Sway Bar

[moophone]

Yes I know sway bars have been discussed, but I think this is a different angle on the subject.

B8.5, sport diff, ST coil overs and I have literally zero understeer. Next, I want to eliminate body roll (coilovers helped but its still there in hard cornering). I was originally thinking 034 rear sway, but I think they say a front sway will lead to more understeer..

Appreciate any thoughts (specifically for B8.5 w/ sport diff). Should I go Rear only, or Rear+Front? Remember I want to keep the steering as-is, but keep the wheels more planted in hard cornering.

[Usa]

"I have literally zero understeer. Next, I want to eliminate understeer" ???

You will benefit more from rear sways, but if you're doing one why not both?

[torinalth]

both. it sounds like you really dont want to change the dynamics, just the leveling. so go front and rear

[moophone]

Edited - Thank you. I meant I want to eliminate Body Roll not understeer

"I have literally zero understeer. Next, I want to eliminate understeer" ???

You will benefit more from rear sways, but if you're doing one why not both?

[SteveYem]

For a while I had Eurocode rear swaybar, stock front bar. The car didn't understeer much, but my perception was that the front of the car twisted/lifted while the rear stayed relatively flat. That went away when I installed the Eurocode front bar. Per Eurocode's recommendation, set the rear to the stiff setting and the front to the soft setting for street driving.

[moophone]

This is what I was thinking as well. In terms of reducing body roll, what percentage would you give the sway bars vs the H&R coilovers? Any issues with the Eurocode swaybars? Did you get endlinks?

Thanks guys.

For a while I had Eurocode rear swaybar, stock front bar. The car didn't understeer much, but my perception was that the front of the car twisted/lifted while the rear stayed relatively flat. That went away when I installed the Eurocode front bar. Per Eurocode's recommendation, set the rear to the stiff setting and the front to the soft setting for street driving.

[torinalth]

you are in canada, do not get the spherical endlinks. they will rust in no time and become noisy and loose. keep the stock links or consider the MOOG replacement pieces that are stiffer, but still solid links. The eurocode sways are nice, but i'd rather have the greasable collars that 034 has.

[nickskeeta]

I just had a 034 Rear sway with adjustable end links installed and it eliminated a good amount of body roll set on the softest setting. Haven't tried the stiffer settings yet. Being that you may also want a front sway, Eurocode may be the better option in your case.

[Transcend]

This may be a relevant question or if it derails your original post, I'm sorry. @nickskeeta, Was there a discussion with 034 behind the idea of offering only a rear sway? I know they feel their rear paired up with stock front gives the car the right characteristic around corners. How does that translate into real world and will that help OP with his setup?

[nickskeeta]

This may be a relevant question or if it derails your original post, I'm sorry. @nickskeeta, Was there a discussion with 034 behind the idea of offering only a rear sway? I know they feel their rear paired up with stock front gives the car the right characteristic around corners. How does that translate into real world and will that help OP with his setup?

Someone asked them that question in their original announcement thread and they said they felt there was no need to develop a front sway because upgrading the rear sway bar only will reduce the understeer. They did the same thing for the TT-RS, they only developed a rear sway.
As for every day driving, I noticed less body roll through most turns depending on entry speed and the size of the turn. The biggest difference I noticed is the reduced understeer. As soon as I get on the throttle through or exiting a turn, you can feel the rear end lay down the power and the front end pull instead of push. I noticed the car is much more confident through turns compared to stock rear sway. I only have 150 miles on it, so I'm still getting used to it. So far, I'm loving it!

[bhvrdr]

I would recommend going with both F and R sways. Going with a rear sway only can give slightly more neutrality at limits you arent likely to see on any public roads but the front swaybar helps in both daily spirited driving and track work. This car has considerable front weight bias and it is also a bit sloppy up front. In other words, the car really doesnt initiate directional change very well. The Front sway helps alot to reduce overall body roll (much more than just the rear) and it also helps considerably with front end turn-in/responsiveness.

Keep in mind the above observations are based on adding sways to a stock suspension car. Your alignment and changes in spring and stock rates are going to play a significant part in the overall handling dynamics that would also need to be explored to arrive at an overall assessment of how your car handles.

Mike

[moophone]

Sounds like the developed this for B8 without rear diff, because I have zero understeer. Don't want the ass end to swing out more. Think I'll go with front+rear, and keep stock endlinks for now, and maybe go moog next year

Someone asked them that question in their original announcement thread and they said they felt there was no need to develop a front sway because upgrading the rear sway bar only will reduce the understeer. They did the same thing for the TT-RS, they only developed a rear sway.
As for every day driving, I noticed less body roll through most turns depending on entry speed and the size of the turn. The biggest difference I noticed is the reduced understeer. As soon as I get on the throttle through or exiting a turn, you can feel the rear end lay down the power and the front end pull instead of push. I noticed the car is much more confident through turns compared to stock rear sway. I only have 150 miles on it, so I'm still getting used to it. So far, I'm loving it!

[RyanJon]

I'm sure I read somewhere that if you have the sports diff your rarb will be the smallest OE bar available?

If so then what's the reasoning for this?

[SteveYem]

I'm sure I read somewhere that if you have the sports diff your rarb will be the smallest OE bar available?

If so then what's the reasoning for this?

Well, not necessarily true. If the car was optioned with full ADS (including the adaptive suspension), then yes the rear sway bar is smaller than standard. The full ADS package also includes sport differential. Meanwhile, if you have a car with sport differential but not the adaptive suspension, then the rear sway bar will be the standard size.

The reason they include the smaller sway bar with the adaptive damping option is so that the car can be as "soft" as possible when the suspension is put into "Comfort" mode. It was a weird move IMO.

[lowjonathan]

Well, not necessarily true. If the car was optioned with full ADS (including the adaptive suspension), then yes the rear sway bar is smaller than standard. The full ADS package also includes sport differential. Meanwhile, if you have a car with sport differential but not the adaptive suspension, then the rear sway bar will be the standard size.

The reason they include the smaller sway bar with the adaptive damping option is so that the car can be as "soft" as possible when the suspension is put into "Comfort" mode. It was a weird move IMO.

Yes, mine is with ADS (adpative suspension), the R ARB is tiny (16mm)....

[eurotic]

The eurocode sways are nice, but i'd rather have the greasable collars that 034 has.

I'm liking the look of the Hotchkis kit for this reason, it has greasable bushing via a zirk fitting so it's as easy as jacking up the car and using a grease gun. I had a set on my B6 S4 and used synthetic grease...never a problem.

OP, I would think a set like the Hotchkis would be good because you could probably maintain the balance that you like by playing with the adjustments. Try soft/soft and if you are happy then great. If it pushes too much then stiffen the rear. If it rotates too much stiffen the front. Of course going full stiff font and back is also an option provided you like the balance that would offer.

[RyanJon]

Well, not necessarily true. If the car was optioned with full ADS (including the adaptive suspension), then yes the rear sway bar is smaller than standard. The full ADS package also includes sport differential. Meanwhile, if you have a car with sport differential but not the adaptive suspension, then the rear sway bar will be the standard size.

The reason they include the smaller sway bar with the adaptive damping option is so that the car can be as "soft" as possible when the suspension is put into "Comfort" mode. It was a weird move IMO.

Ah ok, mine has the sports diff and adjustable damping so I'll definitely have the smallest version.

I'd read somewhere that the smaller rear bar with the sports diff and full ads was to do with reducing oversteer? And that a stiffer rear bar would cause a lot of over rotation? is this not true?

Can anyone who has upgraded their rarb and has sports diff and adjustable damping please comment on how they find the upgrade and what the effects are?

Ryan

[eurotic]

Ah ok, mine has the sports diff and adjustable damping so I'll definitely have the smallest version.

I'd read somewhere that the smaller rear bar with the sports diff and full ads was to do with reducing oversteer? And that a stiffer rear bar would cause a lot of over rotation? is this not true?

Can anyone who has upgraded their rarb and has sports diff and adjustable damping please comment on how they find the upgrade and what the effects are?

Ryan

The reason to stiffen the rear in any car is to get it to rotate more. I can't speak to the exact set-up you mention but if you are not looking for a lot of extra rotation I would think going for a kit that is adjustable at both ends would be what you'd want. Then you can go stiff in the front and soft in the rear and sort of keep the balance the same. The question would be though, are you going to get more rotation or less. Hopefully someone with firsthand experience can chime in with both their pre- and post-upgrade opinions. As you can see on these forums some people like the stock balance and others think the car understeers like a pig. So be careful when someone tells you it's a must have upgrade because they may have a vastly different driving style and feel. </captain_obvious>