, informative conversation I like to see on this forum

That being said, I'll add this to the mix. Found it on the 8V Facebook group posted by George.

"the ECU logs stock and no loggable values out of the normal are stored. The boost is done by lower boost pressure voltage so the ECU only hits target hence it being invisible."

[2015S3]

It's sees stock levels my p3 race pack with boost and AFR are all stock. I would need a secondary boost sensor to see the real boost on the gauge, it connects through the OBD port

[roadrunner_oz]

As far as I am aware no tuner claims TD1 free, just ask them.

Disconnecting the battery will not wipe logs or stored adaptions.

[jpy1980]

In for updates. How is the car running so far? I'm on CA 91 octane, what powers do you think I'd be running if I had your same mods?

[drew4392]

The JB1 leaves more residual data that a tune that is reflashed to stock. The dealer will see overboost for sure when they scan it.

Careful with stating things as fact.

It logs the boost from the MAP sensor. The MAP is reading factory boost levels because it is in effect being fooled. The major difference I see between the JB1 and Neuspeed Module is that the JB1 connects to the fuel rail pressure sensor and acts to increase duty cycle which keeps fuel trims in line with the factory settings.

So the claim is that if the dealer looked at a JB1 equipped car they would see factory boost levels with no overboost triggers, as well as STFT and LTFT would be within acceptable norm due to the fuel rail pressure duty cycle increasing with the corresponding boost increase.

This. And the "someone was caught with a piggyback" stories are speculative until we hear first-hand for once. I am not aware of one (map 1, not a custom map, etc), but please do link a report if I missed it.