Floor Jack Failure

[eightamrock]

I wanted to post a little PSA as we are starting to swap out winter tires for our summer shoes.

Remember to use jack stands! My 2-ton sears floor jack decided to fail mid tire swap today. I pumped up the first tire, threw under my jack stand and started taking the wheel off when I saw the jack just sink slowly back to resting position. The valve must have gone bad because there was no hydraulic fluid leaking, or any other signs of failure. It just would no longer hold any weight. I had to finish the swap with my widow maker, which made me very uncomfortable.

Now I'm in the market for a new floor jack. I like the schwaben low pro, but I cant seem to find any reviews on it. I found a few threads with people saying they have them, but I was just curious for more details about the quality. I've inherited that sears jack which has to be at least 25 years old now, Ive had it myself for at least 10 years handed down to me by my father-in-law. Looking for something that will last the next lifetime.

Any thoughts?

[stigster]

Costco has a low profile jack Arcan 3.25 ton for around $100. I use it and am more than happy.

[kobrian85]

I'm using a Harbor Freight nothing-special-something, I think it's a 3-ton. It works as intended, nothing special, was a gift a few years ago, they are pretty inexpensive.

The only thing I would do differently is get a low profile, like the Schwaben one you link, but that's only because I'll likely have a lowered car for the next several years. That said though, the one I have worked ok with my previous JSW on coils, it was a pretty tight fit, but it worked.

[jmeenach]

I have this one front Harbor Freight. Works great.

http://www.harborfreight.com/3-ton-l...ump-61253.html

[eightamrock]

I'm using a Harbor Freight nothing-special-something, I think it's a 3-ton. It works as intended, nothing special, was a gift a few years ago, they are pretty inexpensive.

The only thing I would do differently is get a low profile, like the Schwaben one you link, but that's only because I'll likely have a lowered car for the next several years. That said though, the one I have worked ok with my previous JSW on coils, it was a pretty tight fit, but it worked.

The 2-ton sears jack I had did not fit under the car at stock height with the pinch weld adapter on it. I had to put the adapter on and then slide the jack under it. I definitely plan on a set of coil overs in late summer, so I think a low profile is a wise choice for me. I found some pittsburgh brand stuff at harbor freight. Looks identical with the same dimensions and capacity as the schwaben, but its $200 less. I imagine these are mass produced somewhere and companies just slap their logo/colors on them.

[eightamrock]

I have this one front Harbor Freight. Works great.

http://www.harborfreight.com/3-ton-l...ump-61253.html

I was just looking at the aluminum version of this one for about $90 more. Do you think the steel or aluminum construction make a difference? Im not lugging it around, I only use it in my garage....

[jmeenach]

I was just looking at the aluminum version of this one for about $90 more. Do you think the steel or aluminum construction make a difference? Im not lugging it around, I only use it in my garage....

If they have the same rating, I wouldn't be more concerned about one than the other. I just went steel because it was cheaper. The only time I regretted my choice was when I had to lift it by myself into the back of a bronco on 38s. Wished I had the aluminum one in that moment

[kobrian85]

The 2-ton sears jack I had did not fit under the car at stock height with the pinch weld adapter on it. I had to put the adapter on and then slide the jack under it. I definitely plan on a set of coil overs in late summer, so I think a low profile is a wise choice for me. I found some pittsburgh brand stuff at harbor freight. Looks identical with the same dimensions and capacity as the schwaben, but its $200 less. I imagine these are mass produced somewhere and companies just slap their logo/colors on them.

Out of curiosity, which pinch weld pucks did you decide to go with?

I think at the end of the day, a jack is a jack. And if you are responsible, you should be using jack stands anytime the car is in the air anyways.

I have a buddy who rocks a couple of the nice aluminum 2-ton Sears jacks, and they are really nice and seem well built, but at nearly $200 I'm not sure it's that worth it when I can get a 3-ton from HF for under $80. And like you said, the HF 3-ton low profile is $100.

[eightamrock]

If they have the same rating, I wouldn't be more concerned about one than the other. I just went steel because it was cheaper. The only time I regretted my choice was when I had to lift it by myself into the back of a bronco on 38s. Wished I had the aluminum one in that moment

hahaha! Looks like a family trip to harbor freight is in order today. Weird question, but do you know the inner diameter of the saddle on that lift? The pinch weld adapter I bought from protech needs at least 4.5" diameter to fit.

[eightamrock]

Out of curiosity, which pinch weld pucks did you decide to go with?

I think at the end of the day, a jack is a jack. And if you are responsible, you should be using jack stands anytime the car is in the air anyways.

I have a buddy who rocks a couple of the nice aluminum 2-ton Sears jacks, and they are really nice and seem well built, but at nearly $200 I'm not sure it's that worth it when I can get a 3-ton from HF for under $80. And like you said, the HF 3-ton low profile is $100.

Yeah I have an old steel set of stands that are equally as old as the jack, but they are in great shape.

I went with this http://protechproducts.com/index.php...&product_id=56 for the pinch weld adapters.

[MrFunk]

I need to get in the habit of using stands... even just to have standing there while the car is up.
Where do you position them? Just at the pinch weld as close to the jack as you can get?

[DannyDeez]

I need to get in the habit of using stands... even just to have standing there while the car is up.
Where do you position them? Just at the pinch weld as close to the jack as you can get?

Thats where I put them. Theres room on the pinch weld to fit the jack and the stand. I know people put them in other places, but thats been easiest for me so far.

[eightamrock]

Thats where I put them. Theres room on the pinch weld to fit the jack and the stand. I know people put them in other places, but thats been easiest for me so far.

I haven't found a great spot for them that's not over the pinch weld either.

[LYKUNO]

... Looking for something that will last the next lifetime.

Any thoughts?

I've had several jacks over the years, ranging from Craftsman heavy duty to the lightweight aluminum "racing" jacks. When I got the S4 I decided that it was time to get a high-quality jack that would last as long as me (or longer). I got an AC Hydraulic DK20Q jack from Pelican Parts. These jacks are Danish made and their quality far surpasses anything I've had or used before; they're in the professional/commercial use range. They have a "quick lift pedal" allowing for quickly raising the jack, and go as low as 80mm saddle height. They are rated up to 4400lbs capacity. See details at Pelican's AC Hydraulic page. One last item is that you can also adjust the drop speed on this jack. See this video that describes making this adjustment. Not sure how many other jacks have this feature. Found a few reviews on Amazon.

[BillyG]

Costco has a low profile jack Arcan 3.25 ton for around $100. I use it and am more than happy.

I also have this jack, from Costco. Works great for swapping tires on both the S4 and SQ5.

[chaos2984]

http://www.harborfreight.com/15-Ton-...ump-60569.html Ive used this one for years. On car and Suv's No issues what so ever. But I use jack stands when i get under the car.

[14S4GWM]

http://www.harborfreight.com/15-Ton-...ump-60569.html Ive used this one for years. On car and Suv's No issues what so ever. But I use jack stands when i get under the car.

I have the same one, it's great.

[o1brit]

I have this one front Harbor Freight. Works great.

http://www.harborfreight.com/3-ton-l...ump-61253.html

I as well use this one and it does everything expected. Price point is solid. Always check fluid levels prior to first use. I've heard stories of failures due to users failing to do this even though the manual clearly states to do so.

Glad you used jack stands and it didn't fail at a more inopportune time. Could have been a completely different PSA. Thanks for sharing

[eightamrock]

I as well use this one and it does everything expected. Price point is solid. Always check fluid levels prior to first use. I've heard stories of failures due to users failing to do this even though the manual clearly states to do so.

Glad you used jack stands and it didn't fail at a more inopportune time. Could have been a completely different PSA. Thanks for sharing

Do you know the saddle diameter by chance? It's not listed, just curious if my protech adapter will fit.

Yeah, learned years ago that you have to use jack stands. A lot of people just trust the jack, especially when they are just doing a quick tire change.

[o1brit]

Do you know the saddle diameter by chance? It's not listed, just curious if my protech adapter will fit.

Yeah, learned years ago that you have to use jack stands. A lot of people just trust the jack, especially when they are just doing a quick tire change.

Off the top of my head, I don't. I'd go measure quick but all of my possessions are on a moving truck somewhere in the Midwest. If somebody else doesn't chime in, I'll try to get a measurement for you this weekend.

[eightamrock]

I also have this jack, from Costco. Works great for swapping tires on both the S4 and SQ5.

My wife has a Q7. It takes a lot of height to get those wheels off the ground. A good option.

[kobrian85]

Always check fluid levels prior to first use. I've heard stories of failures due to users failing to do this even though the manual clearly states to do so.

I had to fill my HF jack with oil after I got it assembled, doesn't come out of the box ready to use.

[ptper]

I bought a Hein-werner. Rock solid, but it was overkill and wasn't low-profile . Sold it and bought an OTC racing jack. No complaints so far.

[jimrobbington]

http://m.harborfreight.com/15-ton-co...ump-60569.html

This one has worked well for me, and never had an issue fitting it under my lowered A4.

[Danny2323]

[vwblackb5]

Here's my Non-widow maker setup. I use both for my B5 and the B8.5. I'm still on winters for both, but will prob switch next week.

- 1.5 Ton Aluminum Race Jack Harbor Freight (low profile)
- Ebay Special Polyurethane Jack Pad adapter
- 2x Wheel chocks
- Wheel Hanger (M14x1.5)
- Long reach protecta sockets
- Breaker bar
- Torque wrench
- Impact wrench + Torque limiting sockets
- Spare 2 Ton Steel Craftsman Jack (standard height)



Fitment on the B8.5 S4 pinch welds


Fitment on the B5 pinch welds

[Danny2323]

Just a helpful tip if you're considering getting one of the blue aluminum jacks from Harbor Freight - the hoop handles on either side can be removed with a hex wrench, allowing more room to squeeze in a jack stand next to the floor jack on the pinch weld. I actually just removed one of the screws, and rotated the handle out of the way.

[S4 00 2.7]

@vwblack

more info on the impact wrench? do you need to have more than one battery around?

[vwblackb5]

Just a helpful tip if you're considering getting one of the blue aluminum jacks from Harbor Freight - the hoop handles on either side can be removed with a hex wrench, allowing more room to squeeze in a jack stand next to the floor jack on the pinch weld. I actually just removed one of the screws, and rotated the handle out of the way.

Agree with redundancy of having a jack stands, but the handles are pretty handy on the jack :) FWIW, having a wheel hanger in place of one of the bolts allows you to remove the wheel and rest the new wheel/quickly get a couple lugs in a less than a minute (unless seized/stuck). In any note, always recommend putting the spare wheel underneath, just in case if jack stands are not available.

@vwblack

more info on the impact wrench? do you need to have more than one battery around?

It's an 18V Makita XWT02Z. Actually have multiple batteries (1) 3.0AH and (2) 2.0AH I got with my other Makita kit (Impact Driver and Drill). You can definitely do full wheel swaps with a single battery charge with room to spare. Plenty of torque, paired with long reach protecta sockets (for removing) and torque limiting sockets (for installing), highly recommend

[14S4GWM]

Just a helpful tip if you're considering getting one of the blue aluminum jacks from Harbor Freight - the hoop handles on either side can be removed with a hex wrench, allowing more room to squeeze in a jack stand next to the floor jack on the pinch weld. I actually just removed one of the screws, and rotated the handle out of the way.

I never payed attention or tried to removethe handles. Those things keep it from rolling under the side of my toolbox. I'm taking one off tomorrow. Thanks for the heads up.

[kobrian85]

@vwblack

more info on the impact wrench? do you need to have more than one battery around?

I have a Dewalt impact, I never feel like I'm remotely close to needing more than one battery for a full remove and reinstall.

[S4 00 2.7]

Agree with redundancy of having a jack stands, but the handles are pretty handy on the jack :) FWIW, having a wheel hanger in place of one of the bolts allows you to remove the wheel and rest the new wheel/quickly get a couple lugs in a less than a minute (unless seized/stuck). In any note, always recommend putting the spare wheel underneath, just in case if jack stands are not available.

It's an 18V Makita XWT02Z. Actually have multiple batteries (1) 3.0AH and (2) 2.0AH I got with my other Makita kit (Impact Driver and Drill). You can definitely do full wheel swaps with a single battery charge with room to spare. Plenty of torque, paired with long reach protecta sockets (for removing) and torque limiting sockets (for installing), highly recommend

I have a Dewalt impact, I never feel like I'm remotely close to needing more than one battery for a full remove and reinstall.

thanks guys! I was asking about battery life in case I worked on a couple cars in one day.

[MrFunk]

I use the same jack and puck. I'm going to remove the loop handle as suggested...

[BillyG]

My wife has a Q7. It takes a lot of height to get those wheels off the ground. A good option.

That it does, and that is exactly why I grabbed the jack from Costco. My previous jack didn't go high enough for the SQ.

[fitzydude]

I had a jack from Sears that started to fail too! Nicknamed him Sir Squishy.

[eightamrock]

[QUOTE=vwblackb5;11516621]Here's my Non-widow maker setup. I use both for my B5 and the B8.5. I'm still on winters for both, but will prob switch next week.

- 1.5 Ton Aluminum Race Jack Harbor Freight (low profile)
- Ebay Special Polyurethane Jack Pad adapter
- 2x Wheel chocks
- Wheel Hanger (M14x1.5)
- Long reach protecta sockets
- Breaker bar
- Torque wrench
- Impact wrench + Torque limiting sockets
- Spare 2 Ton Steel Craftsman Jack (standard height)



Great setup. I use an impact driver to set the lugs then use a torque wrench to cinch them down to the proper spec. Does your impact driver do that in one shot or do you still have to torque the bolts? Im not familiar with torque limiting sockets. They sound incredibly efficient.

[eightamrock]

Just a helpful tip if you're considering getting one of the blue aluminum jacks from Harbor Freight - the hoop handles on either side can be removed with a hex wrench, allowing more room to squeeze in a jack stand next to the floor jack on the pinch weld. I actually just removed one of the screws, and rotated the handle out of the way.

Great tip! I have my eye on this jack, seems a lot of members are using them.

[eightamrock]

This is awesome! Thanks for the photo.

The protech one I have is 4.5" in diameter, but it has an outer lip that makes up the additional .5". I'm 99% sure I can just shave it off and it will fit perfectly on the pad.

[vwblackb5]

Great setup. I use an impact driver to set the lugs then use a torque wrench to cinch them down to the proper spec. Does your impact driver do that in one shot or do you still have to torque the bolts? Im not familiar with torque limiting sockets. They sound incredibly efficient.

Aren't you glad you kept the S4 :) Anyways, yes impact Wrench (not driver) to break the lugs loose and then remove using standard impact socket. The torque limiting sockets is basically a rod with a steel spring. When it reaches a certain torque it flexes under the load and that absorbs the impact of the gun. They only work with impact wrenches, if you use them with a breaker bar it won't limit the torque.

The reverse process goes hand tightening the lugs, then use impact wrench with (torque limiting socket @ 75 ft*lbs) -- star pattern, and lastly finish off with a torque wrench (star pattern) all the way to 90 ft*lbs. Remember, when removing you can apply a larger amount of torque. When installing, you have to distribute the torque evenly and to the specified spec.

[eightamrock]

Aren't you glad you kept the S4 :) Anyways, yes impact Wrench (not driver) to break the lugs loose and then remove using standard impact socket. The torque limiting sockets is basically a rod with a steel spring. When it reaches a certain torque it flexes under the load and that absorbs the impact of the gun. They only work with impact wrenches, if you use them with a breaker bar it won't limit the torque.

The reverse process goes hand tightening the lugs, then use impact wrench with (torque limiting socket @ 75 ft*lbs) -- star pattern, and lastly finish off with a torque wrench (star pattern) all the way to 90 ft*lbs. Remember, when removing you can apply a larger amount of torque. When installing, you have to distribute the torque evenly and to the specified spec.

LOL Yes! It is definitely growing on me, glad I kept it. I haven't chipped it yet, but I have my list of upgrades growing. I'll post a build thread once I really start getting at it.

I do the same process but without the torque limiting sockets. Do you torque with the wheel off the ground or after lowering the car down? I have read in many places over many years that since these are hub centric it doesn't matter. It's also the way I've been doing it since my first GTI many many years ago. I drive the bolts to get the tire lined up properly, drop it and torque the bolts (star pattern) Curious what others are doing.