Clutch judder becoming more apparent

[svt]

I have a 2012 B8 with ~41.5k on the odometer.

The past few weeks, I've been experiencing more and more of this clutch "judder" that other folks had mentioned in here and in other forums. It's occurring 90% of the time in first gear immediately prior to full clutch engagement, regardless if the car is cold or warm. I'm worried that this is starting to become a serious problem as I can sometimes feel it going into 2nd. And to make things worse, my warranty expires at the end of this month.

Has anybody else ever experienced this "judder" or "shudder" of the clutch just prior to full clutch engagement? And is this something that could become a problem down the road? Lastly, if this is an issue, is an issue that could be resolved under warranty?

Cheers.

[blbroo]

Should be a warranty, being drivetrain.

[o1turbo30v]

The clutch is a wear item and not subjected to warranty. Time to upgrade.

[VeeDubbinJetta]

I just noticed mine doing the same thing at times. I have just over 20k miles on my 2014. I was thinking about having them look at it when I take it in for the recall

[svt]

I spoke with one of the service reps tonight and he said that none of it would be covered under warranty... neither the clutch (obviously) or the flywheel. If it were a defect, the warranty on those lasts until 12k.

Seems hard to believe that my clutch is experiencing issues at 41k. Either the first owner drove horribly within the first 20k miles, or the stock Audi clutch is garbage. My old Chevy Cobalt clutch was still going strong at 70k and I drove it like I stole it.

Hopefully it doesn't become an issue anytime soon.

[mr_milo]

I just noticed mine doing the same thing at times. I have just over 20k miles on my 2014. I was thinking about having them look at it when I take it in for the recall

Same here. I'm at ~24K miles on my 2014.

[Project Quattro]

Mine does this occasionally, but I never noticed it until it was below 40 degrees out. Seems to happen more often as it gets colder. I have no idea why that would be, but from September until late December it never happened. I'll probably ask the dealer to look at it whenever I'm next in.


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[fender9530]

I have the same problem. 38k on my 2012. My passengers must think I have no clue what I'm doing. It's very frustrating.


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[seangrimes590]

Same issue on my car, seems to be more prevalent when it's cold out (< 40) or after 45+ minutes on the highway. Clutch doesn't show any signs of slipping otherwise. Interestingly, there's a specific seat position where the clutch will judder at takeoff no matter what. Obviously the seat doesn't mess with the clutch; what I think is happening is the clutch/flywheel/pressure plate combo is shit, and when I sit in a specific position I let the clutch out in a way that it 'doesn't like'. If I move my seat up or back and inch it stops happening.

For anybody having the judder issue, as ridiculous as this sounds, try moving your seat forward or backward just a bit and see what happens. Maybe I'm just an idiot.

[petraman]

Sorry for bumping an old thread but did you get any help from the dealer? Just bought a CPO A4 manual and it does the exact same thing. Took it back to them and they told me it was normal and that I need to slip the clutch more when I drive. I rolled my eyes... none of my 3 other manual transmission cars have ever done anything like this. The only thing close was a car whose clutch was about to go. I have 27k miles on my car... that better not be the case.

[seangrimes590]

I've adjusted how I engage the clutch, exact opposite of what your dealer said actually; engage it as quickly as possible from a stop and it's been pretty good the past few months. It was a rough week or so while I was getting used to the 'new way' of releasing the clutch but once I got used to it things weren't any rougher and no jerkiness or stutter from the clutch. I'd be cautious about slipping the clutch more, the dealer has no requirement to replace that part as it's a wear item so the reduced life from their method is entirely your burden to pay for when it stops grabbing.

[mahunik]

I had a clutch judder for like a week so I pretty much sat in my neighborhood testing different ways of engaging. All I know is at some point it randomly went away and I think launching my car aggressively had some say in it going away lol. Other then my clutch pedal creeking a little bit (111k miles) shit engages like butter on microwaved bread

[petraman]

So now it comes and goes for like weeks at a time. Right now, it's the worst it's been. I haven't driven it any differently, and I've had two other seasoned manual drivers (one of which owns a manual A5) who experienced the same issue so I know it's not me bogging down the engine. I've taken it to the dealer twice for this issue (40 miles away... I have one 5 miles away but I figured the one I bought it from might be more lenient.) and not once could they find a problem with it. In this case, it's not the dealers fault... I tried to replicate it for them and both times it didn't happen to be doing it at all (tried worse case scenario... on a hill, cold morning, nothing).

Then they came out and said it would most likely be a wear item and the $2500 tab would most likely not be covered. I feel like this isn't too fair, since I bought it Certified directly from an Audi dealer. I documented the first phone call literally 1 hour after buying it. I wondered if I should have tried to return it (IIRC there was a 48 hour return period.) I feel pretty swindled right now. What do I do? Is Audi USA receptive to social media? I can't keep driving customers around in a car that shudders on acceleration like this.

[svt]

It comes and goes... not sure why or how, but I can go an entire week without any issues and then it'll shudder for a day or two.

However, I have noticed that it occurs more often when attempting to reverse on an incline. Since moving to a job that has a parking garage, I noticed it more in reverse when backing out of a spot on a ramp.

See if you have any issues with it occurring in reverse on a slight incline.

[dansjuice]

There have been dozens of posts of guys needing new clutches on the b8.5 s4 with less then 36k. Finding it here also on the A4 platform leads me to believe there should be an investigation in a faulty equipment. Does this b8.5 A4 also have the clutches that auto engage and rev matches?

[svt]

There have been dozens of posts of guys needing new clutches on the b8.5 s4 with less then 36k. Finding it here also on the A4 platform leads me to believe there should be an investigation in a faulty equipment. Does this b8.5 A4 also have the clutches that auto engage and rev matches?

Nope. I have a 2012 B8 and I don't have auto engage or rev matching.

[Allowencer]

I have 112k miles on my car, it's a MT and I was the original owner. I've never had any issues with my clutch.

[B7Night]

My B7 lost its clutch at 148,000 miles. It was going to be $3000 at the dealer. But they ended up doing it for $2500. I looked at an Import garage, and it was going to be cheaper, but they weren't going to use the right flywheel. Audi and BMW use a flywheel with a rubber gasket imbedded to help isolate engine/transmission vibration and make the clutch take up smoother. The independent shop wasn't going to replace the flywheel with one that included the gasket. A no go for me! Anyway, I wonder if the chatter behavior in cold weather might be due to the rubber gasket being so cold that it's not absorbing the vibration/clutch impact correctly until it warms and softens up.

[Project Quattro]

There have been dozens of posts of guys needing new clutches on the b8.5 s4 with less then 36k. Finding it here also on the A4 platform leads me to believe there should be an investigation in a faulty equipment. Does this b8.5 A4 also have the clutches that auto engage and rev matches?

Yes the B8.5 does rev match slightly if you release the clutch very slowly (without pressing the gas) on relatively flat ground. It's enough to get the car rolling if you're patient with it.


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[Mr.Audi]

I have the same issues, and its just as intermittent as noted in past posts.


but, Ive had people that have driven it say that its just a worn out clutch assembly an to replace it.

car has 88k on it.

never slips under load or launching or hard accel.

not sure.

[Allowencer]

Yes the B8.5 does rev match slightly if you release the clutch very slowly (without pressing the gas) on relatively flat ground. It's enough to get the car rolling if you're patient with it.

Sent from the Pedal Responce boardroom

The B8 has the same coding too; clutch assist.

[petraman]

Going into the dealer for the third time to have them look at it. I thought it fixed itself for a while there, but it came back with a vengeance a couple weeks ago. Up until now, they haven't been able to replicate it because it comes and goes so quickly, but last time I took it in he finally felt it while he was driving, but it was maybe a 4/10 on the intensity scale. He's skeptical of it being a drivetrain issue, though... I'm not sure what else it could be.

Has anyone been able to find any service bulletins about this issue? Seems like it's pretty common so hopefully there's something out there. To be honest, if they can't figure this out, I'm probably going to sell it. I can't be driving customers around in a car that shakes like a Pinto when you let off the clutch. It's a shame because, other than this issue, I really like the car.

[svt]

It hasn't been affecting me lately. You're right that it comes and goes quite often, but this is the only real issue I've had with the car since owning it 2.5 years. I plan on keeping mine for now until a larger issue arises... I have to get my money out of the snow tires I bought.

[NVLARCHITECT]

Bumping this because I am having the same issue on my B8 A5 2.0. Similar story to another poster - 41k miles and I've been having this clutch "shuddering". It happens when Im fully "in gear". At like 3000rpm if I gas it the RPM needles dont move always and I feel it could be the clutch slipping at the point. Problem is getting more frequent. This sucks !

[petraman]

So... wanted to post an update so I don't bump my other thread which has a ridiculous title... I won't even mention it (I was pissed). I finally got a dealer to admit that, yes, it is definitely the flywheel. However, because I don't have a relationship with that particular dealer, they want me to pay $1200 up front for labor to diagnose it. If the flywheel is not the issue (doubtful) or Audi decides not to warranty it (plausible) I would be out that money and left with the same issue. If the latter is the case, it would cost $5k to replace the clutch and flywheel.

The fact is, I'm really disappointed with Audi customer service. I really don't feel like I'm asking a lot... After a long trip on the highway (which is when its at its worse... funny since the clutch is barely used at all) it can shake the entire car, which was finally able to be duplicated by both dealers. This has been an issue from day 1 and it's amazing that its taken me this long to get at least some kind of a way out (as half-assed it may be). Although I must admit that they didn't have to replace the coils or clean out the carbon, so at least they did something.... but if they did all that, why couldn't they have looked at the drivetrain to begin with? Also, I called AoA customer service and they basically told me it's up to the dealer and I'm SOL.

So what am I going to do? Make lemonade out of lemons. I'm going to go with a Eurocode stage 1 fw/clutch combo and mod the shit out of it. Fuck the warranty, it's obviously useless under certain situations. Won't happen until the spring, most likely (might be making a major move in a month...), but it's gonna happen. From what I've read, combining that setup with a fluidampr leads to a stock-like feel/nvh but much stronger and without the weak DMF. While I'm at it, I will also budget for a rear main seal and SS clutch line. It might be close to what the dealer is asking (hopefully $3.5k-$4k with the fluidampr), but I think I will be much happier (and more confident) with this setup.

I don't regret buying my car... it's a wonderful platform and I'm 100% happy with it otherwise. But this will DEFINITELY be the last used car I buy. Especially considering that I'd pay less money for a lease compared to my loan... TBH, even though I'm not as much of a fan of the B9 as I am the B8.5, a manual sport-plus sure seems tempting right now... (especially if I get this job).

Sorry for the novel.

[mr_milo]

Wow, that sucks! I have to say that I'm not very happy with Audi recently. They were great with my 4000CS and my old '99.5 A4 1.8TQMS but they have gotten really bad about taking responsibility for their issues / problems. It's sad to hear about this and the number of people that were denied an oil consumption fix since they were TD1 from a tune. Just not the same old Audi I have known and loved for so long. :(

[MikeB8.5]

You're going with Stage 1 clutch, Dual mass flywheel and modding on top of it? What type of mods are you planning to throw at a stage 1 clutch. I'd recommend stage 2 at the least and swapping the dual mass for a single mass, otherwise you may be going through the process again in a short period of time.

[petraman]

Sorry if that wasn't clear... the eurocode is a single mass. As far as mods are concerned, I'm planning to go stage 2 (no K04) and probably an IC down the road. Not going to go too crazy, it still needs to be a decent DD.

Although after the recent posts about TD1s, I might hold off a couple years...

[Jacon]

Your clutch problem is probably why it was traded in.

[petraman]

Wanna know the fun part? I found out its original owner was a salesman at the dealer. I hate being cynical, but I have a feeling they knew all along.

[svt]

Your clutch problem is probably why it was traded in.

Thanks for your haphazard opinion.

[petraman]

Sooo... 2nd gear has been giving me issues lately. Kinda feels like it's "catching." If this is leading to a syncro issue, I'm going to be pissed. Ugh, why didn't I just lease a new one? Shudder is still there, hasn't gotten better or worse.

Oh, and my dealer mentioned that they've heard of input shaft seals leaking, causing this kind of shuddering... Which would make sense, given this new issue.

:edit:

oooook, just took the car out and it goes into second perfectly. I don't understand this car.

[petraman]

Sorry for being kind of off-topic, but I imagine this is how the board meeting went when LuK sold Audi on their DMFs:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZpT...utu.be&t=4m24s

[petraman]

Ok! Today I got my new JHM Stage 1 clutch/fw kit installed. 1st off... If you have the means, DO IT NOW! I had no idea how much a direct clutch feel would improve the driving experience. Not very many negatives, either... A little extra noise in the lower RPMs (<2000 at medium throttle) but nothing irritating, and the quicker revs completely make up for it. No audible chatter at idle, either, even with the A/C on.

Did it fix the issue? YES. We couldn't figure out what failed, and in my excitement I forgot to pick up the old parts so I could post pics of them in this thread. Oh well...

[svt]

Ok! Today I got my new JHM Stage 1 clutch/fw kit installed. 1st off... If you have the means, DO IT NOW! I had no idea how much a direct clutch feel would improve the driving experience. Not very many negatives, either... A little extra noise in the lower RPMs (<2000 at medium throttle) but nothing irritating, and the quicker revs completely make up for it. No audible chatter at idle, either, even with the A/C on.

Did it fix the issue? YES. We couldn't figure out what failed, and in my excitement I forgot to pick up the old parts so I could post pics of them in this thread. Oh well...

If you don't mind me asking, how much were the parts + labor on something like this? PM if you'd like.

I may go this route if it continues to bother me, but my car only has 60500 miles on it. Perhaps if I win the lottery...

[petraman]

PM'd

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[petraman]

Went back to the shop, and low and behold, they didn't throw it out! Managed to get a video of it... Pretty clear what the culprit was.

[svt]

pardon my ignorance, but what exactly does that mean? it sounds like it is loose in some way.

[helldriver]

Mine has been doing this also since I bought it 3 yrs ago, sometimes its smooth, sometimes not so smooth ,but it still bites and the power is still getting down, but the inevitable will happen, specially when the turbo gets upgraded. just turned 87,000 on the odo and no hard launches from my foot.

[petraman]

pardon my ignorance, but what exactly does that mean? it sounds like it is loose in some way.

So as I've been told, the flywheel should rotate about that axis, but should also have resistance with no play. As you can see, there's plenty of play with mine. It also shifts up and down, which is odd. I almost want to take it apart to see what actually failed. It's a pretty interesting contraption.