Question regarding TD1

[xuandatou]

Hi,

The car (MY2013) has APR STG2 ECU Tuning and was flagged with TD1 about a year ago

Today I took my car to a local Audi dealership for 25K maintenance and asked my SA to check the back-up camera as well since it did not function properly from time to time (put into the reverse gear, the video screen would slightly flash, then getting dark and finally shut down itself)

"There isn't much I can do for it, TD1 literally avoids everything" said my SA (sounds BS to me)

And here are my questions:

1. Does TD1 really avoid everything on the car?

2. What would be the best solution for my back-up camera issue (or anything that may not highly related with ECU Tuning)?

3. Any trusted dealership in the Bay Area you would recommend?






Thanks in advance !
Pro

[doug97gxe]

TD1 voids your power train warranty .. not all warranty.. contact AoA

[kabob]

There's a Federal law that prevents dealerships from completely voiding your warranty. They can only void the portion that is affected by the modification and the backup camera obviously isn't affected by an APR tune.

[bknewtype]

are you dropped?

i used to have the same issue. backup came goes on, but then goes completely off. sometimes flickers. sometimes i see strange artifacts. i raised my car since then, and i would say the problems went away ( hasnt come back for about a few months already )

the wiring for the backup cam is on the wheel well on the driver side. i made a post about this, can help you check out the wiring

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...1#post10990183

BUT to answer your first question, td1 only voids power train, so u should still be able to take it in for check

[namvar]

Audi concord's service department is very good.


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[xuandatou]

Thank you so much for all the posts ! Seems like I need to switch to Audi Concord and have everything taken care of !

- - - Updated - - -

TD1 voids your power train warranty .. not all warranty.. contact AoA

There's a Federal law that prevents dealerships from completely voiding your warranty. They can only void the portion that is affected by the modification and the backup camera obviously isn't affected by an APR tune.

Audi concord's service department is very good.


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Thank you so much for all the posts ! Seems like I need to switch to Audi Concord and have everything taken care of !

[xuandatou]

are you dropped?

i used to have the same issue. backup came goes on, but then goes completely off. sometimes flickers. sometimes i see strange artifacts. i raised my car since then, and i would say the problems went away ( hasnt come back for about a few months already )

the wiring for the backup cam is on the wheel well on the driver side. i made a post about this, can help you check out the wiring

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...1#post10990183

BUT to answer your first question, td1 only voids power train, so u should still be able to take it in for check

Thanks a lot !

Yeah, the car has been lowered since the delivery day.

I think we have the exact same issue, I will double check the cables

[TOOGECKO]

I was having the same issue. Dealer wanted to change the cable and I had an issue because that involved an ECU flash as part of the proposed fix (APR Stage III car). I did not end up going this route and the problem eventually went away. I suspect mine was caused by me updating the MMI software and it did something to the calibration settings. Been working fine for past several months; drove the car for about two months with intermittent problems. I did check the cable in trunk area and did not find anything abnormal with it...

[Pilfer]

Thanks a lot !

Yeah, the car has been lowered since the delivery day.

I think we have the exact same issue, I will double check the cables

Check out the Audi dealership in Burlingame. Closer than concord for you, I went there with my car which was almost modded as much as yours. No TD1 listed on my service receipt and I told them everything I had done and was planning on doing. They also didn't wash my car which made me very happy

[LINDW4LL]

TD1 voids your power train warranty .. not all warranty.. contact AoA

Wrong. TD1 does not "void" your powertrain warranty. It simply causes Audi to look closer at any powertrain-related claims. This MAY result in denial of certain things, yes, but saying that it automatically causes any part of your warranty to be void is not at all accurate.

[xuandatou]

Check out the Audi dealership in Burlingame. Closer than concord for you, I went there with my car which was almost modded as much as yours. No TD1 listed on my service receipt and I told them everything I had done and was planning on doing. They also didn't wash my car which made me very happy

Had been a happy customer at Rector Audi (Burlingame) until one tech pissed me off by putting back wrong wheel bolts and insisted that he was 100% right. SA down there was OK

To be honest, I do not really care how far I have to drive at this time point. (it seems like Audi of SF is a joke, and so is Audi of Oakland)

I just want the car to be taken care of.

[xuandatou]

Wrong. TD1 does not "void" your powertrain warranty. It simply causes Audi to look closer at any powertrain-related claims. This MAY result in denial of certain things, yes, but saying that it automatically causes any part of your warranty to be void is not at all accurate.

So they still could deny the rear-view camera cable replacement if I met a jerk SA?

[LINDW4LL]

So they still could deny the rear-view camera cable replacement if I met a jerk SA?

Your Service Advisor is either a total moron or is just being a dick. A tune has absolutely nothing to do with your rearview camera, and the fact that he'd even mention TD1 in relation to the diagnosis/replacement of it is astounding.

The best solution here would likely be to find another dealer as it won't be worth dealing with this Service Advisor long-term if you have other (real) issues arise.

[doug97gxe]

Wrong. TD1 does not "void" your powertrain warranty. It simply causes Audi to look closer at any powertrain-related claims. This MAY result in denial of certain things, yes, but saying that it automatically causes any part of your warranty to be void is not at all accurate.

there is a list of TD codes.. its actually does void your power train warranty .. there are other TD codes that void other parts of the warranty as well .. its automatically voided . you can chose to fight it.. but the flag is a void of your power train warranty

[LINDW4LL]

there is a list of TD codes.. its actually does void your power train warranty .. there are other TD codes that void other parts of the warranty as well .. its automatically voided . you can chose to fight it.. but the flag is a void of your power train warranty

I'm well aware of the various codes.

What you're saying is completely wrong and untrue. Please stop spreading BS.

[doug97gxe]

I'm well aware of the various codes.

What you're saying is completely wrong and untrue. Please stop spreading BS.

i'm not going to argue with you for the sake of you wanting to argue.. if you feel what i said is BS or incorrect please post opposing proof.. because there is far more information on it being a void of warranty then you saying its not without proving your point

[doug97gxe]

If an unauthorized ECM calibration is detected, a "TD1" code will automatically be populated within the Warranty Key section of ELSA web.

Note:

No powertrain tuning is supported, authorized or warrantied by Audi of America

maybe i misunderstood this information..

[Zonsolo]

I don't want to get in the middle of your argument, but the last statement:

"No powertrain tuning is supported, authorized or warrantied by Audi of America"

Is stating that they do not warrant, or support any tuning, which makes complete sense. So if you have a problem with your tuning they won't warranty the tune. That statement doesn't say you no longer have the Audi warranty.

[joshuamoore]

Am I reading that correctly that Intake system modifications are included in a TD1 flag?

That worries me since there are now two new intakes available for the RS5 and I was considering one of them :/

[Jimmy ny]

I don't want to get in the middle of your argument, but the last statement:

"No powertrain tuning is supported, authorized or warrantied by Audi of America"

Is stating that they do not warrant, or support any tuning, which makes complete sense. So if you have a problem with your tuning they won't warranty the tune. That statement doesn't say you no longer have the Audi warranty.

They were probably referring to Stasis tunes. They are no longer in business thanks to Audi.


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[doug97gxe]

I don't want to get in the middle of your argument, but the last statement:

"No powertrain tuning is supported, authorized or warrantied by Audi of America"

Is stating that they do not warrant, or support any tuning, which makes complete sense. So if you have a problem with your tuning they won't warranty the tune. That statement doesn't say you no longer have the Audi warranty.

quite possibly

[14S4GWM]

Am I reading that correctly that Intake system modifications are included in a TD1 flag?

That worries me since there are now two new intakes available for the RS5 and I was considering one of them :/

Yes, though would have to be manually flagged. Change before your visit.

[JamesRS5]

Change before your visit.

That's my plan.

[Hy Octane]

Stay Stock and Worry Free!!

[b8audis4]

No idea if that will hold up but I would say that if I install an intake on my car, and the clutch packs go out on the transmission, I feel they would have a pretty hard time denying my warranty for that. I would recommend removing an intake though before you take it in, since it is such an easy install and uninstall.

[joshuamoore]

Yes, though would have to be manually flagged. Change before your visit.

I hear what you are staying there, but if you read what was posted it clearly states:

This warranty code can not be manually added or removed

So, would an intake cause a TD1? That's still the outstanding question. I don't see how it could with an automated test. Then again, I am ignorant about the actual test that is being done automatically and without the service tech's knowledge.

Anyone out there with an aftermarket intake care to share their Audi service experiences?

[LINDW4LL]

I hear what you are staying there, but if you read what was posted it clearly states:

This warranty code can not be manually added or removed

So, would an intake cause a TD1? That's still the outstanding question. I don't see how it could with an automated test. Then again, I am ignorant about the actual test that is being done automatically and without the service tech's knowledge.

Anyone out there with an aftermarket intake care to share their Audi service experiences?

Despite their wording, an intake (along with other aftermarket parts- short shifter, exhaust, etc) can be manually entered into the system by an Audi Technician, which will cause a TD1 flag. 95% of techs will not do this and I think one would have to be a real dick to do so.

However, even if you are manually flagged TD1 due to an intake, that would only matter if their was an engine claim/failure directly related to the aftermarket intake. A foreign object making it past the air filter and damaging your engine is about the only possibility I can think of, and Audi would be right in denying that claim.

[Jimmy ny]

My service dpt. I spoke to told me, they don't look to bother customers with simple mods. They said software is the big issue. They have to scan the car for certain warranty repairs.


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[midam96]

Does Audi TD1 itself for software emissions cheating?

[AirmattRS5]

Does Audi TD1 itself for software emissions cheating?

[bruno7652]

Despite their wording, an intake (along with other aftermarket parts- short shifter, exhaust, etc) can be manually entered into the system by an Audi Technician, which will cause a TD1 flag. 95% of techs will not do this and I think one would have to be a real dick to do so.

However, even if you are manually flagged TD1 due to an intake, that would only matter if their was an engine claim/failure directly related to the aftermarket intake. A foreign object making it past the air filter and damaging your engine is about the only possibility I can think of, and Audi would be right in denying that claim. Not to mention the chance of something making it past a [high quality] air filter is about zero percent.

Please help me understand this better so that even I can understand it.
Are you statting that there is a slight posibility that I could get a TD1 code by some tech simply because I replaced the POS Audi stock paper air intake filter that was stock in my S5, with a much better BMC intake air filter?
I did not replace the air box or the hoses just the intake filter.
I did place the stickers that came with the filter alerting any techs that pop's the hood that the filter in the air box is not to be removed or trashed.

[LINDW4LL]

Please help me understand this better so that even I can understand it.
Are you statting that there is a slight posibility that I could get a TD1 code by some tech simply because I replaced the POS Audi stock paper air intake filter that was stock in my S5, with a much better BMC intake air filter? I did not replace the air box or the hoses just the intake filter.

You could certainly get flagged for that- yes. What many people aren't understanding is that a "TD1" flag by itself is not a big deal, given that it's for an intake, exhaust, etc

The flag would not matter unless there was an engine failure directly related to the air filter, such as a foreign object making it's way through the filter and into your engine. In this case, Audi would technically need to prove that the aftermarket filter caused the failure.

[Pilfer]

L O L

[bruno7652]

Thanks for taking your time to respond to my question.

[Jeff V.]

In this case, Audi would technically need to prove that the aftermarket filter caused the failure.

Actually, the owner of the car would need to spend a pile of money lawyering up to make Audi prove that the mod caused the failure. Like most legal battles, they're bigger than we are and they'll probably win through attrition

Does anyone know of a way to check for a modded ECM without going through a dealer? I don't think my car was flashed before I bought it, but it'd be nice to be able to check. I'm sure it's just based on software checksums like a lot of other cars. But I have yet to see a tool, whether it's VagCom/VCDS or anything else, that can compare your ECM against a list of known factory values.

[LINDW4LL]

Actually, the owner of the car would need to spend a pile of money lawyering up to make Audi prove that the mod caused the failure. Like most legal battles, they're bigger than we are and they'll probably win through attrition

That's why I said "technically"

Nonetheless, the chance of any failure being related to an air filter is just about zero.

[Mobileguy]

My car is modded and I just had it serviced at Audi under warranty.
First and foremost, Audi cannot *void* your warranty, but they certainly have the right to deny a warranty claim if they suspect your modification was a contributing factor. They don't have to *prove* anything (leave that to the lawyers). I suspect in your case, the stealership simply does not want to deal with your warranty repair because Audi no longer rubber stamps dealership warranty reimbursement claims for cars that have been TD1 flagged. It's more work for them and if you have already rubbed them the wrong way, they are unlikely to help you out.

Here is a very good video on how modifications affect warranty claims: http://youtu.be/wW25ZxVPqxg

As for checking if your car is already flagged, I would call AoA and claim that I am about to purchase a car that is still under warranty and ask them if the (your) VIN has been flagged by them.

[NPuter]

I may be wring, but I didn't read anything in the note section of page 2 of the TSB as indicating that the TD1 code can be received for something like an intake. It states, "A warranty key must be entered manually..." - it doesn't specify a certain one. I'm speculating that there are multiple related to different forms of "tuning."
Further, it states in multiple places that the TD1 code is for "unauthorized ecm calibration/chip tuning," so it would make no sense for the code to be added if your only mod is with the intake.

Also, while it does sound like your powertrain warranty is essentially voided with the TD1 code, nothing I saw in the posted literature seems to specifically state that.

[joshuamoore]

I may be wring, but I didn't read anything in the note section of page 2 of the TSB as indicating that the TD1 code can be received for something like an intake. It states, "A warranty key must be entered manually..." - it doesn't specify a certain one. I'm speculating that there are multiple related to different forms of "tuning."
Further, it states in multiple places that the TD1 code is for "unauthorized ecm calibration/chip tuning," so it would make no sense for the code to be added if your only mod is with the intake.

Also, while it does sound like your powertrain warranty is essentially voided with the TD1 code, nothing I saw in the posted literature seems to specifically state that.

It's still not clear, I agree. However, in the posted information it states that ECM tuning is considered Powertrain Tuning and then lists other examples of Powertrain Tuning which includes intake modifications. I think that's where the confusion (at least for me) is.

I'm personally grateful for all the opinions and perspectives being offered here as I'm trying to evaluate the risk of modifying my own RS5.

[bknewtype]

It's still not clear, I agree. However, in the posted information it states that ECM tuning is considered Powertrain Tuning and then lists other examples of Powertrain Tuning which includes intake modifications. I think that's where the confusion (at least for me) is.

I'm personally grateful for all the opinions and perspectives being offered here as I'm trying to evaluate the risk of modifying my own RS5.

i wouldn't worry too much if u want to mod ur RS5. the only thing id say stay away from is the tune since its no big power gains.

exhaust, suspension, ecodes, ridiculously priced intake, and ur good :)