Bumpstops

[miztahsparklez]

Maybe this is a quick one....

I installed bilstein b8 struts a couple months ago on my h&r OE sports and decided to not install the front bump stops.

I was checking the amount of travel after the suspension was compressed and it didn't look like there was much left.

Day to day drives great, but if I push it through the back roads, where the pavement is pretty harsh, there have been times where I've bottomed out. I've also started noticing wear marks on the inner front fenders from where my tire is rubbing slightly and on the plastic panels below the car. This tells me that the car is going even lower than before, as I never had this issue with oem struts and stock bumpstops.

Is it possible to cut a slit in the bump stop and slide it over the shock tube, so I don't have to remove the whole strut assembly again?

For folks with the same suspension combination, how much did you trim off your bumpstops? 1.2-1.5"? Less? Did you use the top or the bottom part with the dust cover?

Here's a picture on a slanted driveway to show how close it can get (at this point there's probably another 1-1.5" of shock travel, as you might be able to see where it contacts my tire, about halfway on the sidewall).



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[Jimmy ny]

I'm not running on my bilstein sport and eibach springs. Perhaps you should buy the rs5 bumpstops and install them. They should be shorter than yours.


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[Danny2323]

I thought the Bilsteins had internal bump stops, making external bump stops unnecessary. Is this incorrect?

[miztahsparklez]

Under further examination, the damage is a little bit worse than I thought. It seems as if the strut towers have been bent just a tad.




I raised this wheel up to try to get a measurement of how much travel is left. From this height I was able to measure at least 1.5-2" of travel before the shock body hits the top. However, it seems that the control arms reach their own limit before that happens.... I cut about 1.5" off the bump stop and will install in a weekend or two. Keep in mind that this damage likely happened during some major ups and downs through the back roads. I distinctly remembered a loud bang when I bottomed out.




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[miztahsparklez]

I thought the Bilsteins had internal bump stops, making external bump stops unnecessary. Is this incorrect?

They may be internally stopped to protect the strut, but it certainly appears that you can travel a lot further before hitting that stop, thus having the control arm go through the top and the bottom of the car bottoming out on the road.

I have some minor scrapes on the bolt heads of where my Alu kreuz made contact and burned through the plastic cover.


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[SteveYem]

I'm trying to figure out how your H&R OE Sport springs lowered your front end that much. When I had them installed on my B8 there was probably 3/4-1" of gap between fender and tire. I was on the stock dampers but I don't see why that would affect ride height.

[miztahsparklez]

I'm trying to figure out how your H&R OE Sport springs lowered your front end that much. When I had them installed on my B8 there was probably 3/4-1" of gap between fender and tire. I was on the stock dampers but I don't see why that would affect ride height.

I purposely made it compressed by raising that wheel higher than the rest. It's normally like the picture below. Also, the bilsteins I think made it go lower just a hair I think. No more than 1/4".




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[cspcrx]

to answer your original question, no you can not split a bump stop and stick it on the shock shaft and expect it to function properly.

[miztahsparklez]

to answer your original question, no you can not split a bump stop and stick it on the shock shaft and expect it to function properly.

Thanks. I was thinking splitting and clamping something around it, but figured that might give even after a few hits.


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[miztahsparklez]

Finally got the front stops on... Unfortunately, it looks like I need to trim even more. 1.5" is too long, as my estimation seemed to be correct. I only have .5" of suspension travel, which is not really enough. My ride seems to have gotten quite a bit stiffer, but at least I won't be bottoming out on stuff anymore.

I may attempt to trim another 1/4-1/2" while the stop is still installed on the car. I think that will give me optimal travel, but still prevent the tire from hitting the fender.


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[cspcrx]

You should not really be relying on the bump stops in this way. Sounds like you need to raise the car a bit to achieve the prevention you are looking for. Just a thought.

[miztahsparklez]

Lol, if it were coil overs, raising would be an option. These are only h&r oe sports . Aren't these supposed to be conservative?


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[Johnnycash]

These are only h&r oe sports . Aren't these supposed to be conservative?

my understanding is the oe are conservative, and the sports are aggressive, you have one or the other not both. probably the sport version...

[mmm def]

Swap out the oe sports for the oe and problem solved

[miztahsparklez]

H&R has the following
OE Sport
Sport
Super Sport
Race

Listed in order of aggressiveness, race being most aggressive.


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[rota92]

I'm under the impression you shouldn't be having these issues on those springs.

Are your shocks blown by chance? It seems like it's blowing through whatever travel it has with a quickness.

[miztahsparklez]

They're new. No leaks. Rides good still. Just pretty limited on travel.

Easy check for other folks is to remove that black cover and see how much room you have between your bump stop and strut top. If it's touching, your bump stop is being worked.

I realize this is the top, which doesn't have any gradual "spring" to it. However, with this in place, there's only .5" between the bottom of this and the strut body. I was thinking of cutting it down further at the narrow most portion.

I may decide to use the bottom half instead, assuming I can get the black dust cover off. I think the dust cover would just get crushed once it impacts the top assembly. This might make things a bit more gradual.




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[rota92]

I'm waiting on my B12 kit so I've been doing some reading and came across this recently.

Do those lengths make sense compared to what you currently have stock?

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...1#post10783588

[miztahsparklez]

Yep, that's about the exact length unmodified. I was reading that thread too.

I'm saying it's just not possible to not cut without it already touching. It also looks like you need to cut A LOT.

Initially I cut the top off 1.5" since I was planning to use the bottom (made a decision for 1.5" based on an overly aggressive drop amount). More reading got me afraid so I opted to use the top since it was longer (bottom was more like 1.25")

Keep in mind it only fully bottomed out on big dips. 90% of the time it was smooth and felt really good.

Rears I left full. My fenders can rub on the sidewall already, so I didnt cut for the rear. Ride is firm, but good overall.


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[mmm def]

Your fenders are rubbing with an oe Spring? How? That's a mild ~1" drop.

[cspcrx]

Something seems way off here. Tire and wheel specs? I can see your running 19s but what ET.

[miztahsparklez]

19x10, 255/35/19, stock tire size. I believe et is around the 40s? I forget when they were made.

I assure you I was about the same height even with stock struts.

I just don't think anyone really looked at the bump stops.

This is at normal level height. The other pic I posted was of the suspension under load, which is why it was tucking tire.



The rear under load can probably go slightly farther than this. You can tell where the fender rubs the sidewall.




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[rota92]

Yea you've got a bigger issue here for sure, it appears as though you had these springs on stock shocks at first? How old are they? Did you buy them new?

It looks like your car is sitting on coils with a pretty aggressive dump. Far from a lowering spring IMO.

[miztahsparklez]

It's the wheel fitment that makes it look lower than it is.

Yes they were on stock struts. Recently upgraded to bilstein b8.

They don't tuck unless I'm placing a lot of load on them (like jacking up a corner). And they look the same as the picture below.

I would not recommend anyone to run without bumpstops as it gives you too much suspension travel, you can possibly damage your strut tower, and you may scrape the underbody/frame on the pavement when the suspension compresses. I am not so worried about the fender rubbing, as my wheels are pretty aggressive fitting, and it's only slightly grazing it before rebounding.

Likewise, I would also not recommend anyone to not cut their bump stops when lowering, even with OE Sports, as there's not enough suspension travel without you riding on them in the front. To validate this, pop off the black cover on your front strut tower and pull down on the dust cover holding your bump stop. If it doesn't move, you're riding on them.

As someone else noted in another thread, cutting the stops slightly for them helped the ride tremendously. I would also agree, as my car would soak up the bumps and handle amazingly well around turns. I'm only looking to get the best of both worlds, great ride plus the protection of not bottoming out the front suspension on the strut towers (which in turn scrapes the underbody of the car on the road).

With the current state, it appears that the fronts are only allowed to travel down another half inch, so they will no longer rub on the sidewall on heavy compression. Cutting it that last 1/4" seems pretty safe at this point.




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[cspcrx]

I am not familiar with the Bilstein b8. But the Bilsteins on my Tacoma actually have an adjustable spring perch. You can use this to move to raise and lower the vehicle. These do not have this by any chance to they?

[miztahsparklez]

The bilstein b8 is just the strut/shock assembly. Non-adjustable for ease of use. Think of it like a koni yellow without adjustment screws. It's similar to the b12 kit they sell that uses I think an eibach spring setup.

The front perch does rotate around the strut assembly, but you can't really raise it, as there's nothing to hold it up on the bottom. Plus I'd get into a reverse rake scenario. Right now it's level in 4 corners.

If I went with the full coil over setup, I would have adjustable perches. However, the ride height and comfort level is pretty appropriate for a daily spirited driver. Very OEM + quality.


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[hatcm167]

Hey everyone, just wanted to share my experience in case anyone else is dealing with the same issue. I was definitely riding on the rear bump stops with Bilstein B8 shocks and H&R OE Sport springs. The factory bump stops are about 111mm long, and my fender-to-ground measurements were 26" on one side and 25.8" on the other. The ride was super bouncy and harsh.

I ended up pulling out the rear shocks, disassembled them from the mounts, and trimmed about 40mm off the bottom of the bump stops (the part that fits into the dust cover). After a test drive, the difference is night and day—much smoother ride!

I don’t anticipate any issues with bottoming out, but if I run into any, I’ll update here. Hope this helps someone!

[maximbrk]

just to also weigh in on the bilstein b8's because bilstein is so awful about their install instructions - there is a very old version of the bilstein b12 kit that has internal bump stops. this is the one that comes with the springs pre-installed on the shock and has a very thick silver shaft. the new bilstein b8, like those in my b12 kit i bought about 2 months ago, did not have the springs pre-installed and did NOT come with internal bump stops. they have a thin silver shaft like the stock dampers. you must trim and re-use the bump stops on all four corners. there are threads out there on how much to trim but it's definitely needed.

I even emailed Bilstein to confirm, but they took forever to reply. thank goodness I went back to put the front bump stops in before I finished up and torqued everything down, because they eventually told me you do in fact need them because they aren't internally bump stopped. not clear at all in the instructions, which basically have a generic "re-use the factory parts that you have to re-use if your kit doesnt have it"

[Nillious]

I trimmed my bump stops all four corners on the car. Pull the bump stops down out of their cups and use a very sharp razor blade to cut as you spin the bump stops. Once you have the bump stop in two pieces you then make a vertical cut on the part being removed and slide it off the shaft. The rears were very easy. The fronts were a little tedious but still much easier the pulling and tearing the fronts apart. Rears were like ten minutes. Fronts took me about a half hour each side and some language our parents would not approve of lol.

[hatcm167]

just to also weigh in on the bilstein b8's because bilstein is so awful about their install instructions - there is a very old version of the bilstein b12 kit that has internal bump stops. this is the one that comes with the springs pre-installed on the shock and has a very thick silver shaft. the new bilstein b8, like those in my b12 kit i bought about 2 months ago, did not have the springs pre-installed and did NOT come with internal bump stops. they have a thin silver shaft like the stock dampers. you must trim and re-use the bump stops on all four corners. there are threads out there on how much to trim but it's definitely needed.

I even emailed Bilstein to confirm, but they took forever to reply. thank goodness I went back to put the front bump stops in before I finished up and torqued everything down, because they eventually told me you do in fact need them because they aren't internally bump stopped. not clear at all in the instructions, which basically have a generic "re-use the factory parts that you have to re-use if your kit doesnt have it"

Mine is riding pretty good after the rear trim, with the "sport" front bumpers untouched. These are the 72mm ones. I'll probably get in there and cut some off the front, just in case.

[maximbrk]

also as advised in the more detailed trimming thread, some method to keep the rear bumpstops up in the top of the strut mount is a good idea, since trimming those removes the little lip on the stops that originally keeps them up in there. I just used some duct tape that I cut to half width and then tightly wrapped around the top to thicken the trimmed bumpstops until they were really snug in the strut mount cup.