Unitronic Performance Software & Pulley Upgrade for 3.0 TFSI

[iceboss23]

We did physically dyno (using a MAHA LPS3000 Dynamometer) a stock car to get a baseline, and then dyno'd each stage as we flashed it including our Stage 2+ Performance Software with our Supercharger Pulley Upgrade. That is precisely what is shown in the dyno graphs above.

So I am going to ignore all the trolling and go right to the point here. Why use conversion at all? Just show us what the dyno read at the wheels stock then at each stage. Using conversions just muddies the water and makes things less credible.

[Shamu]

?? Doesn't look like there's black magic conversion going on here -- they dyno'd on a MAHA (extremely respected and widely used Dyno in Europe) and shared each stage from stock to stg 2 here. Relative results all hold true as they're same car, same Dyno etc...

Edit -- I don't have a Uni tune at this point

[doug97gxe]

So I am going to ignore all the trolling and go right to the point here. Why use conversion at all? Just show us what the dyno read at the wheels stock then at each stage. Using conversions just muddies the water and makes things less credible.

if its the dyno i'm thinking of.. you take the wheels on.. and connect it at the hub.. it then reads at crank.. not wheel

[Leor604]

Yeah, I'm not too concerned whether the readings are CHP/TQ or AWHP/TQ. I am sure that, whatever the conversion factor to convert from one to another (essentially drivetrain loss), Unitronic is applying the same conversion to all stages of the tune so, regardless of the ultimate number, the gains are valid.

[Leor604]

if its the dyno i'm thinking of.. you take the wheels on.. and connect it at the hub.. it then reads at crank.. not wheel

No, crank hp is with the engine out of the car. Anything connected to the hubs/wheels is not crank hp.

[John@Unitronic]

So I am going to ignore all the trolling and go right to the point here. Why use conversion at all? Just show us what the dyno read at the wheels stock then at each stage. Using conversions just muddies the water and makes things less credible.

?? Doesn't look like there's black magic conversion going on here -- they dyno'd on a MAHA (extremely respected and widely used Dyno in Europe) and shared each stage from stock to stg 2 here. Relative results all hold true as they're same car, same Dyno etc...

Edit -- I don't have a Uni tune at this point

Thank you for your input, Shamu. As Shamu said, MAHA Dynamometers are one of of the most respected dynos throughout the worldwide automotive profession/community and are widely used in Europe. I don't want to get this thread too far off topic, so if you're interested in learning more about how MAHA dyno's measure output, please feel free to email me directly to discuss further or check out some of the documentation available on MAHA dynamometers for further information.

if its the dyno i'm thinking of.. you take the wheels on.. and connect it at the hub.. it then reads at crank.. not wheel

That's a Dynapack, which measures output at the hub, removing the unsprung mass of the wheel/tire from the "equation", but doesn't measure output at the crankshaft.

[doug97gxe]

No, crank hp is with the engine out of the car. Anything connected to the hubs/wheels is not crank hp.

That's a Dynapack, which measures output at the hub, removing the unsprung mass of the wheel/tire from the "equation", but doesn't measure output at the crankshaft.

ahhh thanks

[soslower]

Andy deal to jump ship from my APR Stage 1?

[jayts]

Andy deal to jump ship from my APR Stage 1?

I second this?


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[svra42.8]

Can you flash back and forth from stock at home or do you need to visit a Uniteonic dealer for it? Such as if I wanted to do the pulley install myself.

[svra42.8]

Never mind the last post. I see you need to go to a dealer still.

[Laxinthe303]

Our Stage 2+ Performance Software is optimized for 93 octane, but can be used with 91 octane for folks that don't have access to 93. Stage 2+ results on 91 octane will be a bit reduced than the above figures considering the lesser fuel grade.

Thanks! I'm in. If you can get your pulley to your dealer in Broomfield, CO, that would be awesome.

[RWD2quattro]

Our Stage 2+ Performance Software is optimized for 93 octane, but can be used with 91 octane for folks that don't have access to 93. Stage 2+ results on 91 octane will be a bit reduced than the above figures considering the lesser fuel grade.

Do you conduct adjustments to ECU parameters (timing and/or boost) when using 91oct when compared to 93oct on stage 2+?
I'm a bit confused with the statement above, usually timing is pulled when dealing with lesser quality fuels.

Please advise.

[John@Unitronic]

I'm a bit confused with the statement above, usually timing is pulled when dealing with lesser quality fuels.
Please advise.

Yes, the ECU will apply correction (pull timing). There is a limit on how much the ECU can adapt, but using quality 91 octane shouldn't reach those thresholds.

[John@Unitronic]

Thanks! I'm in. If you can get your pulley to your dealer in Broomfield, CO, that would be awesome.

Give a call in to Autosport Werks and place your order!

[vwauditek25]

Very impressed with this tune. Did my 1st one tonight for a very patience and great customer Jay. Drove 2hrs and spent 4hrs with me the best thing was our smiles during the 1st drive.......thanks for the help today John


VW Master technician
Authorized Unitronic dealer
13 CC and 15 Jetta Sport

[John@Unitronic]

Very impressed with this tune. Did my 1st one tonight for a very patience and great customer Jay. Drove 2hrs and spent 4hrs with me the best thing was our smiles during the 1st drive.......thanks for the help today John


VW Master technician
Authorized Unitronic dealer
13 CC and 15 Jetta Sport

It's always a pleasure, Alan!

[RWD2quattro]

Yes, the ECU will apply correction (pull timing). There is a limit on how much the ECU can adapt, but using quality 91 octane shouldn't reach those thresholds.

Thanks John

[Laxinthe303]

Give a call in to Autosport Werks and place your order!

They're waiting on you to deliver pulleys! :) That's who I called.

[vwauditek25]

I've learned you just have to call to get things done


VW Master technician
Authorized Unitronic dealer
13 CC and 15 Jetta Sport

[DGVR6]

Any race file in the works?

[kandrei]

Andy deal to jump ship from my APR Stage 1?

Yes you get a better tune.

[John@Unitronic]

They're waiting on you to deliver pulleys! :) That's who I called.

PM sent.

Any race file in the works?

We'll have options available once UniConnect is available for this platform.

[Jay@JXB]

Just got the Pulley Kit and Stage 2+ done as mentioned above at VW of Crystal Lake in the west Chicago burbs on my '14 MT. Had a good experience there and John was very interested in the process as we went along. A recap:

Pulley is a bitch to get on. 400F didn't do it. Alan got it on finally at 475F in the toaster oven while freezing the shaft with a compressed air canister. The heat and repeated handling took its toll on the finish of the pulley. The paint chipped in a few places in contact with the belt. I wasn't too keen on it but Alan backed it up and wrote on the service order that if it causes any issues he'll replace the pulley. I'd say to people doing this at home try it a little lower in temperature than 475 and focus on getting the shaft cold.

About the results:

1. The car is fast. Like really fast. Stock was pretty quick, this is really quick.

2. 1st gear is near unusable at WOT with traction control on since the weight shifts to the back so much on stock suspension. You can really feel the nose lift; something you couldn't feel on the stock setup. I'm definitely gonna have to upgrade suspension. 2nd gear is an absolute joy. Stock would put your body back in the seat, now you have to hold your head forward too.

3. Due to front end lifting, steering is pretty squirrely while accelerating. Goes with the territory I suppose...

4. 4th gear is my new favorite gear. At 2500 rpm and 40 mph it pulls HARD. As hard as 2nd pulled before the tune. It's the perfect gear to lurk behind that Prius coming out of the stoplight until the passing lane opens up. Then shazam, 40 to 100 without lifting a finger! Showed them. Yeah.

5. Supercharger whine is increased ever so slightly. Roc-Euro intake shows up this week; can't wait to make is scream!

6. Exhaust is louder; there's more exhaust going through it...weird.

7. Somehow, moving the gear lever from 2nd to 3rd is easier. Part of me thinks I'm making this up but I swear there is less resistance in it. **shrug**

8. Probably my biggest complaint, which is actually pretty minor: the way Audi has Dynamic mode set up the car drives normal up to a certain point when depressing the accelerator pedal, then BOOM, power when you cross that threshold. This is fine on the stock tune. It makes the car feel fast; like when you step on it it gives you everything, makes it feel responsive. Add 75hp to the wheels and this becomes a bit overwhelming. Fun no doubt, but certainly not practical. I autocross with the car, and the key to going fast out of corners is to NOT use the accelerator pedal as an ON/OFF switch. This becomes very difficult when your throttle is set up to be an ON/OFF switch in the name of "sportiness".

So to the Unitronic guys I pose the challenge of straightening out dynamic mode to make better use of the accelerator pedal. What do you guys think? Can you make it happen?

9. Oh yeah, donuts are sooo easy now.

Overall, I am very satisfied. Bill was 2200 USD with tax (3.5 hrs of labor I think, could definitely be done in 2 to 2.5 I think if you get the pulley cooking early). Definitely unleashed the car; I'm very excited to get in on a track. Highly recommend the tune; good value for your $ on a $50k German car, and I feel the guys at Unitronic are genuinely interested in customer satisfaction.



PS also don't put the pulley on backwards *cough* Alan *cough*, make sure you visualize your motion before you grab it out of the oven. It all happens quick and you risk damaging your pulley if you have to force it back off backwards.

[SeaBassHWD]

Just got the Pulley Kit and Stage 2+ done as mentioned above at VW of Crystal Lake in the west Chicago burbs on my '14 MT. Had a good experience there and John was very interested in the process as we went along. A recap:

Pulley is a bitch to get on. 400F didn't do it. Alan got it on finally at 475F in the toaster oven while freezing the shaft with a compressed air canister. The heat and repeated handling took its toll on the finish of the pulley. The paint chipped in a few places in contact with the belt. I wasn't too keen on it but Alan backed it up and wrote on the service order that if it causes any issues he'll replace the pulley. I'd say to people doing this at home try it a little lower in temperature than 475 and focus on getting the shaft cold.

About the results:

1. The car is fast. Like really fast. Stock was pretty quick, this is really quick.

2. 1st gear is near unusable at WOT with traction control on since the weight shifts to the back so much on stock suspension. You can really feel the nose lift; something you couldn't feel on the stock setup. I'm definitely gonna have to upgrade suspension. 2nd gear is an absolute joy. Stock would put your body back in the seat, now you have to hold your head forward too.

3. Due to front end lifting, steering is pretty squirrely while accelerating. Goes with the territory I suppose...

4. 4th gear is my new favorite gear. At 2500 rpm and 40 mph it pulls HARD. As hard as 2nd pulled before the tune. It's the perfect gear to lurk behind that Prius coming out of the stoplight until the passing lane opens up. Then shazam, 40 to 100 without lifting a finger! Showed them. Yeah.

5. Supercharger whine is increased ever so slightly. Roc-Euro intake shows up this week; can't wait to make is scream!

6. Exhaust is louder; there's more exhaust going through it...weird.

7. Somehow, moving the gear lever from 2nd to 3rd is easier. Part of me thinks I'm making this up but I swear there is less resistance in it. **shrug**

8. Probably my biggest complaint, which is actually pretty minor: the way Audi has Dynamic mode set up the car drives normal up to a certain point when depressing the accelerator pedal, then BOOM, power when you cross that threshold. This is fine on the stock tune. It makes the car feel fast; like when you step on it it gives you everything, makes it feel responsive. Add 75hp to the wheels and this becomes a bit overwhelming. Fun no doubt, but certainly not practical. I autocross with the car, and the key to going fast out of corners is to NOT use the accelerator pedal as an ON/OFF switch. This becomes very difficult when your throttle is set up to be an ON/OFF switch in the name of "sportiness".

So to the Unitronic guys I pose the challenge of straightening out dynamic mode to make better use of the accelerator pedal. What do you guys think? Can you make it happen?

9. Oh yeah, donuts are sooo easy now.

Overall, I am very satisfied. Bill was 2200 USD with tax (3.5 hrs of labor I think, could definitely be done in 2 to 2.5 I think if you get the pulley cooking early). Definitely unleashed the car; I'm very excited to get in on a track. Highly recommend the tune; good value for your $ on a $50k German car, and I feel the guys at Unitronic are genuinely interested in customer satisfaction.



PS also don't put the pulley on backwards *cough* Alan *cough*, make sure you visualize your motion before you grab it out of the oven. It all happens quick and you risk damaging your pulley if you have to force it back off backwards.

Very good review. can't wait til Uniconnect comes out. Hmmm... Maybe I'll just get it now and then get it'sconnect when its out. I just did my 15k service so it'll be a while til I hit 25k. Decisions decisions

[Shamu]

Just got the Pulley Kit and Stage 2+ done as mentioned above at VW of Crystal Lake in the west Chicago burbs on my '14 MT. Had a good experience there and John was very interested in the process as we went along. A recap:

Pulley is a bitch to get on. 400F didn't do it. Alan got it on finally at 475F in the toaster oven while freezing the shaft with a compressed air canister. The heat and repeated handling took its toll on the finish of the pulley. The paint chipped in a few places in contact with the belt. I wasn't too keen on it but Alan backed it up and wrote on the service order that if it causes any issues he'll replace the pulley. I'd say to people doing this at home try it a little lower in temperature than 475 and focus on getting the shaft cold.

About the results:

1. The car is fast. Like really fast. Stock was pretty quick, this is really quick.

2. 1st gear is near unusable at WOT with traction control on since the weight shifts to the back so much on stock suspension. You can really feel the nose lift; something you couldn't feel on the stock setup. I'm definitely gonna have to upgrade suspension. 2nd gear is an absolute joy. Stock would put your body back in the seat, now you have to hold your head forward too.

3. Due to front end lifting, steering is pretty squirrely while accelerating. Goes with the territory I suppose...

4. 4th gear is my new favorite gear. At 2500 rpm and 40 mph it pulls HARD. As hard as 2nd pulled before the tune. It's the perfect gear to lurk behind that Prius coming out of the stoplight until the passing lane opens up. Then shazam, 40 to 100 without lifting a finger! Showed them. Yeah.

5. Supercharger whine is increased ever so slightly. Roc-Euro intake shows up this week; can't wait to make is scream!

6. Exhaust is louder; there's more exhaust going through it...weird.

7. Somehow, moving the gear lever from 2nd to 3rd is easier. Part of me thinks I'm making this up but I swear there is less resistance in it. **shrug**

8. Probably my biggest complaint, which is actually pretty minor: the way Audi has Dynamic mode set up the car drives normal up to a certain point when depressing the accelerator pedal, then BOOM, power when you cross that threshold. This is fine on the stock tune. It makes the car feel fast; like when you step on it it gives you everything, makes it feel responsive. Add 75hp to the wheels and this becomes a bit overwhelming. Fun no doubt, but certainly not practical. I autocross with the car, and the key to going fast out of corners is to NOT use the accelerator pedal as an ON/OFF switch. This becomes very difficult when your throttle is set up to be an ON/OFF switch in the name of "sportiness".

So to the Unitronic guys I pose the challenge of straightening out dynamic mode to make better use of the accelerator pedal. What do you guys think? Can you make it happen?

9. Oh yeah, donuts are sooo easy now.

Overall, I am very satisfied. Bill was 2200 USD with tax (3.5 hrs of labor I think, could definitely be done in 2 to 2.5 I think if you get the pulley cooking early). Definitely unleashed the car; I'm very excited to get in on a track. Highly recommend the tune; good value for your $ on a $50k German car, and I feel the guys at Unitronic are genuinely interested in customer satisfaction.



PS also don't put the pulley on backwards *cough* Alan *cough*, make sure you visualize your motion before you grab it out of the oven. It all happens quick and you risk damaging your pulley if you have to force it back off backwards.

To point 8, what does it feel like if you drive it in comfort or auto mode -- more manageable? This makes it sound like not so linear power delivery which is slightly odd given the supercharger instead of turbo setup...and your comment about "not practical" is concerning :(

[droopy1592]

To point 8, what does it feel like if you drive it in comfort or auto mode -- more manageable? This makes it sound like not so linear power delivery which is slightly odd given the supercharger instead of turbo setup...and your comment about "not practical" is concerning :(

Comfort is more linear and dynamic I think is all in the first 30% of travel

[vwauditek25]

Just got the Pulley Kit and Stage 2+ done as mentioned above at VW of Crystal Lake in the west Chicago burbs on my '14 MT. Had a good experience there and John was very interested in the process as we went along. A recap:

Pulley is a bitch to get on. 400F didn't do it. Alan got it on finally at 475F in the toaster oven while freezing the shaft with a compressed air canister. The heat and repeated handling took its toll on the finish of the pulley. The paint chipped in a few places in contact with the belt. I wasn't too keen on it but Alan backed it up and wrote on the service order that if it causes any issues he'll replace the pulley. I'd say to people doing this at home try it a little lower in temperature than 475 and focus on getting the shaft cold.

About the results:

1. The car is fast. Like really fast. Stock was pretty quick, this is really quick.

2. 1st gear is near unusable at WOT with traction control on since the weight shifts to the back so much on stock suspension. You can really feel the nose lift; something you couldn't feel on the stock setup. I'm definitely gonna have to upgrade suspension. 2nd gear is an absolute joy. Stock would put your body back in the seat, now you have to hold your head forward too.

3. Due to front end lifting, steering is pretty squirrely while accelerating. Goes with the territory I suppose...

4. 4th gear is my new favorite gear. At 2500 rpm and 40 mph it pulls HARD. As hard as 2nd pulled before the tune. It's the perfect gear to lurk behind that Prius coming out of the stoplight until the passing lane opens up. Then shazam, 40 to 100 without lifting a finger! Showed them. Yeah.

5. Supercharger whine is increased ever so slightly. Roc-Euro intake shows up this week; can't wait to make is scream!

6. Exhaust is louder; there's more exhaust going through it...weird.

7. Somehow, moving the gear lever from 2nd to 3rd is easier. Part of me thinks I'm making this up but I swear there is less resistance in it. **shrug**

8. Probably my biggest complaint, which is actually pretty minor: the way Audi has Dynamic mode set up the car drives normal up to a certain point when depressing the accelerator pedal, then BOOM, power when you cross that threshold. This is fine on the stock tune. It makes the car feel fast; like when you step on it it gives you everything, makes it feel responsive. Add 75hp to the wheels and this becomes a bit overwhelming. Fun no doubt, but certainly not practical. I autocross with the car, and the key to going fast out of corners is to NOT use the accelerator pedal as an ON/OFF switch. This becomes very difficult when your throttle is set up to be an ON/OFF switch in the name of "sportiness".

So to the Unitronic guys I pose the challenge of straightening out dynamic mode to make better use of the accelerator pedal. What do you guys think? Can you make it happen?

9. Oh yeah, donuts are sooo easy now.

Overall, I am very satisfied. Bill was 2200 USD with tax (3.5 hrs of labor I think, could definitely be done in 2 to 2.5 I think if you get the pulley cooking early). Definitely unleashed the car; I'm very excited to get in on a track. Highly recommend the tune; good value for your $ on a $50k German car, and I feel the guys at Unitronic are genuinely interested in customer satisfaction.



PS also don't put the pulley on backwards *cough* Alan *cough*, make sure you visualize your motion before you grab it out of the oven. It all happens quick and you risk damaging your pulley if you have to force it back off backwards.

Of course the backwards pulley will never happen again. But man do you have to do it fast and if you just grab and go things happen. The job should be 2-3hrs all said and done. For my first one It was a learning experience with a understanding customer. Thanks for the write up


VW Master technician
Authorized Unitronic dealer
13 CC and 15 Jetta Sport

[Shamu]

Comfort is more linear and dynamic I think is all in the first 30% of travel

30% of pedal travel is quite a bit before it kicks hard...and I can see what jbullin means about impractical if this truly is the case. Do you have the tune and for what year s4?

[Jay@JXB]

To point 8, what does it feel like if you drive it in comfort or auto mode -- more manageable? This makes it sound like not so linear power delivery which is slightly odd given the supercharger instead of turbo setup...and your comment about "not practical" is concerning :(

Yes comfort mode feels normal still. I don't want to give the wrong impression here. For normal daily driving and spirited driving there's no negative effect; in fact driving in dynamic mode is a blast with the tune! I'll be getting to the track in a couple weekends and I'll report back after. The flaw isn't with the tune or the supercharger, it's the way the throttle response is set up in dynamic mode. I believe it looks something like this:



So when you get to the steep part (because it's a supercharger and there's no turbo lag and a ton of power) it takes off quickly. I imagine comfort mode to look something like this:



Neither are linear like a normal accelerator pedal. I just think there will be some learning curve associated with using the throttle correctly coming out of a corner in dynamic mode.

[Shamu]

^ thanks for the clarification -- @John/Uni, anything you can do to the current program to smooth out the dynamic-mode throttle response setting?

[Leor604]

^ thanks for the clarification -- @John/Uni, anything you can do to the current program to smooth out the dynamic-mode throttle response setting?

So if I understand correctly, you don't have the tune, have not driven the tune and, based on ONE opinion, are asking Unitronic to modify dynamic throttle response to resemble comfort mode. A bit premature, IMHO.

[TexasDfwS4]

+1

[EWM AMIN]

Hey guys,

So after a huge day of serious driving through the city, I tried to get a dyno done at Neetronics here in Toronto. I got a call from Andy who informed me that he couldn't get readings from S4's 2011+, and that he didn't have an OBDII connection to read the RPMS which will give Torque... He couldn't provide me with any sort of timing, only AWHP. I didn't see the value in this, and will schedule another dyno shortly. I'm going to try my luck at Magnus or try to find somebody in the west end.

What I will say is that I went to a competing dealer of Unitronic to get my parts installed. I told him I switched tunes, and he confirmed that the new tune was definitely more aggressive then the previous tune he had installed for me.

He wants to become a Unitronic dealer now.

[the4siswickid]

So if I understand correctly, you don't have the tune, have not driven the tune and, based on ONE opinion, are asking Unitronic to modify dynamic throttle response to resemble comfort mode. A bit premature, IMHO.

No one should ask for modification to a product they don't own, and second, if Dynamic mode is too aggressive, switch to old lady....er.....um..... Comfort mode.


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[Shamu]

So if I understand correctly, you don't have the tune, have not driven the tune and, based on ONE opinion, are asking Unitronic to modify dynamic throttle response to resemble comfort mode. A bit premature, IMHO.

No, u misunderstand. I'm asking john/Uni if they can smooth out the dynamic throttle response with their tune so you don't get this spike/surge, not necessarily to resemble comfort. My original post regarding comfort was to ask if perhaps that setting already did this but per jbullin's response it does not hence my follow up.

[OnEaNgRyBuNnY]

I gotta be honest, I don't think asking about a product before you buy it is wrong or premature at all. Asking about what is possible, I didn't see him say he SHOULD change it. And the question he asked will lead to a better understanding of the "issue" if we get an answer. Might also lead to UNI seeing a need or want for another feature to add to their product lineup that adds to more flexibility. In what I do, i look for info and ideas everywhere and anywhere, even from people with no or little direct exposure or experience, and try to understand as much as i can to make the best decisions both about purchases and about offerings or approaches to how i operate. I'd also take early feedback and concern very seriously and start brainstorming, but hold off on reacting, so I'm prepared if it DOES become a repeat issue. I'm really not sure what the problem is, here?

[Shamu]

Nah no problem here! :) everyone's got, and are entitled to their opinion!


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[Casius]

Our Stage 2+ Performance Software is optimized for 93 octane, but can be used with 91 octane for folks that don't have access to 93. Stage 2+ results on 91 octane will be a bit reduced than the above figures considering the lesser fuel grade.

Just curious, where you guys getting 93 in Montreal (or Canada in general)? Sunoco/Petro Can have the 94 is that what you're using or you getting something else?

[Casius]

If this the dynamic throttle response is anything like the one VW CC I drove I'd hate it too. That thing was terrible to drive. Off the line, I mean in just regular traffic, you'd press the gas and expect to go but all it would do is putter away off the line. You had to mash it to get any go juice but if you mashed it it would just jolt ahead and take off. It seems to be something that VAG likes to do and describing it as a ON/OFF switch is absolutely the best way to explain it. It was horrible and if that's how Dynamic is then a tuner sorting that out would be very much appreciated.