Shep's B5 Part II

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 07:30 AM

Hi all. Long time B5 owner, first time S4 owner. I have had my 2001 A4 since 2008 and just recently picked up a 2001 S4 for about $1300 not exactly knowing what was wrong with it other than it was leaking oil and possibly needed a head gasket. The previous owner didn't want to deal with fixing it and I figured for the price i couldn't go wrong. It is by no means a show car, there are a few bumps and bruises as can be expected from any 15 year old car. The plan is to get this one fixed and transfer a few parts over that i can from my A4 and finally part ways with it.

So once i got the S4 home i checked the Valve cover gaskets and they seemed to leaking on both sides so i picked up a VC gasket kit from ECS and replaced the gaskets and cylinder head plugs/cam caps. While i had it tore down that far i threw in some new plugs too. Thought all went fine, let it sit over night to allow everything to set and took it for a quick drive last night after work. Started to smell some burning oil and noticed it was smoking from the passenger side cap area and there was a decent amount of oil under the car. Seems like i may not have gotten it to properly seat? i am picking up another cap on my way home from work to try it again. Those of you that have replaced them on the passenger side, you just press them in the same way on the driver side correct? or do you loosen up the 2 bolts for the little "valley" area and then tighten it back down. (no silicone was used on the plug/caps)

Parts Installed so far:
ECS Tuning Valve Cover Gasket Kit.
034 Silicone Breather Hose kit w/ New PRV
034 Density Line Control Arm kit
ECS Timing Belt Kit - Ultimate Plus
Coolant Expansion Tank
ST Coils
Apikol Rear Diff Mount
Diesel Geek Skid Plate
Boost Gauge w/ steering column pod

My A4 in its' prime.

**hibiscusS4** · 03-17-2016 07:36 AM

welcome!
the only part i used silicone on was the outside edges on the valve cover gasket. not quite sure the area you are talking abiut

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 07:52 AM

I used silicone on the VC gasket but was just clarifying i didn't use any for the plugs. The area i am referencing is right where the plug is on the passenger side. There is like a housing/cap the bolts down next to the chain tensioner where is. I saw the area between the two referenced as a "valley".

did a quick google search for this picture.

**hibiscusS4** · 03-17-2016 07:54 AM

ohhh the cam plugs i honestly dont remember if you use silicone on those its been awhile...
i think it was just swapping the old for the new and your fine

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 08:00 AM

From what i could find online line the consensus was to not use silicone on the plugs. the silicone gets in the way of allowing the grooves to seat i think? I wasn't sure if the passenger side was different for installing due to the housing being split/bolted and not being a single piece like the driver side.

**erykv1** · 03-17-2016 08:05 AM

cam plugs are supposed to be installed dry. but i've read people putting rtv / sealant on them as well with no ill effects.

there are apparently 2 types of cam seals floating around 1 that is spring loaded around the seal, and one that isn't. make sure yours has the spring. I experienced the same thing you did and realized I had a spring-less plug which started puking shortly after install.

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 08:19 AM

How do i know what one i have?

This is the kit i bought from ECS https://www.ecstuning.com/ES259658/

This is the plug that came with the kit https://www.ecstuning.com/Search/Sit...lug/ES2581845/

**erykv1** · 03-17-2016 08:32 AM

Sorry I should have been a little more careful with my wording. One is a cam plug, and one is a cam seal. Plugs dont have the spring.

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 08:38 AM

Alright thanks, I was confused for a minute.

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 09:27 AM

So out of curiosity i wanted to see how common the S4 was for 2001. Got this back from AOA.

· 4,830 – Model Year 2001 Audi S4 4-Door Sedan 6-Speed Quattro sold in the U.S.

· 1,955 – Model Year 2001 Audi S4 4-Door Sedan 6-Speed Quattro with Light Silver Metallic exteriors sold in the U.S.

· 1,344 – Model Year 2001 Audi S4 4-Door Sedan 6-Speed Quattro with Light Silver Metallic exteriors and Onyx interiors sold in the U.S.

Just over double what the sales were for the A4 1.8t manual quattro (2,352) was for the same year.

**a4kamila6** · 03-17-2016 10:39 AM

Usually i clean the area with non chlorinated break cleaner, clean the cap so its dry, put a small amount of rtv sealant along the outside perimeter of cap, install and good to go.

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 11:16 AM

I cleaned it up with brake cleaner and left the cap in the freezer over night to help make it easier to slide in. Maybe i missed a piece of the old one when i was cleaning it out but i thought it got it all.

You put RTV not inside the cam hole but after the plug is in?

**Emaso919** · 03-17-2016 11:19 AM

Looks like Chris took care of the car Andrew from the picture it looks to be in pretty good shape still, minus the engine issues....

**a4kamila6** · 03-17-2016 11:21 AM

You put the rtv on the plug itself, on the outer portion. Slide it in. Some sealant will ooze out. dont put too much.

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 11:28 AM

Originally Posted by Emaso919

Looks like Chris took care of the car Andrew from the picture it looks to be in pretty good shape still, minus the engine issues....

It is not too bad all in all. There is a little dent by the rear driver quarter panel and a few bigger scratches i will take a better look at after i get it running better and make sure nothing else is wrong engine wise. The front bumper has about a 3 inch crack in it that i will try and address also.

**alphaVR** · 03-17-2016 11:51 AM

Doing the valve cover gaskets was a good idea, but I highly recommend also doing the cam chain tensioner gaskets along with the half-moon seal under them as well. They are prone to leaking over time. To do those two, you either need to buy or rent the cam tensioner tool to depress the tensioner and get the access needed to replace those gaskets. The cam plugs are also a good idea to replace as well.

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 12:24 PM

I forgot about needing the tool for the tensioner gasket until i already had it all off. they didn't appear to be bad yet. Will more than likely pick the tool up with a future parts order. I am not sure when the timing belt and water pump were last done so that is also on the list of things to replace. Just wanted to make sure nothing else was going on motor wise before i did that.

**shepa401** · 03-17-2016 05:44 PM

Found out why it was leaking. Looked at it tonight and the valve cover gasket tweaked in that valley area next to the cam tensioner slightly leaving an opening. Should be a simple(ish) enough fix

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**Emaso919** · 03-18-2016 08:59 AM

Yea my friend just had his s4 bumper plastic welded and fixed wasn't bad in price. I did my timing belt back in January found it it was done before so I was pleased and I have the aluminum thermostat housing to! Still need a few things for mine, I keep throwing the warm up efficiency code with my cat so hopefully when I upgrade my exhaust here in this next month and code out the o2's then that should fix it. I was wondering when the timing was done on your car. Did roddy pick it up with about 70K on it?

**shepa401** · 03-18-2016 09:03 AM

Fixed the valve cover gasket last night. Got confirmation that my control arms should be here Wednesday so then i can get to swapping the suspension over.

**shepa401** · 03-18-2016 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by Emaso919

Yea my friend just had his s4 bumper plastic welded and fixed wasn't bad in price. I did my timing belt back in January found it it was done before so I was pleased and I have the aluminum thermostat housing to! Still need a few things for mine, I keep throwing the warm up efficiency code with my cat so hopefully when I upgrade my exhaust here in this next month and code out the o2's then that should fix it. I was wondering when the timing was done on your car. Did roddy pick it up with about 70K on it?

Not 100% sure when he picked it up i just know he mentioned it was done not long before he bought it.

**Emaso919** · 03-18-2016 10:59 AM

yea, it took my friend and I 3.5 hours in the shop he works at to do a whole TB service

**4LiterBeater** · 03-18-2016 09:43 PM

Originally Posted by erykv1

Sorry I should have been a little more careful with my wording. One is a cam plug, and one is a cam seal. Plugs dont have the spring.

Phew lolol.

**shepa401** · 03-22-2016 07:39 AM

So after i got the valve cover fixed i took the car for a drive around the neighborhood to get it up to operating temp and to check for any other leaks. After about 5 minutes I stopped and everything seemed to be fine. Drove around for another 10 minutes and when i got home i checked again. It wasn't till i moved it to park it back in the garage i noticed the big puddle of oil. I checked oil before i left and oil was about middle of the hatched area of dipstick. after it was in the garage it was just the tip...

I started tearing into it last night but there is oil all over so it is hard to tell exactly where the leak is coming from. I started cleaning up the best that i could but can't reach some of the areas. looking at putting it into service position tonight after work to try and clean better to track down the leak.

From what i can see it appears the leak is coming from the front end of the engine. driver side appears to be a little worse, but there was also a fair amount I cleaned up from the passenger side and there was oil on the alternator. I am not sure if that could have been from changing the VC gasket?

I have been looking through some diagrams trying to figure out where all the oil routing/fittings are to have a little check list of sorts to narrow it down.

Saw this while researching and had a laugh.

**alphaVR** · 03-22-2016 08:16 AM

Putting the car into the service position isn't all that difficult. Time-consuming, sure... but if you do it right, you can save a lot of effort by removing the core support as one big assembly. I would watch the first part of this video for the best way to do this:

As far as the leaks... I would be *very* intent on getting the cam seals checked for possible leakage. There really aren't any other areas on the front of the engine for oil to come from. If you didn't do them, also make sure you check/replace the cam tensioner gasket and half-moon seal since the driver side tensioner is on the front of the engine.

**shepa401** · 03-22-2016 08:34 AM

I was contemplating on removing it all or just pulling it forward. Undecided if i wanted to replace all the coolant right now when i was going to do the timing belt later this summer. I have pulled the front end off my A4 a number of times. I have the next couple days off of work so i plan on trying to get as much done as i can.

As for the tensioner gasket, I plan on doing that now that i have to take that VC back off. Just need to get the tensioner tool. The passenger side didn't appear to be leaking but may just do that side too.

And thank for the video link. Haven't come across that one before. Reminds me of old Auto's class videos we had to watch lol

**hibiscusS4** · 03-22-2016 08:54 AM

ya if your in there might as well do it. or your regret it later lol..... these cars are evil

**shepa401** · 03-22-2016 02:27 PM

Have a tool ordered up and hope to have it in a day or two. In the meantime i get to clean like crazy.

**shepa401** · 03-26-2016 09:21 AM

So took the front end off and saw the timing belt was all types of cracked so will be ordering a timing belt kit this week. D.S. Cam tensioner seems to be leaking and possibly the cam seal too.
On the plus side the car already has the metal thermostat housing so that will save me a couple bucks.

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**Corradovolksb** · 03-26-2016 09:43 AM

Holy shit your super lucky it didn't brake that is one of the worst ones I have seen.

**shepa401** · 03-26-2016 10:19 AM

I have only driven it a few miles since I bought it. P.O. Told me it was changed before he bought it and he only put about 30k miles on it. Who knows if it was even changed. Could oil being on the belt constantly cause that combined with the heat from the motor?

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**alphaVR** · 03-26-2016 10:30 AM

No, the belts are pretty robust. I think PO lied, unfortunately.

I've seen far worse timing belts, but that is DEFINITELY something that needs replaced. Good catch for sure.

**shepa401** · 03-26-2016 11:12 AM

I know the guy I bought it from and think it's a case of whoever he bought it from lied.

Looks like it has been running on borrowed time for sure

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**shepa401** · 03-28-2016 02:16 PM

Small update:

Got my Timing Belt/Water pump kit ordered today along with a new coolant tank to make it look a little nicer, plus i think the tank was starting to leak. a little sign of crusty coolant around the area.

**shepa401** · 04-09-2016 11:18 AM

Finally had some time to work on the car after dealing with having the wrong cam lock bar sent. I was sent one for a 4.2 by mistake. I was really confused why it was about 1/4 inch off for the dowel holes.

So after getting the crank gear off I came to notice that the front seal was not even in place anymore. I am pretty sure it is safe to say I found the major leak. Today I plan on trying to get it the rest of the way back together on the engine side of things then hopefully start swapping the few things that will fit over.

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**Whiplash_89** · 04-09-2016 12:14 PM

Good work.

**shepa401** · 04-09-2016 01:22 PM

Thanks. I usually forget to take "in progress" photos while I am working.
Fingers crossed it will go a little smoother the rest of the way. I usually only have time to work on it later in the evenings and have to set an alarm to stop working on it because I end up losing track of time and next thing j realize it is almost 4 and need to be up and ready to go to work a few hours later lol

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**shepa401** · 04-09-2016 09:42 PM

So had a little bit of a brain fart tonight. Was going to take care of my tensioner/half moon plugs while I was waiting for my timing covers to dry. Cleaned a little rust up. When I was trying to get the tensioner to move I accidentally leaned on it and the cam spun. How much did I screw myself on this one? Is this as easy as just trying to get the cam back to where it was or a lot more involved?

Edit:
So I counted and each side is 3-4 teeth clockwise from the mark on the cap. I should be ok with rotating it back once I bolt the tensioner back in place correct?

Exhaust cam

Intake cam

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