Got my first Blackstone oil test back

[Luxus Panzer]

Things look good. Gonna run it for 10K (KM) next run.

[nsprosty]

Look at those calcium levels you need to feed it some milk.


Great looking report. I know mine wont look that good.

[Luxus Panzer]

Why do you suspect your oil report will be bad?

[K04-B6]

11,000 km intervals??? That's insane lol ... I keep it a 5,000 just to be safe.

[SJorge3442]

11,000 km intervals??? That's insane lol ... I keep it a 5,000 just to be safe.

Insane? 5k is the equivalent of 3000 miles, which is the recommended interval for conventional oils. 5000 miles is the shorter side of the synthetic spectrum. If I drive alot, I run up to 10000 miles between changes. I don't do enough driving any more to do that, so I just change it every 6 months to make sure that there is no water build up going on.

[ADCS]

11,000 km intervals??? That's insane lol ... I keep it a 5,000 just to be safe.

5000kms is insane unless you like wasting money and fossil fuels. What oil are you using?
10,000kms is no problem at all with a good quality oil.

[K04-B6]

I'm using Liqui-Moly which is a German synthetic oil. I choose to do it a 5000kms because that's what I was taught working as a mechanic. Especially with high mileage vehicles I don't want to risk the oil to get too dirty and thick. Run a clean motor = Less problems for me later on. That's just how I see it

*EDIT* Now you guys have me doing some research and I see your point of view.. I thought that any oils '' conventional and Synthetic'' had the same rating of intervals... I'll test it out but my OCD kicks in and makes me want to do it at 5,000kms lol

[ADCS]

Which Liqui Moly? Synthoil Premium or TopTec? I ran Synthoil for several years with 10k kms oil change intervals. No problem.
Liqui Moly states that both the Synthoil and TopTec can be used for 20,000+km intervals (I wouldn't go that high but they have obviously tested them to those levels). You are wasting your money and time with 5000km intervals.

[K04-B6]

Which Liqui Moly? Synthoil Premium or TopTec? I ran Synthoil for several years with 10k kms oil change intervals. No problem.
Liqui Moly states that both the Synthoil and TopTec can be used for 20,000+km intervals (I wouldn't go that high but they have obviously tested them to those levels). You are wasting your money and time with 5000km intervals.

I'm starting to see you logic behind this. I'm researching and learning a lot actually. Especially seeing that the waste part of it is really bad.. Thanks for the lesson guys

[Luxus Panzer]

I am old school as well and had problems getting my head around more then 5K KM.

With a modern synthetic like Rotilla T6, and this test to combat my ignorance (I did know better) I will go 10,000 KM next change no problem and not have any fear.

[jacobsen]

Motul 8100 xcess for summer and motul 0w40 in winter with Mann 950/4 ftw!

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[somedude]

if you choose to go to a higher interval which I full support I would still encourage you to replace the filter at 5k miles on a 10K mile oil change. good oil lasts a long time. Some day I will keep doccuments and see how long you can really go on a oil change. I was determined to do this on my W12 A8 but I said fuck it and ran 10K oil changes because i'm lazy. That and I refuse to believe that a engine that holds 15qt of oil needs a frequent oil change.

[diagnosticator]

Which Liqui Moly? Synthoil Premium or TopTec? I ran Synthoil for several years with 10k kms oil change intervals. No problem.
Liqui Moly states that both the Synthoil and TopTec can be used for 20,000+km intervals (I wouldn't go that high but they have obviously tested them to those levels). You are wasting your money and time with 5000km intervals.

Remember the lawsuits and class action settlement and extended warranty because thousands of 1.8Ts developed sludged engines at 10K miles/16K Km OCI? The fact is, despite modern synthetic oils excellent lubrication and contamination handling capabilities, the only way to remove contaminants suspended in the oil from the engine is by changing the oil before contaminant levels get high enough to cause problems with worst case operating conditions. City driving is severe duty on engine oil, especially where winters are very cold for several months strait. Instructions for OCI is to reduce mileage between oil changes when operating conditions stess the oil a lot. Commuting to work every day in the winter in city stop and go driving cannot be adequately managed by a 10K miles OCI for average driving conditions, that is at best, borderline for severe conditions.

[ADCS]

^ that's great but nobody is talking about 10k MILE oil change intervals :-)

[Luxus Panzer]

^ that's great but nobody is talking about 10k MILE oil change intervals :-)

Us crazy Canadians and our metric system ;)

[Charles.waite]

Even 10,000km intervals are short. I used to run 8-10k MILE intervals, all city, in my b6 and had no issues whatsoever and had a very good blackstone report. Either way, stick with the manufacturer OCIs, use a good filter and good synthetic oil, and you should be fine.

3,000mile/5,000km intervals are stupid short. Even 10,000km intervals are short.

My b7 is the best though. I never have to change the oil because it came with the rare factory option: automatic oil change. It just burns it off slowly so every 1200 miles I add another quart. By the time I hit the OCI I've already replaced the whole sump over time so I can just replace the filter...

[DownhillA4]

I'll continue my 3,000 mile oil changes no matter what people say.

Thread derail.

[Kevin C]

Based on what I have read, if the TBN is still good, then the oil is still protected against oxidation and the sludging issues associated with oxidized oil. If the lab report comes back good, then you're still protected and the OCI can be adjusted accordingly. No lab test? Stick with the factory OCI.

[ADCS]

My b7 is the best though. I never have to change the oil because it came with the rare factory option: automatic oil change. It just burns it off slowly so every 1200 miles I add another quart. By the time I hit the OCI I've already replaced the whole sump over time so I can just replace the filter...

My 1.8T and 2.0T have both developed this design feature. :-)

[diagnosticator]

Based on what I have read, if the TBN is still good, then the oil is still protected against oxidation and the sludging issues associated with oxidized oil. If the lab report comes back good, then you're still protected and the OCI can be adjusted accordingly. No lab test? Stick with the factory OCI.

TBN is Total Base Number, a measure of the alkaline pH chemical additives used to neutralize acids produced during combustion from blow-by gasses and vapors. There is a lot of sludge related contamination that is unrelated to the TBN remaining in the oil. These additives are consumed over time. Eventually, there is not enough TBN left to do the job intended, and the acid concentration increases enough to damage engine parts and for corrosive wear to occur.

[jacobsen]

I'll continue my 3,000 mile oil changes no matter what people say.

Thread derail.

At 3k miles my oil isn't discolored yet.

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[Charles.waite]

I enjoy throwing away perfectly good oil too....

[BugAudi1]

I'm running at 140k on the original chains in my S4. Only a slight rattle on a cold startup from oil draining out the tensioner. I change at 5000 miles and I wouldn't dare going any further than that. Maybe on a belt driven engine.

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[Kevin C]

TBN is Total Base Number, a measure of the alkaline pH chemical additives used to neutralize acids produced during combustion from blow-by gasses and vapors. There is a lot of sludge related contamination that is unrelated to the TBN remaining in the oil. These additives are consumed over time. Eventually, there is not enough TBN left to do the job intended, and the acid concentration increases enough to damage engine parts and for corrosive wear to occur.

This is what I was thinking.... As oil oxidizes, it becomes acidic. The PH buffers in the oil not only neutralize combustion byproducts, they neutralize acids that are created when oil oxidizes (thermal breakdown). In general, oil will have a certain level of antioxidants that are the first line of defense against radicals that try and break down the base stock, and buffering to prevent corrosion damage from oil that does become oxidized. TBN change may not be a perfect correlation, but appears to be a reasonable indicator. I'm not an expert on the subject, but from what I have read, I believe my original statement is reasonable. It's a lot to piece together and I'm learning as I go. I attached a couple of links to articles I recently read, that seem to support my premise.

Oxidation Progress
A common method for studying oxidation is to trend its progression. Oxidation results can be followed by measuring the increase in the acid number of the fluid (or the loss in base number in engine oils caused by the formation of acids), viscosity (caused by the formation of condensation products), FTIR carbonyl oxidation (the ketones, aldehydes, esters and acids formed form the oxidation reactions) and insoluble products.

http://www.machinerylubrication.com/...tion-lubricant

These results are common when trending the lubricant's oxidation profile. As oxidation occurs to the lubricant, it depletes the antioxidants and produces carboxylic acids. The base reserve will neutralize these oxidation-produced acids to carboxylate salts; thus, resulting in a depletion of the base reserve. As previously discussed, many of the esterification and condensation reactions that produce viscosity increases are acid catalyzed. The base reserve will help prevent this chain growth and viscosity problem.

http://www.machinerylubrication.com/...tion-lubricant

Except for the PDSC and RPVOT, the resulting oxidized lubricant from the above test is also evaluated by another oxidation consumption or property test method. The oxidized lubricants are analyzed by tests including base number, AN, FTIR oxidation or viscosity change. This evaluation further indicates the lubricant's oxidation state.


In the automotive sector, crankcase lubricants are subjected to engine tests (D4485) designed to cause severe oxidation, forcing the lubricant to easily oxidize in a short time. The resultant used oil is measured for BN, AN, FTIR-oxidation and viscosity to determine speed and amount of oxidation. These engine tests are analogous to the actual use that the lubricant could be subjected to in the field, but at a shorted interval.

Figure 1 shows an example from one of these test studies. The effects of the acids reacting to lower the base reserve, BN, are clear, while the oxidation cannot immediately be observed in the FTIR or viscosity regions.

[A4orce84]

Hey Guys,

This is a great post! I've actually been considering the idea of bumping up my oil change interval (OCI) from the 5-7k MILE range to the 10k MILE mark on my 1.8T (APR Stage 2+).

The reason why I started thinking this way was mainly from my own previous blackstone labs report that I did a few months ago:
Engine: 1.8T
Year: 2004
Mileage: 163,000
Oil Change Interval (OCI): 6k
Oil: Shell Rotella T6 5W-40



I think all the old 1.8T sludge issues that happened back in the day, were the result of using Dino oil and the old smaller filter. In my opinion, with the Synthetic Oil + Larger 1.8T filters, 10k OCI is more do-able. I'm going to start switching to the longer 10K MILE OCI very soon after I see how the numbers look from Blackstone after 8K-9K mile mark.

What's everyone's thoughts on the topic?

Thanks,
Asif

[tHatOne guY]

Hey Guys,

This is a great post! I've actually been considering the idea of bumping up my oil change interval (OCI) from the 5-7k MILE range to the 10k MILE mark on my 1.8T (APR Stage 2+).

The reason why I started thinking this way was mainly from my own previous blackstone labs report that I did a few months ago:
Engine: 1.8T
Year: 2004
Mileage: 163,000
Oil Change Interval (OCI): 6k
Oil: Shell Rotella T6 5W-40



I think all the old 1.8T sludge issues that happened back in the day, were the result of using Dino oil and the old smaller filter. In my opinion, with the Synthetic Oil + Larger 1.8T filters, 10k OCI is more do-able. I'm going to start switching to the longer 10K MILE OCI very soon after I see how the numbers look from Blackstone after 8K-9K mile mark.

What's everyone's thoughts on the topic?

Thanks,
Asif

I say go for it. I ran my B5 into the ground for 100k miles using only T6 and the large oil filter. Hardly ever warmed up or cooled down properly and regularly ran the oil 14-15k miles before changing. Ran probably about 100-150 tuning logs with that little car and it never missed a beat.

The only failure I experienced with that car was the vvt cam chain tensioner making the diesel sound at idle only. I sold that car with 272k miles on the clock, valve cover looked clean as a whistle at the time of departure.

I've never treated any other car that way but I didn't have much money in it to buy it and I wanted to see if I should even invest the VAG stuff. After that car, I was sold. After jumping ship from a much more reliable Japanese manufacturer I had to put the Audi through some years of hard service before I could really make up my mind to commit.