2002 1.8 a 4 sudden disapperance of clutch

[refueler]

The 2002 1.8 5 spd manual A4 that I've rebuilt was running and driving great until today. I was slowing down to turn onto a side road and down shifting into 3rd gear in preparation to make the turn. When I made the turn I shifted into 2nd gear and I thought I missed it because it only revved up when I tried to accelerate away, so I tried putting into 2nd again but there was nothing there. As I coasted to a stop I tried the other gears nothings there. You can put in 5th gear at idle let the clutch out and it sits there idling as happy as can be no change in rpm you can't tell from the engine runs that you put the car into gear and engaged the clutch. The transmission appears to shift through all of the gears normally the clutch pedal feels normal. Very strange it made no noise, no smell, and I can find no evidence of leaking fluid its like the clutch is not engaging the fly wheel. The previous owner converted this car from an automatic to a 5 spd manual so I'm hoping someone has an idea as to what went wrong with the clutch/transmission. Thank you in advance

[Let it snow]

Almost sounds like you lost an axle. It would have made some noise though. Just throwing that out there.

[MurkyRivers_A4]

I broke an axle on my eclipse. Made a faint pop sound and then did the exact same thing. Clutch pedal felt fine and resistant, transmission was able to row through the gears, but when I let the clutch out while in gear she did nothing.

Open differential problems lol

[MetalMan]

I agree with the theory on broken axle, and considering this happened mid-turn I'm guessing a front axle.
Lift the car off the ground, and check to see if the transmission output flanges are spinning with the transmission in gear (engine idling).

[refueler]

Thank you for the input I'm focused on getting the engine out of a 1999 Ford Ranger. I don't need this right now what a horrible job just to change out a rusted oil pan the engine has to come out. The broken drive axle makes a lot of sense I'll start with the broken axle thank you guys.

[refueler]

Checked out the drive axles no problem there I was trying different things and I can shift through the gears with the engine running with out using the clutch no grinding it shifts smoothly. I guess the transmission has to come out to see what is going on. I have all of the parts to a six speed transmission set up I've been thinking about putting that into the car if I take the 5 spd out any reason I shouldn't do that.

[CyberPMG]

If you have quattro, did you check all 4 axles?

[refueler]

I can check again but I don't understand how I can shift the transmission into any gear without using the clutch while the engine is running. It shifts as if the clutch is being used but there is no engagement with the flywheel.

[SJorge3442]

I can check again but I don't understand how I can shift the transmission into any gear without using the clutch while the engine is running. It shifts as if the clutch is being used but there is no engagement with the flywheel.

Audi's use open diffs. If one axle is broke (disconnected) that flange on the transmission will just spin and spin (zero friction on gear box). If you were to jack up your car and leave one wheel off the ground, you could start your car and put it in gear and it wouldn't fall off the jack. 100% of the power would go to that wheel and that wheel only. The other 3 wheels on the ground wouldnt receive any power.

[refueler]

I agree that if one of the axles was broken that all of the power would go to that wheel. But I don't think that explains how I can shift from 1st to 2nd without using the clutch with the engine running. The last time I tried that when my transmission was functioning properly it did not go into gear it just made a grinding noise and did not go into gear until I depressed the clutch pedal. Even if all of the axles were broken with the engine running I would think that the transmission would either grind going into gear or it would not be able to go into gear as the transmission would be engaged with the flywheel and turning at the same speed as the engine. Not only can I shift from 1st to 2nd to 3rd to 4th to 5th I can shift from 5th to reverse with the engine running and not use the clutch I would think going from 5th to reverse would not be possible if the transmission is turning like you seem to be suggesting. I think that some how my clutch must be disengaged all of the time I can't see any other way I can be shifting between gears without using the clutch while the engine is running. I guess the transmission is coming out after I get the engine back into the Ranger.

[CyberPMG]

It could also be possible the springs in the pressure plate broke. I had that happen to me but caught it as it would start to slip while in gear.

[SJorge3442]

I agree that if one of the axles was broken that all of the power would go to that wheel. But I don't think that explains how I can shift from 1st to 2nd without using the clutch with the engine running. The last time I tried that when my transmission was functioning properly it did not go into gear it just made a grinding noise and did not go into gear until I depressed the clutch pedal. Even if all of the axles were broken with the engine running I would think that the transmission would either grind going into gear or it would not be able to go into gear as the transmission would be engaged with the flywheel and turning at the same speed as the engine. Not only can I shift from 1st to 2nd to 3rd to 4th to 5th I can shift from 5th to reverse with the engine running and not use the clutch I would think going from 5th to reverse would not be possible if the transmission is turning like you seem to be suggesting. I think that some how my clutch must be disengaged all of the time I can't see any other way I can be shifting between gears without using the clutch while the engine is running. I guess the transmission is coming out after I get the engine back into the Ranger.

Yeah you have a valid point about the shifting. Im not transmission expert, so I can't confirm, but logically, it makes sense. I would hit up Scotty at AdvancedAuto Motion and ask him. Hes quite a guru of audi transmissions. At this point, I'm leaning towards the pressure plate being broken or something, causing the clutch disc to not even be spinning.

[Captain_Panic]

I think there is a misunderstanding of the internals here. All of the transmission parts are spinning at all times while the engine is running. It almost seems like your linkage might be busted if you can put it in any gear while running and not getting any grinding. If your pressure plate were failing, you would have noticed the clutch slipping worse and worse over time. If it broke, you likely would have heard shards clanging about in the bellhousing.

I am not feeling well, so I hope read everything correctly, and hope I am explaining myself properly.

[diagnosticator]

I can check again but I don't understand how I can shift the transmission into any gear without using the clutch while the engine is running. It shifts as if the clutch is being used but there is no engagement with the flywheel.

Besides a broken axle shaft, other possible causes for the drive torque to not be transmitted to the wheels is a broken trans input shaft, broken internal trans gear shaft, etc. If your A4 is quattro, then the broken shaft must be located before the trans output to the front and center diffs.

[refueler]

It is a Quattro once I get the transmission out other than seeing broken parts how would I diagnose the other possible broken parts. Would I have to disassemble the transmission "oh I've never done that before" that would be an adventure. I don't know anything about the inner workings of a manual or automatic transmission. So when your are sitting still with the engine idling and your foot depressing the clutch pedal the internal gears to the transmission are still turning I would not have thought that would be the case. Oh maybe I didn't make my self clear that my car will not move when I've been talking about being able to shit through all of the gears what amazes me is shifting from 5th gear to reverse with out using the clutch. In the end the transmission is coming out as I stated earlier I have a 2004 manual transmission with all of the parts to convert from 5 spd to 6spd is this something I should consider or are there draw backs to doing this I always liked the 6spd.

[Captain_Panic]

The shift linkage, the clutch, or an axle could be the cause of your issues. Check the axles and linkage first. If everything there is fine, I would go for the 6 speed swap since you will have to remove most everything anyway for the clutch.

[refueler]

I am leaning towards putting the 6 spd transmission into the Audi. I made good progress on the ranger today I managed to put the engine back into the truck. When I finish the Ranger I plan on tackling the Audi transmission.

[diagnosticator]

I am leaning towards putting the 6 spd transmission into the Audi. I made good progress on the ranger today I managed to put the engine back into the truck. When I finish the Ranger I plan on tackling the Audi transmission.

If the axles are all good, after removing the trans, then spinning the trans input shaft with the trans in gear, if the trans is broken internally there will be no rotation of the trans output shaft.

[refueler]

Thanks diagnosticator I've been thinking about how I was going to figure out what my problem with the with 2002 5spd tranny.

[refueler]

I finally got the transmission out and the splined center hub of the clutch disk was broken off from the friction portion of the disk. Some how it didn't make contact or any noise when the engine was running. I guess that's probably a good thing as it didn't cause any other damage. All there is to do now is to buy a new clutch and reinstall everything.

[maurizio]

any pics?

[refueler]

I hope that this works here is a picture of the broken clutch disk

[refueler]

sorry new at posting pictures I guess I will try to learn how to post pictures

[Kevin C]

sorry new at posting pictures I guess I will try to learn how to post pictures

On Photobucket, click on direct and copy the url.

Click on Insert image and paste that url into the popup window.

[Captain_Panic]

WHOA!

[MoparFreak69]

Yeah! That's how you do it! My GTI clutch rattled like a mofo only a couple months after replacing it. It was separated, but had somehow wedged itself together enough to last me a couple days while waiting on the replacement.

[refueler]

The clutch disk never made any noises of any kind and worked fine right up to when it broke. After it broke you could shift into any gear without using the clutch while the motor was running and it still didn't make any noise at all.