RS7 Problems. Buy-back, replace, compensation...?

[CanuckRS]

I'm looking to get a sense of what is fair in this situation. My point of view is possibly a bit biased so I just wanted to put it out there for everyone to comment.

Purchased my RS7 end of June this year after a factory order and wait of about 4 months. Shortly after delivery (less than a month), noticed oil on the garage floor underneath the engine. I was also having some persistent error messages in the DIS (low battery warning) when starting up in the AM. Took it to the dealer right away and they said they fixed the battery problem and the oil leak was going to take more time to diagnose so come back when i could leave it for longer and they would arrange a courtesy vehicle. (they only have a couple courtesy cars so scheduling it would be an issue they said). FFWD to end of september when the oil leak is getting worse and the low battery warning message had returned shortly after the last appointment. Took 6 weeks to get the car in this time (no courtesy car available for that long they said). What they found were a total of 3 engine leaks. One was the oil filter housing, one was a coolant leak and another is a leak between the guide frame and the engine block. This last oil leak has required them to remove the engine, tear it down and re-seal the leak which they are in the process of doing right now. Vehicle has been with dealer since Nov 13 for all this work. They still have to solve the electrical problem(s) after the engine is put back together.

So my question is, what is fair in this situation in terms of compensation to me the customer? (i think the myriad of options include buy-back, replace, cash compensation, extended warranty...) From my point of view, i would like a replacement vehicle (2016 MY factory order) or a buy-back for full purchase price. The way i look at it is that i paid 120k for a defective vehicle on delivery, this is not a result of wear and tear...the vehicle has less than 5000km on it and the problems started long before the current km. Two issues going forward. 1 - i seriously doubt this vehicle will be bullet proof after it's all fixed, what are the chances that this will solve all the known/unknown issues. 2 - when i sell this vehicle in the future how will all these problems affect resale value. who is going to want to buy a vehicle that had it's engine removed due to a manufacturers defect. They tell me "that's what the warranty is for" when they are fixing my vehicle but this is clearly NOT normal warranty issues that i or any customer would expect to be reasonable. The vehicle was clearly defective on delivery, they must have been way off their game the day they put it together. Even the service guys at the dealership have called these issues "brutal" and completely unacceptable for a new 120k vehicle.

Audi right now is pretty quiet on what compensation they are going to offer me until the vehicle is completely repaired which will take another 1-2 weeks it seems. FYI, there are NO automatic lemon buyback laws here in Canada so we have to work with Audi and the dealership when these issues arise. Thanks for taking the time to read... I'm not here to flame Audi or anyone in particular, just want to get a sense of what everyone's opinion is on the matter. I really hope Audi steps up and does what i hope they should, i have been a loyal customer for many years and i think that should carry some weight as well. Just in the last 10 years i've bought a B7S4, RS4, TTRS and now an RS7. I've done a couple drivers day experiences in Germany, a racetrack experience in the UK and a winter driving course in Canada in addition to factory tours in Ingolstadt and Neckarsulm. I don't think they'll find a more engaged customer than myself with their brand. As you can probably imagine, this has been a pretty stressful situation and frankly i'm just tired of thinking about it right now.

Happy holidays to everyone!! :)

[AudiTechS4]

i work at a dealer here in the states. i know exactly what your going through. We just did this to a v10 r8 engine. Long gone are the audi days of replacing a valve cover gasket or an oil pan gasket. valve covers have become cam girdles and upper oil pans have become crank girdles and they are all held together by sealant no more gaskets. . If they value you as a customer i'm sure they will make it right , I have no idea how dealerships work in canada but audi doesnt like loosing customers.

[Xtek]

Don't go through the dealer. While Audi his its own priorities, dealerships are privately owned and have their own priorities. Go straight to AoA, find a high level person's email or phone number and speak with their assistant. Their best interest is to maintain customers and keep them happy.

Remind them you're a long-term Audi customer and you'd like to keep it that way. I would ask them to replace the engine and let them keep this one to inspect how it went so wrong.

[kiku]

Wow. Just wow. This is NOT normal. An RS7 that came new from factory with such a big issue should not be accepted. I would ask for a new factory order. I don't think anyone who ordered a new rs7 has received one with this significant problem.

Go directly to audi and ask for the mediation. Don't accept anything but a replacement. Even if they "fix it", imagine what will happen when you get to 20k miles? And 40k?

[agent47]

Don't go through the dealer. While Audi his its own priorities, dealerships are privately owned and have their own priorities. Go straight to AoA, find a high level person's email or phone number and speak with their assistant. Their best interest is to maintain customers and keep them happy.

Remind them you're a long-term Audi customer and you'd like to keep it that way. I would ask them to replace the engine and let them keep this one to inspect how it went so wrong.

He is in Canada. Not sure if emailing a person in AoA would help. If it would, I have the emails of a lot of people sitting way up in the hierarchy. And emails to them do cause a lot of waves - experience talking :D

[Xtek]

AoC?

[v8a6]

From my point of view, i would like a replacement vehicle (2016 MY factory order) or a buy-back for full purchase price.

Either of these two options seem fair, and would be the only two resolutions that I personally would accept.

[CanuckRS]

He is in Canada. Not sure if emailing a person in AoA would help. If it would, I have the emails of a lot of people sitting way up in the hierarchy. And emails to them do cause a lot of waves - experience talking :D

Another forum member put me in touch with some other people higher up the food chain at AoC who i am in contact with now about the issues. At the beginning it was particularly frustrating calling the general support line for help, they were of no assistance whatsoever. Audi should have a special number for Audi customers who have purchased certain vehicles so we can get quality support when there are real issues to deal with imo.

[agent47]

General support is POS. I ended up emailing scott keogh, jamie ward, jeri ward and all of their's german dad rupert stadler. Within a few hours I was getting calls from AoA and dealerships near me and Follow up calls ever day..

[Xtek]

Another forum member put me in touch with some other people higher up the food chain at AoC who i am in contact with now about the issues. At the beginning it was particularly frustrating calling the general support line for help, they were of no assistance whatsoever. Audi should have a special number for Audi customers who have purchased certain vehicles so we can get quality support when there are real issues to deal with imo.

That's a very poor approach to take. I understand that they want people who purchase S and RS models to feel special but everyone is still purchasing from the same company... a little disappointed to hear that is the behavior.

Oh well, sorry don't want to redirect the conversation.

[HeelBuff]

Man, that stinks. Audi should get you out of that car and into a new one ASAP and not let you live through the pain you are living through right now - it's in Audi's best interest to do so. The longer this sh!t show continues the more fed up and pissed you are going to get, and the more likely you are going to go nuclear and make it your life's mission to denigrate Audi wherever and whenever you can. Additionally, Quattro and RS are their "Halo" brands and the last thing they want is to tarnish those by getting word out that these kind of quality control failures are built into their processes. With all that said, people make short-sighted, foolish decisions all the time so who knows what Audi is going to do. I'd definitely put the big time guilt on them by underscoring the two points above at every turn until they extract you from this emotional, financial and time drain.

[Laserrs]

"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others" eh? An A3 or an R8, Audi should make it right regardless.

[VeryBadman]

I concur that I would press for new car if I still want to stick with RS7 or full refund.

[Audibot]

Dude, sucks about your situation. Hopefully AoC is making things right. I know in the states, if I were to buy new, I'd buy from NJ because they have really good lemon laws.

[enigma1406]

Audi needs to get their shit together based on all of the posts I've seen about Audi in Canada (lack of loaners affecting service and lack of response from AoC). Maybe it's a function of the marketplace where all dealers are like this. Sorry to hear about your situation and hope it gets resolved.

If the dealership values you as a customer, they should buy it back. I went through a situation with my A6 last year which wasn't even a major issue but I had the dealership buy it back after speaking with the manager. Regarding AofA, isn't Canada part of North America?

It's AoA not AoNA.

[amelen]

Here in the U.S. - when I had some A7 issues, AoA was very helpful. Hopefully the Canadian equivalent will be just as helpful. I'd open a case ASAP and be patient since it takes them a while to work through everything.

[Audibot]

It's AoA not AoNA.

Shouldn't it be AoM, then? Audi of 'Murica

[pandi]

Audi needs to get their shit together based on all of the posts I've seen about Audi in Canada (lack of loaners affecting service and lack of response from AoC). Maybe it's a function of the marketplace where all dealers are like this. Sorry to hear about your situation and hope it gets resolved.



It's AoA not AoNA.

Ok, that's my point. Why wouldn't Canada be part of Audi of America?

[amelen]

For some reason, I remember hearing that Canada doesn't fall under AoA, but I might be wrong. In either case, here is the AoA direct number to open a case: +1 877 615 2834. I'm sure they can point you in the right place if Canada doesn't fall under their jurisdiction.

[Jokergod2000]

For me, I'd ask them for the 200,000km, 10 year platinum extended warranty. I believe it was valued at 12k+ CAD. At least then you get to keep the car, which will probably get sorted out, and get a HUGE warranty that covers pretty much everything for a LONG time. If you get a new car you get a 4 month wait, if you get to keep driving the RS7 it may not be that bad, and the same lack luster 80,000km, 4 year warranty. Of course if you want the new body style it may be a different story but I can’t stand the headlights.

[amelen]

I agree with Jokergod2000. When I had issues, they were much more willing to offer an extended warranty or audi care. They would not budge on a buy-back or a new order. I'd try to ask for that. When you open a case, they ask you to very specifically state what you're looking for in compensation, so just be ready with what you think is fair.

[Xtek]

Keep in mind with the warranty you're still going to have to go through what you're dealing with now... no car while its being worked on, lots of dealer visits, etc. I would really push to have Audi replace the engine.

[CanuckRS]

For me, I'd ask them for the 200,000km, 10 year platinum extended warranty. I believe it was valued at 12k+ CAD. At least then you get to keep the car, which will probably get sorted out, and get a HUGE warranty that covers pretty much everything for a LONG time. If you get a new car you get a 4 month wait, if you get to keep driving the RS7 it may not be that bad, and the same lack luster 80,000km, 4 year warranty. Of course if you want the new body style it may be a different story but I can’t stand the headlights.

the only issue with that approach is it does nothing to address the two issues i am concerned with:

1. i'm still holding a vehicle with a checkered history that may very well have many more issues in store for me. no-one knows the answer but based on the vehicle history, i think it's very likely there may be other problems as yet undiscovered. as mentioned here i waited 6 weeks to have the vehicle even looked at and it's been in the shop for over 5 weeks now. it's been a complete waste of my time and the issues still aren't solved to date.
2. there is also the issue with resale value down the road even with a longer warranty. who would want to take the risk and potential inconvenience of buying an expensive vehicle such as this with huge repair history. maybe someone would, but at a big discount to other similar vehicles for sale. even if i traded it in to a dealer, any one of them would have access to the repair history and know exactly what has happened. i wouldn't want to hide any history either, that's not something i would ever do to someone.

[turbonator S6]

For me, I'd ask them for the 200,000km, 10 year platinum extended warranty. I believe it was valued at 12k+ CAD. At least then you get to keep the car, which will probably get sorted out, and get a HUGE warranty that covers pretty much everything for a LONG time. If you get a new car you get a 4 month wait, if you get to keep driving the RS7 it may not be that bad, and the same lack luster 80,000km, 4 year warranty. Of course if you want the new body style it may be a different story but I can’t stand the headlights.

OP said he had to wait 6 weeks to get a loaner or else be out of a car to use! No way would I accept an extended warranty. My time is worth way more than that. Buyback or new car the only way to go IMO.

[Jokergod2000]

the only issue with that approach is it does nothing to address the two issues i am concerned with:

1. i'm still holding a vehicle with a checkered history that may very well have many more issues in store for me. no-one knows the answer but based on the vehicle history, i think it's very likely there may be other problems as yet undiscovered. as mentioned here i waited 6 weeks to have the vehicle even looked at and it's been in the shop for over 5 weeks now. it's been a complete waste of my time and the issues still aren't solved to date.
2. there is also the issue with resale value down the road even with a longer warranty. who would want to take the risk and potential inconvenience of buying an expensive vehicle such as this with huge repair history. maybe someone would, but at a big discount to other similar vehicles for sale. even if i traded it in to a dealer, any one of them would have access to the repair history and know exactly what has happened. i wouldn't want to hide any history either, that's not something i would ever do to someone.

The available options depend on what Audi is willing to do. It also depends on how long you are planning on keeping it. If you keep it for another 5k you are right it has a sketchy history. If you sell it in 100k I doubt anyone will care what issues it had at 5k. For me, I plan to drive this thing until the warranty expires so I got a 9 year warranty but I don't drive a lot so it was not too expensive.

If they told you your options were:
1. 100% fixed in 4-8 weeks with a 10 year 200k warranty
2. A new car in 4-5 months (I'm assuming you bought it new and chose the options. If not, a new car is always the better option). which would you choose? I'd take the warranty in a second.

Now if this experience has killed your love for the RS7 and you are planning on a different car that is something else entirely. Buy back/replace/fix are all pretty close if you plan to us keep an RS7.

Options in BC are limited on taking it to another dealership but I'd be pushing for a 3rd party rental car if they could not get you an Audi on the spot.

[HeelBuff]

the only issue with that approach is it does nothing to address the two issues i am concerned with:

1. i'm still holding a vehicle with a checkered history that may very well have many more issues in store for me. no-one knows the answer but based on the vehicle history, i think it's very likely there may be other problems as yet undiscovered. as mentioned here i waited 6 weeks to have the vehicle even looked at and it's been in the shop for over 5 weeks now. it's been a complete waste of my time and the issues still aren't solved to date.
2. there is also the issue with resale value down the road even with a longer warranty. who would want to take the risk and potential inconvenience of buying an expensive vehicle such as this with huge repair history. maybe someone would, but at a big discount to other similar vehicles for sale. even if i traded it in to a dealer, any one of them would have access to the repair history and know exactly what has happened. i wouldn't want to hide any history either, that's not something i would ever do to someone.

Agreed 100% on both points. Having a brand new car that's already had open heart surgery and 5 bypasses will never be the same, emotionally or mechanically. Do you trust the dealership techs to be as proficient at disassembling and assembling this engine as the folks at Quattro who've built thousands of these engines? Helllllll no. It's almost certainly their first one and there were probably 2 bolts and 3 nuts left over when they were done. Once a horse breaks its leg it's put out to pasture or worse. A new RS7 tainted by all this stink should be removed and replaced with one Audi is proud of.

I'd expect Wal-Mart to leave me inconvenienced for weeks, offer me a substandard resolution and show no concern for me as a consumer. But Audi? No. I'm very interested to see how this is settled but the clock is ticking and they've sucked badly so far. Good luck.

[agent47]

OP - if it would help I can PM you Stadler's email. He is the ceo and sits in Germany- basically controlling all the sh*t. You can try emailing him and Wolfgang Hoffmann as well. I can get you both their emails.

[CanuckRS]

OP - if it would help I can PM you Stadler's email. He is the ceo and sits in Germany- basically controlling all the sh*t. You can try emailing him and Wolfgang Hoffmann as well. I can get you both their emails.

Thanks for the offer, you got mail!

[CanuckRS]

OP - if it would help I can PM you Stadler's email. He is the ceo and sits in Germany- basically controlling all the sh*t. You can try emailing him and Wolfgang Hoffmann as well. I can get you both their emails.

thanks for your help agent47, i'm not sure how much it played a role but Audi has stepped up and taken care of me completely. Cheers, i owe you a beer...or two! :)

[agent47]

thanks for your help agent47, i'm not sure how much it played a role but Audi has stepped up and taken care of me completely. Cheers, i owe you a beer...or two! :)

Lets go for some single malt! Glad I could help you!

[Xtek]

thanks for your help agent47, i'm not sure how much it played a role but Audi has stepped up and taken care of me completely. Cheers, i owe you a beer...or two! :)

What was the resolution?

[CanuckRS]

What was the resolution?

i'll only say that i no longer have any issues. thanks again to all :)

[amelen]

Glad to hear everything was resolved!

[CanuckRS]

Lets go for some single malt! Glad I could help you!

sounds good to me. if i'm ever in texas i'll drop you a line ;)

[Jokergod2000]

i'll only say that i no longer have any issues. thanks again to all :)

Damn that sucks. It would have been good to hear how this turned out...

[sparkhill]

i'll only say that i no longer have any issues. thanks again to all :)

Ah, the non-disclosure agreement. Glad you found resolution.

[agent47]

sounds good to me. if i'm ever in texas i'll drop you a line ;)

Or when I am up in Canada. I am gonna be there soon on business.

[Audibot]

Lets go for some single malt! Glad I could help you!

Single malt beer tends to be pretty boring unless it's a really good, straight pilsner. Not enough complexity for most tastes.

[agent47]

Single malt beer tends to be pretty boring unless it's a really good, straight pilsner. Not enough complexity for most tastes.

I meant single malt scotch

[Audibot]

I meant single malt scotch

Oh, I figured, but it seemed out of context b/c he said he owed you a beer