Brake Options

[bxultra]

So I've waiting and I think its time to make a decision. Im stuck between brake pad and rotor options. What are your opinions or experiences? Theres so many choices its hard to choose from, Adams rotors has full sets, ECS has full sets. I couldn't find sets of Stoptech or EBC but in the end theres not too much price difference between them all. I have no clue about pads either. Im an enthusiastic and spirited driver and the stock pads (I'm assuming they've never changed lol) stopped the car quite well for me, I've never doubted them. But when things get old you upgrade, right? lol

[Avant Nate]

I've had PBR ceramics for a few years now, no complaints. About to upgrade to A8 fronts, probably go with them again.

[bxultra]

I've had PBR ceramics for a few years now, no complaints. About to upgrade to A8 fronts, probably go with them again.

The A8 brake swap is a little bit of work isn't it? Don't you need to have a certain size or better wheel to avoid fitment issues with the rotors or something? I know theres something along those lines with the A8 setup.

[MetalMan]

The A8 brake swap is a little bit of work isn't it? Don't you need to have a certain size or better wheel to avoid fitment issues with the rotors or something? I know theres something along those lines with the A8 setup.

Not much work, and the work you do for it would be the same work you do if you're replacing rotors anyways. The upgrade only consists of new rotors and caliper carriers, and everything else is the same.
The minimum wheel size would be 16".

[bxultra]

Not much work, and the work you do for it would be the same work you do if you're replacing rotors anyways. The upgrade only consists of new rotors and caliper carriers, and everything else is the same.
The minimum wheel size would be 16".

TT carriers, correct? Thats what I read. It seems those who do this upgrade also upgraded to SS lines as well. I mean I guess I can understand more surface area on the rotor equates to better braking, but is it really that much of a difference or upgrade? Maybe some just do it for a faux BB upgrade? Im just speculating.

[Avant Nate]

Its a ghetto BBK.

[bxultra]

^kinda what I assumed lol

[bxultra]

I don't plan on going BBK until I upgrade my turbo, that probably wouldn't be for another 1.5-2 years.

[MetalMan]

TT carriers, correct? Thats what I read. It seems those who do this upgrade also upgraded to SS lines as well. I mean I guess I can understand more surface area on the rotor equates to better braking, but is it really that much of a difference or upgrade? Maybe some just do it for a faux BB upgrade? Im just speculating.

Yeah, TT (MK1, I think) carriers, and D2 A8 rotors.
The rotors have more surface area for heat dissipation, and more mass to absorb more heat. This means reduced potential for brake fade compared to stock. Downsides are a little more rotating mass and unsprung weight.
Also the brake pads are moved further from the rotation axis compared to stock, which means increased braking force can be applied.

Many people (myself included) consider this a worthy upgrade in terms of performance vs. cost. It certainly looks better too!

[bxultra]

Yeah, TT (MK1, I think) carriers, and D2 A8 rotors.
The rotors have more surface area for heat dissipation, and more mass to absorb more heat. This means reduced potential for brake fade compared to stock. Downsides are a little more rotating mass and unsprung weight.
Also the brake pads are moved further from the rotation axis compared to stock, which means increased braking force can be applied.

Many people (myself included) consider this a worthy upgrade in terms of performance vs. cost. It certainly looks better too!

I can agree it looks good without a doubt, but Im not sure if I can find TT calipers locally for a good price. There probably wouldn't be much difference in price of rotors for an A4 to an A8, but Im not looking to spend $400 EXTRA on new TT carriers just to have A8 rotors. Thats the only thing I can't justify to myself as being a worthy investment. If Im spending 8-900$ on new carriers, rotors, pads, I feel as though I should just go full BBK. Yet I haven't even looked for TT carriers so I can't say the A8 upgrade isn't an option. Ill have to check around.

[BaseDrifter]

TT carriers alone usually sell for $100-150. I lucked out and got the carriers and rotors for less than $200 IIRC. I also rebuilt the calipers, upgraded to ECS stainless brake lines, and I'm running Hawk HPS pads right now. I'd say it's a good upgrade.

And as mentioned, it looks a hell of a lot better. With 16" wheels there is maybe 1/8" of clearance.

[Avant Nate]

ECS has kits with carriers and a8 rotors starting at $255
http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B5_A4-...Front/Stage_1/
So a decent upgrade, especially if your in the need of new rotors.
I pieced mine together for $200. $120 for the carriers and $80 for the rotors. But if you want to spend a grand on a BBK, go for it.

[ricekikr]

Skip the a8. Isn't much improvement over the stock brakes. Fades just as fast the stock brakes. And leverage argument is moot since the stock ones can lockup (normal 350+threadwear) tires just as well as the a8.

But if your on a budget and replacing rotors and pads, might as well get a8 just need additional carriers.

Comparison was A8/hps vs stock, both couldn't lockup (or activate abs) on stickyish tires . Current brakes are 18z/ebc yellow and works much better.

[rodgertherabit]

Its a ghetto BBK.

I would call it a "budget" or "oem" upgrade rather than a BBK. BBKs dont use stock calipers

Now, toss some Boxster 4pots on those a8 rotors, and you have a really strong and basic (small BBK) using real racing brakes. especially on a budget!

[Cgoon009]

EBC redstuff pads.

Slotted and drilled rotors, or blanks. I prefer slotted and drilled.

I ran that set up, and it has by far been my favorite.

[RallyeBourne]

I'm running redstuff on all four corners and loving it. I'm just on blank rotors.

[bxultra]

ECS has kits with carriers and a8 rotors starting at $255
http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B5_A4-...Front/Stage_1/
So a decent upgrade, especially if your in the need of new rotors.
I pieced mine together for $200. $120 for the carriers and $80 for the rotors. But if you want to spend a grand on a BBK, go for it.

This is great! I've never seen this before on the site. Its a little more expensive but it almost makes it come out to 50$ per carrier which beats 100$ per carrier. Ill keep this one in mind when i finally make my decision.

[bxultra]

Does anyone know if theres an a8 brake swap for the rears thats similarly as easy as the fronts? Its not much work at all. Ill be doing all 4 rotors and pads, even though the fronts don't need them. Just to ensure everything is updated/upgraded as I haven't done too much maintenance for the first year I've owned my b5. I guess ill go with the red stuff pads seeing as 2 people prefer them, they're probably more important to stopping the car than the rotors anyways lol

[bxultra]

I would call it a "budget" or "oem" upgrade rather than a BBK. BBKs dont use stock calipers

Now, toss some Boxster 4pots on those a8 rotors, and you have a really strong and basic (small BBK) using real racing brakes. especially on a budget!

Im sure those 4pots are a good chunk of change. But you said on a budget so it wouldn't hurt to do a little search on em.

[RallyeBourne]

If you order the redstuff on pepboys.com right now, you can get 30% off.

[bxultra]

If you order the redstuff on pepboys.com right now, you can get 30% off.

how long will that last? lol do you have to order online?

[RallyeBourne]

how long will that last? lol do you have to order online?

They don't tell us. My guess is as long as the 'founders days' things going on, that ends the 21st. My store will honor the coupon code in store at the register if the customer mentions it, but some wont. The problem is that the EBC stuff is warehouse order, so you'll at least have to call the store to order them.

[bxultra]

They don't tell us. My guess is as long as the 'founders days' things going on, that ends the 21st. My store will honor the coupon code in store at the register if the customer mentions it, but some wont. The problem is that the EBC stuff is warehouse order, so you'll at least have to call the store to order them.

ill go to my local pep boys and see what they got going on. 30% is a good deal for most anything.

[ricekikr]

i guess ill go with the red stuff pads seeing as 2 people prefer them, they're probably more important to stopping the car than the rotors anyways lol

Might want to check Ebc Yellow as well. They should provide better stopping power compared to the reds.

Mine don't squeak at all and works even when cold.

[MetalMan]

Does anyone know if theres an a8 brake swap for the rears thats similarly as easy as the fronts? Its not much work at all. Ill be doing all 4 rotors and pads, even though the fronts don't need them. Just to ensure everything is updated/upgraded

Rear brake upgrade is to go with B5 S4 rear brakes... brake calipers, caliper carriers, and rotors. The rotors are about the same diameter as stock A4 rotors, but whereas A4 rotors are not vented the S4 rotors are vented. From there you could step up to B6/B7 S4 rotors with a carrier spacer adapter (still using B5 S4 calipers/carriers) and have 300mm rear brakes.
Also I should point out B5 S4 and A4 share the same rear brake pads.

[rodgertherabit]

Im sure those 4pots are a good chunk of change.

Depends how you look at it. Especially how you do it.

Used calipers can be had on ebay for around $500 (maybe even less if you get lucky). Brackets are another $150-200. add rotors and pads to taste and you are under $900 easy.

Again, if you do it right you can beat that by hunting the classifieds/CL/ebay.. Hell I might even toss up my ECS Stg2v2 BBK FS ;-P (boxster calipers and 2 pc 13in rotors) and go down to run bigger lips on my rs haha

[rodgertherabit]

Rear brake upgrade is to go with B5 S4 rear brakes... brake calipers, caliper carriers, and rotors. The rotors are about the same diameter as stock A4 rotors, but whereas A4 rotors are not vented the S4 rotors are vented. From there you could step up to B6/B7 S4 rotors with a carrier spacer adapter (still using B5 S4 calipers/carriers) and have 300mm rear brakes.
Also I should point out B5 S4 and A4 share the same rear brake pads.

If ordering new calipers and rotors I would suggest thinking about the 269mm rotor upgrade (IIRC). Again can be done, with some hunting which use similar calipers but upgrade the diameter. Uses the same pads as special edition MKIV (R32,337,20th,gli,TT)

300 in the back is overkill I think, and awfully pricey. Id put the $$ into a solid front set up 1st

[MetalMan]

300 in the back is overkill I think, and awfully pricey. Id put the $$ into a solid front set up 1st

Is it? I haven't priced it out, but to go from B5 S4 rear brakes to the 300mm upgrade the only differences are the caliper spacer plates, brake lines, and rotors. 034 sells a kit for less than $300:
http://store.034motorsport.com/big-b...ear-300mm.html
300mm in the rear is quite unnecessary and probably not a good idea without having a true BBK in the front. I wouldn't even do the 269mm rear upgrade with the A8 rotors up front.

[rodgertherabit]

One thing to note is that you dont get calipers for that $300 ticket...and it is certainly overkill with a8 rotors and cast single piston calipers. I did the 269 set up for around that I thing, for everything.

the brakes on MKIVs are pretty similar to the B5. The GTI/Jetta uses 312mm up front (12.3in) and 256 (10.1in) on the rear from the factory. So A8 rotors and 269mm rotors (cant remember waht model I got mine off of) on a heavier car isnt far fetched. I wouldnt call it a bad pairing either.

It was a very strong/sturdy set up on my 20th with Boxsters up front on 312mm slotted rotors and the 10in vented rears. It was much better and more balanced than having the 18z's and 14in 2pc discs lol. I could lock em up on request yet had tons of pedal modulation

[bxultra]

Used calipers can be had on ebay for around $500
Brackets are another $150-200.
add rotors and pads to taste and you are under $900 easy.
Hell I might even toss up my ECS Stg2v2 BBK FS ;-P (boxster calipers and 2 pc 13in rotors) and go down to run bigger lips on my rs haha

lol when you put that stg2v2 up let me know. But $900 is probably more than I'm looking to spend on brakes, I only make 170hp and I just trying to upgrade/maintain my current set up.

[bxultra]

Rear brake upgrade is to go with B5 S4 rear brakes... brake calipers, caliper carriers, and rotors. The rotors are about the same diameter as stock A4 rotors, but whereas A4 rotors are not vented the S4 rotors are vented.

So you NEED calipers and carriers just to upgrade to b5 s4 rotors?

[bxultra]

It seems as though upgrading to larger rotors on the rear isn't really going to do me any good, so I may just forget that idea for now. But if you can upgrade the fronts to A8 rotors with just carriers, why are B5 S4 rears almost a complete brake swap. (Calipers, Carriers, Rotors, etc.)

[MetalMan]

So you NEED calipers and carriers just to upgrade to b5 s4 rotors?

Yes. B5 A4 calipers and carriers are not the same as B5 S4.

It seems as though upgrading to larger rotors on the rear isn't really going to do me any good, so I may just forget that idea for now. But if you can upgrade the fronts to A8 rotors with just carriers, why are B5 S4 rears almost a complete brake swap. (Calipers, Carriers, Rotors, etc.)

You're gonna have to ask Audi why the rear brake parts are different... just a different design.
Also just to be clear: B5 S4 and B5 A4 stock rear brakes are pretty much the same size. The "upgrade" facet of B5 S4 brakes is that the rotors are vented and thus have much improved cooling. Once you have the B5 S4 rear brakes it takes less than $300 to upgrade to a BBK.
If you upgraded from stock A4 rear brakes to 300mm rear brakes then you're looking at a heftier price tag; ~$200 used calipers/carriers + $300 carrier spacers/longer brake lines/rotors = $500. Still not too bad IMO.

[bxultra]

BUMP...

So my rotors and pads are at ups and should be here today, and I was looking over the diy's and would like to get confirmation on tools, as ill probably have to go buy them because i dont think i have any of them, and a more specific question.

To do the fronts I will need
Pliers for the spring
7mm hex bit/key
17mm hex socket
whatever i deem works to retract the piston

Rears will need
13mm wrench/socket
15mm wrench that fits in that tight spot
8mm hex bit/key
Piston retractor tool.

Now my question. Will I NEED the actually tool for the rears because from my readings it needs to rotate as it retracts. Confirmation on this is most important to me because if the sizes of the tools are wrong, I can always return them lol if i don't need the tool, ill use the c clamp i plan on using for the fronts.

Also, are the dust shields of any importance? Im not to fond of how they look (i know its not very noticeable but I think the brakes would have a cleaner look to them without that stupid metal around half of the rotor).

[bhusted]

Tool list looks about right. You will need the tool to rotate the rear pistons in order to retract them. You can rent the tool at most parts stores.

[MetalMan]

When I did my rears I just used a pair of needle nose pliers with the tips in the piston slots, to rotate the pistons. This may not work depending on your abilities but it saved me a trip to the auto parts store.

[redline380]

My winter project was big brakes. 17z's up front (so I can still run my 17's) and 300mm rears. I could do the math, but the upgrade should come in under $800 no sweat. I am not running the best rotors though, and will probably upgrade later on. Hell, rebuilt 17z's are less than $300 shipped from rockauto. They don't include the crossover pipes though and those are $50 from Porsche.

[redline380]

For rotating the rear pistons, you can just buy that cube adapter for $8 or whatever it costs. Autozone and the like will have them. But honestly, after doing a few brake jobs and rebuilding 4 rear calipers, it is worth spending the $70 on the nifty kit. I should have bought it a long time ago.

[S4NIK8]

Also just to be clear: B5 S4 and B5 A4 stock rear brakes are pretty much the same size. The "upgrade" facet of B5 S4 brakes is that the rotors are vented and thus have much improved cooling.

A4 Rears = 245mm x 10mm

S4 Rears = 256mm x 22mm

So the S4 rears are 11mm or .433" larger in diameter than the A4

A4 Fronts = 288mm x 25mm

A8 Fronts = 312mm x 25mm

A8 Fronts are 24mm or .945" larger diameter.

[bxultra]

Maybe I'm assuming its harder than it really is since I've never wrenched on a car until I bought my audi lol I guess ill find out one way or the other and buy it all and rent the piston tool, whatever i don't use gets returned.