Anyone done the stage 2 without the down pipes?

[Barritia]

I see a thread on here a few weeks ago going on about the stage 2 being more powerful due to the tune and not the downpipes on the S6 so has anyone just done the tune to see? I'm seriously considering stage 3 but don't want to currently get locked into a down pipe and if the downpipes on the S6 are the same as the RS would the down pipes In theory not be more than capable enough on the S6 with a stage 2 tune?

Educate me people.

[soccerking93]

I thought it was a one size fits all kit. Wouldn't it be dangerous to run the car piece meal like that?

[markreed]

Just do the rs downpipes now...and run a stage two file

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[MadAboutCars]

I see a thread on here a few weeks ago going on about the stage 2 being more powerful due to the tune and not the downpipes on the S6 so has anyone just done the tune to see? I'm seriously considering stage 3 but don't want to currently get locked into a down pipe and if the downpipes on the S6 are the same as the RS would the down pipes In theory not be more than capable enough on the S6 with a stage 2 tune?

Educate me people.

Personally, I don't think you will see much difference between the Unitronic stage 1+ and the APR stage 2, and with stage 3, you have to live with the extra turbo lag the RS turbos have, which is very noticeable around town.

[Dguth]

Personally, I don't think you will see much difference between the Unitronic stage 1+ and the APR stage 2, and with stage 3, you have to live with the extra turbo lag the RS turbos have, which is very noticeable around town.

Do you have the rs7 turbos? How much lag is there in daily driving. I'm going stage 3 and had not really thought out about that. Is it pretty sluggish?


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[VVG]

Do you have the rs7 turbos? How much lag is there in daily driving. I'm going stage 3 and had not really thought out about that. Is it pretty sluggish?


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It won't be "sluggish", but you will definitely notice the extra lag during low speed driving. Of course during low speed driving, you likely also won't care.

[hubris]

Interesting, first I am hearing of turbo lag. Does the RS7 itself have the turbo lag you guys are speaking of? Or is that only if the RS7 turbos are transplanted into an S6/7?

[soccerking93]

If there's lag no point in going with rs7 turbos as that will kill the street ability. Might as well just go with like gt28's or gt30's at that point. For now I'll prolly stick to what mark reed suggested and do rs7 downpipes and call it a day. I wonder if they could be picked up for cheap from someone on here who's upgraded?

[MadAboutCars]

Do you have the rs7 turbos? How much lag is there in daily driving. I'm going stage 3 and had not really thought out about that. Is it pretty sluggish?


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I'm comparing it to my tuned MY16 S6 and a stock RS6 I drove (albeit the RS6 was a MY15 model).

If you look at before and after stage 3 dynos, you will see there is less torque lower in the RPM range with the RS turbos, as the bigger turbine takes longer to spool up, because it needs more exhaust pressure.

[Barritia]

So they are not the same down pipes between the S and the RS like I thought?

[MadAboutCars]

My understanding is the downnpipes for the S snd RS are the same.

[Barritia]

That's what I heard too. Not sure if that's true though but someone on here must be in the know if they are.

Which if they are then why would they be a retriction on a S6 when the RS can put way more power through them with no issue.

I would love to see a dyno with stage 2 with and without down pipes.

[VVG]

People shouldn't get into a panic about turbo lag. After all, you are starting with a 4 liter V8, not a 1.8 liter 4. Yes there is going to be more of a delay before you get that huge swell of torque with the bigger turbos, but it is not significantly more. And the fact that you are starting with a V8 means that the car will not be slow off the line. Even the stock S cars have lag. Go drive a highly tuned NA car and you will be spoiled for throttle response, but you also don't get that huge swell of torque that only turbos can provide. However, if you want big torque and no lag, there in no replacement for displacement.

[MadAboutCars]

That's what I heard too. Not sure if that's true though but someone on here must be in the know if they are.

Which if they are then why would they be a retriction on a S6 when the RS can put way more power through them with no issue.

I would love to see a dyno with stage 2 with and without down pipes.

That was Vol's theory as well, but I guess all restrictions add up, especially when the turbo's are maxed out.

[markreed]

Just to be clear, I meant to go with aftermarket rs downpipes now, if planning to stage 3.

I almost went with them, and I have no plans to go stage 3...just found a good deal on them.

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[soccerking93]

You could say the same thing for just about any car or engine. Like that Vette makes 800 horses on the stock heads and cam so they must not be restrictive! But how do you know it won't make 900 or 1000 Hp with better h&c?

That's what I heard too. Not sure if that's true though but someone on here must be in the know if they are.

Which if they are then why would they be a retriction on a S6 when the RS can put way more power through them with no issue.

I would love to see a dyno with stage 2 with and without down pipes.

[playwithonehand]

my rs6 turbo was in yesterday and omg what a fk huge difference, so far only felt once a slight lag in drive.

In Sport every rpm is faster, stronger and more responsive than S6 turbo.

S6 turbo looks tiny compare to rs7 turbo

Dont read too much into Vol4.0 who is against all aftermarket.

APR CAST DOWNPIPE no question ask one of the best$$$ i spent in my life.

gonna do some drag strip tonight

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[S4Per]

Congrats on the upgrade! I forget if you were you Stage 1 or 2 before?

[soccerking93]

Very nice what are you running for fueling?

[playwithonehand]

i was on stage 1 oe tuningwith custom dp, now proud to be Apr stage 3 owner :)

Running 93aki/98ron aiming for 10.9 to 11.2 at least 126mph

anything lower i would sad haha

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[S4Per]

:)
When are you hitting the track?


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[soccerking93]

What about injectors and fuel pump? rs6?

[S4Per]

Stage 3, at least with the RS7 turbos, doesn't require a fuel system update.


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[soccerking93]

How many cc's can the stock fueling flow?

[Sean@APR]

I see a thread on here a few weeks ago going on about the stage 2 being more powerful due to the tune and not the downpipes on the S6 so has anyone just done the tune to see? I'm seriously considering stage 3 but don't want to currently get locked into a down pipe and if the downpipes on the S6 are the same as the RS would the down pipes In theory not be more than capable enough on the S6 with a stage 2 tune?

Educate me people.

A particular forum user is pushing that opinion rather strongly. Our testing disagrees. The pipes make results even with the Stage 1 software. Put the right software with them and it's even better. The pipes rather dramatically change the VE (volumetric efficiency) of the engine. Stage 2 software is designed to run properly with the changed VE. Running it without the pipes isn't going to work because the restriction is still present (lower VE).

As a rule, APR doesn't release anything that doesn't make provable power. I can go back through a list of products we've worked on that went to the bin because they didn't work.

The RS7 turbos are slightly laggier than the stock S6/S7 units, but it's not anything huge. It's certainly not like having GT28s or GT30s. Drive a stock RS6/RS7 and you'll get the same experience. It's very drivable and even more stupid fast when you want it to be.

The real question is, how far do you want to go?

[Sean@APR]

How many cc's can the stock fueling flow?

What about injectors and fuel pump? rs6?

We've done over 1000hp with stock injectors. It did require high and low pressure pumps.

[S4Per]

Edit: great to have experience based knowledge here vs theoretical. Thanks for sharing!
Do you recall what duty cycle looked like for that project, or where it's at for your stage 3 offering?

[Chris Morales]

Sean, are you guys able to provide the extended pipes and hardware necessary to install the stage 2 downpipes on an S8?

[Suii]

Sean, are you guys able to provide the extended pipes and hardware necessary to install the stage 2 downpipes on an S8?

Also waiting for a response on this, us S8 guys are a small group lol

[maxhawk]

The RS7 turbos are slightly laggier than the stock S6/S7 units, but it's not anything huge. It's certainly not like having GT28s or GT30s. Drive a stock RS6/RS7 and you'll get the same experience. It's very drivable and even more stupid fast when you want it to be.

Would you compare the lag to be similar to the difference between K03 vs K04 on the B5 S4 from days of yore?

[Chris Morales]

Also waiting for a response on this, us S8 guys are a small group lol

Great to have company! Now the economic demand with us both will be overwhelming. Ha

[Ensoniq]

Interesting, first I am hearing of turbo lag. Does the RS7 itself have the turbo lag you guys are speaking of? Or is that only if the RS7 turbos are transplanted into an S6/7?

Yes there's a slight lag with the RS7 but hard to sweat it when you get 2.9 to sixty on demand. I think it's a benefit - otherwise drive train would be always breaking things

[Sean@APR]

Would you compare the lag to be similar to the difference between K03 vs K04 on the B5 S4 from days of yore?

K03 vs K04 is a great comparison. I haven't been around long enough to know anything about B5.

[VVG]

K03 vs K04 is a great comparison. I haven't been around long enough to know anything about B5.

I have. In fact, I had the second Stage 3 B5 kit that APR ever publicly sold. Very similar. Just a slight overall delay in the torque swell, but watch out when it came on.

[S4Per]

K03 vs K04 is a great comparison. I haven't been around long enough to know anything about B5.

I'm a little confused by your statement of it being a great comparison, while you have not had familiarity with the B5 where these were used. What makes you say it's a great comparison? (I'm sure I'm missing something here).

I have. In fact, I had the second Stage 3 B5 kit that APR ever publicly sold. Very similar. Just a slight overall delay in the torque swell, but watch out when it came on.

Agree that the difference in lag was very minimal here.