01 Allroad no start - communication w/cluster, immobilizer, etc

[NEAllroad]

Really hoping someone here can help. This is long but hopefully will give enough insight as to what's wrong.

On Thursday, I bought a 2001 Allroad 6spd. 179k miles. Aside from the pixels in the LCD being gone, the car was doing great.
Drove it back to work about an hour away, drove it locally twice, left it overnight. Drove it the next morning to the recon guys, who cleaned it in and out (note - did not open the hood to clean the engine bay, per my request to avoid water issues)

Called around 4p, told me they couldn't get it started. I went over, figuring they left the doors open/lights on, but the battery was good. Car started, ran for a second, then stalled. I tried disconnecting the neg terminal, then a few hours later tried again, no change. Tried a capacitive drain (pos/neg touching off battery), no change. The key was beat so I went home and got my second and third key (master no buttons and a valet). Both keys performed the same - start, run for 1 sec, stall. Immobilizer light on solid.

Push outside, scan codes, p1650. Notice the cluster is not responding (illumination & gauges), but all warning lights on gauge working (abs, etc - at startup.) Ride height buttons inop/unlit/unresponsive - I suspect they are powered off the cluster, so this
makes sense?

Towed to a local Audi/euro shop I know well. They swap the cluster with a known good, cluster working (car not starting as it wasn't coded to the car, just installed for test purposes.) They call and tell me I need a cluster (my odo and clock were inop, but the test cluster worked). I find an 01 Allroad cluster, same exact part number, locally. Give it to them and they install. Tow to the local dealer for coding. They say it's the wrong part. Part number is EXACTLY the same.

They continue to search and find a wire running from OBD to DLC. I call the dealer I bought it from. They say they had anti-theft issues where if you unlocked from the trunk, then opened the driver's door, the car wouldn't start. This jumper corrected the concern - but they never had any no start issues.

Dealer says pay countless hours of further electrical diag. I decline, because I don't hate myself enough to do that just yet, and I can't really afford 10 hrs of them poking around at door rate.

Local shop tells me tow it back to them and they'll tear into it and figure out what the deal is. Hopefully.

Has anyone seen anything like this before? P1650, no comm w the cluster, start then stall?

[rollerton]

Well, I don't know how to start with the no comm issue. And I'm not exactly sure what the nature of the wire from OBD -->DLC is?
But, what I do know is you can cut out the middle man and attempt to rematch your keys to the Immo if the replacement cluster installs and checks out.
So; you say the replacement cluster lit up and seemed okay, but not whether the no comm issue was still present?
Follow this walkthrough, you'll need either a Vag Com KII-Usb cable AND a cheap blue KKL cable off ebay "OR" you can run Vag Commander through a Hex Can VCDS cable in 'dumb mode' :
https://sites.google.com/site/imnuts/

See if you can download Vag Commander from my Gdrive :
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8X...JKN0pkTzg/view

I'd eliminate a faulty cluster issue before anything else, and screw the dealer. You can install almost ANY Immo III C5 cluster into another one and it will function nearly 100% . There are something like 70 different 'part numbers' / suffixes but for the most part the clusters are fairly identical.

[NEAllroad]

Really appreciate the fast response.

-original cluster was unpowered. No illumination, no communication via ObD. No clock or odometer.

-shop took it out and put in a known good c5 cluster and it powered up and they could communicate with it. Odo and clock working. Could not start as it wasn't coded to my car. Instructed me to replace cluster.

- I get a known good cluster from an 01 Allroad, give it to them, they install, again communication up, odo and clock up, no start (need to code to car.)

-tow to dealer per shop for coding. Also had a new key ordered and wanted coded as well.

- dealer claims no communication with new cluster, must be wrong part or defective part.

-mild diag with no discernible answer. Stopped as cost prohibitive.

-next step per shop is to tow back to them for further diag.

Sick of towing and paying through the nose for diag but without software or a cable in hand the car can't move, rock and hard place. Daily driver and only car. Need it running ASAP!

[glennda5id]

Its complicated to swap in a used cluster but can be done with the right tools. I wouldn't expect the dealer to be able to do it.

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index...ument_Cluster)

[rollerton]

Well, sort of sounds like the cluster is a good place to start and the dealer giving you a "wrong part number" excuse is just straight bullshit. Did I tell you about the time 5 years ago when I had to SHOW THE AUDI MASTER TECH HOW TO ADAPT A CLUSTER!?!
They couldn't figure it out.
So, get your car back. If you don't have it order a Ross Tech Hex-Can cable ($349) and follow that walkthrough above. It works, I just did it today on a B6 A4.
Consider that $349 probably won't even get the problem diagnosed at any shop (~2hrs labor?) and then you have the diagnostic cable FOREVER and can save millions.

Edit; Just realized you have to adapt the 'cluster' Immo, so I got ahead of myself a little. You can do most of it, but I don't know that Vag Commander will read the SKC from the cluster..sometimes it will on Immo 3. You would attempt to connect to 'Combi' in the drop down instead.
And you need BOTH (old cluster and replacement) SKC's in order to do the adaptation. So, you CAN get the SKC of your current cluster from the ECU via that walk through. Then install the used one and attempt to acquire the SKC from the cluster module. If it doesn;t work There are a few people who will do it remotely if you have a VCDS cable.

[NEAllroad]

Appreciate the help guys. Dealer gave up, I towed it back to the independent for further repairs/diag. In the interest of time I'll have to succumb to their demands to get the car running - the time it'll take to get the cable would be counterproductive, seeing as its been a week down.

Going forward I intend to do everything myself - always have, but with BMW and Merc. Never ran into such software intensive cars before :(

[NEAllroad]

Update: they found a bad connection in the added wiring. "New" cluster is installed and awaiting coding. They do have VCDS.